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The Hanging: Beyond Travesty
The Washington Post ^ | January 05, 2007 | Charles Krauthammer

Posted on 01/04/2007 9:34:57 PM PST by 21stCenturyFreeThinker

WASHINGTON -- Of the 6 billion people on this earth, not one killed more people than Saddam Hussein. And not just killed, but tortured and mutilated -- doing so often with his own hands and for pleasure. It is quite a distinction to be the pre-eminent monster on the planet. If the death penalty was ever deserved, no one was more richly deserving than Saddam Hussein.

For the Iraqi government to have botched both his trial and execution, therefore, and turned monster into victim, is not just a tragedy, but a crime -- against the new Iraq that Americans are dying for, and against justice itself.

(Excerpt) Read more at realclearpolitics.com ...


TOPICS: Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: capitalpunishment; execution; hanging; hussein; krauthammer; saddam; saddamhussein
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1 posted on 01/04/2007 9:34:59 PM PST by 21stCenturyFreeThinker
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

Something worth doing is worth doing right.


2 posted on 01/04/2007 9:36:24 PM PST by 21stCenturyFreeThinker
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

I love CK, but I disagree with him here. This is what public hangings were like in this country but 80 years ago. Humiliation was/is part of the punishment when one faced/faces the hangman.


3 posted on 01/04/2007 9:37:39 PM PST by Clemenza (Put down that coffee! Coffee is for closers!)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

BTW: Dump the Sunnis, but allow them to share in the oil revenues. Most were loyal to Saddam, and nothing will ever change this.


4 posted on 01/04/2007 9:38:22 PM PST by Clemenza (Put down that coffee! Coffee is for closers!)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

they did do it right - he's dead.


5 posted on 01/04/2007 9:38:22 PM PST by vbmoneyspender
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker
For the Iraqi government to have botched both his trial and execution, therefore, and turned monster into victim, is not just a tragedy, but a crime...

It's all new to them, Charles. Did you learn everything you know overnight? Or even in three and a half years?

Didn't think so.

What matters is that they got the job done and they can move on.

6 posted on 01/04/2007 9:38:42 PM PST by Allegra (Vote Dulcie / Finbar 2008)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

Oh c'mon Charles. They just need more practice. Ease up on 'em. Give 'em time.


7 posted on 01/04/2007 9:39:17 PM PST by Enterprise (Let's not enforce laws that are already on the books, let's just write new laws we won't enforce.)
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To: Clemenza
Most were loyal to Saddam, and nothing will ever change this.

So very untrue.

The task of getting the real truth out of Iraq is an almost insurmountable one.

Will not give up...will not give up...will not give up...

8 posted on 01/04/2007 9:40:46 PM PST by Allegra (Vote Dulcie / Finbar 2008)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker
For the Iraqi government to have botched both his trial and execution, therefore, and turned monster into victim, is not just a tragedy, but a crime -- against the new Iraq that Americans are dying for, and against justice itself.

It's not the Iraqi government who decided to stress the moments in the trial when Sadaam was defiant instead of his atrocities; its the DBM which did that. Every time they showed Sadaam on TV, they could have put him in a small box in the corner and run pictures of mass graves, dead Kurds, human shredders, etc. No, they chose to try to make him an object of sympathy. grrrr

9 posted on 01/04/2007 9:42:38 PM PST by Freee-dame
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

As was posted on a previous thread:

"I thought our mission was to create a viable democracy in Iraq? If so, the chanting of sectarian slogans during Saadam's well deserved end was akin to spitting on our troops. Many have died in an attempt to better than country but the executioners' behavior, as recorded on cell phone cams, makes the task all the more harder."


10 posted on 01/04/2007 9:43:02 PM PST by KantianBurke
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

The hanging looked technically sound, if a little short on decorum.


11 posted on 01/04/2007 9:43:53 PM PST by dighton
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To: KantianBurke

I suppose my plans to make and market a Saddam pinata would be way out of line, then.


12 posted on 01/04/2007 9:45:39 PM PST by Richard Kimball
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker
"..It was also carried out extra-constitutionally. The constitution requires a death sentence to have the signature of the president and two vice presidents, each representing the three major ethnic groups in the country (Sunni, Shiite and Kurd). That provision is meant to prevent sectarian killings. The president did not sign. Maliki contrived some work-around..."

