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Experts: For many gays, public sex means privacy
Seattle Times ^ | August 30 07 | Idaho Stateman

Posted on 08/30/2007 9:42:09 PM PDT by freedomdefender

Many men who solicit sex in public places often are conflicted sexually and seek sex in those locations to maintain anonymity, psychiatric experts say.

Dr. Fred Berlin, an associate professor of psychiatry at Johns Hopkins Medical School in Baltimore, compared homosexual sex at public places with heterosexual men who go to secret parts of town to solicit prostitutes and to drug addicts who find dealers on street corners away from their neighborhoods.

"This is not as complicated as people think," Berlin said. "It is often a case of people with very strong sexual cravings that are difficult to resist, people who are very conflicted and struggling" with their feelings and the stigma of embarrassment of having family members or the community find out.

(Excerpt) Read more at seattletimes.nwsource.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Front Page News
KEYWORDS: homophobia; homosexualagenda; homosexuals; likesavage; mentalillness; perversion; perverts; publicnudity; whypostthis
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I call B.S. Bathroom sex is part of the gay lifestyle. It's part of the pervsion, part of the rush, not a response to societal pressure.
1 posted on 08/30/2007 9:42:11 PM PDT by freedomdefender
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To: freedomdefender
seek sex in those locations to maintain anonymity

Sex in public bathrooms to maintain privacy. Right.

2 posted on 08/30/2007 9:42:54 PM PDT by freedomdefender
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To: freedomdefender

And bank robbers wear a mask to preserve their “anonymity”. That still doesn’t make it right.


3 posted on 08/30/2007 9:45:26 PM PDT by glorgau
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To: freedomdefender
Icky perverts.
4 posted on 08/30/2007 9:47:36 PM PDT by SIDENET (More fun than a beer left in the freezer.)
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To: freedomdefender
It's part of the pervsion, part of the rush, not a response to societal pressure.

Thanks for letting us know and sharing.

5 posted on 08/30/2007 9:50:02 PM PDT by Rudder
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To: freedomdefender

It’s how homosexuals catch and spread all their diseases.


6 posted on 08/30/2007 9:50:13 PM PDT by donna (...gay couples raising kids. That's the American way... -Mitt Romney)
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To: freedomdefender
Well, of course. Now, Freepers, please be careful in all of this discussion not to offend either libertarians or those who believe that nobody has the right to impose their own moral standard on others.

Please, Christians, be understanding of the rest of America which believes that standards and morality are only private matters to decide, and that America’s moral code was never influenced by biblical morality. Please be patient with compatriots who believe that the Separation Clause of the First Amendment means that Christianity cannot be allowed to influence anything in our land at all.

Be longsuffering, please with those who believe that our founding father’s mind set was not heavily that of biblicist Christianity.

7 posted on 08/30/2007 9:54:17 PM PDT by John Leland 1789
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To: freedomdefender

A disgusting, repulsive, and disease-ridden lifestyle that is a gross perversion. Just another example.

By the way, how is Nancy Pelosi’s constituency???


8 posted on 08/30/2007 9:55:37 PM PDT by EagleUSA
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To: freedomdefender
Dr. Fred Berlin... compared homosexual sex at public places with heterosexual men who go to secret parts of town to solicit prostitutes and to drug addicts who find dealers on street corners away from their neighborhoods.

And to university professors who hide in their tenured bubbles on campuses all over the world, where they are paid to endlessly psychobabble on topics they know nothing about.

9 posted on 08/30/2007 9:55:51 PM PDT by SteveMcKing
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To: John Leland 1789

What the hell are you talking about?


10 posted on 08/30/2007 9:57:47 PM PDT by SteveMcKing
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To: SteveMcKing
And to university professors who hide in their tenured bubbles on campuses all over the world, where they are paid to endlessly psychobabble on topics they know nothing about.

Your opinons about Dr. Berlin sound bigoted.*

*Blindly and obstinately attached to some creed or opinion and intolerant toward others.

11 posted on 08/30/2007 10:00:19 PM PDT by Rudder
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To: freedomdefender
This whole damn thing might be solved, to some extent, in the future, IF THE U.S.A. WOULD ADOPT JAPANESE-STYLE PUBLIC TOILET CONSTRUCTION.

