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The case for mistrusting Muslims,0,5502943.story?coll=la-opinion-rightrail ^ | Theodore Dalrymple

Posted on 07/08/2007 2:53:43 AM PDT by ventanax5

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To: ClaireSolt
Been saying that for years and yet no one listens.

What got my Goat was when Medicare cut funding for training doctors.

Thousands of residency training slots went away.

If you look at the number of training slots for new doctors it is not much different that say 6 or seven years ago.

Yet the aging of the population and the need for more doctors has expanded not lessoned.

I read somewhere that docs were retiring faster than they could be replaced yet the government is withdrawing funding for these training slots.

41 posted on 07/08/2007 8:28:56 AM PDT by OKIEDOC (Kalifornia, a red state wannabe. I don't take Ex Lax I just read the New York Times.)
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The American docs were all small businessmen and Republicans. I think they imported foreigners to work cheaply at the V A and also to support socialized medicine. Medicare p;ays so poorly that many docs refuse to accept it. I have to change docs again, because here docs drop it when they have built their practice. This is really just another immigration issus, imho.

42 posted on 07/08/2007 8:33:55 AM PDT by ClaireSolt (Have you have gotten mixed up in a mish-masher?)
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To: mkjessup
The bottom line is that not all Muslims may be terrorists, but to date, ALL terrorists have been MUSLIMS!

Goodness. All those Irish Republicans called Kelly were Muslims and I never knew. They were Catholic Muslims, of course.

43 posted on 07/08/2007 9:42:54 AM PDT by Winniesboy
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To: Winniesboy

you know exactly what is meant by the threat we are facing from mooselums...If anyone from my family dies from a Terriost mooslum...or if an event happens again here in USA...I and millions more...we will all Terroist those can damn be sure of that and PC can be Blown to hell can bet all bets are off...and death to evil will begin with me!

44 posted on 07/08/2007 9:57:47 AM PDT by Turborules
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To: ventanax5
A much better read, IMO, from a radical Muslim apostate:

I was a fanatic...I know their thinking, says former radical Islamist

For decades, radicals have been exploiting the tensions between Islamic theology and the modern secular state - typically by starting debate with the question: "Are you British or Muslim?"

But the main reason why radicals have managed to increase their following is because most Muslim institutions in Britain just don't want to talk about theology.

They refuse to broach the difficult and often complex truth that Islam can be interpreted as condoning violence against the unbeliever - and instead repeat the mantra that Islam is peace and hope that all of this debate will go away.

This has left the territory open for radicals to claim as their own. I should know because, as a former extremist recruiter, I repeatedly came across those who had tried to raise these issues with mosque authorities only to be banned from their grounds.

Every time this happened it felt like a moral and religious victory for us because it served as a recruiting sergeant for extremism.

45 posted on 07/08/2007 10:05:39 AM PDT by dirtboy (Impeach Chertoff and Gonzales. We can't wait until 2009 for them to be gone.)
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To: Pete98

There are times that make it seem so. I have faith that enough sane people are in this Nation... but it may take some serious pain to awaken them. I pray over it daily.


46 posted on 07/08/2007 10:26:01 AM PDT by LibLieSlayer (Support America, Kill terrorists, Destroy dims!)
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To: R.W.Ratikal

“The Case for Mistrusting Muslims.”

Their entire history.

47 posted on 07/08/2007 10:45:26 AM PDT by Noumenon (The Koran is the Mein Kampf of a religion that has always aimed to eliminate the others - O. Fallaci)
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To: logcabinman

Fear the Islamic meme.

48 posted on 07/08/2007 1:27:23 PM PDT by Misterioso
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To: Winniesboy
The bottom line is that not all Muslims may be terrorists, but to date, ALL terrorists have been MUSLIMS!
Goodness. All those Irish Republicans called Kelly were Muslims and I never knew. They were Catholic Muslims, of course.

Don't be a smart ass. You know damn well what I'm talking about, we're talking about the post 9-11 world and the global jihad against America and the West which was launched by MUSLIM TERRORISTS.

Use your head for something other than a hat rack, ok?
49 posted on 07/08/2007 2:33:38 PM PDT by mkjessup (Jan 20, 2009 - "We Don't Know. Where Rudy Went. Just Glad He's Not. The President. Burma Shave.")
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To: Turborules

Well said my FRiend!

50 posted on 07/08/2007 2:52:24 PM PDT by mkjessup (Jan 20, 2009 - "We Don't Know. Where Rudy Went. Just Glad He's Not. The President. Burma Shave.")
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To: mkjessup

God Bless you my friend, and fellow Patriot...the Libs dims and, communist can not see evil...because then they would need God!...when the shit hits the fan...they will need us! Just as always we will clean the mess up..but the age of PC will be over! Long Live the founders of America...and the Constitution they Wrote with their own blood... that makes us the most sought after place of residence in the world! Live free or die can not be just a Historical battle cry! We will all have to make a choice sooner than we wished for...

