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Kuhner: A Giuliani victory will drive Christians out of the GOP
Insight Magazine ^ | 5/23/2007 | Jeffrey T. Kuhner

Posted on 05/24/2007 1:00:37 PM PDT by calcowgirl

- Jeffrey T. Kuhner is the editor of Insight (www.insightmag.com).

Rudy Giuliani’s candidacy threatens to shatter the Republican Party. The former New York mayor remains the party’s front-runner for the 2008 presidential nomination. If this trend continues, his victory will mark the end of the modern GOP.

Ever since Barry Goldwater, the Republicans have become the country’s conservative party. The party stands not only for limited government, low taxes, capitalism and strong national defense, but for something even more fundamental: God, family and bourgeois civilization. The GOP has been the only national political institution willing to defend Judeo-Christian morality from the relentless secular liberal onslaught of the 1960s. At the core of this defense have been abortion and the traditional family. Giuliani’s brand of social liberalism will fundamentally alter the nature of the party.

He is often portrayed in the media as a hawkish conservative. He is nothing of the sort. Rather, he is a type of Republican that has become increasingly fashionable (and influential) over the last decade: A Big Government corporatist, who champions plutocracy, open borders and the rights of big business. As mayor, he had many accomplishments—cutting taxes, cracking down on crime and reducing welfare dependency. Yet he also transformed New York into a safe haven for millions of illegal immigrants; he refused to substantially slash the bloated and scandal-ridden municipal bureaucracy; and he cashed in on his reputation as “America’s Mayor” and “Mr. 9/11” to make out like a bandit after leaving office.

Pundits have gushed over his berating of Ron Paul during the recent candidates’ debate on FOX News, insisting Giuliani demonstrated his "toughness" on national security. He did no such thing, except make several glib statements. The media, however, is refusing to confront this fundamental question: If Giuliani is so tough on national defense, why has his lobbying firm been taking massive amounts of money from Saudi Arabia? His firm, Bracewell & Giuliani, has been lobbying on behalf of countless clients. Like many prominent politicians, Giuliani has made lots of money by entering the sleazy world of lobbying.

This presents an obvious conflict of interest. Yet even more troubling is the fact that the Saudis have become a major client of his firm. Giuliani’s firm has helped him acquire his vast personal fortune. However, his millions have come with a heavy price: He has been bought and paid for by the Saudis. These are the same Saudis who are the world’s largest financial sponsors of terrorism; the same Saudis who bankroll nearly half of Hamas’ budget; the same Saudis who have sent millions to al Qaeda and their affiliates worldwide; and the same Saudis whose regime recently denounced the U.S.-led war in Iraq as an “illegal occupation of a foreign country.” Hence, if Giuliani is such a patriot and someone who is so tough on national security, why has he gotten into bed with the America-hating, Jew-baiting, Wahhabist Islamists in Riyadh?

Even more troubling is his support for abortion rights. Abortion is the seminal issue of our time; it is today what slavery was in the mid-19th century. In fact, there is a considerable historical parallel between the abolitionist and pro-life movements. At their core, both share the same objective: To protect and uphold each individual’s basic human dignity.

The great sin of slavery was that the system denied the essential humanity of America’s black population. Encoded in law was the pernicious—and evil—principle that an entire class of people was less than fully human.

The same barbaric logic applies to abortion. It denies the essential humanity of unborn babies, consigning an entire class of people to be murdered because they are falsely viewed as being less than human. The results have been devastating. Nearly 50 million babies have been slaughtered since Roe v. Wade became law. The pro-life movement is not simply a religious crusade, but, like slavery, it is about ensuring human rights for the weakest and most oppressed in our society. Slavery was a cancer that was eating away at America’s social and moral fabric; abortion is a cancer—a leukemia, in fact—that is corroding and sapping the moral sinews of our society.

There is nothing more defenseless (and more innocent) than a tiny baby. This is even more so when he or she is still in the mother’s womb. It is simple human decency to oppose the killing of babies—born or unborn—in cold blood. If a politician cannot stand up for such a basic, simple principle as the sanctity of unborn children and all human life, then what principle will he stand up for? Ultimately, the answer is none.

This is clearly the case with Giuliani. His fundamental problem is that his reach exceeds his grasp. He was a good mayor of New York. He is nothing more and nothing less. Giuliani doesn’t have the moral character to be president of the United States. To his campaign’s dismay, many Christians are starting to realize this.

James Dobson, the founder and chairman of Focus on the Family, a prominent religious conservative group, vows that he will sit out the 2008 presidential election if Giuliani becomes the Republican presidential candidate.

