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6 Ark. nuns excommunicated for heresy
Yahoo News / AP ^ | September 26, 2007 | ANDREW DeMILLO

Posted on 09/26/2007 4:03:14 PM PDT by Stoat

Photo

 

The Rev. J. Gaston Hebert, Little Rock diocese administrator, speaks during a news conference Wednesday, Sept. 26, 2007, in Little Rock, Ark. Hebert announced Wednesday that six Arkansas nuns have been excommunicated from the Catholic Church for heresy. (AP Photo/Mike Wintroath)

6 Ark. nuns excommunicated for heresy

 

By ANDREW DeMILLO, Associated Press Writer 11 minutes ago
 

LITTLE ROCK, Ark. - Six Catholic nuns have been excommunicated for heresy after refusing to give up membership in a Canadian sect whose founder claims to be the reincarnation of the Virgin Mary, the Diocese of Little Rock announced Wednesday.

The Rev. J. Gaston Hebert, the diocese administrator, said he notified the nuns of the decision Tuesday night after they refused to recant the teachings of the Community of the Lady of All Nations, also known as the Army of Mary.

The Vatican has declared all members of the Army of Mary excommunicated. Hebert said the excommunication was the first in the diocese's 165-year history.

"It is a painfully historic moment for this church," Hebert said.

The six nuns are associated with the Good Shepherd Monastery of Our Lady of Charity and Refuge in Hot Springs. Sister Mary Theresa Dionne, one of the nuns excommunicated, said the nuns will still live at the convent property, which they own.

"We are at peace and we know that for us we are doing the right thing," the 82-year-old nun said. "We pray that the church will open their eyes before it is too late. This is God's work through Mary, the blessed mother, and we're doing what we're asked to do."

At a news conference, Hebert said the nuns "became entranced and deluded with a doctrine that is heretical." He said church officials removed the sacraments from the monastery on Tuesday night.

Hebert said the sect's members believe that its founder, Marie Paule Giguere, is the reincarnation of the Virgin Mary and that God speaks directly through her.

Excommunication bars the nuns from participating in the church liturgy and receiving communion or other sacraments.

The diocese said the action was taken after the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith issued a declaration that the Army of Mary's teachings were heretical and automatically excommunicated any who embraced the doctrine.

Hebert said the diocese had known for years that the nuns were following the sect and said church officials in the past had encouraged them to come back into the fold.

According to the Catholic News Service, the Army of Mary was founded in Quebec in 1971 by Giguere, who said she was receiving visions from God.

Dionne said she does not know if Giguere is the reincarnation of the Virgin Mary, but said she believes God communicates through the sect's founder.

"She is doing only what God and Mary tells her to do," Dionne said.

Calls made to a spokesman for the Army of Mary in Quebec were answered by a fax machine tone.



TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events; Philosophy; US: Arkansas
KEYWORDS: arkansas; armyofmary; catholic; catholics; excommunication; heresy; heretic; heretics; nuns; religion
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1 posted on 09/26/2007 4:03:17 PM PDT by Stoat
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To: Stoat

damned groupies?


2 posted on 09/26/2007 4:04:41 PM PDT by sure_fine ( not one to over kill the thought process)
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To: All
Calls made to a spokesman for the Army of Mary in Quebec were answered by a fax machine tone.

Note to the reporter:  This means that you have the incorrect number for a voice communication.  You're welcome to send them a fax at this number, but you need to find a different number if you wish to speak with someone there.

If this reporter doesn't understand this, I have concerns as to what else in the article may be amiss........

3 posted on 09/26/2007 4:06:02 PM PDT by Stoat (Rice / Coulter 2008: Smart Ladies for a Strong America)
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To: Stoat

Why don’t they excommunicate pedophile priests?


4 posted on 09/26/2007 4:12:11 PM PDT by Anti-Bubba182
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To: wideawake

Thought this may interest you.


5 posted on 09/26/2007 4:12:41 PM PDT by Borges
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To: Stoat; Darksheare

I’m certain that Darksheare is involved in this somewhere...


