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Rick Warren critics over OBAMA told to leave the church...
TownHall ^ | 12.14.2006 | Kevin McCullough

Posted on 12/14/2006 11:48:10 AM PST by jodiluvshoes

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To: P8riot

He "gets it". Raise up strong leaders and plant churches. Add to the Kingdom everywhere people get called and God provides leaders. Not keep everything under your control and be big for the sake of the bottom line. CC Costa Mesa got big despite Chuck Smith's best efforts to plant more Calvary Chapels.

Just as Paul had Timothy and Titus, the REAL leaders find others that are filled with the spirit and pass the torch. Warren, Osteen, the Couch couple -- any of the mega church/mega ministry CEO's would never permit a strong leader to emerge from their "ministry". Might cut into the profits.


301 posted on 12/16/2006 10:28:46 AM PST by L,TOWM (Liberals, The Other White Meat [This is some nasty...])
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To: Quix; All

I don't have the specific scripture reference before me - but Paul taught us that there is an approved method of dealing with "sin" in the church.

First, CHURCH LEADERSHIP is supposed to deal with the issue. Nowhere in Paul's teaching does he say WE HAVE THE RESPONSIBILITY TO DEAL WITH IT - IN THE CHURCH - only in our own home. While I do believe we are to inform the church leadership if we are aware of any "sin" within the church - SO THEY CAN INVESTIGATE. Okay .. that said .. within the church structure, a person accused of "sin" is supposed to be CONFRONTED IN PRIVATE BY CHURCH LEADERSHIP. If the person does not change .. the "sin" is exposed publically. If there is still no repentence, then, the person is supposed to be put out of the church.

Now .. Pastor Warren DID NOT COMMIT ANY SIN! He invited many people to meet with him regarding AIDS. The fact that the meeting took place in his church building is irrelevant. He did not invite a HEATHEN to preach to his congregation, or support abortion. While they were bellyaching about Obama, what about Bill Gates (who was also invited), and who is also pro-choice. Therefore, I do not believe just any member of the congregation has any God-given authority to go to the PUBLIC MEDIA and air their personal gripes. People can still do it .. but that doesn't mean they have GOD-GIVEN authority to do so.

And .. basically that's all the complaints are .. personal and petty gripes. Whether my Pastor always does everything I believe - is not rational thinking - and it does not constitute sin if we disagree.

Pastor Warren does have the authority to do what he believes God has called him to do .. and sometimes we have to accept it's not exactly what we would do. Fine ..!! But .. we are not being held responsible for the Pastor's calling and we're not being held responsible for the health of the congregation.

I still say this is just personal, petty gripes .. and these kind of people need to be "put out of the church".

And .. Pastor Warren is not "in a ditch" .. and he's committed no sin against his congregation. It's best to just pray for him and lift him up - and allow God and the leadership of his church to deal with the issue.

People are confusing "sin" with disagreement.


302 posted on 12/16/2006 11:22:28 AM PST by CyberAnt (Drive-By Media: Fake news, fake documents, fake polls)
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To: L,TOWM

Interesting manipulation of Scripture, facts, history . . .

Large and small churchs both have their plusses and minuses. To God be the Glory whenever and however HIS WILL is done.


303 posted on 12/16/2006 1:05:45 PM PST by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: CyberAnt

You are quite right and well put.

Thanks.

Particularly:

And .. basically that's all the complaints are .. personal and petty gripes. Whether my Pastor always does everything I believe - is not rational thinking - and it does not constitute sin if we disagree.

Pastor Warren does have the authority to do what he believes God has called him to do .. and sometimes we have to accept it's not exactly what we would do. Fine ..!! But .. we are not being held responsible for the Pastor's calling and we're not being held responsible for the health of the congregation.

I still say this is just personal, petty gripes .. and these kind of people need to be "put out of the church".


304 posted on 12/16/2006 1:07:45 PM PST by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: Quix
Interesting manipulation of Scripture, facts, history

Oh? And what would be the un-manipulated scripture, facts, and history be?

I must not have one of Warren's modern translations of 1st Timothy chapter 3 where Paul describes the desired church leader as a man that is greedy for lucre.

The scriptures I have read call for just the opposite.

305 posted on 12/16/2006 2:42:14 PM PST by L,TOWM (Liberals, The Other White Meat [This is some nasty...])
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To: Quix

"LOL. Love it."

I was fairly sure someone other than myself would appreciate that story.


306 posted on 12/16/2006 5:20:37 PM PST by mjaneangels@aolcom
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To: mjaneangels@aolcom

How many sentences into it did you know it was the Apostle Paul?

I think it was by the 3rd or 5th for me.


307 posted on 12/16/2006 5:28:36 PM PST by Quix (LET GOD ARISE AND HIS ENEMIES BE SCATTERED. LET ISRAEL CALL ON GOD AS THEIRS! & ISLAM FLUSH ITSELF)
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To: Quix

"How many sentences into it did you know it was the Apostle Paul?

I think it was by the 3rd or 5th for me."

Honestly, the first time I read it was decades ago, when I was still young and, for the most part, stupid. I did know that it was one of the Apostles, but until I read the "signed" I did not know which one.


308 posted on 12/16/2006 11:19:01 PM PST by mjaneangels@aolcom
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To: 1000 silverlings
I had this "teacher" and I told the class one night about reading something in the Torah. Later she accosted me and said "I don't know what this Torah is you are mentioning but it has no place in our study of Genesis." It was hilarious.

That is hilarious. And she was a "bible teacher"? Sounds like you should have taken over the class. LOL!

309 posted on 12/17/2006 6:21:13 AM PST by micho
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To: SauronOfMordor
a way to bring a group into acceptance of a pre-determined idea, by identifying, isolating, and ridiculing any potential leaders for other points of view

Thanks for the links. The Rats and their media cohorts are experts at Dark Delphi, it would seem.

310 posted on 12/17/2006 10:54:43 AM PST by Veto! (Opinions freely dispensed as advice)
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To: jodiluvshoes
A bit off topic but I recall reading a thread that stated bubba xlinton was asked to speak at Willowbrook Church - another large mega-church in Chicago.

As I am becomoing disenchanted with my church (a member of the Willowbrook organization) behaving like RW's Saddlebrook, any feedback is appreciated.

Merry Christmas freepers!

311 posted on 12/23/2006 7:02:22 AM PST by newfreep (islam is a political movement - vaporize mecca to destroy their source of "inspiration".)
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To: jodiluvshoes

I wish the lady in the letter to Kevin would post her story, an update, so we can find out what happened to her.


312 posted on 04/05/2010 6:44:31 PM PDT by Terriergal ("I am ashamed that women are so simple To offer war where they should kneel for peace," Shakespeare)
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