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Secularist Europe Silences Pro-Lifers and Creationists
Brussels Journal ^ | 6/23/07 | Paul Belien

Posted on 06/25/2007 12:39:01 PM PDT by ZGuy

Last week, a German court sentenced a 55-year old Lutheran pastor to one year in jail for “Volksverhetzung” (incitement of the people) because he compared the killing of the unborn in contemporary Germany to the holocaust. Next week, the Council of Europe is going to vote on a resolution imposing Darwinism as Europe’s official ideology. The European governments are asked to fight the expression of creationist opinions, such as young earth and intelligent design theories. According to the Council of Europe these theories are “undemocratic” and “a threat to human rights.”

Without legalized abortion the number of German children would increase annually by at least 150,000 – which is the number of legal abortions in birth dearth Germany. Pastor Johannes Lerle compared the killing of the unborn to the killing of the Jews in Auschwitz during the Second World War. On 14 June, a court in Erlangen ruled that, in doing so, the pastor had “incited the people” because his statement was a denial of the holocaust of the Jews in Nazi-Germany. Hence, Herr Lerle was sentenced to one year in jail. Earlier, he had already spent eight months in jail for calling abortionists “professional killers” – an allegation which the court ruled to be slanderous because, according to the court, the unborn are not humans.

Other German courts convicted pro-lifers for saying that “in abortion clinics, life unworthy of living is being killed,” because this terminology evoked Hitler’s euthanasia program, which used the same language. In 2005, a German pro-lifer, Günter Annen, was sentenced to 50 days in jail for saying “Stop unjust [rechtswidrige] abortions in [medical] practice,” because, according to the court, the expression “unjust” is understood by laymen as meaning illegal, which abortions are not.

Volksverhetzung is a crime which the Nazis often invoked against their enemies and which contemporary Germany also uses to intimidate homeschoolers. Soon, the German authorities will be able to use the same charge against people who question Darwin’s evolution theory.

Indeed, next Tuesday, the Council of Europe (CoE), Europe’s main human-rights body, will vote on a proposal which advocates the fight against creationism, “young earth” and “intelligent design” in its 47 member states.

According to a report of the CoE’s Parliamentary Assembly, creationists are dangerous “religious fundamentalists” who propagate “forms of religious extremism” and “could become a threat to human rights.” The report adds that the acceptance of the science of evolutionism “is crucial to the future of our societies and our democracies.”

“Creationism, born of the denial of the evolution of species through natural selection, was for a long time an almost exclusively American phenomenon,” the report says.

“Today creationist theories are tending to find their way into Europe and their spread is affecting quite a few Council of Europe member states. […] [T]his is liable to encourage the development of all manner of fundamentalism and extremism, synonymous with attacks of utmost virulence on human rights. The total rejection of science is definitely one of the most serious threats to human rights and civic rights. […] The war on the theory of evolution and on its proponents most often originates in forms of religious extremism which are closely allied to extreme right-wing political movements. The creationist movements possess real political power. The fact of the matter, and this has been exposed on several occasions, is that the advocates of strict creationism are out to replace democracy by theocracy. [...] If we are not careful, the values that are the very essence of the Council of Europe will be under direct threat from creationist fundamentalists.”

According to the CoE report, America and Australia are already on their way towards becoming such undemocratic theocracies where human and civic rights are endangered. Creationism is “well-developed in the English-speaking countries, especially the United States and Australia,” the report states.

“While most curricula in Europe today unashamedly teach evolution as a recognised scientific theory, the same does not apply to the United States. In July 2005, the Pew Research Center conducted a poll that showed that 64% of Americans favoured the teaching of intelligent design alongside the theory of evolution and that 38% would support the total abandonment of the teaching of evolution in publicly owned schools. The American President George W. Bush supports the principle of teaching both intelligent design and the theory of evolution. At the moment, 20 of the 50 American states are facing potential adjustments of their school curricula in favour of intelligent design. Many people think that this phenomenon only affects the United States and that, even if it is not possible to be indifferent to what is happening on the other side of the Atlantic, it is not the Council of Europe’s role to deal with this issue. That, however, is not the case. On the contrary, it would seem crucial for us to take the appropriate precautions in our 47 member states.”