"I cannot, and will not, vote for Rudy Giuliani in 2008. It is an irrevocable decision," he wrote in a recent column for WorldNet Daily.

"If given a Hobson's—Dobson's?—choice between him and Senators Hillary Clinton or Barack Obama, I will either cast my ballot for an also-ran—or if worse comes to worst, not vote in a presidential election for the first time in my adult life. My conscience and my moral convictions will allow me to do nothing else."

And it is not just the evangelical Christians who threaten to abandon the GOP in case of a Giuliani candidacy. Millions of practicing Catholics—a key pillar of the Republican Party in recent years—will leave as well. Pope Benedict XVI has thrown down the gauntlet. He has said that support for abortion will no longer be tolerated by the Catholic Church. The Holy See has made it well-known it is the duty of Catholics, both public officials and voters, to speak out boldly and unequivocally in defense of the unborn and the culture of life.

By electing Giuliani to be their nominee, Republicans will be committing political suicide. Millions of Christian conservatives, the party’s shock troops—the ones who volunteer, man the phone banks, pass out leaflets, pound the pavement—will detach themselves from the GOP. The party’s base will be fractured—perhaps, permanently.

There is a common saying in Washington that the Democrats are the Evil Party and the Republicans are the Stupid Party. A Giuliani candidacy will fundamentally alter that equation: The Republicans will become the Evil and the Stupid Party. It is the political path to Hell. Republicans take it at their peril.


TOPICS: Editorial; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: abortion; bracewellgiuliani; christianvote; giuliani; giulianitruthfile; gop; politicalsuicide; prolife; rinorudy; rudy08; rudy2008; rudyonabortion; stoprudy2008
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1 posted on 05/24/2007 1:00:38 PM PDT by calcowgirl
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To: calcowgirl

I agree with this article.


2 posted on 05/24/2007 1:02:04 PM PDT by lonestar67 (Its time to withdraw from the War on Bush-- your side is hopelessly lost in a quagmire.)
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To: calcowgirl

“A Giuliani victory will drive Christians out of the GOP”

Isn’t that the real goal?


3 posted on 05/24/2007 1:02:12 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: calcowgirl

Ain’t gonna happen. What with his support for gun control, illegal immigration, abortion, the homosexual agenda etc. etc. he isn’t going to be nominated.


4 posted on 05/24/2007 1:03:02 PM PDT by Joe Boucher
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To: calcowgirl
"Millions of Christian conservatives, the party’s shock troops—the ones who volunteer, man the phone banks, pass out leaflets, pound the pavement—will detach themselves from the GOP."

Not to mention the millions of GOP voters who get registered and encouraged to vote in their churches!

5 posted on 05/24/2007 1:05:02 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: calcowgirl; lonestar67
>>>I agree with this article.

I don't.

A Giuliani victory will drive Christians out of the GOP USA

There, now I agree with it.

6 posted on 05/24/2007 1:06:35 PM PDT by Calpernia (Breederville.com)
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To: calcowgirl
A Giuliani victory will drive Christians out of the GOP

The Christians will only be the starting point.

7 posted on 05/24/2007 1:07:45 PM PDT by TLI ( ITINERIS IMPENDEO VALHALLA)
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To: TommyDale

Good point.


8 posted on 05/24/2007 1:08:08 PM PDT by lonestar67 (Its time to withdraw from the War on Bush-- your side is hopelessly lost in a quagmire.)
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To: lonestar67

Me, too. I can not and will not support him in any way.


9 posted on 05/24/2007 1:08:34 PM PDT by MamaB
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To: TommyDale; Liz
Isn’t that the real goal?

The Rooty supporters have made this a fact in their contempt for the religious and social conservatives.

Unfortunately, the GOP is self destructing with their support of open borders, too much corruption and disrespect for their base.

Perhaps the time has come to support a Constitution Party and dump Republicans off the flotilla!

10 posted on 05/24/2007 1:08:46 PM PDT by indylindy (Fighting the new liberal Conservatism. The Left foot in the GOP door.)
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To: indylindy

Sign me up, Indylindy!! I’m bailing from the GOP.


11 posted on 05/24/2007 1:10:00 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: indylindy

Ding Ding Ding

Only ten posts until the REAL issue emerges.

Illegal immigration.


