Malaysia's Lina Joy loses Islam conversion case

Boston.Com - World News ^ | May 30, 2007 | By Jalil Hamid and Syed Azman

[F15Eagle]

PUTRAJAYA, Malaysia (Reuters) - Malaysia's best known Christian convert, Lina Joy, lost a six-year battle on Wednesday to have the word "Islam" removed from her identity card, after the country's highest court rejected the change.

The ruling threatens to further polarize Malaysian society between non-Muslims who feel that their constitutional right to religious freedom is being eroded, and Muslims who believe that civil courts have no right to meddle in Islamic affairs.

"You can't at whim and fancy convert from one religion to another," Federal Court Chief Justice Ahmad Fairuz Sheikh Abdul Halim said in delivering judgment in the case, which has stirred religious tensions in the mainly Muslim nation.

[F15Eagle]

"You can't at whim and fancy convert from one religion to another," Federal Court Chief Justice Ahmad Fairuz Sheikh Abdul Halim

The most important fundamental concept in maintaing a cult is to be certain that no member can ever leave and must always bear the official mark of the cult.

[F15Eagle]

fyi

[Uncledave]

Headline: Sharia Crushes Joy

[Jack Black]

Malaysia is another losing proposition. They have some of the worst Affirmative Action laws in the world. Basically the 40% Indian and Chinese are the productive sector and subsidize the Moslem / Maylay majority in a variety of ways. They also live in fear of some giant ethnic cleansing.

However should the Malays actually start having a pogrom it is likely that China would intervene.

I was there for work and have not desire to go back. I believe it is a powder keg.

[F15Eagle]

typo - s/b “maintaining a cult”

[F15Eagle]

Perfect ...

[2banana]

In practice, sharia courts do not allow Muslims to formally renounce Islam, preferring to send apostates to counseling and, ultimately, fining or jailing them if they do not desist.

They often end up in legal limbo, unable to register their new religious affiliations or legally marry non-Muslims. Many keep silent about their choice or emigrate.

And this is a MODERATE islamic state...

[F15Eagle]

When push-comes-to-shove we can usually guess who will be doing the pushing and shoving.

Remember when the old guy from (Malaysia? I think) was whining about how they hadn’t yet killed off all the Joooooooz?

[Cicero]

"You can't at whim and fancy convert from one religion to another," Federal Court Chief Justice Ahmad Fairuz Sheikh Abdul Halim said.

Conversion from Christian to Muslim = the will of Allah.

Conversion from Muslim to Christian = whim and fancy.

[F15Eagle]

In practice, sharia courts do not allow Muslims to formally renounce Islam

Definitely moderate. Usually they cut off your head for renouncing islam. Says a lot right there ...

[Southerngl]

The ruling threatens to further polarize Malaysian society between non-Muslims who feel that their constitutional right to religious freedom is being eroded, and Muslims who believe that civil courts have no right to meddle in Islamic affairs.
*****

I think at this point it is actually “RELIGIOUS FREEDOM HAS BEEN ERODED”.

[F15Eagle]

Yep he’s full of bacon ... I mean baloney ...

[Uncle Miltie]

"You can't at whim and fancy convert from one religion to another"

Translation: Islam is Force, not Belief.

[BuffaloJack]

I wish Malaysia would adopt a different flag. I don’t like the thought of an Ismalic nut state modelling their flag after ours.

[F15Eagle]

http://www.cnn.com/2003/WORLD/asiapcf/southeast/10/17/oic.mahathir/

excerpts:

"The only problem with the Jews is when the State of Israel was created," he said, adding that Jews worked and were welcomed in Malaysia.

Mahathir said the world's "1.3 billion Muslims cannot be defeated by a few million Jews," but suggested the use of political and economic tactics, not violence, to achieve what he called a "final victory." In his wide-ranging speech to the Organization of Islamic Conference, the often-controversial Mahathir launched a blistering attack on Jews and Israel saying, "Jews rule the world by proxy. They get others to fight and die for them."

" ... The Europeans killed 6 million Jews out of 12 million... "

[F15Eagle]

exactly

[F15Eagle]

yikes - just saw it ...

[expatguy]

I'd like to post more on the subject but I tend to avoid overly sensitive issues like this because of my own concerns for safety.

The overall atmosphere here is very tense regarding this case, but I hope that Americans can now see clearly that there is no moderate Islam and neither are there moderate Muslims. There are however good Muslims and bad Muslims with the bad ones being the ones who don't submit themselves to Islamic law.

There is a saying here "You can take the girl out of the village but you can't take the village out of the girl" ~ the implication is that change is not possible to change ~ no matter how much English they speak, no matter how Western they look or appear ~ there are cultural and religious differences that are almost impossible to breach. The mentality (the mind) of the Malay or Indonesian is something that many Westerners can never understand.

Can things here change? Yes they can, but it takes a lot of effort and patience on our part something that I personally work for a daily basis with at times great risk to myself and yet I receive nothing for my efforts. Times like this I wonder what I am doing and if it is truly worth it.

I know that there are many FReepers who understand the challenges we face and I would like to look for your continued support.

An American Expat in Southeast Asia

[hunter112]

I believe it is a powder keg.

Agreed. It will be a front in the coming enlarging world war on islamunism.

[F15Eagle]

My pastor preaches there on occasion and in Indonesia. Got to be careful.

[Jack Black]

...further polarize Malaysian society between non-Muslims who feel that their constitutional right to religious freedom is being eroded a nonexistent fantasy.

[Jack Black]

You wrote: Can things here change? Yes they can, but it takes a lot of effort and patience on our part something that I personally work for a daily basis with at times great risk to myself and yet I receive nothing for my efforts. Times like this I wonder what I am doing and if it is truly worth it.

I reveiewed your blog, and while interesting I didn't get a sense that you were engaged in a high-risk venture to change East Asia. Could you explain what you mean by the above comment?