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Complexity of Islam feeds misinterpretation
Islamdaily ^ | 12/17/06 | Mansour El-Kikhia

Posted on 12/16/2006 6:51:54 PM PST by Valin

By now, most people know that Sunnis and Shiites make up the two major sects in Islam, but very few are aware that Sunnis adhere to four major schools of Islamic jurisprudence: Hanbali, Hanafi, Shafii and Maliki.

These schools vary from the most conservative Hanbali to the most tolerant Hanafi. The Hanbali is the literalist school and, as such, promotes strict adherence to literal interpretation of the Koran and the Prophet's sayings. An act that does not conform to either is regarded as out of the ordinary (bidaa), and in the Hanbali view all "bidaas" are acts gone astray (thalalah), and all thalalahs are destined for hellfire.

There is no room for conscious mistakes in the Hanbali tradition and even less in the Wahhabi sect that adheres to it. This tradition is very different from the one advocated by the Maliki school, which is predicated on knowledge. Imam Malik, the founder of the tradition, was a scholar of science, mathematics, logic, philosophy and jurisprudence. All these are reflected in the school's teaching of religion and the concept of faith.

Indeed, while the Hanbali school leaves little room for initiative or novel interpretation, the Maliki leaves too much. What is clear, however, is that the Maliki school opposes religion as a burden and refuses the literalist tradition as a path. Intentions play a huge role in the acts of individuals; reason a larger role; and in some instances, attention to the general at the expense of the specific an even larger one.

Islamic jurisprudence is predicated on the following sources: the Koran, the Sunna (way of the Prophet), Kiyass (measurement to a comparable dictum in the first two sources), Ijmaa (consensus by religious scholars) and Ijtihaad (one's own initiative at doing right). To determine if one's actions are religiously correct, they need to be passed through the first four criteria, and if no answer can be found, then one is permitted to do one's best to do right. Here intentions become paramount, for in the final analysis one is responsible for his own actions.

As such, Maliki societies of North Africa tend to be far more religiously and socially tolerant and free than the Arab peninsula. In North Africa, there is no chopping of heads or hands or religious police. There are movie theaters and nightlife, libraries and bookstores with materials on everything except criticism of indigenous regimes. The interesting aspect of this school has been the absence of religious institutions, which permitted indigenous ones to emerge.

However, the most liberal and lax of all the schools of Islamic jurisprudence is the Hanafi school. It is even more liberal than the Maliki because it evolved to cater to non-Arab Muslims. Just as Catholicism had to adapt to believers in Africa by incorporating some local traditions or Latin America by developing liberation theology, the Hanafi schools accommodated the societies it came into contact with. The major adherents to the Hanafi schools can be found in non-Arab Asia.

The final school is the Shafii school. Its founder was a student of Malik but differed from Malik in that he institutionalized his teacher's teachings. His greatest success has been in Lower Egypt, China and Southeast Asia where, like the Hanafi tradition, his brand of Islam catered to non-Arab Muslims.

I don't expect many in the West to know or care about the differences between Islamic schools. But for anyone to judge the majority of Muslim believers by acts or edicts of the minority made up of conservative Wahhabis is silly. The Wahhabis are not bad; they are merely afraid of straying from what they believe to be the righteous path. I don't agree with their philosophy and firmly believe there are many paths to righteousness, but I am not their judge.

Islam has no clergy as is the case in Christianity, and hence the concept of God is not uniform. How a Muslim perceives God is highly personal. And unlike Christianity, which identifies and humanizes the father with the son, Islam doesn't make it easy to understand God. It is much harder to be a Muslim because the purpose of the faith is not to understand God but to understand oneself. Unfortunately, some Muslims have not gotten that message yet.


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KEYWORDS: baitforbigots; bias; christianity; islam; muslim; muslims; religion; religionofpeace; rop; trop
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1 posted on 12/16/2006 6:51:55 PM PST by Valin
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To: Valin
Sunnis adhere to four major schools of Islamic jurisprudence: Hanbali, Hanafi, Shafii and Maliki. These schools vary from the most conservative Hanbali to the most tolerant Hanafi.

The Hanbali school believes in killing infidels without raising taxes.

2 posted on 12/16/2006 7:00:16 PM PST by outofstyle
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To: Valin
Imam Malik, the founder of the tradition, was a scholar of science, mathematics, logic, philosophy and jurisprudence. [...] the Maliki leaves too much.