51 posted on 07/08/2007 6:18:16 PM PDT by Turborules
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To: Old North State


52 posted on 07/08/2007 6:31:27 PM PDT by PGalt
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To: ClaireSolt
Many doctors will no longer handle some of the programs for the poor.

Medi-Cal is a good example along with Medicare.

It’s often hard to find a doctor who will take patients on these programs.

Here is a story that I watched unfold in a border hospital residency program.

It deals with immigration indirectly and with attitudes of certain politicians.

Thank God, I no longer have to deal with residency programs.

There are many unspoken codes in how residencies are handled.

Violate one of those unspoken codes and it can be a career ender.

An example is a forty-year-old foreign doctor with 18 years of experience in private practice and on staff at various foreign hospitals who came to work in a border hospital, residency program.

The doctor was doing a rotation in surgery when she was molested by a more senior third year Arab resident doctor who had come from Syria.

The Arab doctor placed his hand under her skirt, rubbing up between her legs and told her, if you want to pass this rotation then you know what you need to do.

She told him that she would rather fail the rotation than commit adultery.

The new resident doctor complained to her residency program director but he refused to do anything.

The program director and Chief resident warned her very sternly not to make waves over such an insignificant charge.

Therefore, against advice, she wrote up a report of complaint against the offending doctor.

Instead of removing the Arab doctor, the new doctor was moved and the Director of the Surgery residency program gave her failing marks in the rotation that included everything from how she dressed to not having good working relations with her superiors.

I understand from associates that the Arab doctor in question eventually had to leave the hospital.

I believe someone said he was now practicing slicing and dicing surgery in either Kansas City or Chicago.

Being around some of the most educated on the face of the planet can be a real drag.

There always seems to be a petty dust up between staff and the residents.

It is a world where a young resident soon learns the importance of the initials CYA as the Eleventh Commandment.

A residency is like a sweatshop of old.

The hours are long, sometimes 100 or more a week.

Residents from Harvard sued the hospitals, AMA and residency system asking to get reasonable hours.

The standard was eventually reset to an 80-hour workweek.

That only came after several deaths and horrendous mistakes due to resident doctors being so tired they fell asleep while operating on patients or making prescriptions.

The work is tedious with lots of pressure coming from every angle.

If anyone is interested, they might look up and see what side of this debate that Democrat Senator’s Hillary Clinton and Charles Schumer took.

It is interesting that a person advertised to the world as caring for the undeserved and who writes a book “It Takes a Village” would come down on the side of the American Medical Association, hospitals all big political donors.

If nothing has changed in the last few years and due to Clinton's and Schumer’s diligent work, residency programs are exempt from work standards set by the federal government.

When this came down it was, needless to say, a slap in the face.

With out cheap residency doctors pay that averages just a little more than minimum wage hospital profits would be a lot less.

Therefore, less money to donate to politicians.

This also goes to the immigration question of how many H and J visas are issued each year.

With a cap on H visas lifted then more foreign doctors can come in and fill jobs at lower wages.

I am surprised that the Republican Candidates for office have not picked up on Clinton and Schumer’s dubious actions in the Senate.

Instead of taking the side of the underdog, they sided with those having deep pockets.

Personally and professionally, I do not want someone working on my family, anyone or me if the doctor has been up for 24 or more hours or does not understand directions in English.


For those who disagree Flame Away.

53 posted on 07/08/2007 6:57:17 PM PDT by OKIEDOC (Kalifornia, a red state wannabe. I don't take Ex Lax I just read the New York Times.)
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I had a home security biz when alarms for homes were becoming popular. There was a local association that had monthly lunch meetings. The only item on tghe agenda was the effort to get the state to license alarm dealers to limit competition. That is when I learned that government licenses act in restraint of trade.

The AMA has always sought to limit the numbers of docs to keep earnings up. Maybe they made a deal with the devil to staff government programs with cheap foreign docs.

I remember when docs ran the hospitals with pride and competed for community recognition. It was lots better then.