Iraqi president will not sign death warrant for Saddam

".."Personally, no, I won't sign," he told the BBC. But he hinted he may abstain and pass the decision to the two vice-presidents, Adel Abdul Mahdi, a Shia, and Ghazi Yawar, a Sunni Arab, who with him comprise the presidential council. "My two partners in the presidency, the government, the house, all of them are for sentencing Saddam Hussein to death before the court will decide. So, I think I will be alone in this field.".."

The above is from April 19, 2005 and CK should have been aware of the President's position.

13 posted on 01/04/2007 9:47:26 PM PST by Anti-Bubba182
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

The hanging seemed OK to me. A mass murderer was executed. That's all that counts. Saddam didn't deserve a dignified execution

So what if there was some yelling by the Shiites at the execution? Much ado about nothing, same as Abu Ghraib prison with prisoners on a dog leash or wearing panties on their head


14 posted on 01/04/2007 9:50:09 PM PST by dennisw (Don't let your past become your future -- Georges Gurdjieff)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

I disagree with all the pre planned hand wringing over this execution. I watched it and listened. What did anyone expect a hanging of a tyrant to be like our sterile Needle in Vein crap. Plus does anyone remember see the victim impact statements at Geffory Dommers trial. There was much worse said there that at this hanging. Much worse. The whole thing is again a MEDIA jerk circle of stupid people with a propaganda agenda aganist this war. I thought the whole thing was tame. I figured he would be hung in public. Which is what he deserved at the least.


15 posted on 01/04/2007 9:52:51 PM PST by therut
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"For the Iraqi government to have botched both his trial and execution, therefore, and turned monster into victim, is not just a tragedy, but a crime "


??? Being heckled as he died is a 'crime' ???

Its no more than an unfortunate detail.


I really doesnt matter what happened, as the libtard press would find some complaint to whine about. Having a monster like Saddam be put to death is a challenge to all the dolts who think that 'no crime deserves the death sentence'.

Saddam was responsible for his crimes and received Justice, just as the libtards are for theirs and hopefully will also face their own repercussions.
16 posted on 01/04/2007 9:53:36 PM PST by wodinoneeye
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

He's dead.....I'd say they accomplished their goal, and that IS right. SHEESH....the guy had 400,000 people tortured and murdered. I still say he should have been put through a shredder.


17 posted on 01/04/2007 9:54:15 PM PST by goodnesswins (When a "religion" has no commandments.....no wonder no one wants to go to Church on Sunday!)
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To: Clemenza
I love CK, but I disagree with him here. This is what public hangings were like in this country but 80 years ago. Humiliation was/is part of the punishment when one faced/faces the hangman.
If they were only humiliating Saddam it might be one thing, but this is a country on the verge of civil war. Why execute him on the Sunni's major religious holiday? He'd be just as dead if hanged a week later without a bunch of Sadr thugs doing the hanging.

The man was guilty as sin, but our values require he get a fair trial. Imagine what would happen in this country if the government replaced the judge in a trial because they thought he was ruling in favor of the defendant too often?

There's really no reason to fan the flames of civil war.
18 posted on 01/04/2007 9:55:26 PM PST by 21stCenturyFreeThinker
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

"For the Iraqi government to have botched both his trial and execution, therefore, and turned monster into victim"

Pretty well sums it up. The MSM has turned the execution into victimization of Saddam, even though he got a fair trial, had appeals reviewed etc.

The taunting by the guards was no more abusive than the chant "Dead Man Walking" on the Green Mile. Saddam knew who he wronged. Saddam knew those people would seek revenge. He was lucky he got a fair trial at all because the people would have chopped him up in the streets in front of live tv and they would have been just as satisfied justice was served.

Saddam is dead. he got what he deserved. He was a perp, not a victim.


19 posted on 01/04/2007 9:55:52 PM PST by o_zarkman44
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To: wodinoneeye

Oh heck if the left wing kooks could get Bush hung they would say their taunts were FREE SPEECH DUDE!!!!!!!!!!!!


20 posted on 01/04/2007 9:57:05 PM PST by therut
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker
...but this is a country on the verge of civil war.

So says the media.

NOT so says at least one FReeper who has been residing in Baghdad and surrounding areas for the better part of three years.

Just sayin...