Definitely! We do not need science, mathematics, logic or philosophy. Sharia jurisprudence is sufficient.

3 posted on 12/16/2006 7:00:48 PM PST by A. Pole (" There is no other god but Free Market, and Adam Smith is his prophet ! Bazaar Akbar! ")
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To: Valin
It is much harder to be a Muslim because the purpose of the faith is not to understand God but to understand oneself. Unfortunately, some Muslims have not gotten that message yet.

Actually, it sounds like they have gotten the message. They understand that they are flawed, and that they are sinners, and behave appropriately.

4 posted on 12/16/2006 7:10:22 PM PST by Rodney King (No, we can't all just get along.)
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To: A. Pole

Now which school condones the cowardly killing of innocents?? Oh, all of them thats right..?!


5 posted on 12/16/2006 7:10:40 PM PST by samadams2000 (Someone important make......The Call!)
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To: Valin

btt


6 posted on 12/16/2006 7:12:19 PM PST by Cacique (quos Deus vult perdere, prius dementat ( Islamia Delenda Est ))
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To: samadams2000

Oh, all of them thats right..?!


I know you trying to be witty and sarcastic but actually they do.


7 posted on 12/16/2006 7:21:05 PM PST by Valin (History takes time. It is not an instant thing.)
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To: A. Pole
(Glib)Let Allah sort them out.(/Glib)

Actually, this info is good to know.

8 posted on 12/16/2006 7:25:55 PM PST by Incorrigible (If I lead, follow me; If I pause, push me; If I retreat, kill me.)
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To: Valin
Complexity of Islam feeds misinterpretation

"Complexity" -- hmmm, I see. Is that like "nuanced?"

9 posted on 12/16/2006 7:28:34 PM PST by Prince Caspian (Don't ask if it's risky... Ask if the reward is worth the risk)
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To: Valin

"...How a Muslim perceives God is highly personal..."

No it's not! All of them perceive allah exactly as it suited mohammad to perceive allah.

To perceive allah otherwise would be to deny mohammad and for a mohammadan, that's impossible.


10 posted on 12/16/2006 7:30:42 PM PST by Fred Nerks (MEDIA + ENEMY = ENEMEDIA!)
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To: samadams2000
"Now which school condones the cowardly killing of innocents?? Oh, all of them thats right..?!"

Well put.

It's long past time for westerners to try and understand these blodd thirsty aborigines and commence w/ defanging them.

11 posted on 12/16/2006 7:35:39 PM PST by Pietro
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To: Valin
What's so complex about a murder cult?

The only complex questions are about tactics and timing.

12 posted on 12/16/2006 7:40:22 PM PST by Gritty (Fighting the jihad in the courtroom means you’ll lose - Mark Steyn)
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To: Rodney King
It is much harder to be a Muslim because the purpose of the faith is not to understand God but to understand oneself. Unfortunately, some Muslims have not gotten that message yet. Actually, it sounds like they have gotten the message. They understand that they are flawed, and that they are sinners, and behave appropriately. - Rodney King What linguistic balderdash! The purpose of the faith is to promote theocracy, suppress education of the peasants, scientific observation, women and discussion of ideas. Not only that, it encourages ruinous genetic liasons that have debased the race of Arabs. Genetic proof is busting out all over. Poligamy and cosanguinous marriages are the awful legacy Mohammed, who sought to legitimacize his lust and left a genetic nightmare sanctioned by his religion. A danger already well known throughout civilization was sancified by this man. That, IMHO, is why these people are nuts.
13 posted on 12/16/2006 7:41:11 PM PST by bukkdems (If this global warming gets out of hand, we can use some of that nuclear winter.)
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To: Valin
What’s so complex?... Everything everyone needs to know about "Islam":

The goal of Islam is to conquer the world for "allah". Everyone who does not believe in "allah" or mohammed his so-called "prophet" is an infidel.

Infidels get only one of three choices:

1) Believe in allah and mohammed by choice or by force.

2) Become a slave, subject to Islamic masters, under shariah law.

If you refuse the first two "choices":

3) Die for your "faith" or lack there of.

Those are the ONLY choices Islam offers everyone who does not "believe". And if you do "believe by choice or by force and you recant... you die.