6 posted on 09/26/2007 4:15:27 PM PDT by null and void (<---- Awake and filled with a terrible resolve...)
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To: Stoat

“..refusing to give up membership in a Canadian sect whose founder claims to be the reincarnation of the Virgin Mary”

There are lot more noble things one could be excommunciated for.


7 posted on 09/26/2007 4:16:33 PM PDT by Rennes Templar ("The future ain't what it used to be".........Yogi Berra)
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Comment #8 Removed by Moderator

To: Stoat
Granted, I'm not a Catholic theologian, (was raised Catholic) but I am left wondering exactly what part of these nun's training and study of their faith led them to belive that the Catholic church teaches reincarnation? That doesn't make any sense to me. I don't know of any Christian denomination that teaches reincarnation (there may be some, but they would be considered pseudo-Christian cults by most mainstream denominations).

Very sad, when you think of their whole lives having been devoted to the work of God, then to be led astray.

9 posted on 09/26/2007 4:18:23 PM PDT by Pablo64 (National Alpaca Farm Day is 9-29-07. Visit an alpaca farm near you!)
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To: Stoat

If you’re a lowly nun, you get excommunicated, but
if you’re Speaker of the House...


10 posted on 09/26/2007 4:18:41 PM PDT by Redbob (WWJBD - "What Would Jack Bauer Do?")
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To: afraid

That is quite a slur against many, many very holy men.


11 posted on 09/26/2007 4:20:03 PM PDT by Klondike
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To: Stoat
Only four posts to a reference to GAY priests! GAY, you hear? As in "not that there is anything wrong with that!", hardy,har,har!
12 posted on 09/26/2007 4:20:55 PM PDT by Revolting cat! (We all need someone we can bleed on...)
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To: afraid

I really think the Church should start with the Priests before
they worry about some screwball nuns.


13 posted on 09/26/2007 4:21:02 PM PDT by Anti-Bubba182
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To: afraid

That is insulting and very anti-Catholic. There are many thousands of excellent Catholic Priests you have painted with this brush.


14 posted on 09/26/2007 4:24:19 PM PDT by Ben Mugged (Thanks Mom for not considering me a "choice".)
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To: Stoat
6 Ark. nuns excommunicated for heresy
six Arkansas nuns have been excommunicated from the Catholic Church for heresy
6 Ark. nuns excommunicated for heresy
Six Catholic nuns have been excommunicated for heresy

I think the point is:

Six nuns excommunicated for heresy, correct?

15 posted on 09/26/2007 4:26:45 PM PDT by Rudder
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To: All
The Army of Mary was already excommunicated almost two weeks ago

Army of Mary excommunicated by the Vatican

 

Army of Mary excommunicated by the Vatican
Declaration comes after a six year investigation


 

.- The Vatican has excommunicated members of the controversial Community of the Lady of All Nations, better known as the Army of Mary, based in the Archdiocese of Quebec.
 
The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith issued the declaration of excommunication on July 11, after extensive consultations with the Canadian bishops and the Vatican’s Congregation for Institutes of Consecrated Life and Societies of Apostolic Life. Pope Benedict XVI approved the declaration, which was only announced by the Canadian Conference of Catholic Bishops on Sept. 12.

Despite repeated warnings by the Canadian bishops, including their local bishop, Cardinal Marc Ouellet, members of the Army of Mary participated in ordinations forbidden by the Catholic Church.

The Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith said it was forced to issue the declaration because of “the very grave situation” and because there was no “hope of another solution.” The investigation into the Army of Mary has been going on for six years.

Those excommunicated include Fr. Jean-Pierre Mastropietro for having attempted to perform ordinations as well as the six “priests” and “deacons” claiming to have been ordained by him.

The declaration noted that other members who participated at the ordinations, despite a warning from the cardinal, and those who continue to associate with the movement have entered into schism with the Church and are also, therefore, excommunicated. The excommunications were incurred automatically.