 

 
Though one may disagree with people who take the Book of Genesis literally (believing that God created the world in six days and rested on the seventh), surely secularist political organizations telling people what they may or may not believe, constitute a far greater threat to human rights than religious institutions telling their faithful how to vote. In the voting booth people are free to do what they like, whilst in contemporary Europe people are no longer free to publicly voice their own, deeply felt opinions in public.

In Germany, believing abortion to be as murderous as the holocaust is a crime, and educating your own children is a crime too. In France, saying that “homosexual behaviour endangers the survival of humanity” is a crime, and so is the distribution of pork soup to the poor. In Belgium, speaking out against immigration is a crime.

In the latest issue of the Dutch conservative magazine Bitter Lemon the Dutch author Erik van Goor writes that European courts are silencing conservative and orthodox citizens. Freedom of speech no longer exist, says van Goor.

 “While many in the West still idolize the second-hand fighters for free speech, such as [Ayaan] Hirsi Ali and Theo van Gogh, the true victims of curtailment are deliberately kept under wraps. Hirsi Ali, [Pim] Fortuyn and Theo van Gogh were not curtailed by the state or by court, Johannes Lerle is. The former voiced mere opinions – expressions of a public opinion which one may or may not value or believe. The latter – Dr Lerle – shows that what is at stake is not merely opinions, but a moral order which is being questioned; a reality of life and death which is at risk.”

Hirsi Ali, Fortuyn and van Gogh did not defend Europe’s traditional Christian moral order. People such as Johannes Lerle and Christian Vanneste, the French parliamentarian who was convicted for “homophobia,” do. The latter are being persecuted by Western Europe’s political regimes – a phenomenon which is ignored completely by the Western mainstream media, who participate in the persecution.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Germany
KEYWORDS: abortion; antisemitism; brusselsjournal; creatards; cretards; crevo; dlrcravescock; europeanchristians; eussr; evotards; freetards; holocaustdenial; lerle; neoeunazis
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1 posted on 06/25/2007 12:39:03 PM PDT by ZGuy
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To: ZGuy

Europe- soul mates of the Democrat Party.


2 posted on 06/25/2007 12:43:51 PM PDT by Jeff Chandler (A man who will not defend himself does not deserve to be defended by others.)
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To: ZGuy

Jailing Christians for saying what they believe. This is where speech codes will take us in America if we let them exists without constant challenge.


3 posted on 06/25/2007 12:44:25 PM PDT by Greg F (<><)
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To: ZGuy

The latter are being persecuted by Western Europe’s political regimes – a phenomenon which is ignored completely by the Western mainstream media, who participate in the persecution.


4 posted on 06/25/2007 12:46:51 PM PDT by cornelis
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To: ZGuy
If it talks like an aggressively intolerant religion and behaves like an aggressively intolerant religion, then chances are it is an aggressively intolerant religion. This European aggressive secularism exhibits a brutal dogmatism exceeding by far the American left’s wildest fear of “right wing fundamentalism”.
5 posted on 06/25/2007 12:47:24 PM PDT by Colonel Kangaroo
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To: ZGuy

We’re not far behind . See McCain-Feingold.

Where is Voltaire when you need him.


6 posted on 06/25/2007 12:48:38 PM PDT by Timocrat (I Emanate on your Auras and Penumbras Mr Blackmun)
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To: ZGuy

Seems the Nazis never left Germany.


7 posted on 06/25/2007 12:50:01 PM PDT by NapkinUser ("If your arms can kill dozens with one round...yes [ban them]" -Unnamed Freeper. Anti-gunners=idiots)
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To: ZGuy
The killing of the unborn is a holocaust. What the Germans did to the Jews pales to what is happening today:
Number of abortions per year: Approximately 46 Million
Number of abortions per day: Approximately 126,000

8 posted on 06/25/2007 12:51:46 PM PDT by cornelis
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To: ZGuy
According to the Council of Europe these theories are “undemocratic” and “a threat to human rights.”

