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Minutemen heading to back up National Guard
azstarnet ^ | 01.05.2007 | Dale Quinn

Posted on 01/05/2007 6:12:23 PM PST by Flavius

olunteers with the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps are headed for the Arizona-Mexico border Friday to provide backup for National Guard troops in response to an incident near Sasabe in which the approach of armed men forced soldiers to retreat. About 11 p.m. Wednesday, soldiers with a National Guard Entry Identification Team - which provides additional eyes and ears for the U.S. Border Patrol and notifies them of suspicious activity - saw a group of armed individuals approaching them in the desert, said Mario Martinez, spokesman for the U.S. Customs and Border Protection's Border Patrol Office.

The individuals came within 100 yards of the National Guard post, so the troops moved to a safer location and notified Border Patrol agents, Martinez said. When agents responded minutes later, the armed individuals were gone but the agents tracked their footprints to the U.S.-Mexico border, Martinez said. The incident occurred in the west desert corridor between Nogales and Lukeville near Sasabe, which has been a busy area for marijuana seizures since last year. Still, the Border Patrol does not know who the individuals were; why they were armed; or why they were in the United States, Martinez said. There was no verbal or physical confrontation between them and the guard troops, he said. Chris Simcox, the founder and president of the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps, said the incident shows the federal government is ineffective when it comes to protecting the border. "The fact that National Guardsmen were forced to retreat from an armed incursion," Simcox said. "It's just absurd." The volunteer border watch organization wants to send the message that National Guard troops aren't making U.S. citizens any safer. "The National Guard needs to be unhandcuffed and they need to be able to deal with these aggressive international incidents," Simcox said. The troops need to be able to apprehend and detain illegal immigrants when they encounter them, he said. The volunteers will be armed so they can defend themselves and they won't retreat if confronted by dangerous border crossers, he said. Major Paul Aguirre, a spokesman for the Arizona National Guard, said troops are armed and will defend themselves if their lives are in danger, but their role is to provide support for the Border Patrol. Martinez said the National Guard has been effective in its role. The troops provide vehicle maintenance and carry out administrative duties that previously kept agents away from their work on the border. The troops also spot illegal immigrants that otherwise would go unnoticed, Martinez said. The Border Patrol appreciates citizen involvement, but "the border is a dangerous place," Martinez said. "And we have Border Patrol agents trained specifically for that mission." Robin Hoover, the founder of Humane Borders and pastor of First Christian Church, said sending armed U.S. citizens to the border is "idiotic." "It's insane for non-trained personnel to go to the border," he said. "You're just begging for an international incident to happen." He also called into question how effective the National Guard troops were in their mission because they were unable to identify the armed individuals. He pointed out that both U.S. and Mexican military personnel inadvertently cross the border without realizing it and that could have happened in this situation. Martinez said it's important for people not to overreact to the recent incident and that the National Guard troops did exactly what they were expected to do. "We need to make sure that people know what happened out there is serious," Martinez said. "But we don't exaggerate it." Contact reporter Dale Quinn at 629-9412 or dquinn@azstarnet.com. 6 Comments on this story


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: aliens; borderpatrol; immigrantlist; invasionusa; mexico; nationalguard; rostov; usmexwar2007; war; wolverines
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1 posted on 01/05/2007 6:12:25 PM PST by Flavius
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To: Flavius

pathetic.... our troops should run from no one.


2 posted on 01/05/2007 6:15:30 PM PST by Army MP Retired (There Will Be Many False Prophets)
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Comment #3 Removed by Moderator

To: Army MP Retired

Another article I read indicated they were unarmed.


4 posted on 01/05/2007 6:18:41 PM PST by RKV ( He who has the guns, makes the rules.)
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To: Flavius
100 yrds?

Call me if you need me...

5 posted on 01/05/2007 6:19:02 PM PST by Dead Corpse (Anyone who needs to be persuaded to be free, doesn't deserve to be.)
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To: RKV

I'm sure an order is forthcoming for the Guards to ask the minutemen to stay away.


6 posted on 01/05/2007 6:19:59 PM PST by cripplecreek (Peace without victory is a temporary illusion.)
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To: Flavius

A note to Pastor Hoover - the international incident has already occurred. Many times over.


7 posted on 01/05/2007 6:20:11 PM PST by RKV ( He who has the guns, makes the rules.)
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To: cripplecreek

It's time to tell the professionals that they are failing to do the job.


