Sarko was calm, clear, soft spoken, polite, respectful and courteous.
Royal, dressed in a Hillary-like Mao shirt and a man-tailored jacket was shrill, harsh, rude, and disrespectful, both of Sarko, and the rules of the debate. She showed herself to be the hard core Socialist she is, in almost Stalinist martinet fashion, like a school marm. Speaking to Sarko with disdain, mocking him, even laughing, she proved herself to be the BOBO 68ist she is, and what she represents. The undisciplined, smug, self superior elitist who knows what is best for everyone.
IMO she clearly lost the debate. Her fawning over the Centrist Bayrou forgotten, she alienated more moderate voters on the Left, and in the Center.
I would venture a guess and say she gave away at least two points.
My friend, what is the unemployment rate in France currently? I should know this.
MORE FROM THE TOCQUEVILLE CONEECTION REPORT ON THE DEBATE:
TEMPERS FRAY IN FRENCH PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE
PARIS, May 2, 2007 (AFP) - Right-winger Nicolas Sarkozy and socialist rival Segolene Royal staged an often bad tempered televised debate Wednesday that could have a crucial effect on France’s presidential vote.
Facing each other across a table, Royal, who trails her rival in opinion polls ahead of Sunday’s runoff vote, launched a volley of attacks on Sarkozy’s record in government and their disagreements repeatedly flared into ill-restrained hostility.
An estimated 20 million viewers were engrossed by the two and half hours of exchanges on the reasons and cures for France’s economic and social problems. But analysts said neither could claim victory.
In the most fiery outburst, Royal charged Sarkozy with “political immorality” after he said that handicapped children should be guaranteed a place in ordinary schools.
“I am scandalised by what I have just heard,” said Royal in outraged tones, accusing Sarkozy’s government of dismantling Socialist Party education measures for the handicapped. “This is the height of political immorality.”
Sarkozy, who remained calm in the attack, retorted with: “I don’t question your sincerity, don’t question my morality ... You lose your temper very easily.”
Earlier Sarkozy repeated a pledge to cut the number of state employees — prompting accusations from Royal that he would endanger public services such as health and education.
Sarkozy said he would ensure full employment in France in five years by “freeing the forces of labour”, and said the 35-hour working week — introduced by the last socialist government — was killing employment.
“She (Royal) still thinks that you have to share out the work like pieces of a cake. Not a single country in the world accepts this logic, which is a monumental mistake,” he said.
Royal countered with a promise to create 500,000 youth jobs, funded from existing training and unemployment budgets. She questioned Sarkozy’s citation of an economic think-tank that said his programme would benefit the economy more than Royal’s.
This prompted Sarkozy to ask: “Why do you treat anyone who is not of your opinion with irony, even with contempt?”.
On several occasions, to Sarkozy’s proposals, Royal retorted with the remark: “What a pity you didn’t do that during your five years in government”.
Asked at the end to comment on each other, Sarkozy said, “I have much respect for her. We have a lot of differences, but I hope here we have given an image of a renewed democracy, at ease with itself. I hold no personal animosity.”
Royal said she would “refrain from personal remarks”, preferring to concentrate on the clash of ideas.
The encounter could be decisive in determining the choice of millions of uncommitted voters on Sunday. Nearly seven million people chose defeated centrist Francois Bayrou in the first round on April 22, and the second-round campaign has focussed on capturing his electorate.
Analysts said neither candidate had scored a decisive victory.
“There were two winners — with perhaps a slight advantage to Sarkozy. Neither fell into the trap prepared by the other. Sarkozy did not lose his temper and Royal did not come across as light-weight or incompetent,” said Christophe Barbier, editor of l’Express magazine.
Former Socialist minister Jack Lang said “Segolene Royal was breathtaking from start to finish. With real panache, she constantly set the agenda. She obviously appeared as the president of France.”
But Jacques Myard, a deputy from Sarkozy’s ruling UMP party, said Royal “was in a state of near-permanent aggressivity. Opposite her, Nicolas Sarkozy was convincing, able to calmly spell out his arguments without sounding like he was reading from a book.”
