Makes sense.
Posted on 09/22/2007 3:09:59 PM PDT by libstripper
Trevor Putnam knew the gun laws. The officer who stopped him didn’t.
“When I told him that I hadn’t done anything, he said he’d find a reason to put me in jail,” said Putnam, 24, who works with guns every day as vice president of Coal Creek Armory in West Knoxville.
“It’s not that I have a problem with police officers. I deal with police officers nationwide from Arizona to Maine every day. But I lost my confidence in a legal right that I knew I had.”
Knoxville police officers will get a refresher course on the state’s gun permit laws after an officer who didn’t know the law stopped, frisked and threatened to arrest Putnam for legally carrying a gun inside a Wal-Mart this summer.
(Excerpt) Read more at knoxnews.com ...
Second story today about a cop who said he’d “find a reason” to put an innocent man in jail. Can’t wait for the cop groupies to show up.
I'm sure Fred could s'plain things to him.
Ignorance of the law is no excuse. :-)
It's not quite the same if you drop the last sentence.
Without it, it's Intent to deprive under color of law. With it, it's a dumb cop.
I used to donate to the FOP (Fraternal Order of Police) occasionally before I realized that most of the Police Chief’s throughout the country are a anti-2nd amendment.
The average police officer isn’t against the 2nd amendment, but police chief’s have a gun-grabber attitude more often than not.
They often don't.
1) I’m surprised the article gives a what appears to be a fairly even-handed account.
2) I hope the cop doesn’t carry a chip on his shoulder after this. Most cops aren’t fond of being proven in the wrong publicly.
I consider myself very strongly pro-cop, but certainly not a groupie. I can’t find anything about the actions of this officer to defend. I admire the cops who concentrate on getting the truly dangerous people off the streets, and it’s too bad that some of the cops use up so much time on petty crap like this.
What’s the use of carrying a gun if it’s not cocked, locked and ready to rock?
2nd amendment, cops get a lesson, PING!
Typical knee jerk cop reaction. These stupid cops should be glad that regular citizens are willing to carry for their protection and the protection of others. With the amazingly high number of criminals all over the country who are never caught. The citizens need the right to carry. In many cases its the cops who are getting help. Cops react after the crime. A concealed carry holder has a chance to react as crime happens.
Show me one Judge that's never used that phrase before.
I had a rookie officer complain to me because I didn't tell him
there was a Firearm in my vehicle. I had pulled over before he could
complete his license check which would have revealed my CCW.
I think it scared the heck out of him because he was unprepared.
And he didn't even write me up on my speeding ticket. Oh Yea.
Well, I’m one of those cop “groupies.” I nearly always take the side of law enforcement, or at least give them the benefit of the doubt.
This case is different.
The RKBA, in my opinion, is our most important right, and it galls me to think that an officer could be so cavalier about violating it.
I also don’t like it when bad cops make the majority good cops look like thugs, by threatening citizens w/ false charges.
But in some cases, cops are justified in threatening to arrest folks who are just out to goad them, or test them, for no other reason than that they think they can.
I’m not anti-cop, but I’m anti Bad cop, and there seem to be more and more of them. I also detest the cop groupies who show up on every thread saying cops can do no wrong. My perfect solution for these boot-lickers would be for them to run into a bad cop.
When in danger, dial 357. When the danger is over, dial 911.
Dollars to donuts his LEO will be trained and this mistake will not happen again.
Thanks for the ping! Looks like the police chief handled this well.
The Police—Guaranteed to be there in MINUTES when SECONDS count !
911..., the only officially government sanctioned "Dial A Prayer" line!
no consideration that they apologized to this kid, huh? if the cop thought (wrongly, of course) that there was no open carry, he did the stop with reasonable intentions, imho.
but mistakes do happen. and every one of them seems to get posted here! just for the record: the cop was wrong. see? i'm no cop groupie.
That's because police chiefs are politicians, and generally political appointees.
Mark
I can certainly understand the frustration a policeman can have with an in-your-face citizen.
I can understand his DESIRE to threaten to arrest folks who just out to goad or test them.
But I can't see a justification to threaten arrest unless the threat is based on the violation of some law, that could be supported after the fact. And then, only in a professional manner.
With the advent of patrol car (and many other) camera sources, the public is, and will continue, seeing more and more police in action.
And, I think they are seeing many video recordings of policemen who are faced with situations that the viewer might tend to think: "I'd pop that guy a couple of times with my nightstick if he talked to me like that". LOL
However, what they many times see happen is that the policeman remain calm and acts professionally, even when warning someone that if they don't stop doing something (interfering in a domestic dispute, obstructing the policeman's ability to do his job, etc.) they are subject to being arrested.
That professionalism is what the public expects because we give the police a lot of power over the situation and citizens.
Professionalism and honest efforts to weed out the bad apples are the bedrock of maintaining public trust and support of the police.
Makes sense.
An apology doesn't replace time lost or make unwanted media attention vanish.
"Inducing panic" is a favorite charge used by anti-gun cops against legal open carry;it goes along nicely with the police campaigns "see a gun,call TIP-LINE" or something similar.So even in those states where open carry is legal, carrying your hunting rifle or shotgun to the car or truck might induce a liberal neighbor to call the cops. There are still a lot of people who will use any means to make gun ownership seen as odd and threatening.
"I am a belligerent claimant, I claim all of my rights all of the time, I give up none of my rights at any time."
When asked if you understand the Miranda Statement say "NO!"
There are about 500 rights that you have in a Miranda situation - IT is impossible for any citizen to know them - hell most lawyers don't know them.