8 posted on 01/05/2007 6:21:03 PM PST by RKV ( He who has the guns, makes the rules.)
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To: Flavius

Sounds like an armed invasion to me (albeit small). When do we start treating this as the invasion it is?


9 posted on 01/05/2007 6:23:53 PM PST by keepitreal
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To: RKV

I feel bad for the Guardsmen who are apparently under orders to avoid guarding the nation.


10 posted on 01/05/2007 6:24:45 PM PST by cripplecreek (Peace without victory is a temporary illusion.)
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Comment #11 Removed by Moderator

To: Army MP Retired

What kind of weapons are our National Guard troops armed with down there? Just curious. And I agree with you - they should not have to run from anyone especially on their own soil!! Geez!! This is our border and who knows what kind of element is trying to come across. Our soldiers' hands are tied in Iraq as it is, and now they have to retreat here at home and call someone else while the scum gets away! Pathetic is right!
God bless you, sir, and thank you for your service to our country!


12 posted on 01/05/2007 6:26:13 PM PST by fishergirl (Proud mom of an Iraq war veteran - to all our veterans Thank You and God Bless)
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To: cripplecreek

Rules of engagement matter - a lot.


13 posted on 01/05/2007 6:27:22 PM PST by RKV ( He who has the guns, makes the rules.)
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To: Jotun

Bull-Murtha is what they'd think!!


14 posted on 01/05/2007 6:28:11 PM PST by fishergirl (Proud mom of an Iraq war veteran - to all our veterans Thank You and God Bless)
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To: fishergirl

This unit was unarmed as I read about the incident elsewhere.


15 posted on 01/05/2007 6:28:12 PM PST by RKV ( He who has the guns, makes the rules.)
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To: RKV

That's what I read, too.


16 posted on 01/05/2007 6:28:48 PM PST by fishergirl (Proud mom of an Iraq war veteran - to all our veterans Thank You and God Bless)
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To: Flavius

100% Bush's fault, and an absolute disgrace!


17 posted on 01/05/2007 6:30:05 PM PST by DTogo (I haven't left the GOP, the GOP left me.)
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To: Jotun
Can you imagine what the thousands upon thousands of Americans who have died defending this country would think of this?

If they're not rotating in their graves at 100 RPMs, they're probably cursing at the elites.

18 posted on 01/05/2007 6:30:35 PM PST by Extremely Extreme Extremist (Why can't Republicans stand up to Democrats like they do to terrorists?)
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To: RKV

In October, my son was the National Guardsman who shot that guy in New Orleans. There was an artice about it here and I read then that the National Guard on the border was not armed.


19 posted on 01/05/2007 6:32:52 PM PST by fishergirl (Proud mom of an Iraq war veteran - to all our veterans Thank You and God Bless)
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To: DTogo

As Ross Perot might have said "Let's hear it for them volunteers!"


20 posted on 01/05/2007 6:37:04 PM PST by AmericanInTokyo
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To: RKV

OMG! I cannot, as a former fairly senior leader of the sons and daughters of a America's Army, fathom being on a post without a weapon... To what purpose does that serve??? Please write your CG person about this outrage and tell them to equip our warriors with the tools they need to accomplish their mission. Long Live The Republic (LLTR).


21 posted on 01/05/2007 6:39:46 PM PST by Army MP Retired (There Will Be Many False Prophets)
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To: Army MP Retired

The only way this will get fixed is to replace the CinC.


22 posted on 01/05/2007 6:43:02 PM PST by RKV ( He who has the guns, makes the rules.)
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To: Flavius
A National Guard that isn't armed and is under orders not to actually Guard.

Those guys and gals just gotta be frustrated...

23 posted on 01/05/2007 6:44:52 PM PST by GoldCountryRedneck ("Idiocy - Never under estimate the power of stupid people in large numbers" - despair.com)
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To: Flavius

As a retired military member I can tell you I would be mad as hell if I was put in a situation where I had to retreat on American soil.

Our troops retreating in our own country!!!!!!!!!

How bad does it have to get for the quiet majority to rise up and raise HELL with our elected officials!!

Why isn't the MSM talking about this?


24 posted on 01/05/2007 6:45:51 PM PST by CCGuy (It's time to rise up and take our country back)
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To: CCGuy
Why isn't the MSM talking about this?

