Posted on 12/24/2006 12:10:18 PM PST by A. Pole
bump for after Christmas reading
Bump to read after Christmas and try to figure out what is really going on with this President...I feel worse about him every week.
Not so fast.
Today’s immigrants differ greatly from historic immigrant populations. Prior to 1960, immigrants to the U.S. had education levels that were similar to those of the non-immigrant workforce and earned wages that were, on average, higher than those of non-immigrant workers. Since the mid-1960s, however, the education levels of new immigrants have plunged relative to non-immigrants; consequently, the average wages of immigrants are now well below those of the non-immigrant population. Recent immigrants increasingly occupy the low end of the U.S. socio-economic spectrum.[2]
The current influx of poorly educated immigrants is the result of two factors: first, a legal immigration system that favors kinship ties over skills and education; and second, a permissive attitude toward illegal immigration that has led to lax border enforcement and non-enforcement of the laws that prohibit the employment of illegal immigrants. In recent years, these factors have produced an inflow of some ten and a half million immigrants who lack a high school education. In terms of increased poverty and expanded government expenditure, this importation of poorly educated immigrants has had roughly the same effect as the addition of ten and a half million native-born high school drop-outs.From here.
Apparently your opinion is not defensible.
BTTT
And you seem to confuse education with intelligence, hard work, initiative, and entrepreneurship. There is a big difference between those who were offered opportunity and refused it, and those who have never been offered it.
So let's continue with the comparison. Take a large number of American high school dropouts. Put them in Mexico and tell them that to get back to the US, they need to cross 100 miles of rocky desert, will be refused at the border if they try to cross normally, and if they are seen by a policeman will be sent back.
I would give you high odds that most of the American dropouts would end up staying in Mexico, very few even leaving the neighborhood where they found themselves. In short order they would be derelicts, begging for food, and desperately asking other Americans to help them get home.
Is there any comparison with the vast number of Mexican who pass through those same obstacles in a tireless effort to find employment, any employment? Who will hold two and three jobs, networking to find better work, get papers and become legal, and while living in fear in an underground existence?
Yes, America has long recognized that things other than a paper education make good quality immigrants. And we still should. Worthless, lazy peasants should get a one-way ticket out of the country. But there should be a means in which hard working people who already have much at stake in the US, should have an opportunity to expediently get citizenship without having to leave the country and wait for their ten most profitable years while their application is allowed to mellow.
Hell, right now, if the US offered citizenship to foreigners living here in good standing, for $30,000 cash, that they speak fluent English, and can pass our other citizenship requirements, we would get so many applicants that they could easily pay for the entire border fence in a year.
They *want* to be here legally. If they are hard working, industrious, and have through their labor earned lots of money, we should be happy to take them. They are winners.
Losers we should send back to Mexico.
Ah yes. The old "it's just like the Irish" argument.
Did Ireland have a centuries old claim on North America?
Did they lose it in a war against the same people they came to live with?
Did they come in such numbers that they literally outnumbered the people whose country they came to live in within 1 generation?
I could go on and on. But safe to say your analogies fall apart under even simple analysis. And for those of us who have had to live with the real effects of this hostile, vicious, hate filled invasion from a brutal and corrupt society - like having members of our families assaulted, kidnapped, almost murdered (like mine) - your soothing, cooing words ring ugly and empty like the cheap salesguy you are.
By the way...one of the first rights of any democracy is to decide who is part of that democracy, the right of free association. As far as "These are people who came here to stay", when did we vote to have them stay with us and ultimately demand to rule us?
In what way are Americans free when Mexicans vote in their elections, occupy offices in our government, even become police because of sickening, un-Constitutional preferences for them over us?
You obviously have an agenda. And that agenda is, "don't worry little people, everything will be alright when we take over. You're gonna enjoy working for us, just get used to it...". So you're busted, pal. A liar with an agenda is all you are.
And as for this statement:
they tend to form mafias and street gangs
My family(s) have been here for going on 3 centuries and they are still, for the most part, the same Protestant, honorable rural people that they have always been since they stepped off the wooden boats that brought them. I know of no generation that went through this "phase" you claim is normal. They came from civilized societies and they remained and remain civilized.
It was only when we went weak and allowed in the un-Civilized that the phenomenon you speak of occurred.
Excellent post!
Ping!
The U.S. should stop illegal immigration and should restrict immigration to only highly qualified and productive folks. IIRC, you're a worthy immigrant -- technically qualified and produtive, exactly the type that should be encouraged to come in.
Luxembourg has a huge amount of legal immigration as it is one of the centres of the EU, so tons of money pours in from THAT front. It's also a top-notch banking location (think Switzerland, only more secretive) and you have highly qualified bankers coming to L'bourg. Those are the kinds of people needed in the US.
That's a nice list of your opinions there, I wish it was true.
As for this one:
"Mexico itself is showing signs of tremendous social disorder"
Showing signs? More Americans kidnapped by Mexico in 6 months than the 3 years in Iraq. Mexico is second only to murdered journalist. #1 is Iraq. They're right up there in beheadings as well.
BTTT
It must be terribly hard to be so bitter.
So, you say that members of your family have been attacked, even murdered by Mexicans? Tragic. Lots of people feel the same way about black Americans. But if you assign individual acts of violence against an entire race, your injury is far deeper than a physical one.
