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Civil Disobedience in Pennsylvania, and Cops Arrive at Raw Milk Dairy
The Complete Patient ^ | August 10, 2007 | David E. Gumpert

Posted on 08/10/2007 8:27:04 PM PDT by davidgumpert

The latest battle in the raw milk wars broke out today in south-central Pennsylvania. A group of ten state police and agents from the Pennsylvania Department of Agriculture (PDA) and the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) descended on the 100-acre Nature’s Sunlight Farm in Newville, and confiscated about $25,000 worth of raw milk products, along with packaging and equipment.

Though Pennsylvania is supposedly one of the more liberal states with regard to raw milk distribution, allowing farmers with permits to sell it not only from their farms and in farmers markets, but also in retail establishments, farmers say the state has become increasingly hostile to producers over the last few months.

(Excerpt) Read more at thecompletepatient.com ...


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Government; News/Current Events; US: Pennsylvania
KEYWORDS: agents; agriculture; cowshares; dairy; derrybrownfield; fda; foodnazis; healthypeople2010; milk; nais; rawmilk; wapf
A Pennsylvania farmer has turned state efforts to enforce raw milk regulations into a matter of principle, arguing that state regulations not endorsed by the legislature don't have the power of law. He also argues that because he sells directly to consumers, he is engaged in private transactions not covered by state regulations. He's risking much for his beliefs.
1 posted on 08/10/2007 8:27:07 PM PDT by davidgumpert
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To: davidgumpert

My Uncle George used to get the most delicious raw milk from a farmer in western Pennsylvania about 40 years ago. Served ice cold...mmmmm.


2 posted on 08/10/2007 8:33:31 PM PDT by Montanabound
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To: davidgumpert; Diana in Wisconsin

Stop trying to protect me from myself.

ARGH!

BTW, we drink raw milk and have been for about 20 years now and NEVER had a problem.


3 posted on 08/10/2007 8:34:27 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: metmom

Yup, we’ve consumed it for about 5 years, and it’s been very tasty, keeps longer than the pasteurized product, and has provided a variety of health benefits to our family.


4 posted on 08/10/2007 8:42:32 PM PDT by Think free or die
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To: Think free or die

It does keep better, although we keep our refrig at just above freezing. We turn it down until it freezes the milk, then slowly turn it up until that doesn’t happen anymore, and leave it there. We can easily get 10 days out of it.

Did you ever notice that most of the time the stuff in the stores feels somewhat warm anyway? Those milk cases just don’t seem to keep the milk very cold.


5 posted on 08/10/2007 9:18:54 PM PDT by metmom (Welfare was never meant to be a career choice.)
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To: Montanabound

This might interest you. A Campain For Real Milk.
http://www.realmilk.com


6 posted on 08/10/2007 9:24:35 PM PDT by lastchance (Hug your babies.)
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To: davidgumpert

Sigh............I remember when this was a free country.....


7 posted on 08/10/2007 9:36:11 PM PDT by no dems (Dear God, how long are you going to let Ted Kennedy, Robert Byrd and John Conyers live?)
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To: davidgumpert

bump


8 posted on 08/10/2007 9:38:58 PM PDT by VOA
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To: davidgumpert

Gosh, I’m impressed! Our government is so smart - it is an expert on medical procedures, diet, education, and even MILK production! B/ sarcasm


9 posted on 08/10/2007 9:42:56 PM PDT by Libertina
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To: davidgumpert

Nanny government at its worst. :-(

Raw milk is more healthful and delicious than its pasteurized cousin.


10 posted on 08/10/2007 9:55:52 PM PDT by VictoryGal (Never give up, never surrender!)
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To: VictoryGal

Pasteurization messes up everything. Beer and apple cider taste awful once they’ve been pasteurized.


11 posted on 08/10/2007 10:04:50 PM PDT by j. earl carter
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To: VictoryGal

I don’t think that is true, at least the healthful part. If these people want to risk ecoli and other bacterium that is up to them I suppose. I am not sure why they would raid this dairy but if they have broken no law and people want to drink it, it’s fine with me. But as I know, raw milk is no more healthful than pasteurized and of there is no health benefit, why risk it?