Doesn't fit the liberal/socialist propaganda template.

25 posted on 01/05/2007 6:50:10 PM PST by Dead Corpse (Anyone who needs to be persuaded to be free, doesn't deserve to be.)
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To: Regulator; satan
"It's insane for non-trained personnel to go to the border," he said. "You're just begging for an international incident to happen." He also called into question how effective the National Guard troops were in their mission because they were unable to identify the armed individuals. He pointed out that both U.S. and Mexican military personnel inadvertently cross the border without realizing it and that could have happened in this situation. Martinez said it's important for people not to overreact to the recent incident and that the National Guard troops did exactly what they were expected to do. "We need to make sure that people know what happened out there is serious," Martinez said. "But we don't exaggerate it." Contact reporter Dale Quinn at 629-9412 or dquinn@azstarnet.com. 6 Comments on this story

Interesting that they were discussing the Mexican military.

26 posted on 01/05/2007 7:01:07 PM PST by texastoo ("trash the treaties")
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To: Flavius

" U.S. and Mexican military personnel inadvertently cross the border without realizing it'

This occurred seventy miles north of the border, idiot. That's not inadvertent.


27 posted on 01/05/2007 7:03:10 PM PST by gcruse (http://garycruse.blogspot.com/)
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To: Dead Corpse
Why isn't the MSM talking about this? Doesn't fit the liberal/socialist propaganda template.

Correction: It doesn't fit the globalist, elitist, liberal/socialist propaganda, of which a GREAT MANY Democrats AND Republicans routinely espouse and believe in.

28 posted on 01/05/2007 7:04:10 PM PST by Ranger Drew
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To: Flavius

BTTT!


29 posted on 01/05/2007 7:04:37 PM PST by PGalt
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To: Flavius

The mexicans must be heehawing over this. Their intent was clear--they are coming and there isn't a damned thing our government will do to stop them.


30 posted on 01/05/2007 7:04:44 PM PST by freeangel ( (free speech is only good until someone else doesn't like what you say))
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To: texastoo; satan
Interesting that they were discussing the Mexican military

Why yes. A bit Freudian, as they say!

You're just begging for an international incident to happen

One already did. Perpetrated by some guys from Mexico, who don't appear to be all that concerned about it.

But we don't exaggerate it

Note that the downplaying of the incident begins here.

31 posted on 01/05/2007 7:06:39 PM PST by Regulator
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To: gcruse
This occurred seventy miles north of the border, idiot. That's not inadvertent.

Where did you get that?

Sasabe is on the border.

32 posted on 01/05/2007 7:09:03 PM PST by kstewskis ("Tolerance is what happens when one loses their priniciples"....Fr. A. Saenz)
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To: Regulator
Note that the downplaying of the incident begins here

I have noticed!

33 posted on 01/05/2007 7:13:57 PM PST by texastoo ("trash the treaties")
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To: Army MP Retired
This is a National Disgrace. If they are not going arm our NG and allow them to protect the border, then get them out of there. What the H*%% is President Bush thinking to let this happen?

This Country is in one big Mess. We won't protect our borders from millions of illegals and armed attacks by drug dealers or Mexican milt. Many of the Nation's sons and daughters are being killed needlessly in Iraq because we are fighting a PC type war. We now have a cut and run bunch of liberals running the House and Senate because American voters don't have the will or the guts to back up the President long enough to let our military do what needs to be done to achieve success.

And no, I don't fault President Bush for all of this. He has had his share of backstabbing RINO Senators like McCain, Spector, and Lugar. Traitors and just plain lowlifes like Kennedy, Murta, Kerry, Pelosi and Reid to contend with. They are all to blame for this mess we are in.

It really angers me that our brave troops are not armed and allowed to protect our borders or even their own lives from illegals and armed gangs. All the backstabbing Rinos should be put out of office. All the Traitors should be duly tried and hanged. All the lowlife crooks in DC should be prosecuted and jailed.

34 posted on 01/05/2007 7:14:36 PM PST by jerry639
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In 1980,while stationed in Germany, I was informed part of my "official duty" was to destroy all classified information while everyone else on station "bugged out", and to proceed to a designated fallback position, if I survived.
I was not issued a weapon to defend myself while preparing for this potential "duty".
In 1984, my official DOD PCS orders included mandated authorization travel orders which included 15 hand carried personal weapons, and unlimited "ammunition for the above".