12 posted on 05/24/2007 1:10:40 PM PDT by lonestar67 (Its time to withdraw from the War on Bush-- your side is hopelessly lost in a quagmire.)
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To: Joe Boucher

Haven’t you heard? According to Hannity, take away abortion, gun control, and the homosexual agenda, Rudy is a conservative. (sarcasm on)


13 posted on 05/24/2007 1:14:47 PM PDT by murron
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To: lonestar67; indylindy; Liz
"Only ten posts until the REAL issue emerges. Illegal immigration."

No, there are literally a dozen issues or more. The illegal immigration issue is the current hot topic, but the socially conservative Religious Right is concerned with pro-life and anti-homosexual issues as well. Lots of them.

14 posted on 05/24/2007 1:14:58 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: lonestar67
Ding Ding Ding Only ten posts until the REAL issue emerges. Illegal immigration.

Ding, Ding, Ding, You win, Bingo! Its only a part of the self destruction of the GOP who has apparently joined with the Democrats!

15 posted on 05/24/2007 1:16:03 PM PDT by indylindy (Fighting the new liberal Conservatism. The Left foot in the GOP door.)
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To: murron
"Haven’t you heard? According to Hannity, take away abortion, gun control, and the homosexual agenda, Rudy is a conservative."

Take away multiple marriages, philandering, hanging around with multiple criminals and his lying, and Rudy is a saint.

16 posted on 05/24/2007 1:17:04 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: TommyDale

I know. it really is silly how people try to rehabilitate him.

He is mayor of New York ergo we must elect him.


17 posted on 05/24/2007 1:18:16 PM PDT by lonestar67 (Its time to withdraw from the War on Bush-- your side is hopelessly lost in a quagmire.)
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To: indylindy; TommyDale
www.constitutionparty.com

(Member since 2005.)

18 posted on 05/24/2007 1:19:54 PM PDT by Enosh (†)
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To: calcowgirl

Sort of support Christian conservatives forming their own political group. On many issues, they can ally with Republicans, but can also champion morals, a Christianization of society, (and support Creationism without as much insulting—though some of the nastiest mudslingers are fellow Christians), etc. Somewhat similar to the CDU in Germany or the BQ in Canada, except instead of being specifically regional, they could align themselves or split up from the Republicans as they see fit.


19 posted on 05/24/2007 1:21:04 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( What is your take on Acts 15:20 (abstaining from blood) about eating meat? Could you freepmail?)
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To: Enosh

Right now, the choices are very slim in the Constitution Party. I will vote GOP if Fred Thompson gets into the race.


20 posted on 05/24/2007 1:21:54 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: indylindy
The Rooty supporters have made this a fact in their contempt for the religious and social conservatives.

Now let me speak only for myself.

I have ZERO contempt for religious and social conservatives - my family is full of them.

Yes - I am a Rudy supporter - always have been - I have also always said I would support the GOP nominee regardless - I love Fred Thompson.

The reason I support Rudy is the following:

1.) I believe Rudy is the toughest SOB the GOP can offer for the times we live in. (i.e. the WOT)

All other issues simply pale in my mind.

I trust Rudy on fiscal matters, law and order, and I trust him to be one tough SOB - holding his cabinet, the GOP, and the congress accountable.

- Be patient - the party will iron this out.

Mitt is doing well lately.

Fred Thompson's numbers improve daily.

Don't slander ALL Rudy supporters - some of us are reasonable people - honest.

21 posted on 05/24/2007 1:25:27 PM PDT by Jake The Goose
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To: TommyDale

The CP is currently only good for local and (barely) state elections. I will never again “Perot” my POTUS vote.


22 posted on 05/24/2007 1:25:30 PM PDT by Enosh (†)
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To: Enosh

Well, I will “Perot” my vote if Giuliani is the nominee for the GOP. I will not vote for him under any circumstance whatsoever.


23 posted on 05/24/2007 1:28:47 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: Jake The Goose

Tough guys wear dresses? lol


24 posted on 05/24/2007 1:30:23 PM PDT by darkangel82 (Socialism is NOT an American value.)
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To: darkangel82
In my neighborhood - you better be damn tough if you're gonna wear a dress - damn tough.

I get the jab - I laughed.

25 posted on 05/24/2007 1:31:42 PM PDT by Jake The Goose
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To: Jake The Goose; indylindy
"I believe Rudy is the toughest SOB the GOP can offer for the times we live in. (i.e. the WOT)"

I will agree with you up to a point -- that Rudy is an SOB. However, there is no proof whatsoever that he would do any better than most of the GOP field. In fact, his own past statements say that he is not for controlling the borders, he is opposed to the current Immigration Bill because it doesn't go far enough to help illegals! If the guy doesn't want to control the borders, how can we trust him to fight the War on Terror? Anyway, he has several other millstones around his neck and those will surface before the elections.

