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Swat Somebody's Butt And Yours Belongs To The D.A (Mark Steyn On Oregon Nifong Excess Alert)
Orange County Register ^ | 07/29/2007 | Mark Steyn

Posted on 07/29/2007 3:20:00 AM PDT by goldstategop

District Attorney Berry told reporter Susan Goldsmith of the Oregonian that his department "aggressively" pursues sex crimes. "These cases are devastating to children," he said. "They are life-altering cases."

No, sir. The only one devastating children's lives is you. If you "win," and these "criminals" are convicted, 20, 30 years from now – applying for a job, volunteering for a community program, heading north for a weekend in Vancouver and watching the Customs guard swipe the driver's license through the computer – there'll be a blip, something will come up on the screen, and for the umpteenth time two middle-age men will realize they bear a mark that can never be expunged. Because decades ago they patted their pals on the rear in a middle-school corridor.

A world that requires handcuffs and judges and district attorneys for what took place that Friday in February is not just a failed education system but an entire society that's losing any sense of proportion. Without which, civilized life becomes impossible. So we legalize more and more aspects of life and demand that district attorneys prosecute ever more aggressively what were once routine areas of social interaction.

A society that looses the state to criminalize schoolroom horseplay is guilty not only of punishing children as grown-ups but of the infantilization of the entire citizenry.

(Excerpt) Read more at ocregister.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Crime/Corruption; Culture/Society; Editorial; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy; US: Oregon
KEYWORDS: butswatting; corymashburn; discipline; horseplay; kids; marksteyn; mcminville; ocregister; oregonnifong; outofcontrol; prosecutorialexcess; ryancornelison; zerotolerance
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If your kid swats a butt in old-fashioned horseplay, in Oregon, the local Mike Nifong will seek to have your child prosecuted and convicted as a sex offender. Not kidding! I leave it to Mark Steyn to have the final word this morning:

20, 30 years from now – applying for a job, volunteering for a community program, heading north for a weekend in Vancouver and watching the Customs guard swipe the driver's license through the computer – there'll be a blip, something will come up on the screen, and for the umpteenth time two middle-age men will realize they bear a mark that can never be expunged. Because decades ago they patted their pals on the rear in a middle-school corridor.

A world that requires handcuffs and judges and district attorneys for what took place that Friday in February is not just a failed education system but an entire society that's losing any sense of proportion. Without which, civilized life becomes impossible. So we legalize more and more aspects of life and demand that district attorneys prosecute ever more aggressively what were once routine areas of social interaction.

A society that looses the state to criminalize schoolroom horseplay is guilty not only of punishing children as grown-ups but of the infantilization of the entire citizenry.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

1 posted on 07/29/2007 3:20:10 AM PDT by goldstategop
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To: goldstategop

The road to hell is paved with good intentions...

Crime ‘prevention’ is a good thing, right??

Somewhere in the ‘60’s and ‘70’s we, as a society, made the decision to shift our crime-fighting emphasis from ‘retribution and deterrence’ to ‘prevention’, and, in so doing, we opened the flap of a very small tent to the nose of a very large camel.

In the name of ‘prevention’, it’s become necessary to criminalize the *potential* to cause harm — and since there is almost no human activity that doesn’t potentially cause some harm to somebody, we’ve, in effect, made ‘criminals’ of every one of us...

The logical end of this is to criminalize risk, of any kind - and that end is in sight.....


2 posted on 07/29/2007 3:38:01 AM PDT by Uncle Ike (We has met the enemy, and he is us........)
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To: Uncle Ike
Those children should just have been given a lecture by the principle and sent home. There was no need to treat them like criminals, have the police arrest them and put them in jail for what? As for the D.A, if I was a parent hearing that idiotic blather about my child being a "sex offender" he would find himself on the receiving of my fist smashing into his face. Any one who does THAT to a child deserves what they get for being a bully - a bully with a badge.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

3 posted on 07/29/2007 3:49:46 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: goldstategop
So we legalize more and more aspects of life and demand that district attorneys prosecute ever more aggressively what were once routine areas of social interaction.

Amen. Homosexuality and child sacrifice (Abortion) are legalized and celebrated, while at this very second a "Hate Crimes" rider was put into the Defense Appropriations bill (so it would go unnoticed and be signed) that will open the door to persecution against Christians and Jews who speak against evil.

