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Republican Admits to 'Serious Sin in My Past' (Another Rudy supporter with "secrets")
Crosswalk.com ^ | 7-10-07 | Susan Jones

Posted on 07/10/2007 7:07:58 AM PDT by TitansAFC

(CNSNews.com) - A Republican senator has been caught in the "D.C. madam" snare.

Sen. David Vitter's telephone number was listed in the records kept by Deborah Jeane Palfrey - the woman accused of running a prostitution ring. Palfrey insists it was a legitimate escort service. On Monday, she posted her clients' telephone numbers - but no names -- online.

"This was a very serious sin in my past for which I am, of course, completely responsible," Vitter said in a statement released to the Associated Press on Monday.

"Several years ago, I asked for and received forgiveness from God and my wife in confession and marriage counseling. Out of respect for my family, I will keep my discussion of the matter there -- with God and them. But I certainly offer my deep and sincere apologies to all I have disappointed and let down in any way."

Vitter, 46, was elected to the Senate in 2004 - the first Louisiana Republican to serve in the Senate since Reconstruction. He previously served two terms in the U.S. House of Representatives.

Vitter recently helped lead the conservative effort to kill the immigration "reform" bill. He also supports the Marriage Protection Amendment.

"As the parents of four children, my wife Wendy and I get up every day dedicated to securing a truly bright future for all of us in Louisiana," his website says.

According to ABC News, Palfrey's clients included prominent business executives, NASA officials and military officers, but they have so far not been named publicly.

Randal Tobias, a senior State Department official, resigned several months ago after ABC News asked him about his use of the escort service.

'What a joke'

A website dedicated to New Orleans news and information, nola.com, offered readers a chance to vent about Vitter.

"What's your reaction to the senator's admission? Will it affect his ability to represent Louisiana? Are you satisfied with his apology?" the website asked.

Reaction was mostly unfavorable:

"Here is a guy who preached about New Orleans being sinful. What a joke," wrote one reader. "As I've said in the past all men in congress get drunk with power. The only thing that would surprise me is if Mary Landrieu or Pelosi were buying boy toys."

"I want govt. out of my wallet an out of my bedroom, regardless of political party," wrote another reader.

"Soliciting sex is illegal in DC. Vitter therefore broke the law. Are Republicans ready to reelect a criminal to office in 2010? Because Vitter broke the law, he should resign. This is really a huge disgrace, and we cannot afford any more bad press in Louisiana," said another angry constituent.

"His bible thumping family value gravy train has derailed."

One reader mentioned press reports in 2004 in which Vitter (running for the Senate at the time) publicly denied allegations that he had an 11-month affair with a known prostitute.


TOPICS: Government; News/Current Events; Politics/Elections; US: District of Columbia; US: Louisiana
KEYWORDS: dcmadam; louisiana; madam; palfrey; prostitution; rudy; vitter
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Add this to his recent SC campaign manager's arrest on cocaine charges, and we have an emerging pattern. Hedonists and moral relativists love Rudy, and he's happy to have their endorsements and give them high positions (see Bernie Kerik, as well).

No wonder these guys support Rudy Giuliani. He really IS their kind of candidate.

I guess we can't count on Rudy single-handedly cleaning-up all of national government, as his supporters have been trying to tell us. He can't even keep his own house clean - personal or campaign house, that is.

Had enough yet? Stop Rudy NOW!

1 posted on 07/10/2007 7:08:00 AM PDT by TitansAFC
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To: TitansAFC

This has nothing to do with Rudy. Please.


2 posted on 07/10/2007 7:09:14 AM PDT by Perdogg (Support the President's Policy in Iraq)
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To: TitansAFC

Buy Bye


3 posted on 07/10/2007 7:10:21 AM PDT by Augustinian monk
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To: TitansAFC

If Rudy’s past malfeasance and liberalism aren’t enough to shake his fan club, a few rotten supporters aren’t going to dampen their enthusiasm


4 posted on 07/10/2007 7:10:22 AM PDT by pissant (Duncan Hunter: Warrior, Statesman, Conservative)
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To: TitansAFC
Vitter recently helped lead the conservative effort to kill the immigration "reform" bill. He also supports the Marriage Protection Amendment.

David Vitter appears to be a solid conservative in the Senate. Regardless of his mistakes in his personal life, we would be much better served if we did not throw him under the bus because of this.