The declaration concludes by stating: “Whoever knowingly and deliberately embraces this doctrine incurs an excommunication latae sententiae due to heresy.”

"It is our hope that the clarification provided by this present Declaration will assist those whose faith may be harmed by this schismatic group to remain faithful to the Catholic Church,” reads a letter that accompanies the declaration.


The excommunications follow a lengthy process, including appointments by the Holy See of Pontifical Commissioners for the priests associated with the Army of Mary. Bishop Gilles Cazabon, OMI, of Saint-Jérome served in this capacity until 2003. Archbishop Terrence Prendergast, SJ, of Ottawa succeeded him.

The Canadian bishops had issued a doctrinal note in 2001, confirming that the teachings promoted by the Army of Mary were contrary to the doctrines of the Church. The group has contradicted the Catholic faith by claiming that their founder, 86 year-old Marie-Paule Giguere, is the reincarnation of the Blessed Virgin Mary.

In March 2007, Cardinal Ouellet issued a warning that those responsible for the Army of Mary had excluded themselves from the Catholic Church, that its particular teachings were false, and its activities were not to be attended or supported by Catholics.

Click here to read the entire declaration.


16 posted on 09/26/2007 4:30:07 PM PDT by Stoat (Rice / Coulter 2008: Smart Ladies for a Strong America)
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To: Anti-Bubba182
Why don’t they excommunicate pedophile priests?

Religions excommunicate heretics, and not sinners.

There is nothing heretical about murder, incest, pedophilia or thievery etc.

Holding and persisting in views contrary to the teaching of the religion is heresy.

You can be forgiven for your sins, but not for heresy. - tom - Tom

17 posted on 09/26/2007 4:31:52 PM PDT by Capt. Tom (Don't confuse the Bushies with the dumb Republicans - Capt. Tom)
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To: Stoat
A pretty mild fate considering what punishment the religion of peace prescribes for heretics.
18 posted on 09/26/2007 4:36:59 PM PDT by isrul
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To: Capt. Tom

This heresy can be blamed on Rome Herself. Her veneration of Mary is extra biblical and thus heretical in its own right. They started it; it’s their job to correct it.


19 posted on 09/26/2007 4:39:26 PM PDT by CalvaryJohn (What is keeping that damned asteroid?)
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To: Redbob
If you’re a lowly nun, you get excommunicated, but
if you’re Speaker of the House...

I would suggest that Pelosi is in no danger of excommunication because she is rigidly and faithfully abiding by scripture and doctrine as laid down by Marx and Engels and superficially reformatted by MoveOn.org.

20 posted on 09/26/2007 4:39:44 PM PDT by Stoat (Rice / Coulter 2008: Smart Ladies for a Strong America)
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To: Capt. Tom
Excommunication

Automatic excommunication ("latae sententiae excommunication")

There are a few offenses for which Latin Rite Roman Catholics are automatically excommunicated:

1. Apostasy (canon 1364),
2. Heresy (canon 1364),
3. Schism (canon 1364),
4. Desecration of the Eucharist (canon 1367),
5. Physical violence against the Pope (canon 1370),
6. Attempted sacramental absolution of a partner in a sin against the sixth commandment of the Decalogue ("Thou shalt not commit adultery.") (canon 1378 §1),
7. Ordination of a bishop without papal mandate (canon 1382),
8. Direct violation of the sacramental seal of confession by a confessor (canon 1388),
9. Procurement of a completed abortion (canon 1398), or
10. Being a conspiring or necessary accomplice in any of the above (canon 1329).

21 posted on 09/26/2007 4:44:18 PM PDT by Anti-Bubba182
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To: Anti-Bubba182

You’re so right.....why don’t they??


22 posted on 09/26/2007 4:45:17 PM PDT by Fawn (http://www.brightlion.com/InHope/InHope_en.aspx)
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To: Stoat
When Nuns Go Bad...