Kennedy cramming hate crimes into defense bill 'Shameless attempt to push homosexual agenda ... by exploiting soldiers'

4 posted on 07/29/2007 3:53:00 AM PDT by SkyPilot
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To: goldstategop

Also, the school principal and vice principal need to lose their jobs over this. Totally inappropriate over-reaction that shows poor decision making abilities.


5 posted on 07/29/2007 3:54:31 AM PDT by savedbygrace (SECURE THE BORDERS FIRST (I'M YELLING ON PURPOSE))
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To: savedbygrace
And the DA needs to be Nifonged before he does more damage to small children.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

6 posted on 07/29/2007 3:55:29 AM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives In My Heart Forever)
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To: goldstategop

If Bush wanted to make a popular move and gain back some support, he should give these kids a pardon and invite them to the Whitehouse.


7 posted on 07/29/2007 3:58:18 AM PDT by Raycpa
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To: Raycpa

along with the girl “victim”.


8 posted on 07/29/2007 3:59:07 AM PDT by Raycpa
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To: savedbygrace

“Also, the school principal and vice principal need to lose their jobs over this. “

They need to be prosecuted, and banned from any responsible position for life.


9 posted on 07/29/2007 4:16:45 AM PDT by dsc (There is no safety for honest men except by believing all possible evil of evil men. Edmund Burke)
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To: goldstategop
They aggressively pursue to point where common sense takes leave; and only insanity is left.
10 posted on 07/29/2007 4:26:44 AM PDT by freekitty
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To: goldstategop
A problem that could be solved by the GOP is to show how "law and order" has become way too much government and needs to be dialed back. Spend a few dollars asking the world "what happened to common sense?" and you elect some conservatives.

The GOP in the golden state, in which I was born, could gain huge majorities if they asked this question - "what has happened to our schools?" At one time they ranked in the top five now they are in the bottom ten. Then show how the libs and the dems have taxed everyone and the more they tax the worse the education!! This could be said for most lib states and cities. Where is the common sense?

11 posted on 07/29/2007 4:32:42 AM PDT by q_an_a
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To: Uncle Ike

Hey I like your screenname.. In Ike’s time people were crying for the government to criminalize all sorts of things to keep people safe.. Eisenhower told them we could put everyone in jail, give them 3 meals a day and keep them safe but its not really living.


12 posted on 07/29/2007 4:36:00 AM PDT by ran20
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To: freekitty
We are at the insanity level.

As the other poster mentioned, homosexuality in all its deviancy...abortions (dismemberment & killing of babies) are lauded, protected....

..and these two kids (one I saw on TV)...will be hounded the rest of their lives.

13 posted on 07/29/2007 4:38:03 AM PDT by Guenevere (Duncan Hunter for President 2008!!!)
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To: q_an_a

One thing I mentioned on another thread is republican politicians often act like they are the victim nearly in things like the pc agenda or gay agenda in schools. Yet republicans have held the majority of governorships in recent times, and usually had the presidency.

The bureaucracy seems to just run roughshod over them, and they are helpless against it.


14 posted on 07/29/2007 4:38:11 AM PDT by ran20
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To: goldstategop

Isn’t Oregon the state that passed a law saying public sex was OK?


15 posted on 07/29/2007 4:43:37 AM PDT by saganite (Billions and billions and billions----and that's just the NASA budget!)
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To: goldstategop
District Attorney Berry told reporter Susan Goldsmith of the Oregonian that his department "aggressively" pursues sex crimes. "These cases are devastating to children," he said. "They are life-altering cases."

Hmmmm......so does the DA have any comments as to WHY the girls in this case ARE NOT being "aggressively" prosecuted ????

In other articles some of the girl (*victims*) admit to 'butt slapping' the boys.

16 posted on 07/29/2007 4:51:40 AM PDT by txdoda (Voters to Gov't .......Re: post 9-11 Border Security....... ""The results are Unacceptable."")
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To: goldstategop
So, is anyone really surprised when we find, ahem, “educators” and self-important “public servants” worshiping at the Liberal altar of hyper ventilated political correctness?

And these same self-deluded activists who regard themselves as so courageously enlightened and sensitive turn a blind eye to the slaughter of millions of unborn babies because Liberal orthodoxy says those tiny infants are simply “choices”, just like whether to have steak or chicken for dinner.

I expect the MSM, if they cover this at all, to go out of their way to provide cover for their ideological comrades. They will provide detailed reports about how the “educators” and “public servants” wrestled endlessly with their consciences and strove mightily to do whats right, ad nauseum.