No one is perfect. We all make mistakes. The important thing is that when we do screw up, we try to fix it, and not repeat the mistake, and hope for forgiveness from those that we hurt in the process.

5 posted on 07/10/2007 7:11:18 AM PDT by pnh102
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To: TitansAFC

Good grief. I wouldn’t vote for Rudy in a primary because I don’t support his social positions. But I fail to see your logic here. And I like Vitter. Most people do have things in their past they don’t want disclosed. Vitter’s past, the SC campaign manager’s arrest... these have nothing to do with Guiliani.


6 posted on 07/10/2007 7:11:53 AM PDT by twigs
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Comment #7 Removed by Moderator

To: pnh102
In no way did I throw Vitter “under the bus.”

This is about a pattern of people supporting Rudy.

Vitter did not “come clean” with us, anymore than Jesse Jackson did. We only heard about this when he got busted.

Vitter has put his reputation on the line in his support of a Liberal for President. All this does is point out that perhaps that was a bit more of a gamble than we thought - betting on Vitter’s reputation.

Now the question is: do we INSTANTLY forgive and forget with Vitter?

I’m willing to forgive, but his endorsement of Rudy - added with this new revelation of frequenting prostitutes and covering it up from everyone even after “quitting” - is hardly winning my blind support of “Conservative hero,” Mr. Vitter.

With me, he’s kind of on probation.

But we do see a pattern emerging here, like it or not.

8 posted on 07/10/2007 7:19:57 AM PDT by TitansAFC ("My 80% enemy is not my 20% friend" -- Common Sense)
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To: TitansAFC
Get back to me when Vitter has a dead lawyer to explain and when half his friends either wind up in jail or in a coffin.
9 posted on 07/10/2007 7:21:48 AM PDT by Gay State Conservative ("The meaning of peace is the absence of opposition to socialism."-Karl Marx)
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To: TitansAFC
Several years ago, I asked for and received forgiveness from God and my wife in confession and marriage counseling.

It is always disappointing to hear of serious moral failure in the life of a leader ... but since Mr. Vitter is not applying to be pastor of my church, I think the above should suffice.

David Vitter is a national hero for his work in stopping the Kennedy amnesty bill.

10 posted on 07/10/2007 7:22:38 AM PDT by Oliver Optic (Never blame on strategery that which can be fully explained by stupidity.)
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To: TitansAFC
I’m willing to forgive, but his endorsement of Rudy - added with this new revelation of frequenting prostitutes and covering it up from everyone even after “quitting” - is hardly winning my blind support of “Conservative hero,” Mr. Vitter.

Again, it seems that Vitter's personal issues have not impacted his voting record in the US Senate. He might support Rudy, but that doesn't make Vitter himself any less of a conservative. Putting Vitter "on probation" because of his support of Rudy is a bad idea... if enough like minded people withhold their support of Vitter because of this, he will inevitably be replaced, most likely by a liberal Democrat who won't agree with us on anything. Do we really want that?

As wrong as Mr. Vitter's actions in his personal life were, if I was one of his constituents, I would still gladly and heartily support him.

11 posted on 07/10/2007 7:25:55 AM PDT by pnh102
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To: TitansAFC
Your logic makes no sense.

Vitter supports Rudy who is a social liberal who has had association with someone with drug issues.

Well, let’s also go with:

Vitter also supported GWB who had problems in the past.

Using a common but flimsy link here, Rudy and GWB are connected in some way.

I know, PacMan Jones acts like a gang banging thug. He plays for the Titans. TitansAFC roots for the team that employs PacMan Jones. Ergo, Titans AFC supports thug life, people having 4 kids with three women, calling females bitches and hoes, etc.

Rudy falls on his own merits. No need to have to reach for the stars....

12 posted on 07/10/2007 7:26:17 AM PDT by misterrob ("I've never heard of anyone going on the disabled list with pulled fat." RIP Rod Beck)
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To: TitansAFC

Vitter was a “hero” here a couple of weeks ago in re: shamnesty. I don’t know as I’d be so quick to condemn.


13 posted on 07/10/2007 7:26:31 AM PDT by sageb1 (This is the Final Crusade. There are only 2 sides. Pick one.)
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To: TitansAFC
Before all the guys and gals who have cheated on their spouse come here to tell you "this is no big deal," I will say it most certainly is a big deal.