23 posted on 09/26/2007 4:46:34 PM PDT by ricks_place
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To: Stoat
Note to the reporter: This means that you have the incorrect number for a voice communication. You're welcome to send them a fax at this number, but you need to find a different number if you wish to speak with someone there.

Your conclusion wouldn't be correct if they only had one line, and used it for both voice and fax service. So perhaps you ought to dig a little deeper before you start attacking the reporter.

By the way, how many Catholic denominations are there now? Catholics seem to be splintering faster than the Baptists these days.

24 posted on 09/26/2007 4:47:54 PM PDT by PAR35
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To: Stoat; Charles Henrickson; bcsco

The Lutherans on FR are munchin’ popcorn and wondering...”Dude! you called a press conference for THIS!?!”

Good thing the press didn’t cover Martin’s “skid marks” in his underwear!


25 posted on 09/26/2007 4:53:16 PM PDT by Cletus.D.Yokel
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To: Stoat
Calls made to a spokesman for the Army of Mary in Quebec were answered by a fax machine tone.

Ironically, all attempts to send faxes to the Army of Mary were interrupted by a voice on the line saying "Hello? Hello?"
26 posted on 09/26/2007 4:56:12 PM PDT by fr_freak
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To: Stoat

I admit that I was wrong. I thought it had to do with Slick and the cigars.


27 posted on 09/26/2007 5:02:09 PM PDT by OldEagle
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To: PAR35
Your conclusion wouldn't be correct if they only had one line, and used it for both voice and fax service. So perhaps you ought to dig a little deeper before you start attacking the reporter.

Normally I don't use "sarcasm" tags because I think that it's condescending and insulting to readers, who if they considered a post in the context of the article would realize that sarcasm or a tongue-in-cheek response had been intended.  In this case, to submit a post chiding a reporter about such a comparatively insignificant thing as finding a correct phone number when we are talking about the first excommunication of this particular diocese in 165 years seemed a rather obvious juxtaposition of a very serious matter with a trivial one, which I considered to be a humorous and rather obvious 'comic relief' that I felt needed no explanation.  It seems that in the case of yourself, I was mistaken.. 

 As to your surprisingly harshly-worded criticisms, I didn't need to "dig deeper" because a single-line phone / fax line is typically answered by a voice greeting that allows the caller to either begin sending a fax or select options from a menu.  If the line was answered only by a fax tone then this indicates that it is a dedicated fax line. 

More importantly, what probably occurred in reality was that it was indeed the correct number and it was simply a matter of them not wanting to receive calls, so they plugged their fax machine into their voice line.

28 posted on 09/26/2007 5:09:14 PM PDT by Stoat (Rice / Coulter 2008: Smart Ladies for a Strong America)
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To: ricks_place
The heck with cigarettes, let's break out the guns...


29 posted on 09/26/2007 5:10:22 PM PDT by I still care ("Remember... for it is the doom of men that they forget" - Merlin, from Excalibur)
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To: Stoat

bookmark


30 posted on 09/26/2007 5:33:26 PM PDT by GOP Poet
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To: CalvaryJohn
This heresy can be blamed on Rome Herself.

Oh really? How so?

Her veneration of Mary is extra biblical ...

So is going to church on Sunday instead of Saturday. Does that make it wrong?

... and thus heretical in its own right.

Guess so, according to your logic. I respectfully disagree.

They started it; it’s their job to correct it.

As far as the Vatican is concerned, there's nothing to correct. The case you make is less than convincing.

31 posted on 09/26/2007 5:34:10 PM PDT by GenXFreedomFighter
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To: Capt. Tom
You can be forgiven for your sins, but not for heresy.

Sure you can. You can't be forgiven for any sin until you repent. If you repent of your heresy, you will be forgiven, same as for any other sin.

The good nuns refused to repent, so out they go.

32 posted on 09/26/2007 5:40:51 PM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Stoat

The Arkansas 6


33 posted on 09/26/2007 5:40:58 PM PDT by Reagan79 (Ralph Stanley & The Clinch Mountain Boys)
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To: Capt. Tom
"Religions excommunicate heretics, and not sinners."