I'm increasingly skeptical that any of these European countries ever really understood the concepts of democracy or human rights.
9 posted on 06/25/2007 12:51:53 PM PDT by marsh_of_mists
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To: ZGuy

“Volksverhetzung”

This is the arguement Trent Lott uses against Rush.


10 posted on 06/25/2007 12:54:20 PM PDT by Excellence (Three million years is enough! Stop cyclical climate change now!)
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To: ZGuy

“a threat to human rights”

Like the right to believe whatever the hell you want to believe?


11 posted on 06/25/2007 12:54:27 PM PDT by NapkinUser ("If your arms can kill dozens with one round...yes [ban them]" -Unnamed Freeper. Anti-gunners=idiots)
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To: ZGuy
With this mentality, its only a matter of time before another Hitler like figure arises claiming moral superiority. There is nothing uglier in the universe than fallen man playing god.
12 posted on 06/25/2007 12:57:44 PM PDT by HisKingdomWillAbolishSinDeath (Christ's Kingdom on Earth is the answer. What is your question?)
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To: ZGuy
“While most curricula in Europe today unashamedly teach evolution as a recognised scientific theory, the same does not apply to the United States. In July 2005, the Pew Research Center conducted a poll that showed that 64% of Americans favoured the teaching of intelligent design alongside the theory of evolution and that 38% would support the total abandonment of the teaching of evolution in publicly owned schools. The American President George W. Bush supports the principle of teaching both intelligent design and the theory of evolution. At the moment, 20 of the 50 American states are facing potential adjustments of their school curricula in favour of intelligent design. Many people think that this phenomenon only affects the United States and that, even if it is not possible to be indifferent to what is happening on the other side of the Atlantic, it is not the Council of Europe’s role to deal with this issue. That, however, is not the case. On the contrary, it would seem crucial for us to take the appropriate precautions in our 47 member states.”
Underlining mine.
13 posted on 06/25/2007 1:00:24 PM PDT by cornelis
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To: ZGuy

ping for later read


14 posted on 06/25/2007 1:04:01 PM PDT by aimhigh
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To: ZGuy
"Other German courts convicted pro-lifers for saying that “in abortion clinics, life unworthy of living is being killed..."

Marxists using the power of the government to destroy lives that do not speak the government approved dogma in the name of human rights. I bet this article is an inspiration to "Presidential Hopeful" Klinton, imagine the possibilities government control can have to protect us from those that do not speak government approved speech.

15 posted on 06/25/2007 1:08:46 PM PDT by GregoTX (The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.)
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To: MHGinTN; YHAOS; Alamo-Girl; betty boop
CoE
16 posted on 06/25/2007 1:08:53 PM PDT by cornelis
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To: Zionist Conspirator

Darwinism imposed by law.


17 posted on 06/25/2007 1:09:51 PM PDT by wideawake
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To: ZGuy

According to a report of the CoE’s Parliamentary Assembly, creationists are dangerous “religious fundamentalists” who propagate “forms of religious extremism” and “could become a threat to human rights.”

************************************

But Islam gets a pass, and they continue to import them by the gross ...


18 posted on 06/25/2007 1:10:24 PM PDT by ROTB (Our Constitution...only for a [Christian] people...it is wholly inadequate for any other.-J.Q.Adams)
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To: ZGuy
Other German courts convicted pro-lifers for saying that “in abortion clinics, life unworthy of living is being killed,” because this terminology evoked Hitler’s euthanasia program, which used the same language. In 2005, a German pro-lifer, Günter Annen, was sentenced to 50 days in jail for saying “Stop unjust [rechtswidrige] abortions in [medical] practice,” because, according to the court, the expression “unjust” is understood by laymen as meaning illegal, which abortions are not.

We all think of Germany as a nation that removed itself from fascism after World War 2.

I submit, however, that Europe's tendency to live its history as opposed to studying it, is at work here. The Germans may have distanced themselves from Nazism in particular, but they are what they are. And they don't realistically believe that they could ever be anything else; therefore they won't be.

Statism is very much alive and well in the Fatherland.
19 posted on 06/25/2007 1:28:41 PM PDT by JamesP81 (Romans 10:9)
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To: marsh_of_mists
I'm increasingly skeptical that any of these European countries ever really understood the concepts of democracy or human rights.

