Skip to comments.Miami Police Given Choice of Carrying Assault Rifles
Posted on 09/16/2007 8:54:03 PM PDT by neverdem
MIAMI, Sept. 16 (AP) Patrol officers here will have the option of carrying assault rifles as they try to combat the rise in the use of similar weapons by criminals, the citys police chief said Sunday.
The chief, John F. Timoney, approved the policy last week, before a Miami-Dade police officer was killed on Thursday in a shootout with a man wielding an assault rifle.
This is something we do not do with any relish, Chief Timoney said. We do this reluctantly.
The policy had been under review for about a year after officers began seeing an increase in the weapons in the hands of criminals, the chief said.
Officers interested in the guns will have to undergo two days of training and be certified in their use. The Police Department does not yet have money to buy the assault rifles, and if officers want to use them immediately they will have to pay for them, Chief Timoney said.
Years ago, law enforcement specialists like SWAT teams were the only officers to carry assault weapons, but now even some small town police agencies are arming officers with the AR-15, a civilian version of the military M-16 rifle.
Patrol officers in Danbury, Conn., have been allowed to carry the weapons since 2003. Police departments in Merced, Calif., and Waterloo, Iowa, have put them in all patrol vehicles for several years. In Stillwater, Okla., about 70 miles west of Tulsa, every patrol officer is issued an AR-15.
Officers in Los Angeles have been equipped with the weapons since a 1997 gunfight outside a bank where police officers were out-gunned by a man armed...
The Miami Police Department said 15 of its 79 homicides last year involved assault weapons. This year, 12 of the 60 homicides have involved the high-power guns...
(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...
He said it with a straight face no doubt.
Sounds good to me.
If they believe they are facing a narco-terrorist insurgency, why don’t they call out the National Guard?
The military should respond to armies foreign and domestic.
So...exactly what is the Time’s definition of “Assault Rifle”, and “High Power Weapon”. They seem to be using the terms interchangeably in the last sentence.
Someone set up us the bomb.
Timoney is extremely anti-gun and supported the Klinton AWBan , but yet now he finds it reasonable for his police to carry these “ evil weapons “ .
I love the irony of it all ....
It was an AP story. Regardless, the folks in the MSM are fairly clueless about all firearms.
So how does this work? They keep it in their cruiser rack and deploy it when needed? Or go to every disturbing the peace call with a two point sling and 5.56 chest rig?
Mag changes are difficult under the best of circumstances. Fortunately, I get to put rounds through a lot of the new weapons. The 6.8 SPC is really impressive. I was surprised.
I tend to agree with you. Anyone who favors a more militarized police force please see New Orleans. They would probably just use their assault rifles to confiscate the Law abiding citizen’s cache, although I am a bit pessimistic.
Every department I know keeps their rifles in a cruiser rack or in a case in the trunk.
I’ve got no problem with officers having access to the correct weapon for the job.
Unfortunately, this is all too common amongst the authoritarian type. Government good, public bad.
I have a T/C barrel for my G2 carbine in 6.8. Better trajectory/ballistics than the 30-30. I use it for deer.
They need to go back to carrying shotguns in the front of the car. If it's too long then carry a collapsing stock version. HiStandard used to make a nasty looking bullpup shotgun.
That would ruin your day.
Found this article online at the POLICE Magazine web site:
Fighting with a Carbine
Its not enough to have a patrol rifle in your trunk; you need to train to shoot it fast and on target.
by R.K. Campbell
Old West sheriffs and marshals often carried a Colt .45 called the Peacemaker. But that .45 had the limitations of all handguns, so savvy Western lawmen also kept a short-barreled repeating rifle like a Winchester in their saddle bags. They knew that in a real gunfight, a carbine is the real peace maker.
Today, cops are putting carbines back in their saddle bags, uh the trunks of their patrol cars.
A number of critical events in the past 10 years have made the patrol carbine a desirable complement to the peace officers pistol and shotgun. The complacent era in which police officers patrolled only with a pistol started to come to an end in the fire and smoke of such infamous incidents as North Hollywood and Columbine.
A lot of police agencies also started adding rifles or pistol-caliber carbines to their lists of approved tools following the 9/11 attacks. After all, its likely that if terrorists engage in a firefight with American police officers that they will be very well armed, possibly outfitted with body armor, and capable of firing accurately at more than 100 yards. As we all know, a pistol would be next to useless in such a long-range fight against armored subjects.
There are those who say that the need for a rifle in patrol operations is easy to overstate and that its likely to sit in the trunk a long time before you use it. Theyre pretty much right. But heres the counter to that argument. When you need a rifle on patrol, you need it really badly. And you and the public you serve would be endangered because you dont have one...
Rest of article at
This despite the fact that the AP Stylebook has a whole special section on firearms.
...But of course, these terms have been redefined from what they really mean.
As would many pistol-cartridge carbines...
If one is going to carry in the trunk, it doesn't make a lot of sense to me to have a carbine, but of course, that depends on the jurisdiction.
Interesting. I live is a small town in a very rural area and the police here have been patrolling with “assault weapons”(in this case they are really REALLY assault weapons) on board for decades. They keep M4s or MP5s in the trunk of their patrol cars. I’m a little surprised that they are just now getting around to doing this is a place like Miami.