26 posted on 05/24/2007 1:32:14 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: TommyDale
"I will not vote for him under any circumstance whatsoever."

And you are not alone, not by a long shot. That is why Rudy must not get the nomination!

27 posted on 05/24/2007 1:35:42 PM PDT by Enosh (†)
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To: TommyDale
You might be right - you might be - but I doubt it.

I know plenty of people who are 100% opposed to Rudy's social views - and are still 100% behind the man.

THE TIMES WE LIVE IN.

If you think that suddenly people are going to watch the news and go "Oh - Rudy's pro-choice? forget it."

I think that's wishful thinking.

The only way Rudy loses is via a better candidate.

Rudy's numbers are very very strong - he has to be beaten - he won't lose.

FYI - he can be beaten. It will be Mitt or Fred (no one else )

28 posted on 05/24/2007 1:39:36 PM PDT by Jake The Goose
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To: calcowgirl

We don’t need an entertainment celebrity at all. We need a good commander-in-chief—one who has military experience.


29 posted on 05/24/2007 1:41:23 PM PDT by familyop (cbt. engr. (cbt.--has been))
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To: Jake The Goose
"Rudy's numbers are very very strong - he has to be beaten - he won't lose."

He is beating himself. His numbers will continue to drop as more and more people see him for what he is. You keep using the abortion argument, but there are lots of reasons people will not vote for him. You think the NRA members are going to back him? The Religious Right? The Immigration Opponents? The people who object to homosexual marriage/civil unions? Put all those people together and Rudy is not a "single issue" opponent, he is a multiple issue failure!

30 posted on 05/24/2007 1:44:32 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: calcowgirl
He is often portrayed in the media as a hawkish conservative.

But true conservatives regard him as a pro-death RINO.

31 posted on 05/24/2007 1:45:08 PM PDT by XR7
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To: TommyDale

If by some miracle Richardson were to win the Dim primary and Giuliani the Republican one, do you think the NRA would endorse Richardson?


32 posted on 05/24/2007 1:46:49 PM PDT by Ingtar (...right wing conservatives are growing tired of crawling on bloody stumps looking for scraps - JRob)
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To: Ingtar

I think the NRA would sit it out, knowing how the Democrats tend to take guns from citizens.


33 posted on 05/24/2007 1:49:29 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: Joe Boucher
What with his support for gun control, illegal immigration, abortion, the homosexual agenda etc. etc. he isn’t going to be nominated.

Not to mention all that dirty laundry of his that the media will love airing over and over again.

34 posted on 05/24/2007 1:50:50 PM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: TommyDale
Well one of us is wrong - time will tell.

For the record - let me position myself on your list of issues:

- NRA - I have been a member of the NRA since 1992

- Religious Right - be careful, this is not a lock step voting block - not today.

- Immigration - Rudy better watch his step - CLOSE THE BORDERS - then I could care less about those already here.

-Gay Marriage - I am against it - Civil Unions - I have no issue with that. Gay Rights - no problems - just NO SPECIAL GAY RIGHTS - FYI - I have gay friends, they are not all the devil.

35 posted on 05/24/2007 1:50:55 PM PDT by Jake The Goose
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To: Jake The Goose
Rudy's numbers are very very strong

Rudy's numbers are dropping.

36 posted on 05/24/2007 1:53:46 PM PDT by MEGoody (Ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.)
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To: Jake The Goose; indylindy; Liz

You have no clue, do you?

I have been a member of the NRA since 1972.

I don’t have any idea who you include or what you even consider the Religious Right, but I am specifically talking about those who elected GWB in the last two elections by bringing in millions of GOP votes under the radar, by speaking out in favor of the Right to Life.

Immigrants who are here illegally should receive NO SPECIAL CONSIDERATIONS. They should be required to return to Mexico and start the procedure legally. If they want to be reunited with their families, they should move back to Mexico.

I believe that homosexuality is an abomination, and a homosexual civil union is no different than a homosexual marriage. The purpose is to gain spousal rights, and in either case it is not only immoral, it is against nature that a man and a woman are intended to mate.


37 posted on 05/24/2007 1:58:17 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: MEGoody

I won’t argue that.

He still holds a big lead.

I say again - beat Rudy the GOP needs a better candidate.

FRED THOMPSON or possible MITT - Mitt has looked very good.