All of the Europeans that did left for America while the gettin' was good. The few that didn't were beheaded during the French Revolution.
20 posted on 06/25/2007 1:33:11 PM PDT by JamesP81 (Romans 10:9)
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To: ZGuy

bump


21 posted on 06/25/2007 1:34:03 PM PDT by VOA
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To: ZGuy

Thus come the islamists.


22 posted on 06/25/2007 1:44:12 PM PDT by onedoug
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To: VOA

Can Nicoli Carpathia be very for behind?


23 posted on 06/25/2007 1:46:55 PM PDT by Rodm (Seest thou a man diligent in his business? He shall stand before kings)
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To: JamesP81

From whence the angst and fear of a Theocracy? If America had wanted a Theocracy they missed the best chance at it in 1778 or thereabouts. We had roughly 200 years to establish a Theocracy in this “Christian” nation and it didn’t happen. What in the world brings liberals to such fears of something that will never happen because of Christians?


24 posted on 06/25/2007 1:48:08 PM PDT by WVNan
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To: ZGuy
It is not like the German people haven’t been down this path before. What we need next is a reason to militarize the country by a popular leader and hi-ho its off to another war and genocide we go.

(How long will it also be before some secular forces in Europe try to find a way, maybe through some type of international crime treaty, to silence pro-life Christians in the US. The Left cannot stand criticism or even to allow an alternative voice. When the left starts to get in its full power-stride, it will do all it can to silence every non-approved voice.)

25 posted on 06/25/2007 1:48:49 PM PDT by theBuckwheat
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To: Rodm

“Can Nicoli Carpathia be very for behind?”

You forced me to educate myself a bit.
I’m afraid I’m behind on the “Left Behind” series, but did track down
the character (and the fellow that portrayed him).

http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0192963/

(So much for the “Bible Belt” folks being monolithic; I attended a
very conservative/fundamentalist college and haven’t read any of
the “Left Behind” books!)


26 posted on 06/25/2007 1:55:14 PM PDT by VOA
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To: ZGuy

this is sickening...
the lutheran guy proves more than what he claimed; that is the german legal system is a buch of neo-nazis in that they squash free speech to promote their new holocaust!!

i’m in that country right now, i hope I don’t get arrested for saying this! but it sickens me.


27 posted on 06/25/2007 1:56:09 PM PDT by rogernz
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To: cornelis
Thanks for the ping.

Guess it's time for me to shuffle off this vale of tears. This is where I came in back in '36.

28 posted on 06/25/2007 2:33:13 PM PDT by YHAOS
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To: marsh_of_mists
any of these European countries

Pleaase don't paint all Europeans with the same brush. Poland is in battle right now with the EUros over similar issues.
29 posted on 06/25/2007 3:23:10 PM PDT by caveat emptor
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To: ZGuy

The Pastor is a political prisoner. Time to start trashing the German scum as the fascist thugs that they are.

I’m sure the New York Times and ABC will cover this and condemn it for the next 10 weeks.


30 posted on 06/25/2007 3:54:42 PM PDT by sergeantdave
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To: ZGuy
Today creationist theories are tending to find their way into Europe and their spread is affecting quite a few Council of Europe member states. […]

What this means is that evangelicals are making inroads in Europe and the Euro elite don't like it one little bit. A certain percentage of evangelicals will go the young earth route. Those are who we are seeting in this article. But behind them, are almost certainly a lot more evangelicals. They will be persecuted for their faith in Jesus; not for their belief in one interpretation of Genesis.

31 posted on 06/25/2007 4:43:42 PM PDT by ModelBreaker
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To: ZGuy

More evidence of the thriving spirit of Antichrist alive and well in the world today.


32 posted on 06/25/2007 4:44:29 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta
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To: wideawake
Darwinism imposed by law.

But don't you know that "error has no rights?"

Hey, just because our lives have no ultimate meaning doesn't mean we still don't "need" to know the truth of how things work to navigate through this world! [/sarcasm]

33 posted on 06/25/2007 4:47:13 PM PDT by Zionist Conspirator ("Mah tovu 'ohaleykha, Ya`aqov, mishkenoteykha, Yisra'el!")
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To: DaveLoneRanger; SirLinksalot; Tolerance Sucks Rocks; Stultis; js1138; narby; Coyoteman; ...