12 posted on 08/10/2007 10:40:49 PM PDT by WildcatClan (One vote, Three choices: 1) Socialism 2) Bush Redux 3) DUNCAN HUNTER)
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To: davidgumpert

That’s going on the next county.


13 posted on 08/11/2007 4:11:11 AM PDT by Nextrush
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To: jahp; kalee; slowry; redhead; Conservativegreatgrandma; sissyjane; ReagansShinyHair; Blue Eyes; ...
A Nutrition Ping List
For Those Interested in the Research
of Dr. Weston A. Price

distressing news

14 posted on 08/11/2007 6:59:52 AM PDT by Lil'freeper (You do not have the plug-in required to view this tagline.)
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To: All

Another raw milk family here (3 years now) and I cant even begin to list the positive health benefits this wonderful living food has given us.

Why are our police and federal agencies not focusing on the illegal immigrants and muslim terrorists? Bessie and Farmer John arent harming anybody but the dairy industry’s pocketbooks.


15 posted on 08/11/2007 7:59:17 AM PDT by CitadelArmyJag ("Tolerance is the virtue of the man with no convictions" G. K. Chesterton)
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To: WildcatClan

Pasteurization was a real boon in the days where refrigeration was an iffy prospect at best. And if you don’t choose a dairy you trust then there could be issues with raw milk, so people have to be aware and informed. But raw milk, appropriately handled, has enzymes and components denatured or destroyed by pasteurization, thus more healthful.


16 posted on 08/11/2007 8:06:19 AM PDT by VictoryGal (Never give up, never surrender!)
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To: davidgumpert; Lil'freeper

Thanks for the ping Lil’freeper.

Anytime that you market anything that puts doctors and pharmacists out of business, the thugs are going to come and break down your doors.

The U.N. charter demands that 2/3 of the worlds population be killed off, and this operation in Pennsylvania is typical of compliance efforts in that regard. It’s going to get worse.


17 posted on 08/11/2007 9:45:05 AM PDT by editor-surveyor (Turning the general election into a second Democrat primary is not a winning strategy.)
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To: WildcatClan; VictoryGal
"But as I know, raw milk is no more healthful than pasteurized and of there is no health benefit"

Unfortunately, what you 'know' simply isn't true. Pasteurized products are all, at best, dead products that were once edible. It is a wholely destructive process that is unnecessary. God does it right, and man does it wrong, every time.

18 posted on 08/11/2007 9:50:53 AM PDT by editor-surveyor (Turning the general election into a second Democrat primary is not a winning strategy.)
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To: VictoryGal; editor-surveyor

As I said victorygal, if you see some benefit and feel they outweigh the risks you should be able to have all the raw milk you want. I totally agree with you about finding a good dairy but no matter how good, you still are risking listeria, ecoli, and any other number of bacterium. The consumers of raw milk “feel” there is a benefit and if they do then I have no problem with that. I just pointed out there is no science to support these feelings and, on the contrary, pasteurized milk has vitamins A and D added so I would think it is as healthful if not more until I see science that proves otherwise. Children, the elderly and any with compromised immune systems are more vulnerable to the bacterium and many get sick and sadly, there are deaths documented in that regard.

I’ve drank raw milk and never got sick as I know, but it can and will happen, it’s just a matter of odds and conditionals.

That’s just me, enjoy your milk in whatever permutation you choose, as is your right.

Regards,
A confessed chocomilkoholic


19 posted on 08/11/2007 3:02:31 PM PDT by WildcatClan (One vote, Three choices: 1) Socialism 2) Bush Redux 3) DUNCAN HUNTER)
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To: davidgumpert

Not quite to this extent, but something similar happened to a dairy here in Arizona after it had government approval. The union was suing for contract violations.


20 posted on 08/11/2007 6:36:18 PM PDT by HungarianGypsy
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To: VictoryGal

Raw milk is great! Probably wouldn’t be so expensive in some areas if not for the government. I have to deal with the milk water instead, since our family of seven cannot afford a lot of milk at $9 a gallon.


21 posted on 08/11/2007 6:38:06 PM PDT by HungarianGypsy
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To: j. earl carter

Did you hear that raw almonds are now required to be pasteurized also?