21 posted on 01/04/2007 9:58:19 PM PST by Allegra (Vote Dulcie / Finbar 2008)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

Exactly HOW was the trial a travesty? They presented evidence. They gave him a chance to defend himself. They gave him a lawyer. There was a verdict. There was a sentence. He had a chance to appeal. He appealed. His appeal was denied. They carried out the sentence, albeit with a lot of inappropriate behavior at the time he got the drop. Nobody's perfect. Now suddenly, because he acted like he was on the Jerry Springer Show throughout the proceedings, the trial is a travesty? Blow it out your ear.


22 posted on 01/04/2007 9:58:55 PM PST by Eleutheria5
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker
I couldn't agree more with Krauthammer. The just and deserved execution of Saddam Hussein came off as Shiite revenge. The fact that some of Sadr's goons were hand picked by the Iraq government to serve as Saddams's executioners is a definite sign that the Iraqi government has no intention of sharing power with the Sunni's and likely intends to crush them.
23 posted on 01/04/2007 10:01:30 PM PST by TAdams8591
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker
For the Iraqi government to have botched both his trial and execution,

Botched? He was found guilty, which he was; and he died from the hanging. I don't consider that botched.

24 posted on 01/04/2007 10:02:45 PM PST by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

I think Krauthammer gets it all right in this piece.
And that's even while leaving out an entire aspect of why the Trial Of Saddam was so disappointing all the way along its long, long journey to the inevitable guilty decision and subsequent hanging. I didn't expect the trial coverage would be presented like the O.J. trial, but it was just left alone and allowed to happen, through all its bloody twists and turns, and our own government seems to have bowed out of any interest in the actual details of what transpired in the trial. I KNOW (at least as rumored) that we didn't want it to happen as it happened, so suddenly and crudely, with the sectarian revenge motif taking center stage. I recognize the fact, of course, that the Media thinks they own the story, and they could do with it what they wanted: for us to try to control the flow of information and put any kind of spin on it would be judged as propaganda.


25 posted on 01/04/2007 10:04:30 PM PST by supremedoctrine ("Talent hits a target no one else can hit, genius hits a target no one else can see"--Schopenhauer)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

Handwringer alert!


26 posted on 01/04/2007 10:06:16 PM PST by Mad_Tom_Rackham (Well, it's 2007. Time to get ready for 2008.)
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To: wodinoneeye
I really doesnt matter what happened, as the libtard press would find some complaint to whine about
Krauthammer is hardly a liberal.
Saddam was responsible for his crimes and received Justice, just as the libtards are for theirs and hopefully will also face their own repercussions.
This has nothing to do with politics in our country. The Sunni's in Iraq are the ones who feel insulted. Iraq needs a stable government, not a civil war.
27 posted on 01/04/2007 10:06:24 PM PST by 21stCenturyFreeThinker
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To: Clemenza

Precisely. I would think Krauthammer was immune from Leftist tactics by now. Apparently not. Hey, Charles: There should have been MORE taunting for this uber-murderer, like I imagine there was for Mussolini. Solemn is for funerals of worthies. Raucous yelling is for hangings of mass murderers. And has been forever.


28 posted on 01/04/2007 10:09:52 PM PST by JennysCool (Well done, President Ford.)
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To: o_zarkman44
The MSM has turned the execution into victimization of Saddam ...
The MSM isn't the problem here, politics in Iraq are.
Saddam is dead. he got what he deserved. He was a perp, not a victim.
No doubt. But it's amazing they could make this monster look civilized with the whole sloppy process.
29 posted on 01/04/2007 10:13:09 PM PST by 21stCenturyFreeThinker
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To: Enterprise; 21stCenturyFreeThinker
No, this is Krauthammer's bug out. One of the arch neo conservative advocates and apologists of the war is signalling he is getting out of the Iraq trap by gnawing off Maliki's leg.

Funny, how all the neocons who led the charge to get us into this mess can now easily find someone else to blame it on.

We should not be surging American troops in defense of such a government. This governing coalition -- Maliki's Dawa, Hakim's SCIRI and Sadr's Mahdi Army -- seems intent on crushing the Sunnis at all costs. Maliki should be made to know that if he insists on having this sectarian war, he can well have it without us.


30 posted on 01/04/2007 10:16:02 PM PST by nathanbedford ("I like to legislate. I feel I've done a lot of good." Sen. Robert Byrd)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker
Hey Charles...


