Evangelical Split Over Israel Batters Bush

The Jerusalem Connection ^ | July-Aug, 2007 | Larry Cohler-Esses

[tabsternager]

Galatians 3:16: The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. The Scripture does not say “and to seeds,” meaning many people, but “and to your seed,” meaning one person, who is Christ.

Galatians 3:7: Understand, then, that those who believe are children of Abraham.

Galatians 3:29: If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Romans 9:8: In other words, it is not the natural children who are God’s children, but it is the children of the promise who are regarded as Abraham’s offspring.

Galatians 3:28: There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

[George W. Bush]

He's not resting, either, and it would appear that the same forces behind the lack of support (and outright opposition) of US Jews to a pro-Israel ideology is providing new anti-conservative rhetoric to the leftish evangelicals. "Writing Israel a blank check...a slavish, passionate advocacy for Israel...Israel can do no wrong...all based on a loony interpretation of Revelation" and the Zionist appellation.

Oh, dear. So would it qualify if I have posted many times that "Israel has the right to use nuclear weapons pre-emptively if her neighbors threaten her. Or merely annoy her."?

I'm not into the apocalyptic though, being content for God to fulfill His own plan on His own schedule. Hagee and his bunch truly are trying to fulfill the apocalyptic, flying around to try to preach to every last tribe who has never been evangelized since that is on the list (as though they can force God's hand). To be truly slavish, I guess I need to collect all those Left Behind books and films. Admittedly, it hasn't been to popular with other Baptists if I make frank assessments of their scriptural merits. So, being a Baptist, you don't say things like that at the potluck. Not if you want good vittles.

My position on Israel is secular. We established Israel via U.N. authority. Israel withstood her enemies repeatedly. Now she has nukes and the means to deploy them for sea launch. So the fiction of the U.N.'s recognition of Israel is now mere history to me. Especially since I consider the U.N. to be a corrupt criminal incompetent organization that is about equally anti-American and anti-Israeli. And who puts folks like Iran and Cuba and such on their Human Right Commission and expect us not to start laughing at them.

Israel needs to protect herself and ignore all these intruders, whether Euros or Americans or Jewish or Gentiles. Israel, for Israel. And no one else. Israel and America should always be friends as Britain and America are. But as an equal, not a territorial possession like Puerto Rico.

It's might be a form of antisemitism to expect Israel to bow down to American opinions, whether Gentile or Jewish. What are they, beyond the Pale? What entitles these people to treat them as some bunch of nobodies that they can just push around?

Israel needs to defend Israel, first and foremost. The rest of the world can go hang itself. The reason for Israel to exist is so no one can ever again tell the Jews what they can and cannot do in their own lands.

[Halgr]

Your welcome to your opinion...but you don’t enhance your position and the view of fellow Christian FReepers with your vanity posts.

[George W. Bush]

If you just touch the screen of your TV during the prayer, the Reverend Hagee will heal you.

Given that I am a Calvinistic Baptist, my "position" and "the view of fellow Christian FReepers" is irrelevant to my spiritual life. The indwelling of the Spirit and the presence of the Father are not, in my experience, a herd activity.

[kalee]

bttt

[juliej]

YOu don’t have to be nasty with me! I am a supporter of evangelicals! Take your ignation elsewhere.

[ColdSteelTalon]

I am not sure as to what your point is.

[SJackson]

If you'd like to be on this middle east/political ping list, please FR mail me.

High Volume. Articles on Israel can also be found by clicking on the Topic or Keyword Israel. or WOT [War on Terror]

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[Alouette]

Eric Yoffie and Abe Foxman hate Evangelicals more than they love Israel.

Evangelicals are better supporters of Israel than liberal Jews.

FReepMail to be added or removed from this pro-Israel/Judaic/Russian Jewry ping list.

Warning! This is a high-volume ping list.

[Zionist Conspirator]

Chr*stian Zionism was always about the Bible, not about realpolitik. John Hagee is to be congratulated for breaking with the current Israeli government, Bush, and AIPAC in order to stand up for an undiluted Biblical Israel.

The continual screamings about "conversionism" are silly, and this comes from someone who rejects chr*stianity and is opposed to Jews embracing it (and who would much rather see chr*stian Zionists become observant Noachides). What is this bug-bear based on? Evangelicals did not exist in Medieval Europe and no Evangelical, no matter how "missionary," is going to force anyone to convert. You may have trouble getting them to accept "no" as an answer (considering what they sincerely believe the consequences of that answer are), but they aren't going to force anyone to do anything. Meanwhile, the liberal/ecumenical Jewish embrace of the Catholic/Orthodox churches merely rubs salt in the wounds of their hostility to American (white) Protestant Fundamentalism.

