Skip to comments.GIULIANI URGES CLINTON TO RELEASE ISRAELI SPY (1999, Jonathan Pollard)
Posted on 05/06/2007 11:57:38 AM PDT by calcowgirl
click here to read article
Giving you the benefit of the doubt: If your implication is that what Rudy said about Jonathan Pollard is ancient history, you're full of baloney.
The challenges to Giuliani based on his past actions as an executive are as relevant as what Hillary did when she was acting like a tyrant in the White House (Billy Dale & the travel office, Grand Jury testimony that prosecutors didn't believe but couldn't indict her on, etc.). He's got to take the bad with the good about his past, and having gone on record as suggesting the release of an American agent spying for Israel wouldn't be tolerated of a Democrat, either.
Those of us who were warned that the "compassionate conservatism" practiced by then-Governor Bush was more liberal than we were being led to believe feel burned and betrayed. If it weren't for the terrorist attacks that made the war priority number one, Bush's most rock-solid stance would be the opening of the borders to illegal immigrants.
As Jim Robinson said in his controversial thread, this isn't about beating Hillary or Obama, it's about changing the definition of "conservative" for years to come, win or lose; if Giuliani or whoever prevails by being closer to the center than Hillary, Obama, or (ecch) Edwards, it could be curtains for true constructionist jurists in Federal courts from the Supreme Court on down (ever forget that the only reason we have Roberts and Alito today is because Bush made it to a second term and didn't get his wish with Harriet Miers). If he loses, then the message may be the answer is to move further to the center.
Rudy’s biggest asset is his uncanny ability to (a) pucker-up, (b) kneel in obeisance, (c) stick his head up the backsides of voting blocs, and (d) pocket campaign contributions——all at the same time.
Rudy’s campaign gear includes reliable kneepads-—and a physician-on-call-—for emergency removals.
Giuliani is now getting pummeled by the mainstream press, Democrats and the Conservative Republicans. Any bets on how much longer he can stay in the race?
Well, for the sake of freeing Pollard, I’d vote for Rudy. But I’d much rather vote for a number of the other current candidates, but to set Pollard free is a meritorious and gracious act, itself alone worthy of my vote.
Yeah, but he's scared witless by FReepers.
(graphic courtesy of monkapotamus' expertise)
"Oh, please. They're killing me on FR just b/c I had three wives, several
mistresses, was honored by NARAL, donated to Planned Parenthood, and
marched for gay rights under the NAMBLA banner."
Meritorious and gracisous? Would that hold true for every convicted, spying scumbag who sells our national secrets, or is Pollard the only traitor you support?
But since he won't, I hope he rots in prison and gets violated regularly from his boyfriends, Bubba and Le-Roy.
Yet another example of the committed Rudy voter. Scary, huh?
See the US Constituion:
Section 3. Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their enemies, giving them aid and comfort.Israel is an ally -- one of our closest allies.
As ever and always hate for Jews blinds a certain percentage. Pollard was chump change. There were are far bigger and more committed spies -- who DO INDEED work for those who would destroy us.
Are you in the same damnably blindered camp of those in our government who condemned the Israeli raid of the Iraq reactor?
I believe I used the word “traitor,” not treason.
Main Entry: trai·tor
1 : one who betrays another’s trust or is false to an obligation or duty
2 : one who commits treason
Pollard betrayed a trust. He failed in his duty to protect U.S. secrets, willingly handing them over to Israel. His actions had repercussions, endangering (and costing) lives of Americans, and setting back U.S. intelligence. You may call that “chump change.” I call it traitorous.
Frankly, I don’t care what country it was. Those who would betray their country deserve the harshest of punishment. Your attempt to turn my comments into “hate for Jews” and calling others “blind” is disgusting.
Classic strawman argument. Objective criticism of Israel means someone is a Jew-hater.
Let's change Pollard's name. Let's call him Chu Wei, stealing guidance system secrets for China. Or John Smith, stealing sat intel about the region around South Africa for DeBeers -- just to make up a tale. Feel the same way?
What is truly disappointing is that you use such rhetoric to try to infuse hatred. Sorry. No such hatred present here.
Feel the same way?
Yes. Exactly the same way. A traitor is a traitor is a traitor.
I met an idiot savant once. Came into the pizzeria one of my brother's owned. Could multiply seven digit numbers in his head, figure the days between any two dates, and some other interesting tricks.
What feats have you?