Found an excellent article (in .pdf format) on the Police Patrol Rifle here:
THE PATROL RIFLE/CARBINE A MORE SUITABLE PATROL LONG GUN
E.M.U SCHOOL OF POLICE STAFF AND COMMAND
SERGEANT CRAIG BAULDRY CANTON TOWNSHIP POLICE DEPARTEMENT CANTON, MI
back in the old days when the likes of the Miami River cops were robbing dope smugglers and dumping their bodies in said river
the didn’t need no stinking assault rifles
they did just fine with regular old guns even Dumbo Zumbo woulda appreciated
i miss myamuh
I am guessing political reasons. The Police chief and Mayor would have to justify the police officers using their weapons to the news media and the public.
Probably in rural areas the citizens and the police have a much better relationship. The citizens have respect for and trust the police, and expect them to be armed well enough to do whatever they might be called on to do, and assume that they are intelligent and well trained and will do the right thing.
I would guess in the bigger cities you have more of the welfare state anti-police mentality, plus the people and the lawyers looking to hit the legal lottery in a lawsuit against the police.
I am sure the lawyers and the families of the thugs would be screaming that the police are mowing down "disadvantaged urban youth" - or however they would be defending the thugs as - and it had to finally get pretty bad to be able to allow the street cops to have a patrol rifle available to them in order to give them a chance against the thugs armed with AK-47s.
In Palm Beach County, if the sheriff’s deputy qualifies with an AR, he can have it. He has to buy his own, unless he gets on one of the tac teams. In many of the towns around here, the same policy applies. If the officer chooses to take the rifle training and purchase the rifle, he can have it. Quite a few of them do so.
I think the Broward County Sheriffs Department also allows its deputies to carry a rifle in the car after they qualify, but again, they have to buy it. I’ll have to check. I see mostly Palm Beach, only a few Broward deputies.
I’ve also been told some very disturbing things about this shooting by police officers in Palm Beach County. I’ll see a friend of mine tommorrow and try to verify some of it.
Do they get grenade launchers, too?
We ? You got a mouse in yer pocket chief ? I suspect that mouse is a risk manager for your department who's really just a rat !
Real patrolmen, working the streets vs a desk can make do with a bolt patrol rifle, something that will punch the kevlar these bad guys wear these days as we observed at the BOA Hollyweird robbery a few years back....such as the FN Patrol rifle vs an M4 . But I'd think that the M4 carbine would fill the needs better for urban or rural LEO's needs across the board.
As a deputy working alone in the rural mountains where radio links were few and far and cell phones were still a toy vs a tool..... I carried an M1A in my cruiser along with my shotgun. Backup was too far away. I relied on me and my own abilities alone for the most part.
Were I the chief or sheriff of a department today I'd issue the semi-auto version of the M4 carbine to all my officers / deputies with the instruction that seems to be lost on most LEO's these days ....you are responsible for every round you fire. Your must be aware of where your rounds will impact and the range and penetration of that weapons projectiles. Be surgical with you application of deadly force at all times if at all possible.
The ONLY reason I select the M4 carbine is that is the US DOD primary weapon that most former servicemen and new LEO's have experience and training with and if the need for a national guard call out is needed to aid LEO's in preserving the peace they have a logistical common for spares and ammunition etc ........
Just my opinion based on what I know and did in the past.......
The writer doesn’t know the difference between a saddle bag and a rifle scabbard.
Most old time sheriffs carried a Colt but it was in 44-40 so the Winchester and the revolver could share ammunition.
I’m not comfortable with city cops carrying rifles with thirty round mags. I think they should train with their shotguns and use slugs.
But WHY would the cops want Assault Weapons, unless they intend to slaughter a whole bunch of people in just seconds, spray-firing their weapons without even aiming?
Let’s HOPE the cops don’t get too trigger-happy now - they already have that reputation in the Miami Metro-Squad.
Just what we need - big city cops who can’t shoot straight spraying the neighborhood with auto fire.
A few years back some scumsucker bank robber took a female teller hostage. The sheriff gave the moron one minute to release her. At one minute plus one second he was dead with a bullet hole right between the eyes. Deer hunters who carry sheriff badges are a blessing to the community. It’s an advantage rural Americans have over big city residents.
WE've carried Ruger mini14's since 1991 and disposed of the shot gun option shortly after that. M4 or AR's are authorized if you want to shell out the $$$. Only one thing came up where they've been used for deadly force in that time that I can think of at the patrol level. Not that there hasn't been events where they could have been used. The training lieutenant actually prefers if we sling 'em all the time in the spirit of your tagline.
I think more than two days of training would be preferrable. Something more intense, like a Thunder Ranch week long looks better on your training record for those wrongful death lawsuits that invariably come up
Oh sure...no big city cops know how to handle a rifle...or can aspire to being able to plug someone with a head shot...(rolling eyes)
"Quick and dirty."
That is why the M4 would be a better choice for the veterans on the department. Budget is gonna give em maybe a few days to train as ya well know.
.......... I have to agree with HG on this issue. The patrol rifle course at Thunder Ranch would be perfect.
Real easy for HG to suggest though since TR moved up in his AO !.......:o)
Clint Smith's T-Ranch urban rifle was only a 3 dayer iirc but well worth it and all iron sights. It seemed longer because after that I went to Steve Matoon's advanced sniper course. That was a long week + some...oh to be young again. It'd probably kill me now...LOL
With only two days of familiarization training? You've got to be kidding.
good selections.....not convinced on the outgunned reasons that PD’s put forth these days. BTW Snaggin yer gift off the site now.......... slooooooowly !!
East Coast chief should have let the rifles out more than a decade ago. What a moron.
Thanks for that link.
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