Not complicated, just plain EVIL.

Oh yes, a few other items:

1) The only way you are guaranteed to go to heaven: kill infidels and die doing so, the more you kill the better.

2) Heaven is nothing more than a continual sexual orgy. Those "good Muslims" who get there by killing nasty infidel Jews and gentiles and who die in the process get 72 perpetual virgins whose sole purpose is to pleasure them for all eternity. They also have access to boys an young men who they can sexually abuse to their hearts content. AND they get a perpetual hard on that lasts for eternity. This is every adolescent males biggest wet dream.

3) Women are nothing more than property and chattel, who should not be educated, should not drive and who are fit for nothing more than breeding purposes; pushing out baby Muslim men... all the better to take over the world my dear. If these Muslim women get out of line, their Muslim men have the power to beat them, punish them as they see fit and divorce them any old time they feel like it by repeating three times the magic words: "I divorce you, I divorce you, I divorce you." Women also have no right to sexual pleasure because it poses a temptation for them. Therefore, they should have the clitorises God so foolishly gave them violently torn from their bodies ASAP.

Anyone in their right mind reading the above dictates of this perverse so-called "religion" would say that those who believe or follow this stuff belong in an institution, but rather than call it what it is; the religion of Satan, our PC politicians and the MSM perversely call Islam: "The (so-called)Religion of Peace"! Peace my necktie; Islam and it's followers are responsible for the overwhelming majority of terror, violence, war and death in the world today.

There is nothing complex about Islam... people just do not want to face reality regarding how evil it really is and those who follow it, don't want you or the "infidels" of this world to know what they REALLY believe, follow, practice and teach because if you did, you, along with the world would fight them to the death, which is exactly what it is going to come to in the very near future.

14 posted on 12/16/2006 7:52:14 PM PST by Jmouse007 (Convert, Slavery or Death = "Islam the Religion of Peace tm" "It's time to play Cowboys and Muslims")
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To: Valin

"I know you trying to be witty and sarcastic but actually they do."

They do not.


15 posted on 12/16/2006 7:52:17 PM PST by EnochPowellWasRight
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To: outofstyle

Who has that graphic "All I need to know about Islam, I learned on 911?


16 posted on 12/16/2006 8:03:38 PM PST by babygene (Never look into the laser with your last good eye...)
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To: Valin

Now, which branch acknowledges original sin, and repentance through personal relationship with the holy spirit, and receiving forgiveness, without having to earn it, but given freely by the grace of God?


17 posted on 12/16/2006 8:04:42 PM PST by seastay
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To: Valin
They all pray to their cult leader. What more do I need to know?


18 posted on 12/16/2006 8:05:13 PM PST by Jeff Gordon (History convinces me that bad government results from too much government. - Thomas Jefferson)
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To: Valin
The religion of satan, dictated by a lying illiterate murdering theiving pedophile.

Just how complex does it have to be?

19 posted on 12/16/2006 8:06:20 PM PST by rawcatslyentist (When true genius appears, know him by this sign: all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.)
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To: babygene

Who has that graphic "All I need to know about Islam, I learned on 911?


Some slacked jawed mouth breathing moron who has delusions of adequacy probably has it.


20 posted on 12/16/2006 8:08:00 PM PST by Valin (History takes time. It is not an instant thing.)
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To: Valin

"Some slacked jawed mouth breathing moron who has delusions of adequacy probably has it."

Are you a muzzie?


21 posted on 12/16/2006 8:14:01 PM PST by babygene (Never look into the laser with your last good eye...)
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To: Valin
The Wahhabis are not bad; they are merely afraid of straying from what they believe to be the righteous path. I don't agree with their philosophy and firmly believe there are many paths to righteousness, but I am not their judge.

Wahhabis are not bad??? WTF.

A prefect example of why major parts of Islam is a religion that will never be brought into the modern world.

If this author can't even judge the most brutal and regressive form of Islam and call it what it is.

There will be no reform

22 posted on 12/16/2006 8:15:56 PM PST by Popman ("What I was doing wasn't living, it was dying. I really think God had better plans for me.")
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To: babygene
Who has that graphic "All I need to know about Islam, I learned on 911?

