Posted on 03/15/2007 12:58:07 AM PDT by Graybeard58
"Guess it's like being conned into running up a hughe credit card debt while buying non necessities or gong on expensive vactions. "
Democrats wanted this. It means people become beholden to the RATS as they try to enact laws that are meant to keep these people in poverty.
Bush will be blamed and another generation will be lost to MSM propoganda.
"Who's the biggest scam artist?
Uncle Sam."
Nonsense. BIG TIME. The biggest scammers are the "students" who borrow this with no intention of paying it back or going to school. The population of our campus would dramatically decrease after student loan refunds were dispersed. The two "predominantly black" universities in my state originated more defaulted student loans than all other universities in Louisiana COMBINED.
I got out of college with $3,200 in student loans. Blaming the government for people being sorry is easy but not accurate. I have no pity for those who chose to forgo work and borrow all they could to maintain their cushy, party-filled, high-school lifestyle while in college.
W and Congress are letting millions of people in the country illegally every year and the banking industry, meat packers, agriculture, landscaping, construction industries (to mention a few) are banking on profits from perceived cheap labor.
With so many manufacturing and customer service industries now left and moved overseas because of the cheaper labor, the GOV had to do something to create a prop for the economy, so a well-planned collusion was instigated.
In the meantime those same industries have invested short term profits into off shore LLC investment groups that are actually running hedges against those companies (market sectors) with a particular timetable in mind, especially housing and residential real estate. Going long when the real estate market was on the upswing and now having shifted to shorting those same sectors.
In the meantime, the average taxpayer and illegal immigrant gets the shaft from the failures and market downturns while domestic businesses write off the losses on their taxes while making a good return from their off shore investment groups.
You can call me crazy, but this is reality. It's just kept well hidden who the behind the scenes deal makers are.
I don't think debts incurred via fraud were ever (or now) eligible to be discharged in bankruptcy.
that's not the point of the bankruptcy law - the point is that the folks who took out the loans are stuck with the debt and the "shysters" have harvested them as slaves until they pay up.
How likely is it that the "victims" will be able to argue that they should be able to declare bankruptcy because they were "conned" into taking out a huge mortgage?
Chances between slim and none.
That logic is like blaming Jack Daniels for your drunk driving or blaming Smith & Wesson because you shot someone. I thought personal responsibility was a hallmark of conservatism. I guess I was wrong...
My wife and I have credit available through a home equity line and several credit cards that substantially exceeds our annual income. That does NOT mean we have to use all of it!
"That logic is like blaming Jack Daniels for your drunk driving or blaming Smith & Wesson because you shot someone. I thought personal responsibility was a hallmark of conservatism. I guess I was wrong..."
Does Jack Daniels target alcholics or does S&W target murderers? No they don't.
Mathematical probability can and is used by lenders. They know the risk when they make loan decisions. A borrower has responsibility but so does the lender.
Additionally, there is the fraud involved with some loans. Overstatment of income, understatement of fees, and misrepresentation of terms all come into play.
"With your credit rating, this is the best you're going to get," he said. Both our credit scores were above 700.
Another broker offered a split first/second mortgage deal with the second above 10%. She claimed "There's no way" we would get a simple, fixed low-rate loan.
I stopped by a local hole-in-the-wall I drive by everyday. That gentleman turned out to be honest. We got a great loan with low closing costs. Buyers beware, many of them lie.
Libs accuse alcohol distilleries/breweries of targeting alcoholics and say that guns are inherently evil tools of death. Thus, according to liberal logic, yes. I see the same logic in tarring all banks with the accusation of targeting the gullible with more loan than they can afford.
Mathematical probability can and is used by lenders. They know the risk when they make loan decisions. A borrower has responsibility but so does the lender.
In terms of mathematical probability models; yes, larger banks and insurance companies do use credit scoring and actuarial modeling to determine portfolio risk. This makes decisioning much faster, but does not absolve the individual customer of their responsibility for managing their own money. However, I will agree with you that lenders do need to maintain come common sense in their business.
Additionally, there is the fraud involved with some loans.
Yes, on both sides of the transaction. A borrower who signs a mortgage application that says they are a doctor when they are actually a receptionist is committing fraud and possibly perjury. A lender who pushes (or even allows) this is just as guilty.
"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus
"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus
Precisely. I can't see why this is shocking anyone.
Talk about a coincidence: Our current governor, Deval Patrick, was on the board of Ameriquest, one of the shadiest of all sub-prime mortgage lenders.
The increases in residential home value over the last four years were like the increases in value of dot-coms in 1997-99; paper wealth based on greater-fool speculation with no grounding in fundamentals.
Housing appreciation, after it takes this needed haircut, will return to its historic rates. No one who bought a home before 2002, as a place to live, will really suffer.
In the 1980s we, in Texas and the southwest, had a similar system with savings and loan companies - does anyone remember the Keating 5? These loans companies made plenty of bad loans and plenty of big name people went to jail and dozens of banks went bust - 6 with over a billion in assets. The system kept up and was bailed out and the beat goes on. Someone will be buying some cheap homes and later they will sell them for a huge profit.
"Lost another one to Di-Tech."
Don't take a wack at those folk. 3 years ago I refinanced a fixed 30 to a fixed 15. Their interest rate was good but what was better was they actually charged what they advertised. We tried Lending tree, got their 4 quotes, and checked out the two lowest cost. When we got the actual paperwork, we found a hidden $5K in fees, not listed in their original proposals....
No Ditech (GMAC) did a fine job and did it honestly.
"Victims? You want victims? Wait until the value of houses owned by those with good credit ratings start sinking like a stone."
No, they're not victims either. Anyone could see this market was overheated, and if you bought in near the top, or blew all the paper increase in the value of your house on toys and stuff, well you weren't too wise. Those who bought before things got out of hand, and who didn't cash in all their increased equity on toys, vacations, paying off credit cards, and so on, will still be OK.
>Who's the biggest scam artist?
Uncle Sam.
Kids in college are given "financial aid" in the for of federally backed student loans - some over $20,000 per year.<
Why does college cost so much today? Is it the socialistic mindset of the average academic administrator, who welcomes nonsense majors, and classes that have nothing to do with making a living in real life?
That said, if the federal government didn't make these loans so easy to get, perhaps the colleges wouldn't put the cost of a Bachelor's degree up in the 6 figure realm.
>Victims? You want victims? Wait until the value of houses owned by those with good credit ratings start sinking like a stone.<
In our local area, someone has an eight acre parcel of rural land for sale costing over 100,000.00. Two years ago, such a parcel might be advertised for 40,000.00. Flippers and get-rich-quick scammers have been living real high off the hog recently.
Our real estate taxes are going through the roof. We're in our house for the long run.
It wouldn't bother me if real estate values dropped. I'd get a break on taxes.
Pumping buyers into the market increases demand, inflating prices, and reducing demand for rentals. The clampdown will have the opposite effect.
Bad news: my rent on my $500k house may go up from the current $1,600.
Good news: Maybe I'll be able to buy it for $300k in a year or two.
One of my buddies just bought a home in January. It was on the market for $500k last year. He got it for $340k. This is in Seattle!
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