38 posted on 05/24/2007 1:58:30 PM PDT by Jake The Goose
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To: TommyDale

I know you TommyDale - you are who you are.

I am who I am.

Peace be with you brother - that’s enough for today.


39 posted on 05/24/2007 2:00:06 PM PDT by Jake The Goose
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To: indylindy; TommyDale
Isn’t that the real goal? --------to drive Christians out of the GOP.

No question---savvy Repubs predicted this years ago when these Planned Parenthood effheads were showing up at Repub functions.

Rudy is the lapdog of these these dangerous anti-America suckers who want social conservatives out so they can turn the party into a clone of Dim liberalism. They would decimate the system of checks and balances the Framers wisely wrote into the system.

But hold on----we are not going anywhere----the takepver plan is based on the ignorant assumption that conservatives would roll over and play dead.

Ain't happening.

40 posted on 05/24/2007 2:00:54 PM PDT by Liz (It is dangerous to be right when the government is wrong. Voltaire)
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To: TommyDale
“A Giuliani victory will drive Christians out of the GOP”

Isn’t that the real goal?Yes. Or put it another way the goal of the Rockefeller Republicans is to re-establish control over the GOP and restore the pre-Goldwater/Reagan order of things. That is that the GOP is the party of Wall Street. Full stop.

The thing is that the Dems are already pretty close to that - they don't differ from the big-government GOP very much if you take the social issues away. (Pro NAFTA, Pro Free Trade, Pro Immigration Reform, Pro big government health, Pro using power of Gov to pick winners in industry, etc.)

Where do the millions of disaffected conservatives go? A new explicitly religious party, like Europe? The "Christian Conservative" party? How would cleaving off the base change the resulting GOP and Democrats?

It's an interesting topic for mulling over, but I don't see Rudy winning the GOP nomination.

41 posted on 05/24/2007 2:04:36 PM PDT by Jack Black
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To: Jack Black

Agreed.


42 posted on 05/24/2007 2:05:30 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: Joe Boucher
He could get nominated via a brokered convention, but once he's the "R" nominee the MSM will slash him to bits.

And this guy is not voting for any gun grabber, abortion supporting liberal.

43 posted on 05/24/2007 2:06:51 PM PDT by investigateworld (These Border Patrol guys will do more time than a Jap POW Camp commander,thanks BUSH)
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To: TommyDale

“A Giuliani victory will drive Christians out of the GOP”

A Romney victory will cause Christians to stay home.

A McCain victory will drive the sane from the GOP.

Fred better pull our bacon out of the fire.


44 posted on 05/24/2007 2:07:10 PM PDT by FastCoyote
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To: FastCoyote
"A Romney victory will cause Christians to stay home."

I don't agree with this statement, but the others I will agre with 100%.

45 posted on 05/24/2007 2:08:29 PM PDT by TommyDale (More Americans are killed each day in the U.S. by abortion than were killed on 9/11 !)
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To: TommyDale
I agree with your disagreement :)

...and I am REALLY hoping Fred will jump in soon.

46 posted on 05/24/2007 2:12:30 PM PDT by FightforFreedomCA (I'm Bilingual - I speak English to both Men and Women)
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To: calcowgirl

There are especially two candidates who are so far off the
Republican map they could never get nominated let alone elected.

Rudy, with his extreme liberal social views

Ron Paul with his far left anti war and Michale Moore comments.


47 posted on 05/24/2007 2:16:36 PM PDT by SoCalPol (Duncan Hunter '08 Tough on WOT & Illegals)
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To: dirtboy
Millions of Christian conservatives, the party’s shock troops—the ones who volunteer, man the phone banks, pass out leaflets, pound the pavement—will detach themselves from the GOP. The party’s base will be fractured—perhaps, permanently.

Man, you were way ahead of your time. I clearly remember you making an almost similar statement on another thread to Cincinatus' Wife about a month ago.

48 posted on 05/24/2007 2:27:34 PM PDT by Extremely Extreme Extremist
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To: calcowgirl

I will NEVER vote Romney or Guiliani.


49 posted on 05/24/2007 2:29:00 PM PDT by X-Ecutioner
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To: TommyDale

We are readly marching (stupidly Republicans) into oblivion such as Canada’s (right-wing Torries) in the 90’s. Split the Reagan coalition (with liberal pandering), and you send Republicans into permanent minority status!! I will not be controlled by the Rockefellers as WELL!@


50 posted on 05/24/2007 2:31:18 PM PDT by JSDude1 (www.pence08.com.)
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