Campaigning for the second round ends on Friday at midnight. On Thursday the two candidates hold their last rallies, Royal in the northern city of Lille and Sarkozy in Montpellier in the south.
The latest opinion poll released by IPSOS on Tuesday gave Sarkozy 53.5 percent of the vote against 46.5 percent for Royal. A total of 87 percent said they had made up their mind.
In the first round, Sarkozy got 31.2 percent of the vote and Royal 25.9 percent. Le Pen got 10.4 percent.
On Tuesday Le Pen urged his 3.8 million voters not to vote for Sarkozy or Royal. Bayrou has not issued an endorsement for either candidate.
I guess Jack Lang, a former actor turned politician and Socialist lackey either didn’t watch the same debate everyone else did, or else is smoking something funny.
Yeah... but what exactly do they “win”?
Brilliant.
Any way to get the video of this debate? I have several French speaking students and I can undestand lots too.
I would love to see this.
Some new polls just out for Thursday, May 3 2007:
Ipsos/Dell POLL
Sarkozy 53,5% (=)
Royal 46,5% (=)
IpsosPOLL:
48% think it would be better if Sarko gets elected président, only 34% think Royal would be better .
Please...a link for the debate. C-SPAN does not have it yet.
I wish Sarko could run for President here too.
New from The Tocqueville Connection:
BLAIR PRAISES FRENCH RIGHT-WINGER SARKOZY
PARIS, May 2, 2007 (AFP)
- British Prime Minister Tony Blair said in a French magazine interview to be published Thursday he had learned to like and respect Nicolas Sarkozy, the right-wing frontrunner for the presidency.
Asked to speak out in favour of one of the two candidates — Sarkozy or his Socialist rival Segolene Royal — the centre-left leader told Paris Match “that is the decision for the French people. That is your election.
“Look, I am in a special position I have not met Segolene Royal and I obviously know Nicolas Sarkozy well,” he said.
“We have worked closely together on a number of issues. So I got to know him well and I liked him very much and respected him very much.
Asked what he appreciated in the former interior minister, Blair replied: “He is decisive, he is clear.”
“I noticed when we had a difficult situation we needed to resolve when he was the interior minister and the whole business to do with... clandestine immigration, I just found him very open and very helpful.
Sarkozy has been attacked at home for what his critics say is a hard-line approach to immigration issues.
Blair described himself as a “fan” of France, saying the country “has a tremendous opportunity to play a big role on the world stage to get its economy really moving.”
Arguing that France and Britain shared “the same values”, he said it was “essential for young people that Britain and France have a common future” within Europe.
Switching briefly to French, Blair commented on the left-right divide saying “Everybody now wants to find another way, because we know that it’s impossible to be split between the ideologues of left and right.
“For us in Britain it was very important to combine prosperity and social justice,” he said, arguing that it was impossible in today’s world “to protect jobs through more regulation”.
Despite their age difference and much-reported clashes on the European stage, Blair said his relationship with the 74-year-old President Jacques Chirac was “better than was often written” and that he would keep “a lot of respect” for the outgoing leader.
THE INTERNATIONAL HERALD TRIBUNE (owned by The NYTimes and The Washington Post) WEIGHS IN:
French candidates stick to their scripts in a heated debate
By Katrin Bennhold and Doreen Carvajal
Wednesday, May 2, 2007
PARIS:: In a long awaited debate on national television, Nicolas Sarkozy, the candidate of the right, and Ségolène Royal, a Socialist and the first woman with a serious chance at the presidency, traded barbs Wednesday evening but barely strayed from known positions before an audience of millions of people seeking an answer to the question of who should lead this country out of its malaise.
Royal centered her attack on Sarkozy’s record as a member of the outgoing government, while he sought to question her competence to lead the country.
For two hours, in a heavily domestic discussion, the two aired France’s problems: unemployment, crime, young people without hope for the future, public health and pension systems threatened by drastic reduction of funds.
This was the first presidential debate in France in 12 years and Royal came into it needing a strong knockout punch.
