Skip to comments.Will FR embrace socialism to make way for Rudy Giuliani as a Republican presidential candidate?
Posted on 04/21/2007 6:42:25 PM PDT by Jim Robinson
We've got some real challenges facing us. FR was established to fight against government corruption, overstepping, and abuse and to fight for a return to the limited constitutional government as envisioned and set forth by our founding fathers in the Declaration of Independence and the Constitution and other founding documents.
One of the biggest cases of government corruption, overstepping and abuse that I know of is its disgraceful headlong slide into a socialist hell. Our founders never intended for abortion to be the law of the land. And they never intended the Supreme Court to be a legislative body. They never intended God or religion to be written out of public life. They never intended government to be used to deny God's existence or for government to be used to force sexual perversions onto our society or into our children's education curriculum. They never intend for government to disarm the people. They never intended for government to set up sanctuary cities for illegals. They never intended government to rule over the people and or to take their earnings or private property or to deprive them of their constitutional rights to free speech, free religion, private property, due process, etc. They never intended government to seize the private property of private citizens through draconian asset forfeiture laws or laws allowing government to take private property from lawful owners to give to developers. Or to seize wealth and redistribute it to others. Or to provide government forced health insurance or government forced retirement systems.
All of the above are examples of ever expanding socialism and tyranny brought to us by liberals/liberalism.
FR fights against the liberals/Democrats in all of these areas and always will. Now if liberalism infiltrates into the Republican party and Republicans start promoting all this socialist garbage, do you think that I or FR will suddenly stop fighting against it? Do you think I'm going to bow down and accept abortionism, feminism, homosexualism, global warming, illegal alien lawbreakers, gun control, asset forfeiture, socialism, tyranny, totalitarianism, etc, etc, etc, just so some fancy New York liberal lawyer can become president from the Republican party?
Do you really expect me to do that?
I’m with ya!
I also see your concern of Demoncrats in drag pretending to be Republicans ... using the scare tactic of “want Hillary in there”? LOL! NOW is the time to weed out the Demoncrats in drag posing as Republicans and clean up the cultural and moral debauchery that the Rudy’s and McPain's of the world promote.
Hopefully Fred will run!
Watch out Jim the rudy bots will get you banned.
No way would I vote for him even if he was the nominee.
I’m with Thompson.
Up yours asswipe.
That wasn’t a presidential race.
I still can't fathom the idea of not supporting a candidate who goes the right way half the time over a candidate who does none of the time.
I don't support Rudy, but I'll vote for him if I have to just to keep a true 100% socialist out of the White House. Call me a political prostitute, but I still believe in the America I remember and the democrats will take that away from me.
I will be voting for a conservative come Nov, 2008.
Hopefully, that conservative will be from the Republican party and will win the White House.
If the Republicans don’t put up a conservative I can, with clear conscience, vote for, I will still vote for a conservative.
If that means I don't vote for a Republican Party candidate, then so be it. Principles over party, always.
The same folks who thought it would be a good idea to punish the President and the republicans in the mid term elections will be bragging about their power when the democrats take over the white house.
After all, it was said that it didn’t matter if the dems took over the senate because both parties were the same anyway.
That logic sure showed our troops and our allies, didn’t it?
That pretense of supporting the troops is no different than the dems insisting ‘they’ support the troops.
I don't know if Guliani is an economic socialist. He might have vetoed some of the spending bills the Bush signed.
The challenge for Guliani is that he is so far left of many of the cultural issues (not just abortion and gay marriage). When things like the murders at Virginia Tech happen (just like Columbine) many more people are concerned with these culture issues. Voters in Republican primaries are especially concerned about these issues and that is Guliani's challenge duiring the primary season.
I intend to vote for the Republican nominee, no matter who. I’m hoping it will be a conservative, but I’ll never vote RAT.
“So you prefer Hillary, then?”
LOL! Rudy and McPain are as bad as Hillary.
No backbone will get you MORE socialism, NO gun rights and more moral decline with either Hillary, Rudy or McPain.
“Because that’s the choice you know; a not-so-socially-conserevative Republican or another eight years of the Clintons.”
Some of us won’t settle for another four years of Clintons under another name - Rudy or McPain. Hillary, Rudy, McPain - they’re all the same. They should ALL be running as Democrats. You’re silly threats are boring. You ought to just vote for Hillary and be done with it.