I like Vitter but cheating on your spouse, especially when you have small children, is a SERIOUS Character flaw.

If he is flawed when it comes to his family's emotional well being, why would he not be flawed in matters of National concern?

And it does reflect on Rudi and his band of "flawed" supporters.
This party used to stand for something and minimizing things like broken families goes against our principles.
14 posted on 07/10/2007 7:26:33 AM PDT by elizabetty (Perpetual Candidate using campaign donations for your salary - Its a good gig if you can get it.)
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To: TitansAFC
Vitter's help in defeating the amnesty abomination in the Senate, earns him quite a few passes from me. I have often equated Rudy Supporters with Liberals but in this case I will make an exception.

If not for Vitter, and the people like him, we would be on the verge of another Civil war or Anarchy. We all make mistakes, none of us are perfect.

15 posted on 07/10/2007 7:27:09 AM PDT by Post-Neolithic (Money only makes Communists rich Communists)
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To: Perdogg
Ditto. Vitter made a mistake, and he owned up to it with his Wife. After all, it is only about sex.
16 posted on 07/10/2007 7:27:40 AM PDT by GeorgefromGeorgia
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To: Perdogg
The previous thread today focused more on moral judgments by those perfect folks apparently not living in glass houses, rather than his support of RinoRudy.
17 posted on 07/10/2007 7:29:25 AM PDT by ASA Vet (No More RINO's)
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To: elizabetty
I like Vitter but cheating on your spouse, especially when you have small children, is a SERIOUS Character flaw.

No one is saying that cheating on one's spouse is not a serious character flaw. It is, but we must also understand that every now and then, even the best of people can give into temptation and do things they wouldn't otherwise do. Everyone is susceptible to this, it is part of our human nature.

Of course, this does not excuse such actions. If anything, we should pray that he and his family can get through this difficult time.

You should look at this another way. It isn't like he got drunk and killed somebody.

18 posted on 07/10/2007 7:32:32 AM PDT by pnh102
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To: TitansAFC
No wonder these guys support Rudy Giuliani. He really IS their kind of candidate.

You really, really, really don't want to imply that only politicians supporting Rudy ever committeed adultery...do you?

I didn't think so.

19 posted on 07/10/2007 7:34:25 AM PDT by Corin Stormhands (http://wardsmythe.com / Script Frenzy 2007 - WINNER!!!)
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To: elizabetty
-—”And it does reflect on Rudi and his band of “flawed” supporters.
This party used to stand for something and minimizing things like broken families goes against our principles.”-—

Prude!

He cast his damn vote correctly, so what the hell more do you want? Perfection?!?! Cam’t you see that asking a married man not to frequent prostitutes is practically Puritan of you?!?!?!

How DARE you have a moral standard for office-bearers!?!?! Do you want the Democrats to win, or are you rooting for the terrorists?!?!

And Rudy being surrounded by gay Republicans, NARAL-types, cocaine users, crooked cops, and frequenters of prostitutes - all of these people holding KEY positions in his campaigns and administrations - proves nothing. After all, if I use six degrees of separation with you, I can connect you to Osama Bin Laden.

Instantly forgive, because they vote Conservative. That way, we can be just like the Democrats. The measure of a person is no longer based on their character as a whole - it is based on how they vote on key political issues. We can overlook the other stuff, because he’s our guy!

20 posted on 07/10/2007 7:36:23 AM PDT by TitansAFC ("My 80% enemy is not my 20% friend" -- Common Sense)
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To: TitansAFC

It’s Louisiana. Running with whores is a virtue down there.


21 posted on 07/10/2007 7:36:36 AM PDT by DesScorp
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To: TitansAFC
Instantly forgive, because they vote Conservative. That way, we can be just like the Democrats.

If someone votes conservative, as Vitter does, how can be "like a Democrat?"

If Ray Nagin manages to become US Senator from Louisiana, it will be because we threw Vitter under the bus.

22 posted on 07/10/2007 7:39:00 AM PDT by pnh102
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To: DesScorp

-—”It’s Louisiana. Running with whores is a virtue down there.”-—

Ouch! But you do get laughs from this man born in Baton Rouge......

;-)


23 posted on 07/10/2007 7:39:09 AM PDT by TitansAFC ("My 80% enemy is not my 20% friend" -- Common Sense)
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To: TitansAFC

Who are you for? With just a bit of research I can find a supporter of him/her who is not pure.