What IS IT with American public toilets anyways that have this huge open space between stalls under the dividers, some up very high, maybe even to one-foot high, and you can see the feet and hear the business of the other person next to you doing their business, and facilitates such nonsense as the gay "tap code"?

Not to mention these huge cracks in the stall door, sometimes as wide as two inches, where you can look in on someone and they vice-versa. Ever heard of knocking to see if it is being used??

In Japan, toilet stalls are constructed with dividers 100% clear down to the floor, and in many cases right up to the ceiling, completely enclosed, with complete privacy. The stall doors and jambs also have no gaps between them, so you cannot see in side either.

The only way a rope-sucker is going to get the specific attention of the fellow gay in the next stall is going to be through calling out his filthy desire, which none of those perverts will do for fear of an arrest, or worse yet for them, the prompt delivery of a knuckle sandwich to them by any normal person.

Also, make toilet stalls even more narrow and smaller so only one person can get inside. (Americans on the average will have to lose a lot of weight to be comfortable).

I think all of this to some extent may well put a stop to George Michael-type "cruising" in toilets, on the other hand, watch the American heroin addicts enjoy all that new found "privacy".

Of course the drawback to Japanese restrooms is that, for the urinals at least, often many of them are in clear view from the street!! (At least you can see a stall wall. See, it is clear down to the floor and nearly up to the ceiling! But if you run out of toilet paper and need a break, sorry, out of luck!)


12 posted on 08/30/2007 10:01:05 PM PDT by AmericanInTokyo (Visit this thread 1-hour from now. In that time, an average of 416.6 more ILLEGALS will be in the US)
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To: AmericanInTokyo

I remember visiting Germany when I was in Jr. High, and going into the men’s room - where you’d see elderly cleaning ladies cleaning and mopping, oblivious to the men and they were oblivious to the cleaning ladies. For a suburban American kid, it was a weird experience.


13 posted on 08/30/2007 10:05:45 PM PDT by freedomdefender
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To: freedomdefender; TigersEye
"I think the main goal is for those people to meet like-minded people," Nevada psychiatrist Sally Skewis said.

Meeting strangers in a public toilet sounds nasty to me. I would get awfully upset if someone rubbed feet with me or made advances for sex to me while I was using one... In fact I might shove their head into a toilet. I hope its just a guy thing because I have issues enough with public restrooms as it is. Its a nasty dirty place to be having sex anyway.

14 posted on 08/30/2007 10:05:47 PM PDT by pandoraou812 ( zero tolerance to the will of Allah ...... dilligaf? with an efg.....)
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To: pandoraou812

Public toilets not infrequently are gross enough, typically, with dirt and splashes of “water” on the floor - the idea of men making passes at each other, on top of the unsanitary conditions already there, makes me gag.


15 posted on 08/30/2007 10:08:02 PM PDT by freedomdefender
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To: freedomdefender

Yep it is societies fault.

Poor misunderstood perverts.They have uncontrollable desires just like my dog does.


16 posted on 08/30/2007 10:11:54 PM PDT by biscuit jane
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To: pandoraou812

Several times in my life a stranger in the next stall has asked for TP, and I have handed some over. Now that is illegal invasion of space. Go figure. It’s for the children, I hear.


17 posted on 08/30/2007 10:12:37 PM PDT by ClaireSolt (Have you have gotten mixed up in a mish-masher?)
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To: freedomdefender
For many addicts, burglary is "working a job".

these people are trying to change reality by redefining language. It doesn't fly, and it makes them look stupid.

18 posted on 08/30/2007 10:13:17 PM PDT by MrEdd (Keeping my foot on the necks of liberals since 1980.)
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To: freedomdefender

I can just see some perv making a pass at my husband. He really would flip out and stick the perv’s head in the toilet. And beat the cr@p out of him. In fact all the guys I know would beat such a person up badly. I think these perv’s must be very stupid. I really have no clue why one would take the chance of getting beat up for sex. Is that part of the “rush”? If so they sicker then I thought.