I truly hope hillary is the dem candidate.
She will lose. Big.
I have no intention of “embracing” socialism, but I do embrace reality, and will vote for whatever candidates (for all offices) show the least commitment to socialism. I have no idea if that will be Rudy Giuliani, but if I’m facing a ballot that’s offering me a choice between Rudy, Hillary or Obama, and a couple of fringe party candidates who don’t have a snowball’s chance in hell of winning, I won’t hesitate to vote for Rudy. Unfortunately, there are no viable candidates who have a real aversion to socialism, because there is only a small minority of US voters who have a real aversion to socialism. That state of affairs will not be fixed at the voting booths — it needs to be fixed through political education of our fellow citizens, one by one. Only after a great deal more of that is accomplished, will candidates who are committed to rolling back the tide of socialism become potential winners of elections.
I lived in NYC through Rudy’s entire time as Mayor, and believe me, the city was much better off with him as Mayor, than it would have been with any of the other candidates who had any chance of actually getting elected. I don’t like his views on the Second Amendment, illegal aliens, or massive social “welfare” programs, but I won’t express my dislike for those views by voting for somebody who holds even more socialist views on these and other topics, or by handing my vote to a more-socialist-than-Rudy candidate by voting for somebody who has no chance whatsoever of winning.
Call if collectism if you want. Same thing to me.
When he posted that, I considered if the thought crossed your mind of choking him through the computer monitor.
Looks like you just did.
Thanks for clearing that up. So voting for liberals is ok, unless they run for president. Got it.
If you disagreed with a canidate on many issues but you were totlly convinced that that person was the best person to confront the Islamofacist. Would you support that person for President?
...gun grabbing, pro-abortion AND pro sanctuary cities for illegal immigrants...
I was about to ask if there was a single person on this thread that had even the vaguest idea of what the actual definition of “socialism” was.
You’re delusional. Rudy doesn’t go to the right even 10% of the time.
Well, Jim, since most of your polls show that the majority of us DON’T want Rudy the Rino for president I don’t think you have to worry about us embracing socialism. I sure as he** won’t.
Doesn't sound so bad to me. I lived through eight years of that hell before. If that is my choice, then I go third party. I will have plenty of time to decide which one.
Personally, I think this country just may have to burn before it gets better: the last American citizens who truly understood the meaning of sacrifice are rapidly departing from this world.
If FR continues to allow the full slate of candidates to be discussed, and that includes Rudy, then I don't see the point of this thread, and I say that with total respect of the fact that this is your site, and you get to run it as you see fit.
Yep, and Gracie too.......
I hope not. It will suck if our two main choices are Hillary and Giuliary.
Yet one of the people who have fought the hardest against Rudy is now banned from FR because the Rudybots started yelling that he was stalking. He was baited at every corner...when he asked them to stop posting to him, they said they would do as they damned well pleased...and they got him banned.
Please reinstate posting priviledges for Fierce Allegiance.
I’ll never vote Rat either. Despite which ticket he’s running on.
“Our founders never intended for abortion to be the law of the land. And they never intended the Supreme Court to be a legislative body. They never intended God or religion to be written out of public life. They never intended government to be used to deny God’s existence or for government to be used to force sexual perversions onto our society or into our children’s education curriculum”
Our founders could never envision the perverse behavior
of the ACLU, and teachers unions who wish to ram homosexuality down our children’s throats. Rudy has no problem with evil and perversity. We cannot allow him to prevail!!
No and I stand with you. Liberalism and all the evil that goes with it must be defeated. That fight starts here.
“Do you think I’m going to bow down and accept abortionism, feminism, homosexualism, global warming, illegal alien lawbreakers, gun control, asset forfeiture, socialism, tyranny, totalitarianism, etc, etc, etc, just so some fancy New York liberal lawyer can become president from the Republican party?
Do you really expect me to do that?”
No, sir. I don’t expect you to do so. And I hope that the conservative movement doesn’t become so unconfident in itself that it believes such expectations are reasonable. The Constitution established by our Founding Fathers - if it had any purpose - was to limit government (especially the federal government). No manner of sophistry on the part of modern liberals can change that.