If a cop threatens to arrest you especially on a traffic stop ask to be taken to a magistrate for a probable cause hearing.
“But I can’t see a justification to threaten arrest unless the threat is based on the violation of some law, that could be supported after the fact. And then, only in a professional manner.”
I guess I can’t really argue with that. I know that when I watch punks and bangers, who’ve just endangered or victimized the public, spitting on cops, I wish there could be a little street justice. Often it’s the only justice these a**holes are going to get.
So, yeah. The desire is there. But it definitely has enough potential for abuse, that realistically I’m against it.
“I am a belligerent claimant, I claim all of my rights all of the time,..”
Or maybe you’re just a jerk with an attitude. Hard to say.
Is that a pocket 1911A1?
knee jerking in maryland... not totally up on the rest of the story, still being investigated or covered up...
an off duty deputy was in line at a convenience store...
a man in front of him was “acting nervous”.
the off duty deputy noticed a hunting knife in the man’s pocket and realizing he might rob the store, he pulls out his revolver to order the pre-perp to the floor... but before he can get a word out... the pre-perp grabs the gun that was being pointed at him, probably an act of self defence... a struggle ensued that led to the man’s arrest and indictment on resisting arrest and assault of an officer and many more...
more to come on the story...
teeman
In recent years we’ve seen a lot of cops come right out of the ranks of the military. They change uniforms rather easily but find it harder to change their attitudes. As soldiers they have less need to be polite than a good police officer and it shows in cases like this. It doesn’t say in the article but I will bet that the officer came to the Knoxville police department from some form of military police. We see it a lot here in the Northwest with similar stories about police power-trips.
I’m afraid it’s going to end badly.
L
Apparently the only person induced to panic was the cop.
It's a Smith & Wesson 1911.
Model: SW1911PD
Caliber: .45ACP
Capacity: 8+1 Rounds
Barrel Length: 4 1/4"
Front Sight: Dot Front Sight
Rear Sight: Novak Lo Mount Carry
Grip: Wood Grips
External Safety: Single Side
Frame: Medium
Finish: Blue/Black
Overall Length: 8"
Material: Scandium Alloy Frame/Carbon Steel Slide
Weight Empty: 28 oz.
It's a Smith & Wesson 1911.
Model: SW1911PD
Caliber: .45ACP
Capacity: 8+1 Rounds
Barrel Length: 4 1/4"
Front Sight: Dot Front Sight
Rear Sight: Novak Lo Mount Carry
Grip: Wood Grips
External Safety: Single Side
Frame: Medium
Finish: Blue/Black
Overall Length: 8"
Material: Scandium Alloy Frame/Carbon Steel Slide
Weight Empty: 28 oz. 
I'm a Sig Sauer P220ST fan myself.
A young friend of mine dropped out of a local police academy when he realized that he just couldn't fit in to the requirement to unquestioningly obey superiors. He would have made a fine cop.
Civil rights is not “petty”.
an off duty deputy was in line at a convenience store...
a man in front of him was “acting nervous”.
“the off duty deputy noticed a hunting knife in the man’s pocket and realizing he might rob the store, he pulls out his revolver to order the pre-perp to the floor... but before he can get a word out... the pre-perp grabs the gun that was being pointed at him, probably an act of self defence... a struggle ensued that led to the man’s arrest and indictment on resisting arrest and assault of an officer and many more...”
Interesting situation based on what you’ve written. How did the guy with the knife know it was an off duty cop and not someone trying to rob or harm him?
And as we’ve all read many times, who’s to say who is belligerant or copping an attitude. That appears to be the standard cop claim for any situation.
“State law says you carry it concealed, not in plain view (with the) hammer back,””
Is is safe to carry holstered with the hammer cocked?
I’ve got a carry permit and carry all the time. Whether or not you are allowed “open carry” in your state, it is just not too smart to do it. 1. The “bad guy” knows you’ve got a gun. 2. The little old lady who “doesn’t believe in guns” thinks you are a terrorist and 3. the whole idea of concealment is voided if someone “forgets” to cover up ... it is “not knowing who might have a gun” that reduces crime rates. Don’t get me wrong, if you have a “right” to open carry, not a problem with me, but it isn’t very smart for the above reasons. Best to keep it covered, avoid the nonsense and not tip off the bad guy to jump you first.
Depends on the gun. I'd never carry a revolver that way, but a 1911 is supposed to be carried that way.
The greatest threat to freedom loving people.
Where did I say civil rights are petty?
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/1900468/posts
Best regards,
I too am anti bad cop. I think the publicity given to a few bad incidents out of the millions of actions the police perform each year are not justified to tar them all.
Off duty cop = moron
he pulls out his revolver to order the pre-perp to the floor...
You just got to be a cop, what in the world is a pre-perp.
Part of the wonderful world of LA Police Chief Darryl Gates "pro-active" policing, a pre-perp is a citizen who is guilty until proven innocent or until someone finds the right combination of charges from the smorgasboard of over 4 million laws ( and counting).
See George Orwell's book "1984" with the speech to Winston Smith: "See Mr. Smith, we want EVERYONE to be guilty of SOMETHING"
Best regards,
A retail store I worked in once had a loss prevention officer that said, and not joking, "everyone is guilty, we just haven't caught them yet".
Court TV runs a commercial for one of their Forsenic Investigation Shows (Dale Hinnamen?)with one of the most chilling anti-Science sentences I have ever heard:
"Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence" (of a crime)!
They have run that commercial for at least six months and apparently it accurately reflects the pattern of belief held by some in the forensic investigation community.
Best regards,
Yes, with the Safety on.
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