And yet, onto your other arguments, history well establishes what I said as true. Indeed there have been Italian, Irish, German, and Jewish gangs and mafias, all related to waves of immigration. But over time, assimilation and integration has tempered much of that problem.
No reason to expect different from Mexicans. And, BTW, only a tiny fraction of those living in America join the Aztlan movement, embrace la raza as such, want part of America to return to Mexico or secede, or other such nonsense promulgated by nuts.
Teddy Kennedy, I might add, wanted the US to abandon Vietnam and invade northern Ireland to drive the British army out. You know these Irish immigrants, so hot headed.
Good Post!
BTTT
Yeah. That's the kind of smirking, sneering contempt I expected from someone like you.
No lie, Pinche, just fact.
And as far as "Mexican" being a race, that's a truly laughable conceit. I guess you and your buddies can use that to dress yourselves in victim's clothing. Every criminal has an excuse for his behavior, why not make it an excuse for a whole nation of criminals?
Your response to the reality of my post outs you. Why you're posting on a largely conservative website I can't fathom. Guess you're the ultimate troll. You think horrific crimes are no big deal? That's sort of the defining idea of liberalism.
Truly nauseating. You and your buddies have good hunting in the coming year, OK? Lots of victims out there for you to prey on. Don't worry, the ACLU, MALDEF, LULAC - all your brigades - they'll be shilling for you. You should do well.
It's who you are.
"I would prefer indepence myself for Puerto Rico"
Hello again. I promised to get back to you.
Less than 5% of the electorate vote for the Puerto Rico Independence Party in each election. In fact, that party lost its certification in the last election because they didn't raise enough votes. They had to go through a recertification process, in the nature of a signature drive, in order to restore their franchise.
Independence is not an option.
The rest of the votes are about equally divided between the status quo party and the statehood party (there's no Republican v. Democrat tradition here), so there's no overwhelming majority for either status. And that's our fault, not being able to raise an overwhelming majority in favor of statehood. Yet.
Please remember that aside from regular elections, the only way to measure support for either status has been through locally produced referenda. These votes have been mere beauty contests, where the status quo supporters have been able to insert an impossible version of "commonwealth" which in fact have resulted in a poison pill for the process.
Since in accordance with the Constitution Congress retains sovereignity over the non-state territories, and since through the Insular Cases the courts have given sort of permanence to this state of affairs, there exists a pretty serious deficit of democracy in the nation that bills itself as the champion of democracy around the world.
And that's the fundamental problem. There exists a significant portion of the population of the United States of America who enjoys only "those rights which Congress chooses to accord them".
And since only Congress can change this sad state of affairs, it is entirely responsible for mantaining a colonial and despotical regime in the United States. Congess has never made any significant steps towards changing this. This is not fair not only for over four million American citizens in the territories, but also for the rest of the American taxpayers.
My problem with the article subject of this thread is that it states that there are no more than one class of citizenship in America, when in fact there are.
I'll give you just one example:
You are an American citizen living in a state. You move to France tomorrow and you can still cast an absentee vote in the state you left behind. But if you move to Puerto Rico, a US territory whose citizens are born Americans, you automatically lose your right to vote in your state's and federal elections through an absentee vote. You would be in a political limbo, where Congress makes laws that apply to you but you cannot do anything about it through a representative or a senator. Your Commander in Chief can send you to war but you couldn't vote him in or out of office.
Hope you and your family had a wonderful Christmas and best wishes for 2007.
Okay, let's cut to the chase. You are a racist. I tried to be nice about your obvious issues.
I truly doubt that, plural, members of your family have been attacked by Mexicans. Unless you see just their living near you to be an attack. You use the same language of racial hate that segregationists used to.
If you aren't, then you had better seriously reconsider how you say what you say.
I live in Phoenix. There are lots of ethnic Mexicans here. But, come to think of it, there are a lot of Vietnamese here. After the fall of Saigon, we got 30,000 Vietnamese in one month, and nobody noticed.
Yes, I am aware that as late as the 1940s, the Mexican government said that the difference between a Mexican and an Indian was that a Mexican wore shoes.
But out of a metro area of 2.5M people, 460 square miles, there are about 6, non-adjacent, one block square areas that are Mexican in character. All the other Mexicans are dispersed through our giant suburbs.
Some are cash workers. Some are minimum wage. Some are blue collar, and some are white collar. Some are just across the border, and some are offended if you call them Mexican, because they are Americans.
The only reason that they held a large march here was because they were seriously afraid that nutballs were going to convince the government to deport 14 Million people. The biggest ethnic cleansing since Stalin.
And yes, there are a lot of wackos out there that think that is a fine idea. Thank God, almost none of them are in the government, or are likely to be.
I have taught in a public high school where an entire room full of kids are ethnically Mexican. Most are Mormon. Many planned to go into the US military on graduation. Their families are conservative and republican.
If you feel threatened by such as them, you are sick in the head.
"Anyway, such a statement is no justification for continued mass immigration. The inference that "We are a nation of immigrants and, therefore, we must not limit immigration" is a classic example of circular argument."
Tell it to Bush...he makes this statement constantly. I guess he thinks if he makes it often enough, we'll believe him.
TAKE BACK AMERICA...NOW
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