It appears some "lessons learned" have not been made available to current National Guard forces, or were ignored.
35 posted on 01/05/2007 7:17:07 PM PST by sarasmom
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To: kstewskis

I read it in one of the articles about the incursion. Can't find it now.


36 posted on 01/05/2007 7:17:08 PM PST by gcruse (http://garycruse.blogspot.com/)
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To: jerry639

"I don't fault President Bush for all of this'

Who do you blame for the NG not being armed while on the border, then?


37 posted on 01/05/2007 7:18:46 PM PST by gcruse (http://garycruse.blogspot.com/)
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To: Flavius
"Still, the Border Patrol does not know who the individuals were; why they were armed; or why they were in the United States, Martinez said."

Kiss your @ss adios folks! Hell they could have been bringing in suitcase nukes for all the border patrol knows.

38 posted on 01/05/2007 7:21:02 PM PST by fightu4it (conquest by immigration and subversion spells the end of US.)
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To: gcruse
Who do you blame for the NG not being armed while on the border, then?

Of course, I blame the President for the NG not being armed while on the boarder. He gave the orders that put them there.

Now go back and read what I typed. I said that the President was not entirely to blame for all the mess this Country was in.

Did you read all of it or are you just wanting to pick an argument?

39 posted on 01/05/2007 7:25:21 PM PST by jerry639
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To: keepitreal
Sounds like an armed invasion to me (albeit small). When do we start treating this as the invasion it is?

When the one of us who sees the invasion for what it is, realizes that there is MORE than one.

When things have broken down so far, there is no other choice but to see. That is the day I await.

Because it will come.

40 posted on 01/05/2007 7:25:34 PM PST by Last Laugh (We the People are in charge, so let's act like it!)
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To: sarasmom

wow! Thank goodness you were there to defend the Fulda Gap!! Even if it was only with your shredder - you set the conditions for us to win the Cold War. LLTR!


41 posted on 01/05/2007 7:30:51 PM PST by Army MP Retired (There Will Be Many False Prophets)
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To: cripplecreek
I'm sure an order is forthcoming for the Guards to ask the minutemen to stay away.

Well, they can just do their little order. The minutemen have a RIGHT to be there. I support them!

I don't think the minutemen should be so dang PC either, not under the Second Amendment, anyway. But they are starting under the law..until the law is proven wrong.

And the law......is....wrong.

42 posted on 01/05/2007 7:31:43 PM PST by Last Laugh (We the People are in charge, so let's act like it!)
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To: gcruse

the Governor of the state to which the NG belong, of course.


43 posted on 01/05/2007 7:35:12 PM PST by Army MP Retired (There Will Be Many False Prophets)
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To: All

I voted for bush twice. I trusted him. this story today is the last straw as my belief in his concerns for our country's borders has now diminished to the point where I feel betrayed by him. sorry bushbots IF your reading but thats the way it is.


44 posted on 01/05/2007 7:45:00 PM PST by bobby.223
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To: bobby.223

"international incident"
NO!!!!
NATIONAL DEFENSE


45 posted on 01/05/2007 7:47:24 PM PST by omega4179 (Just say no to riNOs)
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To: CCGuy
Why isn't the MSM talking about this?

This is the crucial question, or ONE OF the crucial questions..!!

46 posted on 01/05/2007 7:54:58 PM PST by La Enchiladita (People get ready . . .)
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To: Flavius

Whos the commander in chief around here?


47 posted on 01/05/2007 7:57:40 PM PST by omega4179 (Just say no to riNOs and Mexico)
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To: DTogo

Wow. I am amazed to learn that President Bush actually writes and passes laws.

Thanks for clueing me in as to how government really works...


48 posted on 01/05/2007 8:00:59 PM PST by The Coopster
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To: Flavius
National Guard troops in response to an incident near Sasabe in which the approach of armed men forced soldiers to retreat

How embarrassing!! Those Guardsmen must feel like sh@@, their President let them down and prohibited them from able to protect themselves or the Country. Wow!

49 posted on 01/05/2007 8:08:01 PM PST by Logical me (Oh, well!!!)
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To: La Enchiladita

ping


50 posted on 01/05/2007 8:09:06 PM PST by Arizona Carolyn
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