Oh, I see. Calling me a “hater” wasn’t good enough.
Because I want to see National Security enforced, you call me an “idiot.”
Resort to personal attacks is highly unbecoming. Good day.
Well, you are a hater. Trying to hate two at once too. Hate Guiliani and Pollard. Spics and Jews. Otherwise there’s ZERO to the argument for holding Pollard longer. The facts are that he spied for an an ally, and his time already served — mostly in solitary, iirc — is far harder than ANY comparable case.
I believe this poster has gone over the line.
I tried to be as polite as I could be in the presence of personal attacks,
but this is offensive and unwarranted.
Rudy and Olson's position is that Pollard's punishment did not fit the crime when compared to others of the same ilk.
Do you have a problem with that??
Bibi Netanyahu has many fans here. Why shouldn't Rudy, or any American pol, have fans in Israel?
Rudy is very popular with Jews. So????????
I hope all the GOP candidates are. Jews are activists, and they have money to contribute. The GOP would love to get the Jewish vote.
"Olson had also gained notability by acting as attorney for convicted spy Jonathan Pollard while he was in private practice. Olson had appealed to United States Court of Appeals for the D.C. Circuit claiming that during Pollard's trial, the life sentence he received was in violation of the plea bargain agreement, which had specifically taken life off the table. Olson also argued that in violation of said plea bargain, that was grounds for a mistrial. The Court of Appeals, in a panel of three judges, voted 2-1 that no grounds existed for a mistrial. Future Supreme Court Justice Ruth Bader Ginsburg cast the deciding vote against Pollard's motion."
There is no punishment too large for those that sell out their country.
I don't care if they are Israelis, Mexicans or Martians, but this dual nationality crap is UN AMERICAN.
You cannot serve two masters. You are either an American Citizen loyal ONLY to the USA or you AIN'T - period, end, stop.
BTW - do you have a problem with Israelis supporting Rudy, or any other American pol? Many supported GWB too.
I just went back and read some of your posts. Great job defending your position. I think some people also use the term ally when isn’t quite relevant. Technically, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Egypt, and a long list of others are our allies. That term can real grey real quick.
Bill Clinton should be in jail too, but aw, what the heck : )
Daniel Pearl, by virtue of his parents being dual citizens, had dual citizenship as well. Would you accuse him of disloyalty?
Are you implying Israel is not an ally? Or that Egypt is as much of an ally as Israel?
A dose of humor :) Hey SJB
HI there! It looked like a bit of humor was called for.
I have a problem with ALL foreigners meddling in U.S. elections.
And I assure you no GOP candidate will turn down contributions or support from law-abiding citizens of any country.
Supporting a candidate is called free speech.
Thanks. There are indeed different levels of allies, but that isn’t my point, really. Whether ally or not, our secrets are our secrets. If the U.S. chooses to share those secrets, that is one thing. Those who choose to help themselves serve heavy consequences—and rightfully so.
Pollard’s actions were traitorous. To call him “chump change” should be an insult to all of those wanting to maintain National Security and sovereignty.
(question: is it j edward or jed ward? I was going to type JE but I remember someone posting to you as JW. I’m so confused!!!! LOL)
“Are you implying Israel is not an ally?”
Nope, I was implying and will say outright that if anyone chooses to use the “it was an ally” as a position of defense, they are opening themselves up to the argument of whether that should be a factor or not.
“Or that Egypt is as much of an ally as Israel?”
If someone wants to use the ally position, then they have to defend that very scenario. What does the Department of State declare?
How did you do that deceptive thing with the url you posted? And why?
I don’t know who he was loyal to.
jedward’s fine if it’s not too long to type :) or j
I don’t know who are loyal to.
Humor is good :) Mine of more of a sinical type (lol)
I don’t know who you are loyal to.
Last I looked, U.S. residence was required to legally vote.
I also believe there is a ban on contributions from foreign nationals, according to FEC rules.
Like I said--I'm against foreign meddling, no matter the foreigner.
Your spelling of cynical is pretty funny. :)
Your spelling of cynical is pretty funny. :)
I think it is quite clear: The United States of America!
Americans living overseas are entitled to vote in American elections.
Humor is good :) Mine of more of a sinical type (lol”
Oh, a bit of a demon, eh? : )
So you say.
You should see my spelling at around 2:30 in the morning. Bearly reedable :)
lol...total refusal to use spellcheck :) Cynical, I’ve got it now (LOL)