22 posted on 08/11/2007 6:39:05 PM PDT by HungarianGypsy
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To: HungarianGypsy; j. earl carter
"Did you hear that raw almonds are now required to be pasteurized also?"

This is going to sound like a tinfoil hat party, but there is a definate reason why they want to destroy raw almonds, in fact two reasons that are very much related. Raw almonds have trace amounts of amygdalin in them, and amygdalin cures several forms of cancer very quickly. Heating destroys the amygdalin, rendering the almonds worthless for nutrition purposes. Heating also kills the germ of the almond, so that it will not sprout and become a wild almond tree. Wild almonds have massive amounts of amygdalin; even enough that they are still nutritious after a light roasting, so the medical gestapo wants to prevent them from growing.

23 posted on 08/11/2007 8:37:24 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Turning the general election into a second Democrat primary is not a winning strategy.)
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To: WildcatClan
"I’ve drank raw milk and never got sick as I know, but it can and will happen, it’s just a matter of odds and conditionals."

What you don't know can hurt you. First, the dairies that produce the raw milk are far cleaner than those that produce the pasteurized milk, and they feed their cows real food, i.e. green grass, alfalfa, oats, rather than silage made from other animals that have died from disease, any form of waste celulose, spoiled dairy products, spoiled produce, stale bakery goods, waste crushed seed from vegetable oil production, and ground up green waste from rsidential garbage pickup as all the others do. They also raise most of their own animals, and quarantine the animals that they purchase outside for months. Illness from consumption of commercial raw dairy products is extremely rare, almost to the point of nonexistence, as opposed to regular dairy products that produce thousands of illnesses per year. Much of the difference is due to the amount of care taken in handling the raw product, which is essentially absent in the regular dairies. Regular dairies are foul, disgusting places.

24 posted on 08/11/2007 9:02:06 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Turning the general election into a second Democrat primary is not a winning strategy.)
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To: davidgumpert

Raw milk is the new marijuana.


25 posted on 08/11/2007 9:07:36 PM PDT by Rb ver. 2.0 (eHarmony reject)
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To: davidgumpert
Right on, David. The benefits and risks aside, this is a rights issue for both farmers and consumers.

Also, the increased harassment of small dairy farmers in PA isn't surprising given the fact that Sec. of Ag., Dennis Wolff is a 500+ head dairy farmer and Director of Food Safety Bill Chirdon's former employer is Dean Foods. Safety, my arse.

The fact is, Big Dairy will never be able to match the quality and safety standards of sustainable, grass-based dairy farms. The raw milk market is one that responsible stewards of land and animal will be able to exploit. Big Dairy doesn't like this, if the National Dairy Council's worn "Russian roulette" warning is any indication. Grain-based, confinement dairies simply cannot compete - and they know it. The scare-mongoring may have worked twenty years ago but this is the age of Google and more and more consumers are connecting the dots themselves.

A good place to start, for those just learning about the benefits of raw milk, is http://raw-milk-facts.com and Ron Schmid's book, The Untold Story of Milk. Here's a free download of Chapter 15 - The Safety of Raw versus Pasteurized Milk and Appendix A - A Reply to US FDA's Statement on Raw Milk.

Fanna

26 posted on 08/22/2007 10:44:43 AM PDT by Fanna Raw
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To: WildcatClan

People have been drinking raw milk since the beginning. There seems to be as much risk with pasturized milk as raw.


27 posted on 08/22/2007 10:50:15 AM PDT by oneamericanvoice (Support freedom! Support the troops! Surrender is not an option!)
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To: oneamericanvoice
That's right. Ron's book has an excellent exposition on the history of pasteurization in our country. Thanks, in large part to the unsanitary conditions, inhumane treatment of cows and their attending ill health at distillery dairies of the late 19th and early 20th century, unhealthy milk was the result and therefore, affected the health of the growing population of cities quite negatively, especially children and the pasteurization movement gained steam.

Even today, with stricter standards of safety, you couldn't pay me to drink raw milk from grain-based, confinement dairies.

