Marijuana Top U.S. Cash Crop at $35 Billion

NewsMax ^ | Dec. 18, 2006 | Reuters

[Wolfie]

I had this, uh, friend of mine, yeah, that's it...who grew his own supply for awhile. Usually planted 6, and ended up with 3 or 4 females for harvest. Grew 'em in a very small "light box" using flouresecent tubes. The plants never got more than 12 in. tall. Harvested about an ounce every 90 days, which was more than enough. Very high quality stuff, and not too much to it from a technical standpoint. But, we're talking felony "manufacturing" here, so he went back to the Black Market.

[Zakeet]

Interesting. Thanks.

[TKDietz]

Ninety days from seed to mature flower and your friend was able to keep these plants started from seed at one foot in height or less? Sounds like your friend is either telling "fish stories" or he had some special seeds and he really knew what he was doing. From what I've read and heard from people in the know it usually it takes a lot longer to go from seed to mature flower and usually plants started from seed end up being taller than clones because clones tend to be taken from mature plants that are ready to flower. Plants grown from seed have to grow and mature for a couple of months before flowering can be induced, and flowering will take somewhere in the 60 to 90 day range depending on the variety of marijuana grown.

On the other hand, your friend has grown a lot more bud than I have. I've never grown any. So I guess he knows more about it than I do if he says he can grow a one foot tall marijuana plant from seed to mature flowers in 90 days maybe he can. There are apparently new seed varieties, "Lowryder" being one of them, that are supposed to be able to finish really small and in a good bit less than 90 days. Those are new though, so maybe your friend hasn't been out of the pot growing scene as long as he says he has.

[shempy]

I have had many many samples of home grown weed back in the day. You are right that some growers take quality to the extreme. But really, marijuana is primarily a THC delivery vehicle. With the latest strains of seeds that are designed for indoor growing, you can very easily have potent smokable weed in just 6 to 8 weeks. It may not qualify as a High Times centerfold, but it will almost assuredly beat the standard mexican brick weed.

I suppose I over stated the ease, but really, if not any idiot, any relatively normal person could grow marijuana and be fairly successful. With legalization would come a whole array of products that would simplify the process further. The all-in-one grow systems actually work quite well. With a wider market they would improve.

[TKDietz]

Maybe, but these are cheap Mexicans we're talking about. I doubt they'd spend good money on a fancy press when they could fabricate one out of some scrap iron and a car jack. Also, some of these "bricks" are pretty darned big. Usually they're bigger than a standard masonry brick. Some I've seen were a good four to six inches thick and more than one foot by one foot on the sides. At a trial a few months back in my county the prosecutors stacked hundreds of "bricks" that size up in a pile in front of the jury. It was a pretty powerful image for the jury, and everyone else. The smell was just awful. Apparently they had kept this stuff in a leaky shack during the months leading up to the trial. The bundles wrapped in paper and plastic had visible water damage and the smell of mold was enough to knock you down.

[TKDietz]

Do you think most pot smokers would grow their own though? I kind of doubt it. It takes space a lot of people don't have, not to mention time and effort and money. I think if it was legal and people could just go to the pot shop and choose from a wide variety of quality product most would just buy it when they wanted it. I think that after a while there would be popular brands or at least varieties difficult to replicate at home, and people would for the most part stick with their favorite brands. It will be kind of the same thing we see with beer today.

Most pot smokers don't smoke that much anyway. Our government estimates that the average "current" smoker consumes approximately seven grams each month. A study in Holland of regular smokers showed that on average people were smoking around ten grams per month, with of course some smoking much less and some smoking much more. I don't know what the real average is, but I do know that you average working person who smokes a little maybe in the evenings and/or maybe some on weekends probably isn't going through just a whole lot of marijuana all by himself. More occasional smokers probably aren't going through anywhere near seven to ten grams in a month. If people don't smoke that much anyway, and they can get familiar brands and high quality product at the store for a reasonable price, why would they go to the trouble of growing their own?