17 posted on 07/29/2007 5:01:33 AM PDT by Carbonado ("Islame-ic radical" is a redundant term, just like "Leftist journalist")
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To: q_an_a
The GOP in the golden state, in which I was born, could gain huge majorities if they asked this question - "what has happened to our schools?" At one time they ranked in the top five now they are in the bottom ten.

I have no detailed knowledge at all about California public schools (other than my elderly California-schooled parents being some of the best educated persons I know...), but I suspect that when Political Correctness shacked up with Illegal Immigration their kid was named Ignorance.

18 posted on 07/29/2007 5:10:53 AM PDT by AnalogReigns
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To: goldstategop

When I was that age, we boys would go around “snapping” bra straps.

Now that I have outed myself, I sure hope there is a statute of limitations on “bra strap snapping”.


19 posted on 07/29/2007 5:27:24 AM PDT by gruntSGT (Genuine Certified Card Carrying Foaming at the Mouth Lindsay Graham Hater.)
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To: goldstategop

As far as these “authorities” go, it’s:

ROPE, FLAGPOLE (SOME ASSEMBLY REQUIRED).


20 posted on 07/29/2007 5:27:42 AM PDT by Flintlock
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To: Guenevere

We really need to learn to say “NO” to this dimwits.


21 posted on 07/29/2007 5:36:43 AM PDT by freekitty
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To: savedbygrace
When you have teachers who don't want to "break the rules" and who also support zero-tolerance policies (e.g., a water pistol is a "weapon"; a peck on the cheek is "rape"); and administrators and principals who want to keep their jobs and also avoid civil lawsuits against them; and elected prosecutors who demonstrate their "get tough" profile by calling Mommy's pinking shears "a deadly weapon" and two Flintstones vitamin pills "a potentially deadly threat to our children", then you have created a system that not only encourage but **demands** the litigious assault against not merely minors (under 18), but little children of 8, 10, and 14 years old.

There are two problems here.

The first is school teachers and officials who are largely terrified of their own students, mainly because the have no legal right or ability to control those students in a civilized or rational manner (e.g., suspension, expulsion, etc.).

And the precipitating cause of all of this is a judicial system that is infested with judges who legislate from the bench, and who impose a whimsical and arbitrary system of justice that absolutely mocks cultural norms of behavior and subverts the ruole of law.

I am by no means supporting the reprehensible cowardice of teachers and administrators when they participate in prosecuting 9 and 11 year old children for someting that would have meant a note to Mommy and Daddy 25 years ago.

But I am saying that teachers, administrators, prosecutors, and communities have created an irrational and hysterical system full of unintended consequences, the most horrific of which is that little children from 7 to 13 years old can and do become felons for having a plastic picnic knife in their lunchbox.

This is entirely the fault and responsibilty of communities, who do have the power to change the rules. And if they instead choose to offload their civic responsibilities to such a twisted system of injustice, they deserve everything they get. Unfortunately it is their children who will pay the price.

22 posted on 07/29/2007 5:39:39 AM PDT by angkor
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To: dsc; savedbygrace; goldstategop
I disagree. The teachers, administrators, and even the prosecutor are performing their jobs within the guidelines established by the voting citizens of Oregon.

Note if you will where Steyn properly lays the blame. Not upon the teachers or the police, but upon the citizens and the society of the state of Oregon.

"A world that requires handcuffs and judges and district attorneys for what took place that Friday in February is not just a failed education system but an entire society .... A society that looses the state to criminalize schoolroom horseplay....

23 posted on 07/29/2007 5:47:31 AM PDT by angkor
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To: goldstategop

now these kids are deemed sex predators and offenders...

the next step might be....one of them might contemplate a columbine....

then the lib/dems will cry and rant...WHY OH WHY????

pc crap run amuck!!!!!!

a petition should be started for jorge bush to pardon them!!!!


24 posted on 07/29/2007 5:50:49 AM PDT by nyyankeefan
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To: dsc

and spanked ... principal, vice principal, prosecutor, the whole lot of them.


25 posted on 07/29/2007 5:54:34 AM PDT by NonValueAdded (Brian J. Marotta, 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub, (1948-2007) Rest In Peace, our FRiend)
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To: gruntSGT

Yup. I’m sure glad I got out of Junior High School when I did. All of us (boys and girls) would labeled sexual predators today for some of the stuff we did. We were just fooling around, having fun. Little did we know that we were causing each other life-long psychologcal trauma...