Here you are:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/1736879/posts#15

23 posted on 12/16/2006 8:16:13 PM PST by A. Pole (Saint Augustine: "The truth speaks from the bottom of the heart without the noise of words")
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To: Valin

In other words: They make it up as they go along.


24 posted on 12/16/2006 8:17:02 PM PST by Cogadh na Sith (There's an open road from the cradle to the tomb.)
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To: A. Pole

Thanks


25 posted on 12/16/2006 8:18:12 PM PST by babygene (Never look into the laser with your last good eye...)
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To: Valin
all thalalahs are destined for hellfire.

I thought Donna Thalalah was Secretary of Education under Clinton. I'd send her to hellfire....

26 posted on 12/16/2006 8:18:31 PM PST by Cogadh na Sith (There's an open road from the cradle to the tomb.)
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To: bukkdems

Thank you!
Go to consang.net and we Will all finally realize our peril


27 posted on 12/16/2006 8:21:08 PM PST by acapesket (never had a vote count in all my years here)
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To: Fred Nerks
Islam is Mohammadism. The 'religion' follows the precepts of Muhammed, its prophet. Read into his life and one will find it is followed religiously.
28 posted on 12/16/2006 8:26:08 PM PST by BIGLOOK (Keelhauling is a sensible solution to mutiny.)
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To: Valin

It's funny how I don't see the complexity as a concern, I'm kind of base and un-nuanced sometimes.

They have brainwashed their populations that Jews use the blood of palestinian children to make bread, their children have American and Israeli flags that they use as doormats at the entrances of their classrooms.

These people have been brainwashed into a dangerous death cult, we should have stopped it a LOT sooner, but now we face a choice. Us or Them.

It is time for the Hiroshima/Nagasaki wake up call to these populations.

America is the most powerful nation in the world and can wipe you off the face of the map in less than a week. If you don't rebel against your radical theocracies we will keep killing you until you submit. I thought this was a GLOBAL WAR ON TERROR, not a friggin' pillow fight.

The terrorists at the outset of this "Global War" predicted when American soldiers started coming home in body bags that the American public would lose their stomach for war, with willing propaganda from the AMERICAN media, their prediction has come true.

Are we willing to walk away depressed, with our tail between our legs saying there is no way we can win this war while they ululate and celebrate in the streets? Making their terrorist theocratic leaders MORE powerful?

Or are we willing to kill a few million of them in one day, let THEIR people lose THEIR stomach for war, let THEM walk away depressed and say there is no way WE can win this war against the most powerful, technologically advanced nation in the world?

Right now it seems the answer to this question is the former. Unless we choose the latter we will RUE THE DAY we did not decimate our enemy while we had weapons of mass destruction and they didn't.


29 posted on 12/16/2006 8:27:26 PM PST by word_warrior_bob
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To: outofstyle
The Hanbali school believes in killing infidels without raising taxes.

Hey, I'll sign up for that.

Oh, wait. I'm not sure they mean the same thing that I do by "infidel".

30 posted on 12/16/2006 8:27:48 PM PST by mhx
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To: Valin

If The Wahhabis are finding most Islamic education in the USA and England, does it matter what other sects say? No one doubts the malevalence of the Wahabbis sect, since it has fueled Al Kayda.


31 posted on 12/16/2006 8:30:24 PM PST by RobbyS ( CHI)
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To: Valin

What a load of BS.I only one thing that Islam is incompatible with Western civilization and the sooner we realse that the better we will be.


32 posted on 12/16/2006 8:33:01 PM PST by puppypusher
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To: EnochPowellWasRight

"Because holy war is an obligation of the faith, it is elaborately regulated in the shari'a. Fighters in a jihad are enjoined not to kill women, children, and the aged unless they attack first, not to torture or mutilate prisoners,..."
Dr. Bernard Lewis "The Crisis of islam"

"Do not kill any old person, any child or any woman" (Abu Dawud). "Do not kill the monks in monasteries" or "Do not kill the people who are sitting in places of worship" (Musnad of Ibn Hanbal).

During a war, the Prophet saw the corpse of a woman lying on the ground and observed: "She was not fighting. How then she came to be killed?" From this statement of the Prophet the exegetists and jurists have drawn the principle that those who are non-combatants should not be killed during or after the war.