For Gods sake seeing a prostitute in this day and age is equivalent to a burp.


24 posted on 07/10/2007 7:39:49 AM PDT by woofie
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To: TitansAFC

What does this have to do with Giuliani?

How desperate can you be?


25 posted on 07/10/2007 7:40:17 AM PDT by finnman69 (May Paris Hilton's plane crash into Britney Spears house while Lindsey Lohan is over doing coke)
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To: pnh102

-—”If Ray Nagin manages to become US Senator from Louisiana, it will be because we threw Vitter under the bus.”-—

Ah. I see. The Democrats are worse, so shut up.


26 posted on 07/10/2007 7:40:23 AM PDT by TitansAFC ("My 80% enemy is not my 20% friend" -- Common Sense)
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To: finnman69
-—”What does this have to do with Giuliani?

How desperate can you be?”-—

Not desperate enough to support a Liberal for President - so I wouldn’t go throwing around the word, “desperate.”

27 posted on 07/10/2007 7:43:41 AM PDT by TitansAFC ("My 80% enemy is not my 20% friend" -- Common Sense)
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To: pnh102
"The important thing is that when we do screw up, we try to fix it, and not repeat the mistake, and hope for forgiveness from those that we hurt in the process."

The important thing is that when we do screw up, and before we get caught, we try to fix it, and not repeat the mistake, and hope for forgiveness from those that we hurt in the process. We have a little more credibility that way.

After we're caught, it loses a bit in the sincerity department.

28 posted on 07/10/2007 7:44:36 AM PDT by robertpaulsen
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To: twigs
Rudy may be the only one to provide a crossover link for many Democrats if they cannot stand Hillary. Democrats will never go for the Bob Dole type like Thompson. Dole was a huge mistake and running someone like him will hand the whitehouse over to the Dems. Vitter will be chastised by the media for being a hypocrite. Senator Kennedy and Dodd are expected to be waitress sandwich players. Two faced GOP politicians should know by now they are fair game. The FBI file expose' after Hillary's gang got into the 1200 files was swift. Many of the GOP politicians had affairs exposed and children by other woman.

Vitter is not the last GOP name from the list of whore users. I am betting there are more.

29 posted on 07/10/2007 7:46:22 AM PDT by oldironsides
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To: TitansAFC
"Because Vitter a Republican broke the law, he should resign."

There. I fixed it.

30 posted on 07/10/2007 7:46:33 AM PDT by robertpaulsen
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To: robertpaulsen

Eh?

You want him to resign?

A bit much, if you ask me.


31 posted on 07/10/2007 7:48:26 AM PDT by TitansAFC ("My 80% enemy is not my 20% friend" -- Common Sense)
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To: TitansAFC

“Soliciting sex is illegal in DC. Vitter therefore broke the law. Are Republicans ready to reelect a criminal to office in 2010? Because Vitter broke the law, he should resign. This is really a huge disgrace, and we cannot afford any more bad press in Louisiana,” said another angry constituent.

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

I wonder if they constituent wanted Clinton convicted in the Senate. That was rhetorical.


32 posted on 07/10/2007 7:50:22 AM PDT by doug from upland ((Stopping Hillary should be a FreeRepublic Manhattan Project))
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To: TitansAFC
Ah. I see. The Democrats are worse, so shut up.

Yes, the Democrats are worse. Which outcome is better to you, having all imperfect Republicans, including conservatives, be removed from office, and be replaced with liberal (and imperfect) Democrats, or not?

Vitter is no RINO. He stood fast against shamnesty. If his family can forgive him for his mistakes, than so should we.

33 posted on 07/10/2007 7:51:27 AM PDT by pnh102
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To: pnh102
Republican/Conservative voters obviously had a tough time being in the majority, and for decades have had an aversion to ruthlessness in our pols, as evidenced by our Congress and State Houses elections.

Which Dim voters have mastered well, as evidenced by how much power they have accumulated in the MSM, the Fed bureaucracies, education and the judiciary.

34 posted on 07/10/2007 7:52:21 AM PDT by roses of sharon
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To: TitansAFC

Using this as a vehicle to attack Rudy is not a good idea. I’m a Fred Thompson supporter. But if you think that Fred or Duncan Hunter or Ron Paul or Tom Tancredo, et al have no supporters with skeletons in their closet you are mistaken.