Before the face-off began, commentators expressed doubts that the encounter could radically alter the campaign before the vote Sunday. Nearly nine in 10 voters say they have already decided who would get their ballot and Sarkozy has been ahead in the opinion polls since mid-January.
Sarkozy, 52, was chosen by lots as the opening speaker so Royal, 53, won the last word in an encounter that was meticulously planned, with the candidates seated exactly 2.2 meters from each other across a white table.
Both were allotted exactly the same air time.
The first question of substance was about the style each candidate would bring to the presidency. They quickly moved to a sharp exchange centered on the fears of the French ? unemployment and crime ? with Sarkozy defending his four years as interior minister and Royal accusing his government of neither suppressing crime nor giving sufficient funds or protection to public services ? from the police to hospitals.
“What have you done in five years? For five years you had all the power.
There is a problem of credibility,” Royal said after Sarkozy outlined his plans for institutional and economic reforms.
“You talking to me about credibility, Madame Royal?” Sarkozy retorted.
Sparks flew between the two as moderators parried their volleys. In the middle of an exchange on schooling for the handicapped, Royal sought to paint Sarkozy as unreasonably hard-hearted. He urged her to calm down, whereupon she insisted three times: “I will not calm down!” Sarkozy then said: “To be president of the Republic you have to be calm..”
It was important to draw the right conclusions of the past few years in France, he said, pointing to the strong showing of the nationalist Jean-Marie Le Pen in 2002. The president is someone, he said, who must “keep his word and really engage in a few topics.”
“I will speak much more frequently to the French,” he added in a clear jab at President Jacques Chirac, who at moments of crisis was sometimes silent during his 12 years in power. “I don’t want to hide behind taboos,” he said.
A combative Royal riposted by sketching a devastating picture of France today, a country deeply in debt with two million people living below the poverty line, three million unemployed and prey to rising violence.
“I want to get France out of the situation it finds itself in today,” she said, challenging Sarkozy to say whether as a member of the government he accepted responsibility for the current state of affairs.
Sarkozy came straight back at her: “Yes, Madame Royal,” he said. “I am responsible for a part of the record of this government.” But he added that when the center-right government took over from the Socialists in 2002, “I found a situation that was catastrophic.”
Sarkozy threw back at her the record of the Socialist government under Lionel Jospin ? of which Royal was a member. He pulled out his own statistics, asserting that the crime rate today was much improved from the days when the Socialists were in power.
Sarkozy agreed with Royal that the debt was a major problem, but said it had not sprouted up in the last five years. Part of his solution, he said, would be to replace only one of every two civil servants workers who vacates a position.
Royal went on the attack. “If I were elected president of the republic, the rights of the republic will be protected,” she said. “No, Mr. Sarkozy, I will not reduce social services,” she then declared, adding that if his government had not closed so many classrooms, for example, schools and schoolchildren would be doing better.
Coming to what Royal described as the central question, work, the two clashed again. She called Sarkozy’s proposals “inefficient and even dangerous” and asked him, “If you think the 35-hour work week created so much damage, why didn’t you get rid of it?”
“I want to re-launch growth,” she said, adding that she would rather give a job to a young person than give a gift to business in the form of exoneration from payroll taxes on overtime work beyond the 35-hour week.
“I am in favor of a 35-hour week,” Sarkozy insisted. But he said people should have the right to work more if they wanted, especially people with low salaries. “What good is extra time off if at the end of the month there’s no money left?” he asked. “Let people make more money if they agree to work more.”
In one of the more heated exchanges of the evening, Sarkozy accused Royal of having no credible economic program.
“It seems to me that when it comes to debt,” he said, “you given no indication how to reduce it. That’s your right. When it comes to growth, you have given no means of reviving growth. I have: because you’re right we need more growth. The problem of France is that there is about 1 percentage point of growth less than in other big democracies and economies in the world. Why: For a simple reason, Madame Royal: Because we work less than the others.
“It may surprise you,” he said, that none of the 10 countries in Europe that have fuller employment have the 35-hour week. “You want more civil servants?” he added. “That’s nice. But how do you pay that?” She shot back: “Don’t deform my words. I will maintain the number of civil servants not increase it. I will redeploy them in a more efficient way.”
