Posted on 06/10/2007 3:43:53 PM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum
One of the things that's got to be going through a lot of peoples' minds now is how one man with two handguns, that he had to reload time and time again, could go from classroom to classroom on the Virginia Tech campus without being stopped. Much of the answer can be found in policies put in place by the university itself.
Virginia, like 39 other states, allows citizens with training and legal permits to carry concealed weapons. That means that Virginians regularly sit in movie theaters and eat in restaurants among armed citizens. They walk, joke, and rub shoulders everyday with people who responsibly carry firearms — and are far safer than they would be in San Francisco, Oakland, Detroit, Chicago, New York City, or Washington, D.C., where such permits are difficult or impossible to obtain.
The statistics are clear. Communities that recognize and grant Second Amendment rights to responsible adults have a significantly lower incidence of violent crime than those that do not. More to the point, incarcerated criminals tell criminologists that they consider local gun laws when they decide what sort of crime they will commit, and where they will do so.
Still, there are a lot of people who are just offended by the notion that people can carry guns around. They view everybody, or at least many of us, as potential murderers prevented only by the lack of a convenient weapon. Virginia Tech administrators overrode Virginia state law and threatened to expel or fire anybody who brings a weapon onto campus.
In recent years, however, armed Americans — not on-duty police officers — have successfully prevented a number of attempted mass murders. Evidence from Israel, where many teachers have weapons and have stopped serious terror attacks, has been documented. Supporting, though contrary, evidence from Great Britain, where strict gun controls have led to violent crime rates far higher than ours, is also common knowledge.
So Virginians asked their legislators to change the university's "concealed carry" policy to exempt people 21 years of age or older who have passed background checks and taken training classes. The university, however, lobbied against that bill, and a top administrator subsequently praised the legislature for blocking the measure.
The logic behind this attitude baffles me, but I suspect it has to do with a basic difference in worldviews. Some people think that power should exist only at the top, and everybody else should rely on "the authorities" for protection.
Despite such attitudes, average Americans have always made up the front line against crime. Through programs like Neighborhood Watch and Amber Alert, we are stopping and catching criminals daily. Normal people tackled "shoe bomber" Richard Reid as he was trying to blow up an airliner. It was a truck driver who found the D.C. snipers. Statistics from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention show that civilians use firearms to prevent at least a half million crimes annually.
When people capable of performing acts of heroism are discouraged or denied the opportunity, our society is all the poorer. And from the selfless examples of the passengers on Flight 93 on 9/11 to Virginia Tech professor Liviu Librescu, a Holocaust survivor who sacrificed himself to save his students earlier this week, we know what extraordinary acts of heroism ordinary citizens are capable of.
Many other universities have been swayed by an anti-gun, anti-self defense ideology. I respect their right to hold those views, but I challenge their decision to deny Americans the right to protect themselves on their campuses — and then proudly advertise that fact to any and all.
Whenever I've seen one of those "Gun-free Zone" signs, especially outside of a school filled with our youngest and most vulnerable citizens, I've always wondered exactly who these signs are directed at. Obviously, they don't mean much to the sort of man who murdered 32 people just a few days ago.
— Fred Thompson is an actor and former United States senator from Tennessee.
"Gun Owners of America ratings — "He has no need to convince voters that he has changed his ways and now sees the light, because he has been fairly consistent throughout his career.""
Fred will be the next President of the United States.
I surely hope you are right! He seems to be more logical and intelligent than most politicians.....and has the Constitution at the forefront of his thoughts/actions!
First responders wasted much time trying to break through the doors ~ some claims are that 9 minutes transpired until a boltcutter was found.
Probably up to half the victims were shot in that period.
Modern systems have been available for over half a century. There's no excuse for this. Wouldn't matter if it was a fire killing students, or a madman, or a tornado, or earthquake, the absence of usable modern panic bar systems would contribute substantially to the final death toll.
One FreepeR said that he or she wouldn't want a drinking prone college student to be able to carry and cited SpringBreak as an example of kids gone wild.
I believe the boy or girl entering college with a CCW, has already proven themselves to their home community, including police, that they are responsable and are in no less a position as the newly licensed driver with an equal license to kill.
Let a qualified CCW carrier carry in school ... including faculty.
On the 2nd Amendment... kudos to Fred!
I liked this part....
He's hit the nail on the head, and not just on this topic. Far too many people wait for the gov't to bail them out of every problem rather than bootstrapping themselves into action. From the Katrina victims to welfare recipients, everyone wants the gov't to "fix things" for them. My feelings on the matter: get off your butt and fix it yourself. It will get done quicker and probably at half the cost. As to gun laws, Fred has a good point: protect yourself, but within the confines of the law.
Fred gets it! I carry a concealed weapon and I feel a hell of a lot safer for it. My wife carries as well and its a real comfort to me knowing she can (and will) protect herself.
You can defeat a panic bar system with a screwdriver or ice pick.
Thanks for posting that. I’ve been reading Fred’s recent essays. He looks like a candidate that I can support.
In Israel, gun ownership is considered a civic duty.
Surprised to find someone trying to let the Virginia Tech administrators off the hook in these killings. Madmen and fires exist. Rational people plan their building security so that people can get out quickly in an emergency.
Failure to take appropriate action at a propitious moment (before the event) is morally reprehensible.
Doesn't matter. No socialist bureaucrat is going to convince me to surrender my arms.
I see.... I see....
Not exactly the right view point he’s articulating there...
Good catch.
Thanks.
So Virginians asked their legislators to change the university’s “concealed carry” policy to exempt people 21 years of age or older who have passed background checks and taken training classes. The university, however, lobbied against that bill, and a top administrator subsequently praised the legislature for blocking the measure.
