Posted on 05/18/2007 9:06:58 AM PDT by Jakarta ex-pat
Later read maybe pingout.
You seem to think it feels good to lose faith. Trust me, nothing feels worse than knowing how lonely we really are, in this existence.
As for your directive to “tell God flat out you don’t believe and ask that if He be real, that He change that,” how long must one wait, and how long must one ask? All I hear are chirping crickets of reality. Not one or two days, a good many years and counting...
That, and by the way, real atheists have nothing against this God. They are just amused at the lengths mankind goes into believing that which isn’t real, and a few other times, a good reason for being afraid of the delusional.
Naw... been there, done that. The years kept rolling by, and I just got stronger in my convictions. If that's the 'revelation' you describe, then every theist religion is false.
“Between being dishonest to myself, or sobering to reality, the latter choice is what I’d make any day.”
I agree. Existentialism doesn’t necessarily have a happy ending, but at least it’s honest and requires no suspension of disbelief.
I do believe that the biggest atheists are the ones who pray the most fervently, ironically. They are so badly in need to justify their doubtable beliefs, they need to pull themselves and others into the absurd, much like how a crime seems to become naught, if everyone’s doing it.
“I do believe. Help my unbelief!”
To me, that’s oxymoronic.
:)
[All you’re telling me is that I should believe in a god because if he actually does exist then unbelievers all go to hell]
I’m not suggesting that at all- lot’s of people will beleive there is a God- however, they will miss the mark of salvation. All I am saying is seek Him
[Atheists are people who simply demand proof in order to believe in something]
Seems to me that you demand it, but on your terms only- if that weren’t the case, then you’d at least Seek Him. The proof comes through the leap.
[So, lesson learned right? Not all atheists are damn dirty commies although a lot are.]
Never said they were as explained by my genralizing reply to Carrots
[how long must one wait, and how long must one ask?]
As long as it requires- giving up isn’t a justification for unbelief
[They are just amused at the lengths mankind goes into believing that which isn’t real, and a few other times,]
Not real? Says who? Those who haven’t found God? lol
[“I do believe. Help my unbelief!”
To me, that’s oxymoronic.]
Which is why that statemtn shouldn’t be made- The correct statemtn is “I don’t believe, help my unbelief”
I have an empty glass in front of me. How long must I believe that it’ll fill up with the finest whiskey, before I need to give up on the notion that it’ll ever happen?
Actually it was my earlier post that gcruse replied to.
Look at it, and you’ll see how that oxymoron fits.
[Yes we can get into the whole scientifically proving god’s existence but it really doesn’t matter because the fundamental basis of religion is believing without proof, i.e. faith]
Also not entirely correct- God Himself said al lthe proof needed is all around us so that no man will have an excuse for not believing or not seeking Him- it’s just a matter of where you’d rather put your faith- either in a science that excludes God, or science that includes Him, or even in the elements all around us that point to God.
[I have an empty glass in front of me. How long must I believe that it’ll fill up with the finest whiskey, before I need to give up on the notion that it’ll ever happen?]
You’re asking for nothing to do the act- whereas asking God to reveal Himself to you is asking someone capable of doing so.
Oh come on! If that's the case, then what's around to prevent the sheeple from believing there could be two, or more creators?
That's weird, circular ill-logic. The effect begging for the cause.
Have a band-aid. That was aimed at Dawkins’ inability to provide coherent answers to those questions. Your answers are far superior to his.
[Oh come on! If that’s the case, then what’s around to prevent the sheeple from believing there could be two, or more creators?]
Jesus Christ. That and the confirmation in believers through the Holy Spirit
[That’s weird, circular ill-logic. The effect begging for the cause.]
How do you know God idn’t answer your requestsd earlier? Perhaps He has, many times, and you’ve tried to rationalize them away or dismiss them- knowing better, but doing so. Does the heart really want the answer? Or is htere somethign in you that wants somethign to use as an excuse not to believe?
Circular reasoning? How do you know if you don’t experience God’s Salvation? You’re arguing from a position that isn’t privy to the experience, and so can’t make an experiential conclusion. If He isn’t real, He won’t answer, but If He does answer, and you don’t accept, then it’s a willful un-experiential conclusion that you come to
G’night- need a nap.
Why Jesus Christ?
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