I think when it becomes legal for the most part the only people we will seeing growing their own will be people who burn through incredible amounts of the stuff and some hobbyist types, the types who brew their own beer. And a lot of those who do grow their own will probably only do it once or twice as was the experience for most of us who tried brewing our own beer. Why go to all that trouble when you can just pop into a store and buy what you want? Pot isn't that expensive today, per "dose" at least. It will be even cheaper if it's legalized even if they do tax the heck out of it.

[Phantom Lord]

Apparently they had kept this stuff in a leaky shack during the months leading up to the trial.

Hey, thats better than some NC cops did a few years ago.

They caught a guy with something like 3,000 lbs of pot. It was more than their local sherrifs office evidence locker could hold. So they took a back hoe, dug a hole, and buried it.

They came back the next morning and it had been dug up and stolen from the cops!

I will try to hunt down the story and link it.

[Phantom Lord]

Found it. It was slightly different than I remembered. But hey, it was 5 years ago.

FBI, Chatham expand search for marijuana Up to $40,000 offered for specific information

PITTSBORO - The FBI is offering a $ 40,000 reward for specific information leading to the arrest and prosecution of those responsible for two thefts totaling nearly 5,000 pounds of marijuana from the Chatham County Sheriff's Department. "We want individuals with specific knowledge to come forth," said Chris Swecker, special agent of the Charlotte division of the FBI. "We actually have an overload of information on this case."

But much of the information has been general information based on innuendo and rumor, he said. "We have pursued a number of leads," he said. "We have some very promising ones." However, Swecker declined to elaborate, saying the investigation is ongoing.

The FBI has been investigating the two thefts since January. The Chatham County Sheriff's Department, in its largest drug bust, confiscated the nearly 5,000 pounds of marijuana from a home in Siler City in February 2000. The marijuana apparently came from Mexico to North Carolina through Texas, Swecker said. The Chatham County Sheriff's Department placed the seized marijuana in the back of an armored 21/2-ton truck that was parked behind the department. "The marijuana was stored in the truck because of storage problems," Sheriff Ike Gray said.

Gray said the evidence room could not accommodate the 20- to 40-pound bundles of marijuana, which had an estimated street value of half a million dollars, so in September, Sheriff's Department officials drove the truck full of marijuana to the county's landfill. When they opened the back of the truck, they saw that about 3,000 pounds of the marijuana was missing.

After notifying the Sheriff's Department about the missing marijuana, they buried the remaining marijuana - about 2,000 pounds - in a pit at the landfill. Several weeks later, it was discovered that the buried marijuana had been stolen from the landfill. Gray said the procedure for seized marijuana is now to burn it.

The FBI has found no evidence connecting the two thefts, Swecker said, saying that the agency also has more information about the theft from the landfill than the theft from the truck.

"With the truck in the parking lot, virtually anyone could have had access," Swecker said. A side window of the truck was broken, and the padlock on the back of the truck was left intact, he said. However, he said, the FBI has "subjects involved in the landfill theft."

"There were five to 10 people involved with burying the marijuana," he said.

While the FBI has been investigating the Sheriff's Department, it also has been looking elsewhere, he said, saying the early focus on the Sheriff's Department was based on the logical sequence of the investigation. "It's very normal to start with the agency that's missing the drugs," Swecker said. "We always start the investigation with those who have had access to the drugs. We're not just looking at the Sheriff's Department."

Swecker said the department has been helpful in the investigation, granting about a dozen interviews. He also said Gray voluntarily took a polygraph test. "He has set the tone, and that's good," Swecker said. "We were asked into this investigation. [Sheriff Gray] has called me just about every week to see how things are going. Not everyone wants the FBI tramping in their back yard, but Sheriff Gray invited us." The Sheriff's Department has been criticized for the thefts of the marijuana, and one county commissioner, Rick Givens, has said he was considering running for sheriff.

"Our department has been under scrutiny since this thing started," Gray said. "Some employees have been ridiculed as a result of the missing marijuana. "My approach is to get the confidence back in this department. We want 100 percent cooperation to vindicate this department."

Copyright 2001 The Durham Herald Co., Chapel Hill Herald

There is more good stuff at the link.

[shempy]

When it becomes legal most people will buy it as opposed to grow it, I agree with that. But only if it is kept cheap.