The logic behind this attitude baffles me, but I suspect it has to do with a basic difference in worldviews. Some people think that power should exist only at the top, and everybody else should rely on “the authorities” for protection.
Great article, EXCEPT for this:
“Communities that recognize and grant Second Amendment rights “
Communities do not grant rights. The constitution does. The only thing governments do is deny them.
still misses the mark... Not at all. Fred is simply stating facts, not a position. There are communities which don't recognize and grant Second Amendment rights.
Posted before seeing your post LOL
Sure, but that does not make what Fred said wrong. There are communities which have taken away second amendment rights.
I pray that you’re right. Well, I guess that I know you’re right — I pray that you’re correct.
And, I think it revealing that being right is synonymous with being correct. Whereas, being left is synonymous with........
Actually, the Constitution doesn't grant rights either.
Our rights come from God. The Constitution merely recognized a few of the more obvious ones in the Bill Of Rights and left the others unmentioned, but acknowledged.
I remember those discussions. It was when the tragedy was still vividly in the headlines. I was interested in knowing if there were any any ideas for preventing or limiting this type of tragedy from occurring in the future, other than conceal carry.
To my disappointment, in true FReeper fashion, I was flamed for even suggesting that there might be other alternatives.
Now of course, the dead are buried, everyone has been counseled and the incident is hardly an afterthought. It will no doubt happen again and we will have no more ability to handle it that we did before.
Oh, I don’t disagree that the buildings shouldn’t have had them. I’m just pointing out that a madman can figure out ways to get a “captive audience” - and that they would not have made one ounce of difference.
Remember, he controlled the hallways - so nobody would be getting out of the classrooms to the exits, panic-bar-equipped or not. And, they had the burglar-proof glass on all the windows, most of which in that building won’t open.
The chained exterior doors didn’t keep people in. They kept the police out. No panic bar system ever made would allow easy access from the outside. Debating over the panic bars is stupid, silly, and not material to the main debate - which is how to stop such a maniac.
Imho these "top administrators" should be responsible to the families of the victims and pay restitution, funeral cost, pain & suffering as well.
“Communities that recognize and grant Second Amendment rights “
Communities do not grant rights. The constitution does. The only thing governments do is deny them.
Fred has the right policy position. He just doesn't quite understand how the Constitution works, or, more probably, had a 2:00AM brain block. ... not to worry.
I honestly can’t see an answer except for another gun confronting the shooter.
If he is real, I'm sure as hell going to vote for him.
He’s got my vote!
Again, these systems have been around for over half a century and modern building access codes (which have been adopted as law in all 50 states) REQUIRE panic bars.
Don't they teach folks how to read building codes anymore?
As far as the madman controlling anything, he controlled the SECOND FLOOR with his guns, but he was simultaneously able to control the FIRST FLOOR with chains on the antique door closing mechanisms.
Even if the administrators had not planned for an armed madman, why didn't they plan for fire?
It's time to quit making excuses for the administrators and get some new folks into that school who have a sense of what it takes to make a campus safe.
Understood.
Neither could anyone else so you are in the 99% majority.
Time will tell if he’s just confused and misspoke.... or if he’s a statist who thinks rights DO come from government. Still for someone gunning (if I may use the pun) for the top spot... he needs to choose his words better.
“Communities do not grant rights. The constitution does. The only thing governments do is deny them.”
Fraid not, our constitution merely recognizes our God given rights. God, not man or govt endowed us with our rights. Any other viewpoint allows for man or govt to remove said rights which means they aren’t inalienable.
This is the primary reason for the prolonged efforts of the progressive movement to remove God from our social makeup. Once we’ve removed the true source of our rights, they can claim that they originated in man and can therefore be removed by men.
Those rights are acknowledged, not granted.
Ok Ok everyone, I stand corrected. Hopefully, what I said and meant to say is the same case as Thompson. And that is what so many have pointed out. Yes I spoke it badly, but the intent was there. The Bill of rights is there to protect us, but communities do not have the right to grant or deny any of the rights written in them.
Thing is, and I was pointing out, you cannot make those kind of mistakes when in politics. If a mere pion such as myself picked up on it, and even though I articulated it badly, I did, the liberals would run wild with it. That is why speech writers etc, redo so many speeches.
:D hugs
:)
What's a viable alternative?
That’s a good looking sticker there Doug. Nice to see an idea take hold.
Here’s a good story:
Back during the ‘04 campaign I of course had the Bush stickers and anti-Kerry stickers on my SUV. In addition on the rear side glass on both sides I had taken a cheap pair of flip-flops and used velcro to attach them to the glass and drew a circle around them with a cross through it using white shoe polish, advertising “No flip floppers”.
Days go by and this jeep passes me while tooting his horn and giving me a big thumbs up as he passes.
After the election I was working on our state senators house adding some new cabinetry to his office. He had a detached guest house that he was letting this guy stay in for a while. I overheard him talking on his cellphone and he had mentioned he was on his way back to DC. After the call I asked him what he did in DC and his reply was that he was a Bush staffer sent done to Florida to help out in the campaign and the senator gave him his guest house.
After our little chit chat he continued loading his belongings into his white jeep when it dawned on me that this was the same guy who had passed me tooting his horn. I confronted him again and asked if he had remembered the SUV that had the flip flops on it, and things clicked with him in return and he also remembered.
Turns out he told me that he had told the President about my flip flops and got a good laugh over it.
Fred Thompson/John Bolton 2008
Fred Thompson/John Bolton 2008
Funny thing knarf, I thought that was MY question.
I guess one doesn't exist...anyway, not on this forum.
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