19 posted on 08/30/2007 10:13:35 PM PDT by pandoraou812 ( zero tolerance to the will of Allah ...... dilligaf? with an efg.....)
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To: freedomdefender
That happens all the time in Japan. Happened just the other day. Cleaning women often enter men's restrooms in Japan while they are still in operation--not shutting them down for cleaning--and nobody so much as bats an eye. It is indeed a cultural difference.
20 posted on 08/30/2007 10:14:30 PM PDT by AmericanInTokyo (Visit this thread 1-hour from now. In that time, an average of 416.6 more ILLEGALS will be in the US)
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To: ClaireSolt
I have handed paper down to someone too lol. Now I really hope this is a guy thing because I dont want to get involved with any women pervs. Seriously I don’t like using restrooms as it is...Now I have this to worry about? EWWWW! I hate to be rude to anyone but I think I am going to play deaf & ignore them , & get out of the restroom asap ...lmao ~P~
21 posted on 08/30/2007 10:18:18 PM PDT by pandoraou812 ( zero tolerance to the will of Allah ...... dilligaf? with an efg.....)
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To: freedomdefender
Dr. Fred Berlin, an associate professor of psychiatry at Johns Hopkins Medical School in Baltimore, compared homosexual sex at public places with heterosexual men who go to secret parts of town to solicit prostitutes and to drug addicts who find dealers on street corners away from their neighborhoods.

Does the good professor think that any of these behaviors are acceptable?

22 posted on 08/30/2007 10:18:19 PM PDT by w1andsodidwe
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To: freedomdefender
"It is often a case of people with very strong sexual cravings that are difficult to resist, people who are very conflicted and struggling" with their feelings and the stigma of embarrassment of having family members or the community find out.'

So they have sex publicly? I'm lost.... Seems to me it's just a sissified excuse for inexcusable behavior.

23 posted on 08/30/2007 10:19:34 PM PDT by Hi Heels (Cleverly disguised as a responsible adult)
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To: pandoraou812
I would get awfully upset if someone rubbed feet with me or made advances for sex to me while I was using one.

This brings up a point. If you read the police report on Smoking Gun, you see that the officer mentions making eye contact through the gaps in the stall door before Craig entered the adjacent stall. This was the actual "initial contact" and it is what egged Craig on, and explains why he persisted with the tapping etc.

The report doesn't say, "I made eye contact", but it does say that "I saw his blue eyes". He's indicating that Craig was peering into his stall, but if he saw his blue eyes, he was making eye contact!

These sorts of stings are on firm legal ground, but by any kind of common sense understanding, they are certainly "entrapment".

24 posted on 08/30/2007 10:23:11 PM PDT by dr_lew
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To: John Leland 1789

Don’t forget about not offending Bill O’Really...


25 posted on 08/30/2007 10:23:59 PM PDT by weegee (NO THIRD TERM. America does not need another unconstitutional Clinton co-presidency.)
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To: Rudder; SteveMcKing

is that a serious post?


26 posted on 08/30/2007 10:25:13 PM PDT by wardaddy (America.....the beginning of the end as we know it probably)
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To: w1andsodidwe
Does the good professor think that any of these behaviors are acceptable?

Apparently. As they used to say, "PhD" means "piled higher and deeper."

27 posted on 08/30/2007 10:25:35 PM PDT by freedomdefender
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To: John Leland 1789

I understand you.


28 posted on 08/30/2007 10:25:50 PM PDT by wardaddy (America.....the beginning of the end as we know it probably)
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To: AmericanInTokyo

The difference between American vs. Japanese restrooms might be explained by cost. It’s probably cheaper to buy stalls with partial dividers. If I owned a business, I would want to install the type you described - with dividers from the floor to the ceiling and without gaps in the doors - but it might be too expensive.

I’ll tell you, I don’t like sending my young sons into public men’s rooms to use urinals that are open for everyone to see. Urinals should be enclosed, too. (Between the germs and this weird stuff going on, I worry about sending them in there at all, as do many other parents.)

Personally, I prefer the “family” restrooms. The whole family goes in and locks the door to outsiders. There’s a toilet, a sink, a diaper changing station, in one private room.