Just wondering if our members from the Church of Darwin are for or against this turn of events brought to us by the socialist EU collective.


34 posted on 06/25/2007 6:25:22 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: ModelBreaker

“What this means is that evangelicals are making inroads in Europe and the Euro elite don’t like it one little bit. A certain percentage of evangelicals will go the young earth route. Those are who we are seeing in this article. But behind them, are almost certainly a lot more evangelicals. ..” ~ ModelBreaker

And throughout their “report” those “elites” betray the fact that they are well aware of the real reason why they’re getting so much heat from the religious community.

I am providing some of the telling excerpts below:

Doc. 11297 - 8 June 2007
The dangers of creationism in education http://assembly.coe.int/Main.asp?link=/Documents/WorkingDocs/Doc07/EDOC11297.htm

Report
Committee on Culture, Science and Education
Rapporteur: Mr Guy LENGAGNE, France, Socialist Group

[...]
100. At the same time, it is necessary to consider the causes of such a challenge to the theory of evolution. This theory leaves itself open to many attacks but that could perhaps be explained by the poor way in which it is taught, especially from the epistemological point of view.

101. These reflections lead us to conclude that better teaching or the more appropriate teaching of the sciences and evolution might enable the dissemination of alternative pseudo-theories such as those of the creationists to be combated effectively. It is necessary to avoid doubt entering individuals minds with regard to fundamental scientific knowledge. This importance of quality science teaching that is better suited to the realities of daily life was highlighted in the report on students’ declining interest in scientific studies. ..”

[...]

The position of the Vatican and the Christian religious movements

75. For a long time, the Catholic Church was opposed to transformism and then to evolutionism. However, this opposition has to be understood in the context of the more general mistrust of science prevailing at the time, given the international climate of socialism, which it saw as a consequence of evolutionism. Thus, for a long time there were clashes between the positivist revolutionaries and the Catholics who supported the restoration of the monarchy. The Catholic Church has clearly demonstrated for a very long time that it is creationist. After the Second Vatican Council the Catholic Church was more discreet and almost remained aloof on this issue. This was until 1996, when, on 23 October, Pope John-Paul II recognised that Darwin’s theories were “more than a hypothesis”. ...

76. In the tradition of his predecessor, Pope Benedict XVI now welcomes the role of the sciences in the evolution of humanity: ...In early September 2006, he brought together a group of former students and colleagues at Castel Gondolfo for a seminar on the evolutionism versus creationism debate. He published the conclusions of this seminar in mid-April 2007 in German under the title “Schöpfung und Evolution” (Creation and Evolution). ... The Pope rejects ..the theory of evolution, which hides its own weaknesses and does not want to see the questions that arise beyond the methodological capacities of science. The theory of evolution is considered too pervasive by the Catholic Church, which seems above all to be worried about the influence of social Darwinism and the evolutionist theories concerning economic matters and medical ethics. ..”

[...] End excerpts.

Note what a misleading statement this is: “...This was until 1996, when, on 23 October, Pope John-Paul II recognised that Darwin’s theories were “more than a hypothesis”.

In reality, this is precisely what the pope said:

“...What is the significance of such a theory? To address this question is to enter the field of epistemology.

A theory is a metascientific elaboration distinct from the results of observation, but consistent with them. By means of it a series of independent data and facts can be related and interpreted in a unified explanation. A theory’s validity depends on whether or not it can be verified; it is constantly tested against the facts; wherever it can no longer explain the latter, it shows its limitations and unsuitability. It must then be rethought.

Furthermore, while the formulation of a theory like that of evolution complies with the need for consistency with the observed data, it borrows certain notions from natural philosophy.

And, to tell the truth, rather than the theory of evolution, we should speak of several theories of evolution.

On the one hand, this plurality has to do with the different explanations advanced for the mechanism of evolution, and on the other, with the various philosophies on which it is based. Hence the existence of materialist, reductionist, and spiritualist interpretations. What is to be decided here is the true role of philosophy and, beyond it, of theology.

