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It's official, Elvis lives [inflationary cosmology saves the King!]
Telegraph.co.uk ^ | 16 January 2007 | Marcus Chown

Posted on 01/15/2007 6:32:55 PM PST by snarks_when_bored

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To: fso301
Here's a nice, fairly elementary discussion of inflation by one of its discoverers:

Alan H. Guth, Eternal Inflation (PDF format)

51 posted on 01/15/2007 9:24:50 PM PST by snarks_when_bored
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To: PackerBronco; sittnick

The Niven story appears to be an imaginative rendering of Everett's Many Worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics. See post #44 above...


52 posted on 01/15/2007 9:28:38 PM PST by snarks_when_bored
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To: snarks_when_bored

Thanks, I definitely read it.


53 posted on 01/15/2007 9:30:30 PM PST by fso301
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To: Dog Gone
These infinite universes are expanding and eventually will collide.

And no one knows what will happen then.

I've just run across this article by Garriga, Guth and Vilenkin discussing bubble collisions:

Jaume Garriga, Alan H. Guth, Alexander Vilenkin, Eternal inflation, bubble collisions, and the persistence of memory (PDF format)

54 posted on 01/15/2007 9:36:56 PM PST by snarks_when_bored
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To: who_would_fardels_bear
If every possible universe exists then there are an infinite number of universes in which I am a saint and an infinite number of universes in which I am an axe murderer.

But in what sense can those "Doppelgangers" be considered to be actually you?

What's more, I hear people say, "I sure am glad I wasn't born in Ethiopia." In what sense would that person have been you?

One more thing. Say they perfected a matter transporter that seemed to work just fine on people. The way it worked is that it scanned you somehow, down to the very atoms and their states, and then transmitted that information through a wormhole to a very distant place, where the receiver reconstructed "you" down to the atom, out of raw materials.

Oh, and in the process, your atoms at the transmitting end would get disassembled and recycled.

Would you be willing to be 'transported' that way? Would the 'thing' on the other end have consciousness, or soul, or whatever? Would it be yours? Would it be you?

Uhhh, pass the bong, man.

55 posted on 01/15/2007 11:47:02 PM PST by Erasmus (Able was Napolopan ere Napolopan saw Elba.)
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To: snarks_when_bored

The King did not die. He ascended. One day he will return as a hunka hunka burnin' love to banish all sorrow. In that day we will truly be his teddy bears.


56 posted on 01/16/2007 4:06:36 AM PST by Junior (Losing faith in humanity one person at a time.)
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To: Junior

Will he bring the spaghetti with him?


57 posted on 01/16/2007 10:34:20 AM PST by snarks_when_bored
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To: snarks_when_bored
No. The sacred, deep-fried peanutbutter-and-banana sandwich.

"Eat it in memory of him." Uh huh.

58 posted on 01/16/2007 10:47:56 AM PST by Junior (Losing faith in humanity one person at a time.)
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To: Erasmus
It wouldn't be "me" in all those other universes either axe murdering people or feeding the poor. But there would be billions and billions of axe murderers that looked like me according to multiverse theory.

So if there is a God then He seems to have created the universe in such a way as to guarantee that there would be infinite numbers of Hitlers and axe murders and Celine Dions.

Either God is perverse or has a really sick sense of humor if this is the case.

59 posted on 01/16/2007 11:24:55 AM PST by who_would_fardels_bear
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To: snarks_when_bored

Whoa, that article started out in english...


60 posted on 01/16/2007 11:31:32 AM PST by Dog Gone
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To: Dog Gone
Whoa, that article started out in english...

With articles like that, you just read around the equations...(grin)

61 posted on 01/16/2007 11:45:39 AM PST by snarks_when_bored
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To: Junior

(laugh) Nicely put.


62 posted on 01/16/2007 11:47:28 AM PST by snarks_when_bored
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To: snarks_when_bored
If your head hasn't yet exploded...

Too late!


63 posted on 01/16/2007 12:01:32 PM PST by uglybiker (A bunch of radical Unitarians left a flaming question mark on my lawn!)
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To: uglybiker

I suspect that it's fortunate that I've blocked GIF animations...


64 posted on 01/16/2007 12:10:24 PM PST by snarks_when_bored
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To: who_would_fardels_bear
Either God is perverse or has a really sick sense of humor if this is the case.

Or...

There are an infinite number of gods...

65 posted on 01/16/2007 12:17:44 PM PST by Junior (Losing faith in humanity one person at a time.)
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To: Junior
"There are an infinite number of gods..."

So if a God is the definer of morality in the universe He creates then there are infinite moralities, which is to say there is no morality.

If it is possible for us to know that there are other universes that have potentially different moralities then we know that there are multiple moralities and so there is no absolute morality.

So we still have the same problem.

Even if there are no Gods. If in our own universe the vast majority of us come to the conclusion that axe murdering is wrong, then if there is another universe where the vast majority of sentient beings have come to a different conclusion, then who is to say which morality is correct?