I just hate to see people argue for legalization by talking up the tax revenue end of the debate. I favor legalization first and foremost as an issue of freedom. Taxes and regulations are the opposite of freedom in my view, so that end of the debate is annoying. Selling the notion that freedom is good because of the tax revenue it raises seems very oxy-moronic to me.

The tax revenue legalizers are almost as annoying as the "pot is medicine" crowd. I really don't care if some people use it as medicine. It should be legal because the government doesn't own my body and they should have no say in what I choose to put into it.

[TKDietz]

I was thinking about this some more and what I really think will happen when it becomes legal is that hash will become much more popular than regular marijuana. They'll grow pot on a huge scale with plants tightly packed in the fields like corn. They'll have bred this marijuana not only for reasonably high THC levels, but also for good fiber in the stalks or high yielding oil seed, or both. They'll mechanically harvest these fields, dry the product, extract the resin, and use the seeds and fibrous stalks for industrial or other purposes. They'll blend the resins to achieve the desired taste, smell, and potency, and probably some nasty additives, and then they'll press it all into blocks or sheets and cut out and package a uniform product they can market to the masses. That's the way we do things. We process the heck out of everything. Fancy manicured buds are too labor intensive to produce. Big business will want to mechanize the process and high grade connoisseur buds will be high end luxury items marketed in boutique shops to people that can afford them. The average Joe pot smoker will be buying his usual brand of cheap processed hash, just like he buys his Marlboros and his Miller Light, or generic smokes and cheap beer. Tastes will change, brand loyalties will develop, and people won't want crappy homegrown from someone's backyard anymore than they'd want his homegrown tobacco or home brewed beer.

[TKDietz]

I think it's as important to talk about tax issues as it is all the money we are wasting trying to enforce marijuana prohibition. Tax is a fact of life. It is also a fact of life that it costs money to regulate an industry. Regulations are also unfortunately a fact of life. This industry would be regulated, and the money to do that would have to come from somewhere. Taxes and excises that will surely be imposed would no doubt cover the cost of regulating the industry and more. Income and sales tax paid by the regulators and all of those working in the industry would also contribute to general tax revenues, and of course their incomes will also add money to our economy. As it is this industry is entirely unregulated and entirely untaxed. It is run in large part by organized crime and an awful lot of the money made ends up in the hands of criminals in Mexico. Not regulating this industry costs us money that could be either better utilized by the government or turned back over to us in the form of tax cuts. That's certainly not the only argument for legalizing marijuana, but it is an important point that has to be made.

[Uriah]

Wait Wait......I'll remember in a second

[shempy]

I suppose taxes and government intrusion on business are just facts of life and I should just accept that. I suppose I should adopt a similar view point on abortion, gun control, public education, and socialized medicine. But no matter how hard I try, I can't.

I would rather marijuana remain illegal than have 60% of my cost go to our bloated government. At least with it illegal the majority of the price I pay goes to brazen capitalists instead of pandering socialists. And really, the market place works - even for (or maybe especially for) illegal produce. Name a highly taxed and regulated product that has consistently dropped in price the last twenty years like pot has.

[robertpaulsen]

None of the domestic is exported?

[TKDietz]

"I suppose taxes and government intrusion on business are just facts of life and I should just accept that."

Nothing wrong with fighting for less of both, but yes regulation and taxes are pretty much a fact of life. It was that way long before either of us was born and it will be that way long after you and I die. The only reason the marijuana industry is not regulated and taxed is that it's an illegal underground industry. If it was legal, we'd probably see regulation and laws governing the industry very much like those that exist for alcoholic beverages. It's a given that there will be regulation, and taxes too for that matter. To varying degrees, all industries are regulated. You know that and I know that. Our government loves to add new regulations and it always seem to work out that even if they get rid of old regulations they always seem to come up with even more new ones. Republicans are almost as bad over-regulating and over-taxing as Democrats, so whether we like it or not we're just going to see more of the same in future. We'd better get used to it.

"I would rather marijuana remain illegal than have 60% of my cost go to our bloated government. At least with it illegal the majority of the price I pay goes to brazen capitalists instead of pandering socialists."