The two candidates spent most of the debate on domestic matters, only turning to foreign and security policy after the first two hours.
The debate was moderated by Patrick Poivre d’Arvor, anchor of the evening newscast on TF1, the leading French station, and Arlette Chabot of state-run France 2. Both had interviewed the candidates several times separately, but neither had moderated a presidential debate before.
Broadcasters expected 20 million people to tune in to the debate. In many usually animated streets of Paris cafés and restaurants, normally bustling, were populated with only handfuls of people, and the sounds of the debate blared through open windows.
Great news.
THE LONDON TELEGRAPG WEIGHS IN:
Sarkozy and Royal lock horns in TV showdown
By Henry Samuel in Paris
Last Updated: 2:04am BST 03/05/2007
Nicolas Sarkozy and Ségolène Royal came face to face in a television studio known as “the boxing ring” last night, with Miss Royal immediately on the offensive in a debate that could swing Sunday’s French presidential election.
Before an estimated 20 million viewers Miss Royal, the Socialist candidate, told Mr Sarkozy, the Right-wing front runner, that his “zero tolerance” policy on crime while interior minister had failed.
“You are in part responsible for the situation in which France finds itself today,” Miss Royal said in her opening remarks, accusing the government of failing to tackle unemployment and overseeing an increase in street crime.
“Today, you can see that the French are very worried about the rise in violence and aggression in French society,” she said.
“The number of violent acts at school has risen by 26 per cent.
“I want to be the president who creates a France where aggression and violence is receding, a France that will win the battle against unemployment and an expensive life, and that will make inequalities decrease.”
Mr Sarkozy, the leader of the UMP party, hit back saying that a rise in crime had happened under the last Socialist government.
He said: “I was interior minister for four years. I found a catastrophic situation which went a long way in explaining the defeat of your friends in the government to which you belonged at the time.’’
Mr Sarkozy then attacked France’s laws on a 35-hour working week, which Miss Royal champions, saying they had been “disastrous” for the nation and had spread a “malaise”, particularly in hospitals.
Miss Royal, however, said she understood that nurses did not wish to work longer hours and the only problem was that not enough of them had been employed.
In the studio the two finalists faced one another six feet apart at a square table while they answered questions from France’s two best-known interviewers. Fitting their political views, Miss Royal sat on the left, while Mr Sarkozy was on the right.
Such televised debates have been held in every French election since 1974 except in 2002, when Jacques Chirac refused to meet the far-Right leader Jean-Marie Le Pen.
Last night’s encounter was seen by both sides as crucial in swaying millions of floating voters, particularly the seven million who backed centrist François Bayrou in the first round of the vote on April 22. Despite repeated overtures, Miss Royal has won over only a third of the Bayrou electorate but needs two thirds to win.
Mr Sarkozy has sought to present himself during the election campaign almost as an opposition leader, promising to break with the past if he takes over.
“We cannot continue to do politics as before,” he said in last night’s debate.
Previous debates have produced some killer one-liners. In a clash with François Mitterrand in 1974, Valéry Giscard d’Estaing coined the phrase: “You do not have a monopoly on the heart”, which was seen as tipping the election in his favour - he won by less than 400,000 votes.
In 1988, Mr Mitterrand outwitted Mr Chirac, his prime minister.
“This evening, I am not your prime minister and you are not the president. We are two equal candidates. Permit me to call you Mr Mitterrand,” said Mr Chirac.
“You’re absolutely right, Mr prime minister,” came the reply.
However, before the debate Mr Sarkozy, 52, was keen to play down the importance of the event: “I don’t think that the French are going to make their choice of president for the next five years based on an impression from a two-hour debate,” he said.
Mr Sarkozy had the most to lose: he has been consistent favourite in recent months, and has kept a lead over Miss Royal in polls published since the first round, in which he scored 31.2 per cent compared to Miss Royal’s 25.9 per cent.