31 posted on 01/04/2007 10:19:05 PM PST by GATOR NAVY (Naming CVNs after congressmen and mediocre presidents burns my butt)
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To: Allegra
For the Iraqi government to have botched both his trial and execution, therefore, and turned monster into victim, is not just a tragedy, but a crime...

Perhaps Krauthammer would prefer the Iraqi courts to have emulated the United States courts most recent famous case.. the O.J. Simpson trial..

I would say the Iraqis did a lot better than that LA court that tried O.J.... wouldn't you? Perhaps Krauthammer would have preferred the trial's outcome if Judge Samuel Alito had presided.

Perhaps their system should have stopped the death sentence because hanging is a cruel and unusual punishment. I wonder which nations justice system does that for lethal injections..which are as cruel and unusual as a flue shot.

I believe the Iraqi court and justice system in its most famous case, has done a lot better than the USA court System did in the O.J. case.

Typical Washington Journalist.... Krauthammer looks at Iraqi justice though the Washington eyes of perfection.. He ought to compare the Iraqi justice system to our own.

If he had he would not come off as the ignorant fool he apparently is.

32 posted on 01/04/2007 10:19:13 PM PST by Common Tator
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To: Allegra
Most were loyal to Saddam, and nothing will ever change this.>>>>>>>>>>

So very untrue. >>>>>>>>>>>>

How can people over here understand that not all Sunnis were in the Baath Party? There are now only a few die hards who supported Sadaam, and most of them were tribally connected around Tikrit, if I am not mistaken. If this were not so , there would have been riots in the streets, right? The impression I get here Allegra, is that the Saudis are very worried about a Shia dominated Iraq.A few weeks ago the Saudis began voicing their discontent at the Shia dominance in Iraq's government, and a visit from Cheny seemed to silence the Saudi complaints. Is something up? Are the Saudis going to come into Iraq with their military and reconstruction teams? Rumors abound.

33 posted on 01/04/2007 10:22:05 PM PST by Candor7 (Into Liberal flatulance goes the best hope of the West, and who wants to be a smart feller?)
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To: o_zarkman44

The taunting by the guards was no more abusive than the chant "Dead Man Walking" on the Green Mile. Saddam knew who he wronged. Saddam knew those people would seek revenge. He was lucky he got a fair trial at all because the people would have chopped him up in the streets in front of live tv and they would have been just as satisfied justice was served.



HAL: Now...what in the hell happened?

PAUL: An execution. A successful one.

HAL: How in the name of ****** can you call THAT a success?

PAUL: Edward Delacroix is dead...(looks at Percy)...isn't he?


34 posted on 01/04/2007 10:22:31 PM PST by Christian4Bush ('For the children", Nancy? You mean the ones that your party hasn't advocated aborting yet? - C4B)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker

At least they didn't hang him with bungee cord or he'd still be bouncing around today.


35 posted on 01/04/2007 10:22:35 PM PST by Hillarys Gate Cult (The man who said "there's no such thing as a stupid question" has never talked to Helen Thomas.)
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To: dighton
The hanging looked technically sound, if a little short on decorum.

YES! LOL-LOL-LOL

36 posted on 01/04/2007 10:24:08 PM PST by onyx (DONATE NOW! -- It takes DONATIONS to keep FR running!!)
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To: Richard Kimball


ROTFLOL!!!!!!!!


37 posted on 01/04/2007 10:24:32 PM PST by onyx (DONATE NOW! -- It takes DONATIONS to keep FR running!!)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker
I suppose it is never too late for CK to bemoan how Mussolini was put to wire.

God, it must hurt to wring hands so hard.

38 posted on 01/04/2007 10:24:35 PM PST by dersepp (I Am A Militia Of One)
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To: Allegra


Thank you, Allegra!!!


39 posted on 01/04/2007 10:25:17 PM PST by onyx (DONATE NOW! -- It takes DONATIONS to keep FR running!!)
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To: Mad_Tom_Rackham


LOL-LOL-LOL


40 posted on 01/04/2007 10:25:40 PM PST by onyx (DONATE NOW! -- It takes DONATIONS to keep FR running!!)
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To: Hillarys Gate Cult

LOL!!!


41 posted on 01/04/2007 10:26:10 PM PST by onyx (DONATE NOW! -- It takes DONATIONS to keep FR running!!)
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To: Richard Kimball

No. But you'd better hurry or someone will beat you to it;

ENTREPRENEUR ROLLS OUT SADDAM HANGING DOLL
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1762684/posts


42 posted on 01/04/2007 10:29:26 PM PST by Hillarys Gate Cult (The man who said "there's no such thing as a stupid question" has never talked to Helen Thomas.)
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To: Allegra
Geez I never figured Chuck would turn into a bed wetter this quick.