P.S. We don’t seem to have the same problems in the women’s rooms, at least as far as I’ve noticed, anyway.


29 posted on 08/30/2007 10:30:58 PM PDT by Tired of Taxes (Dad, I will always think of you.)
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To: dr_lew
Well from what I’ve heard some places in cities actually have holes in the sides of the walls for the men to stick it through. IMO thats disgusting not to mention it can spread STD’s, AIDS & whatever else they have. If there were complaints on harassment from pervs toward normal men & the cop was there checking things out IMO he was doing his job. IMO if you can’t use a restroom without a perv coming on to you then the cop belonged there to protect the normal men. I don’t care if you want to call it entrapment. Normal people shouldn’t have to be exposed to some creep sticking his foot into your stall or peeking into it either.
30 posted on 08/30/2007 10:31:11 PM PDT by pandoraou812 ( zero tolerance to the will of Allah ...... dilligaf? with an efg.....)
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Note: In the family restrooms, the toilet is enclosed in a stall, too.


31 posted on 08/30/2007 10:32:36 PM PDT by Tired of Taxes (Dad, I will always think of you.)
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To: Tired of Taxes
Fascinating to see how the other half, well, "lives".

Good suggestions and thoughts. Take care, Good night.

32 posted on 08/30/2007 10:32:53 PM PDT by AmericanInTokyo (Visit this thread 1-hour from now. In that time, an average of 416.6 more ILLEGALS will be in the US)
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To: AmericanInTokyo

The stall walls stop short of the floor to make it easier to clean and mop the floor. Public restroom toilets do not touch the floor for the same reason. They are mounted on the wall instead.

What I don’t understand is why we have undercover cops trolling restrooms for gays. I’m a straight guy and i would never think of calling the cops if some homo tapped his foot at me in a restroom. I’d just ignore it. If the idiot got too persistent, he’d have to answer for it with his fists, provided a few choice swear words did not back him down right dam quick.

Nothing about this story makes a lick of sense to me.


33 posted on 08/30/2007 10:33:02 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: freedomdefender
This is not as complicated as people think," Berlin said. "It is often a case of people with very strong sexual cravings that are difficult to resist..."

Damn straight it's not complicated -- you've got a right hand, use it! Saves lots of time, money, embarassment, legal problems...

34 posted on 08/30/2007 10:33:38 PM PDT by jiggyboy (Ten per cent of poll respondents are either lying or insane)
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To: pandoraou812

Lets “think out of the stall” creatively, and see ways to design public restrooms in the USA to discourage this kinda nonsense then!


35 posted on 08/30/2007 10:34:10 PM PDT by AmericanInTokyo (Visit this thread 1-hour from now. In that time, an average of 416.6 more ILLEGALS will be in the US)
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To: freedomdefender

I wish they would get real.


36 posted on 08/30/2007 10:36:00 PM PDT by freekitty (May the eagles long fly over our beautiful and free American sky.)
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To: pandoraou812

I’ve been told that gay men fight eachother more often and more severely than straight men fight eachother.


37 posted on 08/30/2007 10:36:46 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: Hi Heels
So they have sex publicly? I'm lost.... Seems to me it's just a sissified excuse for inexcusable behavior.

I agree...I think that is plain nasty & if one gets beat up for it then he rightly deserves it too. I think I am lost too with this. I never thought someone putting their hand down for paper might be a perv wanting sex. I truly hope this is a guy thing.

38 posted on 08/30/2007 10:36:50 PM PDT by pandoraou812 ( zero tolerance to the will of Allah ...... dilligaf? with an efg.....)
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To: freedomdefender
Does the good professor think that any of these behaviors are acceptable?

No.

39 posted on 08/30/2007 10:38:44 PM PDT by Rudder
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To: Tired of Taxes
" I don’t like sending my young sons into public men’s rooms to use urinals that are open for everyone to see. "

Unfortunately, that's because we haven't enforced codes of proper social conduct. Now we have to worry about the person across the table, or in this case, the stall.