Depends on how you define excommunicate. I recall the Apostle Paul ordered the congregation at Corinth to boot out a congregent for sleeping with his father's wife. (Granted, he was readmitted but only after he repented of this sin)

34 posted on 09/26/2007 5:41:31 PM PDT by joebuck
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To: Capt. Tom
Religions excommunicate heretics, and not sinners.

Quite a few religions excommunicate unrepentant sinners. The Bible is pretty clear that this is the right thing to do, but it doesn't happen often.

35 posted on 09/26/2007 5:43:00 PM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Reagan79
The Arkansas 6

LMAO!

Somehow, I have the sneaking suspicion that the "Reverend" Jesse Jackson and the "Reverend" Al Sharpton will not be troubling themselves to go to Arkansas to organize a protest march in support of these nuns.

36 posted on 09/26/2007 5:45:12 PM PDT by Stoat (Rice / Coulter 2008: Smart Ladies for a Strong America)
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To: Anti-Bubba182

I’m quite certain the Church does not care what you think. Nor should they.


37 posted on 09/26/2007 5:45:33 PM PDT by Petronski (Congratulations Tribe! AL Central Champs)
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To: Stoat; Liberty Valance

There’s only one real question here. How many divisions does the Army of Mary have?


38 posted on 09/26/2007 5:54:05 PM PDT by Brucifer (G. W. Bush "The dog ate my copy of the Constitution.")
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To: Pablo64
Very sad, when you think of their whole lives having been devoted to the work of God, then to be led astray.

Agreed, and a reminder that regardless of who you are, you'll generally reap what you sow.

 

39 posted on 09/26/2007 6:52:33 PM PDT by Stoat (Rice / Coulter 2008: Smart Ladies for a Strong America)
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To: Stoat

I think there are fourtenn nuns there, half of them Canadians, the remainder Vietnamese, and Americans. I wonder which ones got excommunicated, and which ones didn’t?
Here are the nuns at worship:
http://www.adorationchapel.org/Sisters_of_Charity/more_tour.htm


40 posted on 09/26/2007 7:04:42 PM PDT by sockmonkey
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To: CalvaryJohn

But for church tradition you would never be able to establish the NT Canon.


41 posted on 09/26/2007 7:19:17 PM PDT by festus (No matter how guilty you are a jury will probably get you off.)
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To: Stoat

How can they be excommunicated and still be nuns?? They have broken their vow of obedience. They may own the property but they are just ladies in costumes now. When will they realize it?? It all boils down to obedience.


42 posted on 09/26/2007 7:30:41 PM PDT by MomwithHope
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To: Ben Mugged

I am anti-Catholic. That church is soulless and empty.


43 posted on 09/26/2007 7:38:33 PM PDT by afraid
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To: Brucifer

LOL! No the real question is how much ammo do they have. Never know when we’ll need them ;)


44 posted on 09/26/2007 7:42:58 PM PDT by Twink
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To: All; afraid

After reading this article, original post, and all the threads (granted, I usually skim and that gets me in trouble at times), I saw a ton of humor but sadly also a ton of anti- catholicism.

Today, I read posts (on another thread) that Catholicism is not bible based, which is odd since Catholics did translate the first bible, it didn’t magically appear in the middle ages. I read that Catholics aren’t Christians. In this thread, I read that Rome and Catholics venerate/worship Mary so it’s their own fault. I had to LOL at that one since it’s so ridiculous I don’t even know how to respond. We don’t “worship” Mary, we honor her as the Mother of Jesus (our Mother)- there’s even a Commandment about “honor thy mother and father”

Personally, I’ve been surprised by what I’ve read in this and another thread today. I thought this was a conservative site. I didn’t realize the catholic hate was so prevalent here. I see it all over the news, internet, life, but thought this site was different.