If anyone killed a person not in retaliation for murder or to spread mischief in the land, it would be as if he killed the whole of mankind. And (likewise) if anyone saved a life, it would be as if he saved the whole of mankind"
(Surah Al-Maaida 5:32)


33 posted on 12/16/2006 8:34:55 PM PST by Valin (History takes time. It is not an instant thing.)
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To: puppypusher

Well when it comes to BS I have to defer to a true expert such as yourself. As you are if not full of it, you do a very good impersonation of someone who is.


34 posted on 12/16/2006 8:37:21 PM PST by Valin (History takes time. It is not an instant thing.)
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To: babygene

No, I am a Christian. And what does that have to do with the price of tea in china?


35 posted on 12/16/2006 8:41:37 PM PST by Valin (History takes time. It is not an instant thing.)
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To: Valin

Well when it comes to BS I have to defer to a true expert such as yourself. As you are if not full of it, you do a very good impersonation of someone who is.

_______


If you put the word Radical in front of Islam would he still be full of it?

There are whole populations who are brainwashed beyond repair. We can't hire 500 million deprogrammers to sit in a locked hotel room with all of thes people for a month.

There is a disturbing percentage of muslims who are incompatable with Western Civilization, the Nazi's never hit New York and Washington, the muslims did.

We decimated the enemies countries in World War II, why can't we decimate the enemies countries now? Especially when we have weapons of mass destruction. Would you have trusted Hitler to be judicious in his use of nuclear weapons? Are we willing to trust this new crop of Hitlers to be judicious in THEIR use of nuclear weapons once they get their hands on them?


36 posted on 12/16/2006 8:47:27 PM PST by word_warrior_bob
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To: outofstyle

I don't care if Islam has one or ten thousand different schools of thought. They still don't get along with anyone else. They still think it their duty to kill all others who don't believe as they do.
It is a death cult not a religion.


37 posted on 12/16/2006 8:47:41 PM PST by smoketree (the insanity, the lunacy these days)
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To: word_warrior_bob

We decimated the enemies countries in World War II, why can't we decimate the enemies countries now? Especially when we have weapons of mass destruction.


Two points
Question: And then what?
Question which countries would that be?

See my tagline.


38 posted on 12/16/2006 8:51:51 PM PST by Valin (History takes time. It is not an instant thing.)
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To: Valin
The Wahhabis are not bad; they are merely afraid of straying from what they believe to be the righteous path.

Sounds like the red crescent aclu.

I don't agree with their philosophy and firmly believe there are many paths to righteousness, but I am not their judge.

Nope. YHWH will judge them, I suspect harshly.

39 posted on 12/16/2006 8:58:30 PM PST by ModelBreaker
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To: Valin

Also the weapons used in WWII were quite different as was the infiltratin of the enemy all over the globe.
If the Nazi's had smuggled several nuclear weapons into the US we might have lost. The fact that large armies had to be moved long distances to have enough force to prevail is not true today.
The spread of Muslims all over the globe means that a possible army exists everywhere if some event galvanizes the masses of followers of Islam to act.
Say for instance we do nuke several Muslim countries including Mecca. There would be tremendous outrage perhaps enough to cause worldwide battles on small and larger scales.
That was not the case during WWII.


40 posted on 12/16/2006 8:59:37 PM PST by smoketree (the insanity, the lunacy these days)
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To: Valin

It's like debating which color shoes the beheaders are wearing -- doesn't make a speck of difference, really. We DO understand Islam, all that we ever needed to know. No confusion here in the West whatsoever....


41 posted on 12/16/2006 8:59:52 PM PST by bboop (Stealth Tutor)
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To: Valin

We decimated the enemies countries in World War II, why can't we decimate the enemies countries now? Especially when we have weapons of mass destruction.


Two points
Question: And then what?
Question which countries would that be?

_______

First Iran, and then what? If they don't submit to our wishes and dismantle all of their armies the way Germany did, hit them again, rinse, repeat, until they're all dead or their populations overthrow their regime, or they surrender completely.

Any sabre rattling by any other lunatic country gets the same treatment.

History takes time?

Yes, ignore the Nazi threat and it takes a LOT more time and death to destroy the menace.

The Emperor thought he was God, so did a good portion of his population, Hiroshima and Nagasaki showed them he wasn't and the cold slap of reality hit them between the eyes, how much time did that history take before they surrendered.