26 posted on 07/29/2007 5:54:43 AM PDT by Philistone (Your existence as a non-believer offends the Prophet(MPBUH).)
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To: angkor
I disagree. The teachers, administrators, and even the prosecutor are performing their jobs

So why aren't the (guilty) girls being prosecuted also. ??

27 posted on 07/29/2007 5:57:35 AM PDT by txdoda (Voters to Gov't .......Re: post 9-11 Border Security....... ""The results are Unacceptable."")
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To: angkor
You don't happen to write for US News and World Report, do you? /obscure

Just teasing ... your examination of the issue is spot on.

28 posted on 07/29/2007 6:01:39 AM PDT by NonValueAdded (Brian J. Marotta, 68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub, (1948-2007) Rest In Peace, our FRiend)
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To: gruntSGT
When I was that age, we boys would go around “snapping” bra straps. Now that I have outed myself, I sure hope there is a statute of limitations on “bra strap snapping”.

It was because of guys like you, that girls began wearing bras that snapped in the front. We really confused more than a few guys back then.

29 posted on 07/29/2007 6:16:48 AM PDT by Jaidyn
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To: savedbygrace; DaveLoneRanger
the school principal and vice principal need to lose their jobs over this. Totally inappropriate over-reaction that shows poor decision making abilities.
The individual parent has only one way of making his/her "no confidence vote" stick. And that would be to absent his/her children for that school - by moving out of district or by otherwise making different arrangements for the education of their children.

30 posted on 07/29/2007 6:19:12 AM PDT by conservatism_IS_compassion (The idea around which liberalism coheres is that NOTHING actually matters except PR.)
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To: goldstategop

I could be wrong, but I believe the zealous excesses of the King’s men with regards to the King’s subjects, had something to do with a war in 1776......


31 posted on 07/29/2007 6:21:16 AM PDT by mo
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To: txdoda
So why aren't the (guilty) girls being prosecuted also. ??

You're right about that.

I suspect it's a tactical "oversight" designed to keep the citizens from realizing what stupid leftist sheeple they are, and from clearly seeing the sick and irrational society they've created.

32 posted on 07/29/2007 6:29:40 AM PDT by angkor
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To: mo

.... the zealous excesses of the King’s men with regards to the King’s subjects, had something to do with a war in 1776......

There are days when the “nonsense” I read becomes too much to bear and the thought that we should be taking up arms to put a stop to it enters my mind and then I think...YOU CAN’T FIX STUPID!


33 posted on 07/29/2007 6:38:47 AM PDT by UltraKonservativen (( YOU CAN'T FIX STUPID!!!))
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To: txdoda
So why aren't the (guilty) girls being prosecuted also. ??

Apparently because in Oregon only males can be charged with "sexual assault by butt slap".

I said it was a sick, twisted, irrational, and whimsical system, didn't I?

34 posted on 07/29/2007 6:39:29 AM PDT by angkor
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To: NonValueAdded
You don't happen to write for US News and World Report, do you? /obscure

Not recently.

35 posted on 07/29/2007 6:42:18 AM PDT by angkor
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To: goldstategop
I am beginning to think that to be a DA, you have to have a law degree and no common sense, none, nada, zilch, is that correct?

What bothers me greatly about this injustice is that other DA’s are not speaking out about what is happening to the boys.

Sort of like the Muslims not condemning Terrorist or Jihadists.

Of course Oregon is wedged between California and Washington so some of the inane silliness of these two wacko states may be rubbing off on Oregon.

36 posted on 07/29/2007 6:46:53 AM PDT by OKIEDOC (Kalifornia, a red state wannabe. I don't take Ex Lax I just read the New York Times.)
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Comment #37 Removed by Moderator

To: angkor

All football players will soon have a record?


38 posted on 07/29/2007 7:05:09 AM PDT by DUMBGRUNT (Life is Good!)
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To: goldstategop
Within the last week, my son-in-law was accused of sexual abuse, our family vacation planned for six months was cancelled, my daughter lost custody of my grandaughter, and much more.

This was because a "therapist" misunderstood what a girl told them and reported the situation to the state, and a second girl who has a history of wild false accusations against adults reported that my son-in-law "looked at her chest and she didn't like it" (whatever that means). Even that second accusation is now in doubt, but hasn't been resolved yet.