54 posted on 07/08/2007 10:42:54 PM PDT by ClaireSolt (Have you have gotten mixed up in a mish-masher?)
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To: mkjessup; Turborules
My apologies for the flippancy of my comment if you felt it inappropriate to this most serious of topics, and I have no wish to minimise the scale of what is faced. Yet to suggest, as you do, that Islam is the only source of terrorism in the world is not helpful to those of us who have spent a good portion of our lives coping with terrorism which has wholly different origins, and who may indeed have something useful to contribute from that experience.
55 posted on 07/09/2007 2:25:31 AM PDT by Winniesboy
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You won’t get any argument from me. I work in health care and muslim doctors will refer their patients only to other muslim doctors, at least where I worked until recently. Another trick muslim doctors pull is bringing their relatives here for free expensive medical care. Establishing residency is very easy in this state, so they live with other muslim relatives for a few weeks and then they apply for medicaid for an expensive surgery or procedure.
This makes a lot of the people I worked with livid because we are paying taxes for this.
56 posted on 07/09/2007 5:13:00 AM PDT by k omalley (Caro Enim Mea, Vere est Cibus, et Sanguis Meus, Vere est Potus)
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To: Winniesboy
thank you for the clarification...I did not consider your comment flippant...just see Islam is not mentioned by me as the only Evil...just the one evil most vocal and active at destroying our way of life...Libs as hidden communist kills the spirit, just as a bomb kills the body, when men of faith and freedom roll over...we are enslaved! I would rather die fighting Evil! than have any group or ideology determine my fate!
57 posted on 07/09/2007 1:10:57 PM PDT by Turborules
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To: ClaireSolt

Do you realize that you have hit on a major area of discrimination against foreign-trained medical personnel?

In most states, a doctor coming from a foreign country cannot even work as a lowly minimum wage paid Medical Assistant with out a certification from some government-sanctioned group.

I know many doctors in the San Diego area who cannot practice any kind of medicine even though their degrees have been certified by an International Evaluation Service (IERF) to be equal to any medical degree given by an American Medical school.

Many of these doctors are doing things like my friend Manuel who is driving a taxi part-time and working at a 7-11 full time to make ends meet.

The requirements placed on foreign doctors are above and beyond those of other professionals.

The requirements are necessary but to get those requirements fulfilled is expensive.

The AMA and the way doctors are chosen for a residency is a restraint of trade as it limits who can apply and where they can get interviews.

On top of that, the process is expensive, especially if like Manuel your working two jobs just to pay rent and put three kids through school.

All this crap about Kalifornia wanting to help get more Spanish speaking doctors into the medical field is just more liberal double speak.

If you live in this state, the majority of new doctors being trained in hospital residency programs just from the valley areas are from countries who hate our guts.

In addition, when training is completed for these new doctors will move on and not work in underserved areas.

I have read posts on residency forums from residents who absolutely hate this country.

Some of the posts are about the kinds of American patients they have to treat and it is enough to make any red blooded American mad as a Hornet.

The doctors from predominately-Muslim countries are very critical of America.

One resident doctor from a Middle Eastern country stated he would never have signed a residency contract with a border hospital had he known the amount of human trash that visited the hospital seeking treatment.

Another doctor from a Middle Eastern country remarked that the patients he had to treat were inferior to his fellow fellow citizens even though his country is considered below third world.

If anyone is interested, I will look up and post some of these residency forum links.

Then those who have critisized my harsh comments can read for themselves what the Indian, Pakistanis, Syrians, Iranian, Chinese and other countries think of their inferior American patients.

I have posted before and gotten flamed about wanting doctors who can communicate with their patients.

If you have doctors able to communicate with patients then you might cut down the enormous costs of having to do over prescribing of unnecessary medical procedures.

Oh, but OKIEDOC you have it wrong, some will say.

These non English-speaking people just need to up and leave and get their medical needs attended in their home country.

We also need to be logical is my answer.

Well to all, many of these people are American citizens and not illegal border jumpers.

Just the lowly opinion of a red state wannabe.

Flame Away

58 posted on 07/09/2007 1:24:03 PM PDT by OKIEDOC (Kalifornia, a red state wannabe. I don't take Ex Lax I just read the New York Times.)
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To: k omalley
Yes, you are correct.

A week or so ago I posted about a lady visiting in this town from another country.

I saw her Sunday at church and she gave me an update of her hospital experience.

She was on a visa so went to a community health center.

Her heart rate was low so sent her to ER in the local hospital.

The doctor on duty from an African country could not understand Spanish when she tried to tell him that she had forgotten to take her medicine.

Since he could not understand what she was saying he ordered out several very expensive test from Radiology and the lab.

He was as they say doing some very nice CYA.

The lady was released from ER after about 5 hours.

A few days later she got a call from the finance office at the hospital asking when she could make a payment on her bill.

The bill amounted to more than $5,500 and later was increased another $2,250 for a total of $7,750 for the 5 hour stay.

Of course $7,750 dollars is more money than she has seen in years and couldn’t pay.

The hospital sent her to Medi-Cal and they agreed to pay for the entire cost.

The funny thing is that she only needed to take the medicine prescribed for her condition but due to catch 22 factors ended up in a financial bind.

As for the patient stealing it does happen and lots of American doctors are aware that it happens.

59 posted on 07/09/2007 8:40:02 PM PDT by OKIEDOC (Kalifornia, a red state wannabe. I don't take Ex Lax I just read the New York Times.)
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To: ventanax5
... its bovine complacency born of an inability, or unwillingness ...

60 posted on 07/12/2007 8:30:55 PM PDT by Spirochete
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