Consequently, theories of evolution which, in accordance with the philosophies inspiring them, consider the spirit as emerging from the forces of living matter or as a mere epiphenomenon of this matter are incompatible with the truth about man. Nor are they able to ground the dignity of the person. ...”

Excerpted from:

Theories of Evolution http://www.firstthings.com/ftissues/ft9703/articles/johnpaul.html

John Paul II

Copyright (c) 1997 First Things 71 (March 1997): 28-29.
Address to the Pontifical Academy of Sciences, October 22, 1996. bttt


35 posted on 06/25/2007 6:26:59 PM PDT by Matchett-PI (A better name for the goracle is "MALgore" - as in MALpractice, MALevolent, MALfeasance, MALodorous,)
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To: GodGunsGuts
"Church of Darwin?" Darwin was a scientist, to be STUDIED not worshipped.

Many of us don't need a fairytale to base our lives on, nor would ever think of turning to mythology to explain the natural world.

36 posted on 06/25/2007 6:27:35 PM PDT by Clemenza (Rudy Giuliani, like Pesto and Seattle, belongs in the scrap heap of '90s Culture)
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To: Clemenza
==Many of us don’t need a fairytale to base our lives on, nor would ever think of turning to mythology to explain the natural world.

Then stop worshiping at the neo-pagan alter of the Church of Darwin. Not only do Darwinists believe a fairytale, they are now busy trying to install it as an official state sanctioned religion, complete with all the enforcement mechanisms one would expect from totalitarian minded materialists.

37 posted on 06/25/2007 6:34:25 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: GodGunsGuts

I hate what the Europeans are doing as much as you. I am particularly saddened to hear what happenned to that Pastor in Germany mentioned in the article.


38 posted on 06/25/2007 6:35:49 PM PDT by Clemenza (Rudy Giuliani, like Pesto and Seattle, belongs in the scrap heap of '90s Culture)
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To: GodGunsGuts
Then stop worshiping at the neo-pagan alter of the Church of Darwin. Not only do Darwinists believe a fairytale, they are now busy trying to install it as an official state sanctioned religion, complete with all the enforcement mechanisms one would expect from totalitarian minded materialists.

At least six lies on two sentences! Are you trying for a new record?

39 posted on 06/25/2007 6:36:07 PM PDT by Coyoteman (Religious belief does not constitute scientific evidence, nor does it convey scientific knowledge.)
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To: Coyoteman

==At least six lies on two sentences! Are you trying for a new record?

No, I would never think of trying to top you.


40 posted on 06/25/2007 6:37:35 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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Comment #41 Removed by Moderator

To: ZGuy

Unbelievable. I just sent the pointer off to members of my church council (of which I am a member) asking for their prayers for our European brothers and sisters in Christ.

Thanks for the post.


42 posted on 06/25/2007 7:10:18 PM PDT by XEHRpa
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To: JamesP81

The people who are being charged are saying that Germany is going down the same road of perdition as it did in the 1930’s, yet they are being charged with the same laws outlawing the denial of the evils of the regime of the 1930’s-1945. What am I missing here?


43 posted on 06/25/2007 7:25:19 PM PDT by Fred Hayek (Liberalism is a mental disorder)
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To: ZGuy

Couldn’t this be posted under front page news?


44 posted on 06/25/2007 7:32:07 PM PDT by huldah1776 (Worthy is the Lamb.)
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To: theBuckwheat

The left are preparing the youth right now in the public schools.


45 posted on 06/25/2007 7:34:01 PM PDT by huldah1776 (Worthy is the Lamb.)
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To: Coyoteman

So what’s your contention here, that the Lutheran minister doesn’t think abortion is all that bad because he is a holocaust denier? Sorry, your link just doesn’t pass the smell test. But for the sake of argument, let’s assume for a moment that this guy is a holocaust denier. Do you think someone should be put in jail for comparing the abortion of millions of unborn and partially born children to the holocaust? Also, do you believe it is right to use the force of government to silence ID/Creation Science?