This appears as if it will go away, but even still the state agency that is heading up the charges will retain the accusations on file forever. We have yet to find out if the charges are public domain and can be discovered by future employers in some computer scan of son-in-laws records.

Children need to be protected from sexual predators, absolutely. But there needs to be some genuine sexual predation going on, and not just improbable accusations from pre-teens that know full well they have the upper hand and cannot be held accountable themselves.

In a way, this reminds me of the Victorian era, except rather than the church enforcing idiotic standards of modesty while the back alleys are full of prostitutes, instead the state is treating normal activities and obviously false accusations with deathly seriousness, while schools teach abnormal sexual practices to first graders. Some common sense is called for, and the power of bureaucrats to teach deviancy to children while other bureaucrats go on witch hunts on parents must end.

39 posted on 07/29/2007 7:08:54 AM PDT by narby
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To: savedbygrace

Given the scope of what this has all become by now, justice would be dragging the adults responsible to a public suare and hanging them.

I mean it.


40 posted on 07/29/2007 7:10:57 AM PDT by Balding_Eagle (If America falls, darkness will cover the face of the earth for a thousand years.)
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To: angkor

Last year, my wife was called in to the school.

The problem? My 9 yr old daughter had licked her fingers and chased the boys on the playground. Asked why, she replied, “I wanted to cause pandemonium, and I did.”

The school recommended psychiatric counseling. (One of the teachers, in private, told her, “Sounds like what I did when I was 9 years old.”) My wife decided on home schooling.


41 posted on 07/29/2007 7:13:09 AM PDT by Mr Rogers (I'm agnostic on evolution, but sit ups are from Hell!)
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To: DUMBGRUNT
All football players will soon have a record?

No sireee.

Any potentially gay-like behavior by male football players cannot be considered to be "sexual assault by butt slap".

42 posted on 07/29/2007 7:39:23 AM PDT by angkor
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To: Raycpa

“If Bush wanted to make a popular move and gain back some support, he should give these kids a pardon and invite them to the Whitehouse.”

Unfortunately neither is named Scooter Libby, it won’t happen.


43 posted on 07/29/2007 7:43:54 AM PDT by Leatherneck_MT (Famously frisky)
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To: goldstategop

We live in a world were children who bring a squirt gun to school are brought up on weapons charges


44 posted on 07/29/2007 7:45:55 AM PDT by mylife (The Roar Of The Masses Could Be Farts)
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To: goldstategop
Unfortunately this kind of zero-tolerance thinking is common in public schools. When my daughter was in high school, one day a boy she was friends with was being silly and basically climbed on top of her chair when they were between assignments. The students all laughed and my daughter thought nothing of it at all. They were all friends being funny in high school.

Some teacher saw it and decided it was sexual in nature. The boy got in trouble, and because my daughter did not protest and immediately report the "incident", she was prevented from attending graduation a couple of weeks later. This kind of school "justice" reminds me of the way Islam treats women who are raped. The mealy-mouthed administration said "there's nothing we can do".

45 posted on 07/29/2007 7:52:39 AM PDT by Sender (Be subtle! Be subtle! And use your squirrels for every kind of business.)
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To: goldstategop
There is a need to “purge” the radicals from the education system....we need to return to the fundamental education, and leave the social engineering at the school door....
46 posted on 07/29/2007 7:54:42 AM PDT by thinking
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To: angkor
The teachers, administrators, and even the prosecutor are performing their jobs within the guidelines established by the voting citizens of Oregon.

What? That makes no sense. Voters do not establish guidelines; they only vote for representatives who in turn establish guidelines. And they only know that they've voted badly after the fact . . . and only if they're paying attention.

47 posted on 07/29/2007 8:22:19 AM PDT by savedbygrace (SECURE THE BORDERS FIRST (I'M YELLING ON PURPOSE))
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To: goldstategop

You know, my main concern the way things are going these days is that if you swat somebody on the butt, you might give them brain damage.


48 posted on 07/29/2007 8:24:49 AM PDT by RichInOC (No! BAD Rich!)
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To: goldstategop
This is the butt-swat we got in school.
49 posted on 07/29/2007 8:33:20 AM PDT by UnklGene
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To: goldstategop
Those children should just have been given a lecture by the principle and sent home.

Don't get carried away!

50 posted on 07/29/2007 8:45:38 AM PDT by B4Ranch ( "Freedom is not free, but don't worry the U.S. Marine Corps will pay most of your share.")
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