Let history repeat itself before needless millions die, crush the enemy until they lose their will and surrender, I thought this was a war.

Or we can let this process play itself out until they get nuclear capability and kill millions of Americans and THEN use overwhelming force, I prefer my history quick.

Do you really think there is any long term resolution to the muslim problem, I don't. The only thing they understand and respect is power and force, give it to them until they surrender and disarm. They are a threat to the world and need to be disarmed.


42 posted on 12/16/2006 9:00:52 PM PST by word_warrior_bob
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To: word_warrior_bob

A proper start would be to make Islam illegal since it is a proven menace.


43 posted on 12/16/2006 9:04:35 PM PST by smoketree (the insanity, the lunacy these days)
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To: Valin
"During a war, the Prophet saw the corpse of a woman lying on the ground and observed: "She was not fighting. How then she came to be killed?""

Ah, but the "prophet" clearly saw the women and children of the tribes he subjugated as "fighting", considering the way he treated them.

"From this statement of the Prophet the exegetists and jurists have drawn the principle that those who are non-combatants should not be killed during or after the war."

Define "noncombatant" for them. Reference to Sura 9, the Sura that abrogated the previous ones.

"If anyone killed a person not in retaliation for murder or to spread mischief in the land, it would be as if he killed the whole of mankind. And (likewise) if anyone saved a life, it would be as if he saved the whole of mankind""

I was hoping that you'd bring out this old chestnut. Now, quote the whole thing.
44 posted on 12/16/2006 9:07:23 PM PST by EnochPowellWasRight
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To: Valin
Complexity of Islam feeds misinterpretation

another dazzle 'em with bullshit* article.

I know for a fact that the majority of the adherents of islam are ignorant, stupid, primitive, murdering savages, which they have been proving daily for genrations.

The only time they have not been thus is when they have been decisively stomped into the mud, where they are more at home: Lepanto, the Siege of Vienna.

What complex about that?

* BULLSHIT*

45 posted on 12/16/2006 9:20:27 PM PST by Publius6961 (MSM: Israelis are killed by rockets; Lebanese are killed by Israelis.)
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To: Valin

It seems the Nuke Mecca Crowd is content to dismiss an article based on its title alone. For those of us who read it, it was very interesting.

And FYI, some branches of the Maliki school are so conservative that they dissuade proselytizing by Muslims who live in non-Muslim lands.


46 posted on 12/16/2006 9:32:45 PM PST by zimdog
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To: Valin
I may not be a genius like you but I do remember my History growing up in the 1970's and seeing the savagery at the Munich summer Olympic games created by your Muslim pals.

Then there is the Disaster that Jimmah Carter put us through with the Iranian Terrorist takeover of the U.S. embassy and the kidnapping of the staff for 400+ days.Thank god for Ronald Reagan.

Than we had the disastrous Clinton Administration and the terror attacks that Killed Hundreds of American's Prior to the attacks on the World Trade Center.

Now when you take those Violent attacks and then Listen to what your enemy has to say it won't take a genius to No that Islam Is incompatible with Western Civilization.

So sorry I ruffled your feathers there.
47 posted on 12/16/2006 9:33:07 PM PST by puppypusher
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To: Valin

"I don't expect many in the West to know or care about the differences between Islamic schools"

EXACTIMENTE!!!

In the long run, they main difference is an argument about best to forcibly spread their contagion - and enforce it.


48 posted on 12/16/2006 9:35:24 PM PST by ZULU (Non nobis, non nobis, Domine, sed nomini tuo da gloriam. God, guts, and guns made America great.)
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To: zimdog
And FYI, some branches of the Maliki school are so conservative that they dissuade proselytizing by Muslims who live in non-Muslim lands.

Wow.
Funny thing is, no one is jumping up and down wanting to nuke them.

It's the other 99.9% of the killer maggots.

49 posted on 12/16/2006 9:36:29 PM PST by Publius6961 (MSM: Israelis are killed by rockets; Lebanese are killed by Israelis.)
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To: bboop

"No confusion here in the West whatsoever...."

Plenty of confusion in our understanding of Islam. If we realized what Islam was all about we would immediately refuse entry of any Muslim.


50 posted on 12/16/2006 9:40:42 PM PST by 353FMG (I never met a liberal I didn't dislike.)
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