The latest Ipsos poll yesterday gave Mr Sarkozy 53.5 per cent of the vote against 46.5 per cent for Miss Royal. A total of 87 per cent said they had made up their mind. Both candidates had meticulously prepared for last night’s television encounter. Mr Sarkozy took advice from Eric Besson, the Socialist’s former chief economist who defected to his side during the campaign.
Mr Besson, who since quitting the Royal camp has written a best-selling book on her failings, has spent the past few days at Mr Sarkozy’s side pinpointing all the weak links in her “presidential pact” - particularly in economic matters.
The man who only months ago described Mr Sarkozy as an “American neo-conservative with a French passport” pledged allegiance to the Right-wing candidate at a rally last week, in which he warned him to expect more “demonisation”.
The first and only debate in the closely-fought election race was shown live on France’s two main television channels and was estimated to have been watched by nearly half of France’s 44.5 million voters.
MORE UPDATES FROM BOZ AT French Election 2007
Francois Hollande (Head of PS and Royal partner):
“The debate was profitable. Segolene led and even dominated the exchange (...). She showed (...) credibility. She also showed coherence.”
Julien Dray (Royal spokesperson):
“Those which did not know Ségolène Royal discovered a president, a woman of authority, convictions. Several times, Nicolas Sarkozy was on the defensive. Perhaps it is that he did not expect such a confrontation and such an intensity.
Rachida Dati (Sarkozy spokesperson):
“He was very clearly and very precise, which was not the case of Ségolène Royal who throughout this debate was very fuzzy, indeed in confusion (...) She added confusion to confusion, fuzziness to fuzziness.”
Valerie Pecresse (UMP spokesperson):
“This debate, it is Nicolas Sarkozy who won it. Because everyone thought that he was going to be unnerved. Because all the campaign of the PS was only founded on its character, and the fact that it was to make fear.”
IMHO Boz' comments are interesting and informative, but he is not coming from an objective point of view. He is somewhat anti-Sarko and has not hidden his wish that Royal were better so she could score a win for the Left. Thoughts on Debate
I've just finished watching the majority of tonight's debate, so I thought I would finally comment. First of all, Royal did a much better job during most of the debate itself in terms of TV behavior. Each candidate naturally repeated the same propositions that we have heard throughout the campaign, but Sarkozy was noticeably looking at the table or at the moderators, where as Royal was always looking intently across the table at Sarkozy.
Nevertheless, the conclusions gave me the reverse impression. Sarkozy either wear's his heart on his sleeve or is an excellent actor, for whenever he talks about the value of work and his intent to act, he comes across convincingly and charismatic. Royal, on the other hand, easily slipped into her "mother of four" speech, which ended up sounding trite and scripted.
Overall, this will lead voters to make up their minds only by reinforcing already established impressions. Neither candidate really stood out for the better or worse, which by default will hurt Royal. In tomorrow's Washington Post the article on the debate highlights Royal's instant of "anger" as a decisive moment.
In front of millions of television viewers, Sarkozy turned the tables. Royal got furious when he started talking about handicapped children, saying he was "playing" with the issue. "I am very angry," she said.
"You become unhinged very easily, Madame," said Sarkozy. "To be president of the republic, one must be calm. ... I don't know why Mrs. Royal, who's usually calm, has lost her calm."
If this becomes the defining moment of the debate, it could very well damage her, although I doubt it will do either. You can watch the interchange here. Watching it one starts to get flashbacks to that 1993 debate between the two, when a younger Segolene Royal refused to allow Sarkozy to interrupt her. It's reassuring to know that despite the differences in circumstances, they haven't much changed.
THE WASHINGTON POST WEIGHS IN :
French Presidential Rivals Debate
By JOHN LEICESTER
PARIS — For more than two hours, France’s presidential front-runner needled his challenger during a debate Wednesday _ a little sarcasm here, a comment about her partner there _ all wrapped in a veneer of chivalry and always addressing her as “Madame.”
Finally, Segolene Royal snapped. The woman seeking to become France’s first female president erupted in anger toward the end of the prime-time duel with conservative Nicolas Sarkozy.