35 posted on 07/10/2007 7:55:09 AM PDT by Artemis Webb (New York Politicians do not think or believe like Americans! .....Fred Thompson -- 2008)
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To: TitansAFC
What on earth does this have to do with Rudy??
36 posted on 07/10/2007 7:55:22 AM PDT by DaveLoneRanger (As He died to make men holy, let us die to make men free.)
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To: pnh102
It is, but we must also understand that every now and then, even the best of people can give into temptation....

That is why are Representatives should be the best of us, not like the rest of us.

He has serious matters to deal with and a certain amount of power. If he can give into sexual whims when it would destroy those closest to him and most dependent upon him, then he might do something to "screw" the American public he does not know.
37 posted on 07/10/2007 8:00:27 AM PDT by elizabetty (Perpetual Candidate using campaign donations for your salary - Its a good gig if you can get it.)
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To: pnh102
Well, unlike you, I don’t want to murder everyone who criticizes Vitter.

Oh wait.....that’s not what you said, is it?

Nor did I say we need to REMOVE Vitter, so stop pretending I did.

I did say that frequenting a prostitute and covering it up from us for so long deserves some consideration. Rather than DEMAND everyone INSTANTLY forgive him and “move on,” how about accepting that perhaps some of us are going to have less than blind faith in Vitter for a little while?

I cannot buy into the “he opposed amnesty, so let’s ignore everything else he does” philosophy.

No he does not need to be removed. Yes, we need to be a little more cautious in our support of Vitter than we have been. Yes, he’s still better than the Democrats lining-up to face him. No, we don’t INSTANTLY just pretend that it means nothing.

38 posted on 07/10/2007 8:00:48 AM PDT by TitansAFC ("My 80% enemy is not my 20% friend" -- Common Sense)
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To: DaveLoneRanger
-—”What on earth does this have to do with Rudy??”-—

Nothing. We should still trust him to make the highest appointments in this land without hesitation. Shouldn’t even hesitate....

39 posted on 07/10/2007 8:03:32 AM PDT by TitansAFC ("My 80% enemy is not my 20% friend" -- Common Sense)
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To: pnh102
If Ray Nagin manages to become US Senator from Louisiana, it will be because we threw Vitter under the bus.

Is anybody saying Vitter should be "thrown under the bus?"

Because of this incident he has a strike against him (and some would argue supporting Rudi is also a strike against him).

But we will look at what he does consistently, not what he does once or "used to do."

While I am disgusted by his actions I am very impressed with his reaction to it. He is being a stand up guy and there is a good chance he has learned an important lesson from this.
40 posted on 07/10/2007 8:04:29 AM PDT by elizabetty (Perpetual Candidate using campaign donations for your salary - Its a good gig if you can get it.)
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To: TitansAFC
I'd guess you are strecthing to tie this to the Rudy campaign but if it floats your boat go ahead... My guess is that there is a better arbitrator of the issue.....

In 2000, Vitter was included in a Newhouse News Service story about the strain of congressional careers on families.

His wife, Wendy, was asked by the Newhouse reporter: If her husband were as unfaithful as Livingston or former President Bill Clinton, would she be as forgiving as Hillary Rodham Clinton?

“I’m a lot more like Lorena Bobbitt than Hillary,” Wendy Vitter told Newhouse News. “If he does something like that, I’m walking away with one thing, and it’s not alimony, trust me.”

“I think fear is a very good motivating factor in a marriage,” she added. “Don’t put fear down.”

Vitter briefly considered a run for governor, but bowed out in May 2002, citing strains on his marriage. He announced that he and his wife had entered counseling.


41 posted on 07/10/2007 8:04:59 AM PDT by deport ( Cue Spooky Music...)
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To: TitansAFC

Ok. So you wish Vitter to go out and announce his sins? Having secret sins, particularly of a certain sort, makes anyone in public life vulnerable. But I don’t expect them to announce their dark side. Would you? But how anyone handles this when it becomes public is the real test to me. It’s hard to find good public servants today. And we wonder why?


42 posted on 07/10/2007 8:07:04 AM PDT by twigs
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To: TitansAFC
I cannot buy into the “he opposed amnesty, so let’s ignore everything else he does” philosophy.