Complaints about "conversionism" are even more groundless when made by people who insist on making a never-ending list of demands of internal changes in other people's religions. Do they honestly think this is better than out-and-out proselytization??? To the contrary, it's a zillion times less honorable!

The positions of such people as Hagee is not so much based on either conversionism or an "end-times scenario," but on simple Biblical sentimentalism. Why is this so hard to understand? Oh, I know. Because no one except for them actually associates the Jews with the Bible.

As for Yoffie and his ilk, Jews who want a "secular state" unconnected with Theocratic Biblical Judaism should not live in the Holy Land. From what I hear, Antarctica is pretty empty.

And as for Oslo/Gay Rights Abie suddenly defending chr*stian support of Israel, considering the things he's said about them in the past I hope he has apologized profusely and repented of his anti-Torah positions. Otherwise he can go jump in the lake. I know of no more negative stereotype of the Jewish People than Foxman (except maybe Dershowitz). Where are all those Yemenite shepherds when you need them???

[Zionist Conspirator]

I am Jewish and take my religion seriously. I would never seek to impose it on anybody else. Parshalls was off base. I want Jews to be better Jews and Christians to be better Christians.

All Jews are statutorily obligated to observe the Torah. All non-Jews are statutorily obligated to observe the Noachide Laws. All false, man-made religions are forbidden to everyone, Jew and non-Jew.

I am afraid the "super-tolerance" of authentic Judaism on this issue has been greatly exaggerated.

Don't dictate to chr*stians a list of demands of internal changes in their theology. Simply convert them to Noachism.

[Zionist Conspirator]

Eric Yoffie and Abe Foxman hate Evangelicals more than they love Israel.

Evangelicals are better supporters of Israel than liberal Jews.

'Amen ve'amen!

And what's the deal with Foxman having his photo taken with the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople? After all the invocations of medieval Eastern Europe you'd think he wouldn't do that. In fact, the Eastern Orthodox have never even "modernized" their liturgy like the Catholics have, and Foxman seems to think that's just fine!

Maybe American liberal Jews look on Orthodox chr*stians as "noble savages?" But I suspsect the real reason is that they prefer anti-Semitic chr*stians to those who associate the Jewish People with those Theocratic "neanderthals" in the Book of Joshua.

[Alouette]

Maybe American liberal Jews look on Orthodox chr*stians as "noble savages?"

They look on Islamists as "noble savages" and Evangelicals as "savages."

[Zionist Conspirator]

The problem is most people (including most Jews) don't associate the Jewish People with the Biblical Israelites. The Bible is now associated with "redneck" Southern American Protestants (and before anyone gets angry with me, I'm everything in that description except Protestant!).

To most people the Jews are the "leftwing religious dissidents" of the Middle Ages, the "unconscious critics of their time" whose ill-treatment at the hands of contemporary chr*stians is treated as a sort of liberal/pluralist "passion narrative." Essentially the Jews allegedly "paved the way for being gay" by being an oppressed minority in a chr*stian "theocratic" context. This is why liberals used to love (or at least used to claim to love) the Jews.

Meanwhile, if you actually read the Hebrew Bible you get a completely different picture of the essence of Jewishness, but then again, good liberals insist on dismissing the Bible as "mythology" so they can pretend the Jews just sort of sprang up from nowhere two thousand years ago for the specific purpose of being oppressed by chr*stians.

No wonder Fundamentalists who want to recreate Biblical Israel drive them nuts.

[Zionist Conspirator]

They look on Islamists as "noble savages" and Evangelicals as "savages."

You don't have to tell me that. But why did Foxman have his grinning puss photographed with the Patriarch of Constantinople??? What would Tevye say about that? "Oh well, at least it wasn't a Southern Baptist"???

[Halgr]

Where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.–Matt. 18:20

[safisoft]

Galatians 3:28: There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

On of the most misquoted passages. So, you not not a Gentile? People who quote this always do it with the intention of really saying, "We should have no Jews, only Gentiles."

No male, no female? My guess is that you do not apply the same standard as your perverted view of the first clause.

I thought you were going to keep your anti-Semitic theology off these threads. Bottom line, you are not free, but a slave.

[Valin]

Christians United for Israel, a major Christian Zionist group with strong ties to the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, lobbied President Bush against the two-state solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict

I see no other practical solution. Now if only the Palestinians would get on board.