It was surprising _ and potentially damaging _ that Royal, not Sarkozy, proved quick to anger. During their bitter election campaign, the Socialist has sought to portray her conservative rival as too unstable, too brutal, to lead the nuclear-armed nation.
In front of millions of television viewers, Sarkozy turned the tables. Royal got furious when he started talking about handicapped children, saying he was “playing” with the issue. “I am very angry,” she said.
“You become unhinged very easily, Madame,” said Sarkozy. “To be president of the republic, one must be calm. ... I don’t know why Mrs. Royal, who’s usually calm, has lost her calm.”
On policy, the first and last debate between the two candidates before Sunday’s runoff election produced no major surprises. They disagreed on how to get France’s sluggish economy working again, on whether Turkey should join the European Union, on how to safeguard French pensions and on whether taxes should be cut.
Royal, who is behind in polls and needed to score points, immediately went on the offensive, criticizing Sarkozy’s record as a minister in President Jacques Chirac’s government before he became a candidate for the presidency.
Sarkozy, leading in the polls and looking to get through the debate unscathed, did not rise to Royal’s baiting, even after she repeatedly interrupted him.
“Will you let me finish?” he asked at one point.
“No,” said Royal.
“Ah,” replied Sarkozy.
An immediate point of contention was France’s 35-hour work week _ a landmark reform for Socialists, but decried by business leaders as a crippling brake on companies.
Sarkozy wants to get around the 35-hour week by making overtime tax-free to encourage people to work more. He described the shortened work week as a “monumental error,” and noted that no other country in Europe had followed France’s lead.
Royal defended the 35-hour work week as a form of social progress and asked why, if it was so opposed, the government in which Sarkozy served had not gotten rid of the legislation. Repeatedly, she accused Sarkozy _ who served as the interior and finance minister _ of having failed to improve France while he was in government.
“What did you do for five years? Because for five years, you had all the power. There’s a credibility problem,” she said.
He, in turn, suggested that her economic program was unworkable and lacked precision. And he dug at her partner and the father of their four children, Socialist Party boss Francois Hollande.
“I know that Francois Hollande said he doesn’t like the rich, which is a strange thing,” said Sarkozy, adding Hollande “must not like himself.”
The debate was expected to draw 20 million viewers or more in a nation re-energized by its hunger for change after 12 lackluster years under Chirac.
Sarkozy and Royal were the last two candidates standing after the April 22 first round of voting in which Sarkozy won 31.2 percent and Royal had 25.9 percent, with 10 rival candidates across the political spectrum knocked out of the race.
Royal’s underdog bid had gathered some momentum recently.
She outdid Sarkozy on Tuesday with a larger rally in Paris than one he had over the weekend. Also Tuesday, far-right nationalist Jean-Marie Le Pen, who placed fourth with nearly 4 million votes, urged his supporters to abstain Sunday. Polls show his voters were more likely to back Sarkozy than Royal, and it could cut into Sarkozy’s support if they stay home.
Sarkozy, who built much of his campaign on a pledge to break with the Chirac era, promised in his concluding remarks not to disappoint or betray the French if they elect him. Royal urged voters to be “daring” enough to elect a woman, citing the example of German Chancellor Angela Merkel.
“I know that for some ... it is not easy to tell oneself that a woman can shoulder the highest responsibilities,” she said. “Others do it elsewhere in the world.”
___
Associated Press Writer Jenny Barchfield in Paris contributed to this report.
I haven’t had time to go and look at the actual transcripts, but I doubt Sarkozy said “unhinged”.
My bet is he said “derange”, which the translator translated as “deranged” or “unhinged”, while it really means “irritated”.
“Unhinged” is too strong. “Irritated”, “angry”, “agitated” perhaps.
It’s probably asking to much, but do you happen to have the actual text where Sarkozy is alleged to have said to Royal that she comes “unhinged” too easily? I doubt it.
Thanks for your post and for your analysis. Both very cogent, and very coherent.
I just watched the analysis of this on France 24. They had a four-member panel, three of whom hate Sarko and love Royal, the fourth wasn’t really enthused about either. I don’t know why they bother.
FYI