L

43 posted on 01/04/2007 10:29:39 PM PST by Lurker (History's most dangerous force is government and the crime syndicates that grow with it.)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker; All

CK is very intelligent, but his underwear is stuck WAY up his ass.

He needs to loosen up.

This wasn't botched.

This is what hangings have been like in most parts of the world for thousands of years.

We just are shocked because we think we are more "civilized" with our doctors putting people to sleep.

Well, there is some good to this "uncivilized" sort of hanging, ESPECIALLY the humiliation they put Saddam through.


44 posted on 01/04/2007 10:32:39 PM PST by rwfromkansas (http://xanga.com/rwfromkansas)
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To: Anti-Bubba182

The news reports indicated that the president did in fact sign the document, regardless of his personal weenie liberal views on the death penalty.


45 posted on 01/04/2007 10:34:39 PM PST by rwfromkansas (http://xanga.com/rwfromkansas)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker
This ridiculous hand-wringing is unpersuasive. Hussein was tried, convicted, had an appeal, lost, and was hung.

He's not the first, nor will he be the last, tyrant to be jeered at during the execution of his sentence. Certainly the effeminate Europeans remained devoid of this sort of limp-wristed hand-wringing as they executed Italy's Premier Mussolini around the time that Hussein himself was born.

Frankly, the global Left wanted Hussein to remain alive so that his Ba'athist insurgents would continue to wage their terror war as ardently as possible...so that the American Right would be dealt a political blow at the expense of American blood.

But that's hardly a reason to keep Hussein alive.

Gee, some people chanted or yelled at Saddam before and while he swung from a rope. Yeah, like that's never happened before in *any* nation criticizing last month's hanging.

Get over it.
46 posted on 01/04/2007 10:36:33 PM PST by Southack (Media Bias means that Castro won't be punished for Cuban war crimes against Black Angolans in Africa)
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To: Clemenza

I tend to agree with you.

However, I thought it should have been a public hanging. Especially since so many witnesses were waiting to testify against Saddam .. and with this hanging they would not get the chance. While being public might have presented security issues, staging it in a brightly lit, public place - and filming it for posterity - would have been a better solution - IMHO.

I saw a military guy being interviewed on FOX and he stated that he believed "we would have done it differently" .. but he never elaborated on what that would have been.

But .. it's a very sad take on our country when even one person believes hanging Saddam was a bad thing.


47 posted on 01/04/2007 10:39:17 PM PST by CyberAnt (Drive-By Media: Fake news, fake documents, fake polls)
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To: Allegra

Well, you've read mine, so you know how I stand.

I could have used a little more of that Mussolini oomph!


48 posted on 01/04/2007 10:39:18 PM PST by JennysCool (Well done, President Ford.)
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To: 21stCenturyFreeThinker
Of the 6 billion people on this earth, not one killed more people than Saddam Hussein.

No, William Ruckelshaus has killed (~10 million) and injured (~500 million) far more people than Saddam Hussein. He just did it with a signature on behalf of Environmentalism.
49 posted on 01/04/2007 10:39:35 PM PST by aruanan
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To: supremedoctrine
I didn't expect the trial coverage would be presented like the O.J. trial, but it was just left alone and allowed to happen, through all its bloody twists and turns, and our own government seems to have bowed out of any interest in the actual details of what transpired in the trial.
They choose a small and relatively simple case so they could convict and hang him. If they had wanted more press coverage they could have convicted him on the genocide charges. It would have taken longer though.
I KNOW (at least as rumored) that we didn't want it to happen as it happened, so suddenly and crudely, with the sectarian revenge motif taking center stage.
Good point. The Malaki government really put us in a no win situation. If we intervened to delay the execution it would look like we were pulling the strings on a puppet government. Not intervening looked like we were blessing a sectarian act of revenge.

The whole holiday things kind of sums it up. Of all the 365 days in the year they could have chosen to hang him, they choose the Suni's big holiday. Iraq needs a government of all its people. The sloppy way this was handled doesn't help reach that goal.
50 posted on 01/04/2007 10:39:38 PM PST by 21stCenturyFreeThinker
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