Multiverses are worse than multiculturalism when it comes to abandoning morality for whatever seems to work at the time. It's situational ethics at a multi-cosmic level.

66 posted on 01/16/2007 1:38:07 PM PST by who_would_fardels_bear
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To: who_would_fardels_bear
So if a God is the definer of morality in the universe He creates then there are infinite moralities, which is to say there is no morality.

You're assuming God defines morality. Going by His actions in the OT, Satan has nothing on God in the amoral department.

67 posted on 01/16/2007 2:10:30 PM PST by Junior (Losing faith in humanity one person at a time.)
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To: snarks_when_bored
"If your head hasn't yet exploded, you now have all you need to understand the first paragraph of this article."

Oy!

68 posted on 01/16/2007 2:16:56 PM PST by Diana in Wisconsin (Save The Earth. It's The Only Planet With Chocolate.)
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To: WestVirginiaRebel


"I'm a hunka hunka burnin love, baby!"
69 posted on 01/16/2007 2:22:31 PM PST by reagan_fanatic (You'll shoot your eye out, kid)
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To: Junior
I'm not assuming anything: I'm assuming everything.

There may or may not be a God. There may or may not be such a thing as morality. God may or may not define morality (if such a thing exists.)

All I'm trying to say is that in a situation where there is a single universe, even without a God, there is some way of making a case for certain acts being inherently good and other acts being inherently evil.

However if we have infinite multiverses where no matter what we do in this world, countless copies of us are doing the exact opposite, then there is no way of salvaging anything resembling morality.

Then all we are left with is the fact that the majority of us are too afraid to buck the system, and the few people that are courageous enough are running it however they choose. Nihilism at its finest! Of course if I had the guts to run the entire system Michael Jackson, Celine Dion, and Brittney Spears would never have been allowed to get above dive bar singing status.

70 posted on 01/16/2007 3:03:05 PM PST by who_would_fardels_bear
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To: devolve


71 posted on 01/16/2007 4:33:02 PM PST by potlatch (Does a clean house indicate that there is a broken computer in it?)
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To: reagan_fanatic
A pregnant Elvis with a cameltoe? Not even Suspicious Minds want to know anything about that!
72 posted on 01/16/2007 4:58:45 PM PST by snarks_when_bored
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To: cmsgop; commandante_zero; lesser_satan; saganite; Nachoman; sittnick; Doohickey; Dog Gone; ...
Sunday is fun day...

The following paragraphs are from Don N. Page, Is Our Universe Likely to Decay within 20 Billion Years? (PDF format):

Let us take the case in which the decay of the universe proceeds by the nucleation of a small bubble that then expands at practically the speed of light, destroying everything within the causal future of the bubble nucleation event.

[snip]

One might ask what the observable effects would be of the decay of the universe, if ordered observers like us could otherwise survive for times long in comparison with 20 billion years. First of all, the destruction of the universe would occur by a very thin bubble wall traveling extremely close to the speed of light, so no one would be able to see it coming to dread the imminent destruction. Furthermore, the destruction of all we know (our nearly flat spacetime, as well as all of its contents of particles and fields) would happen so fast that there is not likely to be nearly enough time for any signals of pain to reach your brain. And no grieving survivors will be left behind. So in this way it would be the most humanely possible execution.

Furthermore, the whole analysis of quantum cosmology and of measures on the multiverse seems (at least to me) very difficult to do without adopting something like the Everett many-worlds version of quantum theory (perhaps a variant like my own Sensible Quantum Mechanics or Mindless Sensationalism [1, 36]). Then of course if there are “worlds” (quantum amplitudes) that are destroyed by a particular bubble, there will always remain other “worlds” that survive. Therefore, in this picture of the decaying universe, it will always persist in some fraction of the Everett worlds (better, in some measure), but it is just that the fraction or measure will decrease asymptotically toward zero. This means that there is always some positive measure for observers to survive until any arbitrarily late fixed time, so one could never absolutely rule out a decaying universe by observations at any finite time.

However, as the measure decreases for our universe to survive for longer and longer times, a random sampling of observers and observations by this measure would be increasingly unlikely to pick one at increasingly late times. Although observers would still exist then, they would be increasingly rare and unusual. Of course, any particular observer who did find himself or herself there could not rule out the possibility that he or she is just a very unusual observer, but he or she would have good statistical grounds for doubting the prediction made in this paper that he or she really is quite unusual. In any case, the decrease in the measure of the universe that I am predicting here takes such a long time that it should not cause anyone to worry about it (except perhaps to try to find a solution to the huge scientific mystery of the measure for the string landscape or other multiverse theory). However, it is interesting that the discovery of the cosmic acceleration [37, 38] may not teach us that the universe will certainly last much longer than the possible finite lifetimes of k = +1 matter-dominated FRW models previously considered, but it may instead have the implication that our universe is actually decaying even faster than what was previously considered.


73 posted on 01/21/2007 3:10:34 PM PST by snarks_when_bored
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