I don’t know much about Mormonism and anytime I reply to a Mormon based thread, I try to be respectful and hope to learn about their faith. Since Romney is running for POTUS, I have an additional interest. Same with Scientology - don’t know much about that either. I know Catholicism and most of the Protestant denominations. I’m shocked and sorta sad that the same consideration and knowledge is so lacking here.

As with all threads, posts, I do enjoy the wit/humor. The misinformation and out right lies is what bothers me.

Just my two cents.


45 posted on 09/26/2007 7:57:40 PM PDT by Twink
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To: Stoat
"We are at peace and we know that for us we are doing the right thing," the 82-year-old nun said. "We pray that the church will open their eyes before it is too late. This is God's work through Mary, the blessed mother, and we're doing what we're asked to do."

Sad!

46 posted on 09/26/2007 8:01:29 PM PDT by editor-surveyor (Turning the general election into a second Democrat primary is not a winning strategy.)
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To: MomwithHope
How can they be excommunicated and still be nuns?? They have broken their vow of obedience. They may own the property but they are just ladies in costumes now. When will they realize it?? It all boils down to obedience.

Agreed, all essential points.  I would suggest, however, that in addition to obedience there is simply the matter of basic respect.  Nobody can join an organization, any organization, that has specific rules, practices, and customs and then decide that they are going to violate those rules with impunity and expect that their actions will be blindly accepted by that organization....this is a ludicrous premise, brought about, perhaps, by the collapse of so many other institutions due to a failure to adhere to their own standards.  What if the Republican Party were to adopt a plank for it's platform that abortion on demand is just fine and peachy, any old time you like?  That the private ownership of guns was a bad thing?  It would cease to be anything like what is commonly known as the Republican Party, even though a few RINOS in the ranks undoubtedly believe such idiotic things.  They have no respect for the Party itself, just as these nuns have 'apparently' lost their respect for the Church and it's teachings.  If you care enough for an organization to join it, then be respectful enough of that organization to abide by it's rules.  If you have a question or a concern about a rule, then bring it up through the existing channels of discourse.....don't proclaim your antipathy to the rules of an organization, practice your unaccepted interpretation and then continue to call yourself a member of that organization in good standing.  It's profoundly disrespectful as well as being dishonest.

A nun's habit is not only a symbol  of piety, faith and obedience, it is a uniform that proclaims an adherence to the practices and stated principles of the Church.  Openly violating those principles is, in my view, similar to a uniformed police officer engaging in criminal activity....that officer is engaging in activities unbecoming an officer and in violation of the police department and the laws they are sworn to uphold and enforce.  That officer should lose the privilege of wearing the uniform, at a minimum.  By wearing the uniform of the Church, a nun similarly professes her embrace of the Church and it's teachings, and she sets an example for all of society.  When someone speaks with a nun about matters pertaining to the Church, one has a right to expect that the nun's words will be reflective of the position of the Church.

47 posted on 09/26/2007 8:01:42 PM PDT by Stoat (Rice / Coulter 2008: Smart Ladies for a Strong America)
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To: Pablo64

I agree. It is sad when they spent most of their lives in service, then this.

The one nun, 82 or so, quoted in the article, sorta makes me think she’s losing it or something. Reincarnation is definitely not a “Christian” belief.

Honestly, this is the first I’ve heard of this order. However, we have a really “liberal” parish here with extremely left leaning nuns - they’re Hillary supporters, and her platform goes against just about everything the Catholic Church teaches (with the exception of certaim socialism based programs) but since they’re in their late 50’s- early 60’s, I blame it on feminist bull they fell for ;)


48 posted on 09/26/2007 8:08:04 PM PDT by Twink
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To: afraid

Be sure you use that line during your particular judgment, goober.


49 posted on 09/26/2007 8:09:24 PM PDT by A.A. Cunningham
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To: CalvaryJohn
You should concentrate on repairing your mental frailties rather than commenting on things you admittedly know nothing about.
50 posted on 09/26/2007 8:12:33 PM PDT by A.A. Cunningham
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