I'd rather see law abiding citizens reaping most of the rewards from this industry. I read a government report on Morocco recently. They estimate that something like 700,000 or 800,000 Moroccans are employed in their illegal hashish industry. I don't know how many are employed in the American marijuana industry but it's probably a lot and a legal industry could open up several hundred thousand or more legal jobs here. These jobs would benefit law abiding productive working Americans rather than the criminal element. I represent a lot of these guys and while they certainly aren't all just terrible people the high profits in this illegal business attract some really bad news criminals. Some of the profits still benefit local communities but much of this money goes to finance further criminal enterprise. A lot of it goes to Mexico and benefits the thugs that have the Mexican government by the throat. Make no mistake about it, Mexican organized crime run the lion's share of the drug trade in this country. They're bringing in most of the cocaine, meth, heroin, marijuana, etc.. They're involved with a lot of harmful activities and the higher ups especially in these organizations can be some bloodthirsty murderous jerks who use fear and intimidation and murder to get what they want, when they're not bribing and corrupting government officials. They have a lot of power in Mexico and this country. I like the idea of taking this business from them and giving it to good law abiding Americans who will spend their earnings in our communities. That benefits us all even if they do have to pay Caesar his due.

"And really, the market place works - even for (or maybe especially for) illegal produce. Name a highly taxed and regulated product that has consistently dropped in price the last twenty years like pot has."

I don't think it has consistently dropped in price over the last twenty years. Regardless, it could be a heck of a lot cheaper if legal. Production costs will drop through the floor when they start mass producing pot on a wide scale and employing modern agricultural magic. They'll have to tax the crap out of it to keep prices where they are now, and if they tax it too much they'll just encourage a thriving black market, so it may very well work out that marijuana is cheaper for those who want to buy it. With competing products on the shelves quality of that available will improve, as of course will the variety of choices for consumers. That sounds more like a market place that works than what is currently out there.

[cryptical]

None of the domestic is exported?

Not enough to matter, cite if you think otherwise.

[hosepipe]

[ No wonder so many Americans fall for the most ridiculous nonsense such as human caused global warming or 9/11 conspiracy theories. ]

or vote for democrats and Rinos..

[robertpaulsen]

"If the Federal government removed the laws banning MJ cultivation, consumption, and sale, farms producing the product would explode and massive multinational companies would be buying up the contracts for the mature plants to process, package, and sell all over the country. Small specialty shops would be popping up all over the place with their own grown rooms and supply souces. And weekend users would have their own plants going in the basement, attic, and back yard. Friends and family would be trading their products with eachother for comparrison. Actual street value of MJ for an individual, private transaction would plummet."

Wow! What an adventure! Manufacturing plants being built, stores opening up, availability everywhere, prices plummeting ... just, wow!

Now, other than the dopers, who wants this? Seriously, other than the 5% of adults who occasionally smoke pot, who would vote for this?

You think parents want this? Employers? Anyone with half a brain? And, if marijuana, why not other recreational drugs -- can't you make exactly the same argument for them? Or are you willing to be labeled a hypocrite in exchange for the legalization of marijuana?

We tried to prohibit alcohol and that didn't work. We're stuck with the misery and suffering caused by that legal drug. That doesn't mean we have to voluntarily add to the problem.

[robertpaulsen]

"Gettman said the 10-fold increase in U.S. marijuana production, from 1,000 metric tons in 1981 to 10,000 metric tons in 2006, showed the country was failing to control marijuana by making its cultivation and use illegal."

According to the chart below, the actual number of marijuana users fell from around 21 million to around 15 million in the same time frame. So, you would have me believe that existing users increased their marijuana intake by a factor of 13? Houston, we have a problem!

[robertpaulsen]

"I was under the assumption that the state government sold all medical marijuana in California, so could the price not plummeting be due to the government monopoly on marijuana?"

I don't believe the State of California sells marijuana. Or gives it away.

According to Proposition 215, medical marijuana was not to be sold by anyone. It could be grown by the user. It could be grown by a designated caregiver -- that caregiver could grow for a number of medical marijuana users. It could be grown by a co-op. But it could not be sold.

It IS being sold by private companies and individuals, and local law enforcement is looking the other way. The system will self-implode in a few years. Already, people are getting upset with the blatant commercialism.