28 posted on 08/22/2007 11:13:26 AM PDT by Fanna Raw
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To: Fanna Raw

While I am all for personal freedom, please don’t make the mistake that I think “distillery dairies”, as you called them, are the bastions of illness, unsanitary conditions, and mistreatment. Dairymen from both sides have no reason to be unsanitary as it leads to illness amongs the cows, or mistreat the source of their livelyhood. They, on the other hand, understand that the cows are not pets.

I grew up drinking pasturized milk, and don’t know of any attending illness caused by it. However, I’ll bet there are those that couldn’t/wouldn’t attribute illness to drinking raw milk either.


29 posted on 08/22/2007 3:19:25 PM PDT by oneamericanvoice (Support freedom! Support the troops! Surrender is not an option!)
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To: Fanna Raw
Uh, okay.

Welcome to Free Republic.
30 posted on 08/22/2007 3:36:47 PM PDT by beezdotcom
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To: beezdotcom

Thanks, great to be here.


31 posted on 08/22/2007 5:44:44 PM PDT by Fanna Raw
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To: oneamericanvoice
"While I am all for personal freedom, please don’t make the mistake that I think “distillery dairies”, as you called them, are the bastions of illness, unsanitary conditions, and mistreatment."

I should clarify, from Ron Schmid's book, The Untold Story of Milk that distillery dairies of the 19th and early 20th century produced raw milk for public consumption, not for pasteurization, at least not initially. Clearly, there were other contributing factors to the high mortality rates during that period, but the role distillery dairies played cannot be ignored, nor it's catalytic role in producing many states restrictions on raw milk sales and consumption today.

The distillery owners back then got into the dairy business by housing cows right next to their distilleries. The cows were not grass-fed (not even grain-fed for that matter), but rather, were fed hot slop waste straight from the stills. The cows were basically milked to death, regardless of what ailments they may have had due to their poor diet and filthy living conditions.

No healthy raw milk could have come from these cows. The milk these distillery dairies produced was so inferior that it had a pale blue hue and additives like chalk, flour, sugar and even plaster of Paris were added to improve consistency and color. Butter and cheese were impossible to make with this slop milk.

In any case, it's an obvious point that food producers should have impeccible sanitary conditions. My farmer doesn't treat his herd like pets, but rather, understands the basic principle that cows, given their natural diet and spending the majority of their days outdoors are healthy cows and healthy cows produce the best milk.

I too grew up on pasteurized milk and never got sick - but people do. Only 1.2% of reported cases of foodborne illnesses are attributed to dairy (at least in 2002). I surmise most of these are from pasteurized sources given how small a market raw milk currently is. Does the safety card really justify the unreasonable roadblocks between farmers and consumers though? Of the 76 million cases of foodborne illnesses reported to the CDC each year (so much for regulations keeping our food supply safe), shouldn't our regulators focus their efforts on the top five offenders: fish, produce, poultry, eggs and beef?

32 posted on 08/22/2007 5:45:52 PM PDT by Fanna Raw
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To: Fanna Raw

Thank you for clarification.

We shouldn’t equate the dairies of the 19th & 20th century with those of today for obvious reasons. The dairies of today don’t resemble those earlier dairies. Nice history lesson though.

Agreed. Dairies should have impeccable sanitary conditions, and I believe they do. It would be counter productive to do otherwise.

I have to disagree with your proposal that the regulators focus on the top five, because milk is such a staple.


33 posted on 08/22/2007 6:03:20 PM PDT by oneamericanvoice (Support freedom! Support the troops! Surrender is not an option!)
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To: oneamericanvoice

You’re quite welcome. Actually though, pasteurized dairy isn’t such a staple food with the majority of the population. Lactose intolerance affects nearly 95% of Asian Americans, 74% of Native Americans, 70% of African Americans, 53% of Mexican Americans, and 15% of Caucasians.

In fact, since consuming raw milk/dairy for almost two years now, my lactose intolerance, or rather, my lactase deficiency has all but disappeared.

I do agree that dairies producing for public consumption should be regulated, however, regulators have no right interfering with direct farm sales to private consumers.


34 posted on 08/22/2007 8:20:11 PM PDT by Fanna Raw
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