He's also supported the troops, is pro-life, the war, he might even be a fiscal conservative too. Those are also other reasons to support him.

43 posted on 07/10/2007 8:07:59 AM PDT by pnh102
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To: TitansAFC

So where are the Democrats who saw her whores?


44 posted on 07/10/2007 8:09:26 AM PDT by dennisw
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To: elizabetty
I just saw this:

I hope there is no testimony or singed oath of any kind from this episode that might hurt Vitter (perjury, for example):

-—”Congressman Denies Affair With Prostitute, Says Charges Are Politically Motivated

by Christopher Tidmore

PoliticsLA.com columnist

posted by March 26, 2004

For the first time, Congressman David Vitter has spoken out publically about allegations that he carried on an eleven month affair with a known prostitute named Wendy Cortez.

On WSMB radio last Saturday, a caller who identified himself as Elwood asked Vitter about charges, made by a member of the Louisiana Republican State Central Committee in the Weekly that the then-State Representative, had had an affair with a known prosition in the French Quarter. Elwood continued, “Would you be willing to sign an affidavit that you have ever known, met or had relations with one Wendy Cortez.”

Vitter responded, “I think you know that that allegation is abosultely and completely untrue...I have said that on numerous occassions...I’ll say that in any forum...Unfortuanately, that’s just crass Louisiana politics, now that I am running for the Senate. I have made that clear that it is alll completely untrue...And, it’s obviously politically motivated.”

In point of fact, Congressman Vitter had previously refused any comment on the charges. The story appeared in this newspaper just days after Vitter dropped out of the race for Governor in June of 2002. The Louisiana Weekly published allegations that Cortez, a known prostitute, claimed that she had an 11-month affair with Vitter, a state representative at the time.

Vincent Bruno, secretary of the Republican Party of Jefferson Parish and a member of the RSCC, alleged that Congressman David Vitter had engaged in an extramarital affair. In what was a high-stakes political battle between some of the most prominent members of the Louisiana Republican Party, Bruno charged that a prostitute, who stated her name to be Wendy Cortez, allegedly confessed to him to having a paid sexual relationship with Vitter. Three separate and independent sources, including WDSU-TV reporter Richard Angelico, confirmed Bruno’s allegation. Each had spoken to Cortez personally, and she recounted to them the details of her alleged affair with Vitter.”-—

45 posted on 07/10/2007 8:09:50 AM PDT by TitansAFC ("My 80% enemy is not my 20% friend" -- Common Sense)
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To: oldironsides
Rudy may be the only one to provide a crossdresser link for many Democrats if they cannot stand Hillary.
46 posted on 07/10/2007 8:09:54 AM PDT by ASA Vet (No More RINO's)
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To: pnh102

I agree that Vitter has been a solid conservative. However, I think what is being overlooked here is that he made a mistake, and lied to his constituents to cover it up. Cheating on his wife is not good either, but that is between he, his wife and God. It doesn’t have anything to do with me.

I would have some serious trust issues with this guy. If he is the best Republican running, I could still vote for him. But that is a big if. Surely there is someone with more integrity and solid conservative credentials that could run.

Vitter should be criticized for his behavior and every respectable conservative should be seriously considering whether he is worthy of their vote. Otherwise, we are the same as the liberals; willing to sacrifice our values to win the election.


47 posted on 07/10/2007 8:10:23 AM PDT by ga medic
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To: dennisw

-—”So where are the Democrats who saw her whores?”-—

Oh man! I am hoping to see that list.....

Notice the deafening silence of the Democrats on this today?


48 posted on 07/10/2007 8:10:58 AM PDT by TitansAFC ("My 80% enemy is not my 20% friend" -- Common Sense)
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To: TitansAFC

I wonder if Dems on the list will ever see the light of day—or just Repubs.


49 posted on 07/10/2007 8:18:41 AM PDT by brushcop (Men of B-Co 2/69 3ID Outpost Bataan/Iraq: Kill the enemy--in large numbers.)
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To: brushcop

This is D.C.

My bet is that it will be difficult to ever get those Dem names.

I also bet that Vitter is the ONLY Republican, hence the leak. If there were more Republicans, we’d already know.

Just my opinion....


50 posted on 07/10/2007 8:22:27 AM PDT by TitansAFC ("My 80% enemy is not my 20% friend" -- Common Sense)
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