40 posted on 08/30/2007 10:38:59 PM PDT by endthematrix (He was shouting 'Allah!' but I didn't hear that. It just sounded like a lot of crap to me.)
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To: pandoraou812
I don’t care if you want to call it entrapment.

You should say, "I don't care if it IS entrapment." because, you know, it is.

BTW, I agree entirely with your POV that this is a completely legitimate police function, and that we as a society should not tolerate this sort of activity in public restrooms, and so on.

But still, I think that the police report shows that the officer was at pains to minimize the degree to which he made indications to Craig ( and to others he encountered in this line of duty ) that he would be receptive to such advances as Craig was then encouraged to make. If they didn't do this, they wouldn't catch anybody!

The Law lies to itself, just as everybody else does.

41 posted on 08/30/2007 10:39:48 PM PDT by dr_lew
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To: pandoraou812

“...cop belonged there to protect the normal men.”
~~~~~~~

I don’t understand why “normal” men need protecting. Can’t they protect themselves? It’s just a few homos for crying out loud.


42 posted on 08/30/2007 10:40:53 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: mamelukesabre

Many years ago my hairdresser was gay & he was very nice. We got to be friends and shopping with him was better then shopping with my girlfriends. He was very dramatic and was always having hissy fits over the littlest things with his “other”. If they want to fight it doesn’t bother me. I just wish they would get out of the bathroom & back into the closet. I do not understand why they even call themselves Gay..Most seem pretty unhappy & strange to me.


43 posted on 08/30/2007 10:42:38 PM PDT by pandoraou812 ( zero tolerance to the will of Allah ...... dilligaf? with an efg.....)
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To: dr_lew

True. Its a really sad day when you can’t go to the bathroom in peace.


44 posted on 08/30/2007 10:48:22 PM PDT by pandoraou812 ( zero tolerance to the will of Allah ...... dilligaf? with an efg.....)
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To: mamelukesabre

Because if a normal man hits a Gay man the normal man is going to get arrested for some crazy named hate crime. Let me ask you if some man started rubbing his foot under the stall against yours what would you do? If I were a man & I was peeing I would aim it at that foot as a warning . But maybe it would be a turn on though to the perv...Seems to me the normal thing would to beat the cr@p out of the perv. I think the pervs have the upper hand. You are d@mned if you do anything. If you call a cop you are picking on them . If you hit them you are going to jail. All they do is whine & moan. I wish they would get back into the closet & shut up. I am really sick of gays.


45 posted on 08/30/2007 10:55:32 PM PDT by pandoraou812 ( zero tolerance to the will of Allah ...... dilligaf? with an efg.....)
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To: John Leland 1789

Good. Tell us what sect of Christianity we should base our laws on if we’re going to become a Christian based nation.


46 posted on 08/30/2007 11:05:09 PM PDT by TypeZoNegative (Trinidad&Tobago: Proof that a Muslim minority (5%pop) causes a majority of a country's problems.)
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To: pandoraou812
"I think the main goal is for those people to meet like-minded people," Nevada psychiatrist Sally Skewis said.

And people wonder why I don't like shrinks. Ever wonder why psychiatrists have such a high suicide rate? They're nuts!

As for the public toilet pervs; stick your hand under my stall and you may not draw it back with as many fingers. I carry a folding knife for a reason ya know.

47 posted on 08/30/2007 11:05:19 PM PDT by TigersEye (This is the age of the death of reason.)
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To: SteveMcKing

“What the hell are you talking about?”


Oh, just stick around.


48 posted on 08/30/2007 11:05:57 PM PDT by John Leland 1789
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To: weegee

Help! Offending O’Reilly is like stepping on the toes of a statue of Mary!


49 posted on 08/30/2007 11:07:18 PM PDT by John Leland 1789
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To: TypeZoNegative

“Tell us what sect of Christianity we should base our laws on if we’re going to become a Christian based nation.”


We’re not. We were, but we are not, and we shall never be again. You can now only look for declension in morals and spiritual things, which will, by-and-by turn our land over to the perverts, and then to the wrath of God.


50 posted on 08/30/2007 11:13:12 PM PDT by John Leland 1789
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