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Posted on 03/31/2007 10:27:45 PM PDT by TigerLikesRooster
N.Korea Told to Return Captured U.S. Navy Boat
Former Prime Minister Lee Hae-chan asked North Korea to return the USS Pueblo to the U.S. during his visit to Pyongyang early March, a member of his entourage said Thursday. North Korea hijacked the U.S. Navy ship off the coast of Wonsan in January 1968, claiming it had crossed into North Korean waters.
According to the aide, after looking at the Pueblo, which is on display near the Taedong River, the former prime minister told officials of the North’s Korean Council for Reconciliation and Cooperation that the return of the captured ship would be a chance to improve U.S.-North Korean relations. North Korean officials apparently were not wholly averse to the idea and they appeared willing to report it to their seniors, the aide said.
The proposal has resulted in speculation that Lee’s remarks after his return to Seoul that North Korea may take “concrete action” to build trust with the U.S. refer to the return of the vessel. The captured naval ship was moved from Wonsan to the Taedong River area in 1999. Washington has been demanding the return of the ancient ship.
"Yes it is a symbol, but a much greater one to them than to US."
Maybe to most - but to some of us an indicator of a major screw-up that we should have learned a lesson from - I hope we have. I don't think so given the state of our current political situation now.
As in on the flight deck? Nukes stayed below with a USMC sentry guarding the hatch. In general at least one interceptor sat hooked up on a catapult and a pilot usually at the island if Flight Ops weren't going on. There should have been one loaded conventional with cannon rounds {for the aircrafts onboard guns} as well in the aircraft. The only reason I can think of for a nuke being topside was a GQ drill. {They have to practice sometime. But it doesn't take that long to get a weapon up from the magazine to the flight deck.
How in the hell did the Admiral in charge go for 100% Nuke on deck?
If you mean Commander Carrier Group it's not even his decession as to what weapons are loaded in the magazines. That one comes down from the Pentagon.
And LBJ took Cmdr Butcher to task? What an @ss.
Agreed. He sent that ship into what was determined to be a hostile enviroment and armed the crew with a 50 caliber afterthought and side arms. Not much of a defense against out numbering patrol boats and Migs circling like vultures.
I just can't quite figure out what you mena by only nukes on deck. Not disagreeing just doesn't sound Kosher.
I have some weapons handling experience myself. I was in a nuke capable Army NG unit and I was an ammo hauler. Uncle isn't happy about exposing too much for all the world to see as far as where nukes appear. Every time we moved nukes on the ship it was GQ or modified GQ especially during onload and off loads.
Another possibility as well. Training generally involves a disarmed round. IOW a dummy. It is treated as an armed round during training. That's bout all I can say on that :>}
I do remember some Navy Cold War protocol I was in from 76-80. In general though like I said if they were moving nukes it was likely a GQ drill and not a day to day operational posture.
Airedales and AVORD guys know a lot more about this than me. When we went to GQ I was usually baby sitting the air-conditioning plants below the waterline.
"The body of his dad should be thrown out of his class coffin, where it is on display inside his billion-dollar mausoleum"
Woah! A Billion - any pics avaliable?
That has got to be one hum dinnger.
It will be done - all in time.
I yeild to your experience - which you so eloquently put - I'm just running off of emotion.
You might be thinking about this though. During the LIBERTY attack 7 months earlier than PUEBLO planes were launced and on their way to help Liberty from a carrier but were recalled inflight by Pentagon in a not so polite wording as I understand it. They never made it and were ordered back to the ship. The LIBERTY attack followed by the PUEBLO attack makes me wonder what LBJ had gotten himself into though.
" But it doesn't take that long to get a weapon up from the magazine to the flight deck."
Then why didn't we cover/protect him?
" LIBERTY"
Very painful - we could go on on this - suffice to say that LBJ was a mess and is still to - to this day.
Politics. As a research vessel the Pueblo should not have had a 50 caliber on it. If the conditions warranted such then the mission had done been compromised. North Korea was likely tracking the ship and Washington knew it thus the order for the 50 caliber I think was done in Toyko before they left out headed toward NK.
I have no idea why Pueblo wasn't covered. One possibility was not having any combat ships close by so as to not draw attention. Technically PUEBLO was a non combat research ship in the eyes of the world. LBJ did a stupid act by placing the 50 caliber onboard to start with. A capable E.D. system would have been a much wiser investment.
If it was that much danger the mission should have been aborted or at least the Captain alerted. The Pentagon knew NK was on the war path though but PUEBLO wasn't privy to some of the later developments and deteriorating conditions as I understand it.
When at the pointed tip of the spear, sometimes they are 'it'
Sometimes you are it
If ever I could ever I was able to write a message/book back to all the young people, I think that would be the title of it
They did. Their fight and priority was to destroy as much classified material as possible. The Captain used delay tactics to try and buy more time. Their sole defense was a 50 caliber on a ship that was supposed to be unarmed to start with.
There wasn't much else they could do. They were burning material which was priority number one and busting equipment but only had one incinerator. They were using waste cans for burns as well. If you don't have the means to fight and you have classified material you as quickly as possible destroy the equipment. They had no explosives nothing to work with despite the Captain's request and expressed concerns for such. Scuttling the ship was impossible as the Navy builds ships to resist sinking.
This wasn't a field combat nor a typical Naval attack. Now had it been a carrier coming under attack and in danger of capture or being over ran by the enemy? There would have been a different outcome. 5000 dead squids and a ship on the ocean floor.
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At least they should have sent them out with a ship better equipped to get rid of all the intel gear, and maybe one for easier scuttling if needed.
There were boats and Migs as well. The 50 caliber was placed on-board at Tokyo and was in cold heavy seas covered by a tarp. Boucher wanted the ship rigged for E.D. before deployment and rightfully so. It was ignored or denied. The PUEBLO was a one mission ship. What I'm saying is the ship and the crew trained for that single deployment. The Pentagon wasn't gonna put that much into the ship as that was likely it's one and only deployment.
It was a converted ship what from previous I can't remember off the top of my head. True there was fuel on-board. But DFM {Diesel Fuel Marine} has to have a lot of heat and generally a good draft to burn. Ask any farmer what he starts brush fires with. He gets kerosene. Diesel fuel just doesn't cit it. To make it work in boilers you use force draft blowers to create a torch effect. In engines you use forced air intake and compression creating heat.
I don't fault Boucher nor his crew. Nobody could have won that battle under the given circumstances. I understand the Code Of Conduct to Fight but I understand common sense to say the smash and burns were far more critical. Boucher bought them as much time as he could. I think NK had an idea of what they had otherwise they would have sank it. I kinda suspect Boucher figured as much and used it to his advantage as well. LBJ and McNamara lost that ship themselves. It was a disaster waiting to happen.
A good response would be, **** you very much--KA-f#@c(&+)g-BOOM!!!!!
God help these basturds if we ever get a leader!
Correct. Should have been done, along with the pier and the town attatched to it.
The USS Pueblo is still carried on the rolls as a commissioned ship on active duty.
The North Koreans captured The Pueblo a week before TET.
A flight of A-10 Warthogs with fighter cover could solve the issue in no time at all.
Re #31
OK a billion or so - wow!
Thanks
"The North Koreans captured The Pueblo a week before TET."
Things that make ya' go Hmmmmmmmm
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