46 posted on 06/25/2007 7:34:13 PM PDT by GodGunsGuts
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To: VOA

Did your school not teach you to study the scriptures for yourself? Jesus doesn’t secretly come back and leave. The first resurrection is laid out plain and simple in Revelation 19. Pray to be shown the truth before you read. Enjoy!


47 posted on 06/25/2007 7:37:17 PM PDT by huldah1776 (Worthy is the Lamb.)
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To: rogernz

the holocaust of abortion is worldwide and spreading. God is waiting for us to stop it before He has to.


48 posted on 06/25/2007 7:38:32 PM PDT by huldah1776 (Worthy is the Lamb.)
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To: cornelis

From the Council of Europe “Report”:

37. “... The American President George W. Bush supports the principle of teaching both intelligent design and the theory of evolution.....” ~ The dangers of creationism in education http://assembly.coe.int/Main.asp?link=/Documents/WorkingDocs/Doc07/EDOC11297.htm

Let us be precise and tell the _whole_ truth, shall we?:

Bush August 2005:

On August 1, 2005, a group of reporters from Texas met with President Bush in the Roosevelt room for a roundtable interview. (Transcript August 2, 2005 - WashingtonPost.com) Excerpt:

Q: I wanted to ask you about the — what seems to be a growing debate over evolution versus intelligent design. What are your personal views on that, and do you think both should be taught in public schools?

THE PRESIDENT: I think—as I said, harking back to my days as my governor—both you and Herman are doing a fine job of dragging me back to the past. (Laughter.) Then, I said that, first of all, that decision should be made to local school districts, but I felt like both sides ought to be properly taught.

Q: So the answer accepts the validity of intelligent design as an alternative to evolution?

THE PRESIDENT: I think that part of education is to expose people to different schools of thought, and I’m not suggesting—you’re asking me whether or not people ought to be exposed to different ideas, and the answer is yes.”

Dr. John Marburger III, Presidential Science Advisor, said, “evolution is the cornerstone of modern biology” and “intelligent design is not a scientific concept.” Aug. 2, 2005 - The New York Times

Dr. Marvin Cohen, President of the American Physical Society, and recipient of the National Medal of Science from President Bush in 2002, in an Aug. 4 release, said that as Presidential Science Advisor John Marburger has explained, President Bush does not regard intelligent design as science. If such things are to be taught in the public schools, they belong in a course on comparative religion, which is a particularly appropriate subject for our children given the present state of the world.”

*
Clinton/Gore August 27, 1999:

“..a spokesman for Vice President Al Gore announced that the vice president “favors the teaching of evolution in the public schools,” adding the decision should be local and “localities should be free to teach creationism as well.” ...in certain contexts, such as in a religion class..”

Gore’s boss, President Bill Clinton, agrees that local control of schools is proper. “I think the president believes the curriculum is by law and by all common practice left to local school boards,” White House Press Secretary Joe Lockhart said.

What do the Republican presidential hopefuls say about evolution?

Texas Gov. George W. Bush, the GOP front-runner, believes both evolution and creationism are valid educational subjects.

“He believes it is a question for states and local school boards to decide but believes both ought to be taught,” a spokeswoman said. ...

....Pope John Paul II announced last year that the Roman Catholic church would not oppose evolution — it seems to be mostly fundamentalist Protestants who oppose the theory. ..”

[[[ Not quite. The _whole_ truth: “Theories” of Evolution by John Paul II http://www.firstthings.com/article.php3?id_article=3659 ]]]

..But it remains to be seen whether this argument, which never seems to fall completely out of the public discourse, will play a major role in the still-evolving 2000 presidential election landscape.” ~ By Bruce Morton/CNN Presidential candidates weigh in on evolution debate
http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/stories/1999/08/27/president.2000/evolution.create/


49 posted on 06/25/2007 7:40:23 PM PDT by Matchett-PI (A better name for the goracle is "MALgore" - as in MALpractice, MALevolent, MALfeasance, MALodorous,)
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To: Timocrat
Where is Voltaire when you need him.

Voltaire would be leading the pack, because he hated Christianity.

50 posted on 06/25/2007 7:44:25 PM PDT by RobbyS ( CHIRHOa)
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