I am a conservative not a Republican. I will vote for Republicans IF they are conservative. If Bush's opponent had not been Hanoi John Kerry, I would not have voted in the last election.
Islam's war against the west will inevitably bring the US a nuclear strike. The persistent open borders are a hot potato that will utterly destroy the party in power when it happens. I prefer that the borders be closed - but barring that, let it be the liberals who are destroyed if we're not going to move to prevent it.
This is as obvious and foreseeable as the earlier attacks on September eleventh. Aside from the loss we all will have of family and friends WHEN not if this happens, I recognize that the party who emerges in power will be able to radically reshape government the United States. Many on the left foresee this as well, and are actively working to keep our defenses weak.
I therefore am willing to sacrifice important pieces to win the game. Winning the white house or congress are less important than closing the borders. A candidate who could win an office, at the cost of placing someone in office that the left could justifiably claim failed to aggressively defend America costs conservatism control of the board.
By the same token I will not move to save a socially liberal republican candidate merely to defeat the democrat. Sometimes control of the board is more important than saving every pawn.
If I get a liberal in office who votes liberal while claiming (unchallenged) to represent the party with a conservative platform, then my voice is even more unheard than if a liberal democrat is in office. It means that conservatives will vote for anyone who claims conservatism, even if they are to the left of Hillary Clinton. It also means that the Republican party did this eyes wide open, believing that I (and other conservatives) would vote for a yellow dog if it was a republican. Sorry RNC that only works with democrats.
It’s not just FR, it is the Republican Party.
If the GOP will not stand up for the unborn baby, who will?
If the GOP won’t stand up for the RTKBA, who will?
If the GOP will not stand up for God in Public view, who will?
The GOP needs to give us a real choice. Socially, there is no difference between Rudy and Hillary.
I need a Conservative Patriot to beat a Commie liberal. The GOP needs to motivate the base.
The media is trying to make us believe we need a liberal to beat a liberal.
The media has not picked a front runner in a long time. Coward Dean was supposed to be the next Demoratic Nominee in 04.
When that didn’t work, Kohn Kerry was going to be President.
That didn’t work, so now I need a liberal to beat a liberal.
I say horse hockey!
I am with you, Jim.
Give me a Conservative or give me death.
I quite agree. I think Rudy was pressed up against the rightward wall as hard he could be in NYC. Any further and he wouldn't have gotten re-elected, and we'd have had somebody much, much further to the left instead. I expect he'll move somewhat further to the right as a national candidate because he'll have the space to do so -- the rightward wall of the national room is much further right than the rightward wall of the NYC room. Though I know it won't be as far right as my views are, I really don't want him to go any further, since as you note, the only viable alternative is likely to be Hillary.
that’s the point. There is precious little difference between Hilary and Guiliani. Would you vote for Hilary if there was an R behind her name?
>This is the forum that largely chose Alan Keyes as the presidential candidate in 2000 so I’m not terribly worried that they don’t like Rudy. LOL<
Really? I didn’t know that. I’ve supported Alan Keyes for 30 years. Good man. Good mind. Too bad the country doesn’t realize how much it needed him. Look where we find ourselves now! Whatever happened to all those FReeper Conservatives?!
You might try paying a little attention to some of the conservatives here. I think the chances of Rudy ever getting the nomination or of becoming president are somewhere between slim to none and not a snowball’s chance in hell.
I don’t believe Rudy is a socialist, but I do believe he’s a chameleon who will blow whichever way the winds of Congress blow, and if that Congress happens to be a Democrat Congress intent on making the United States as great a socialist welfare state as France, then Rudy might just go along to get along.
He cannot be allowed to succeed, because his success would only embolden Republican liberals (”moderates”) and make other wishy-washy GOP jellyfish believe that going “moderate” is the way to win elections.
Run, Fred, run.
I beg of you.
You just deleted someone who joined nine years ago.
Take it easy.
Pre-emptive surrender by picking a RINO is a really friggin’ stupid way to go.
Well the long and short of it is FR is basically irrelevant to who the Republican nominee is and who wins the presidential election - unless there’s some incident similar to the Rather/Texas Guard thing - same of course is true of DU, and Daily Kos and whatever.
As active and large as the board is it’s still a micropscopic (and unrepresentative) portion of even just the Republican Party, much less the electorate as a whole.