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Vatican book on Templars' demise
BBC ^ | October 5, 2007

Posted on 10/05/2007 1:44:55 PM PDT by NYer

The Vatican is to publish a book which is expected to shed light on the demise of the Knights Templar, a Christian military order from the Middle Ages.

The book is based on a document known as the Chinon parchment, found in the Vatican Secret Archives six years ago after years of being incorrectly filed.

The document is a record of the heresy hearings of the Templars before Pope Clement V in the 14th Century.

The official who found the paper says it exonerates the knights entirely.

Prof Barbara Frale, who stumbled across the parchment by mistake, says that it lays bare the rituals and ceremonies over which the Templars were accused of heresy.

In the hearings before Clement V, the knights reportedly admitted spitting on the cross, denying Jesus and kissing the lower back of the man proposing them during initiation ceremonies.

However, many of the confessions were obtained under torture and knights later recanted or tried to claim that their initiation ceremony merely mimicked the humiliation the knights would suffer if they fell into the hands of the Muslim leader Saladin.

The leader of the order, Jacques de Moley, was one of those who confessed to heresy, but later recanted.

He was burned at the stake in Paris in 1314, the same year that the Pope dissolved the order.

However, according to Prof Frale, study of the document shows that the knights were not heretics as had been believed for 700 years.

In fact she says "the Pope was obliged to ask for pardons from the knights... the document we have found absolves them".

Details of the parchment will be published as part of Processus contra Templarios, a book that will be released by the Vatican's Secret Archive on 25 October.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Culture/Society; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: christian; churchhistory; godsgravesglyphs; knights; knightstemplar; knighttemplars; masons; templar; templars; vatican
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1 posted on 10/05/2007 1:44:56 PM PDT by NYer
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To: Salvation; narses; SMEDLEYBUTLER; redhead; Notwithstanding; nickcarraway; Romulus; ...
Catholic Ping
Please freepmail me if you want on/off this list


2 posted on 10/05/2007 1:45:52 PM PDT by NYer ("Where the bishop is present, there is the Catholic Church" - Ignatius of Antioch)
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To: NYer

Interesting...thanks for posting!


3 posted on 10/05/2007 1:49:22 PM PDT by Joe 6-pack (Que me amat, amet et canem meum)
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To: NYer; Rennes Templar

Bump & Ping


4 posted on 10/05/2007 1:50:47 PM PDT by mnehring ("Ron Paul and his flaming antiwar spam monkeys can Kiss my Ass!!"- Jim Robinson, Sept, 30, 2007)
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To: NYer

Some have theorized that the Jedi Purge was based in part on the insidious destruction of the Knights Templar on Friday 13. (along with Kristal Nacht and the World War 2 Holocaust).


5 posted on 10/05/2007 1:51:05 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( What is your take on Acts 15:20 (abstaining from blood) about eating meat? Could you freepmail?)
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To: NYer
Prof Frale, study of the document shows that the knights were not heretics as had been believed for 700 years....... the document we have found absolves them".

If true, the Vatican should issue an official apology (albeit, the Templars were dissolved in 1307 (when they were massacred.) There are 13 thousand plus souls who deserve this symbolic apology. SMIB

6 posted on 10/05/2007 1:53:41 PM PDT by mnehring ("Ron Paul and his flaming antiwar spam monkeys can Kiss my Ass!!"- Jim Robinson, Sept, 30, 2007)
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To: NYer

Why did the Catholic church allow a falsehood to exist for 700 years?


7 posted on 10/05/2007 1:55:56 PM PDT by ConservativeMind
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To: NYer
The Vatican sure did themselves proud with their treatment of the Templars.
8 posted on 10/05/2007 1:56:24 PM PDT by vetsvette (Bring Him Back)
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To: ConservativeMind
Probably because the ‘Templars of legend’ have been so engrossed in literature and conspiracy that any discussion of the real Templars in history pretty much alienates anyone who brings the topic up.
9 posted on 10/05/2007 1:58:02 PM PDT by mnehring ("Ron Paul and his flaming antiwar spam monkeys can Kiss my Ass!!"- Jim Robinson, Sept, 30, 2007)
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To: NYer

The bottom line on the Knights is that the King of France decided he didn’t want to pay back all the money he had borrowed off them. So, with the tacit consent of the Vatican, he butchered a bunch of them in a sudden purge after torturing “confessions” out of them. DeMolay was buned on Fri. 13 which became the basis for the superstition of that day being bad luck. (it certainly was for the KT)


10 posted on 10/05/2007 1:59:06 PM PDT by joebuck
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To: mnehrling

“If true, the Vatican should issue an official apology (albeit, the Templars were dissolved in 1307 (when they were massacred.) There are 13 thousand plus souls who deserve this symbolic apology. SMIB”

Good point.

According to History channel show on it, the instigator of the trial of the Knights Templar was the French King, who had owed the Templars a lot of money. The King also at the time had his own Avignon Pope (time of papal schism) so it wasn’t the Pope in Rome who was overseeing this.


11 posted on 10/05/2007 2:00:26 PM PDT by WOSG (I just wish freepers would bash Democrats as much as they bash Republicans)
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To: NYer

Soooo, who does the movie?
Jackson?
The guy that did the hobbit?


12 posted on 10/05/2007 2:00:48 PM PDT by Joe Boucher (An enemy of Islam)
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To: NYer
From the Vatican Information Service (N.B. This URL gets recycled, so it works for now, but ...):

VATICAN SECRET ARCHIVES: "PROCESSUS CONTRA TEMPLARIOS"

VATICAN CITY, OCT 4, 2007 (VIS) - On October 25 in the Vatican's Old Synod Hall, the presentation will take place of the "Processus contra Templarios," a book published by the Vatican Secret Archives on the subject of the Knights Templar, the medieval military-religious order founded in Jerusalem in 1118 and suppressed by Pope Clement V (1305-1314).

According to a communique made public yesterday afternoon, the new volume is "a previously unpublished and exclusive edition of the complete acts of the original hearing against the Knights Templar." The book, unique of its kind, will have a print run "rigorously limited to 799 copies" and contains the "faithful reproduction of the original parchments conserved in the Vatican Secret Archives."

The project, the communique concludes, "is part of the series of 'Exemplaria Praetiosa,' ... the most elaborate and important publication yet undertaken by the Pontifical Archives."

The new volume will be presented by Archbishop Raffaele Farina S.D.B., archivist and librarian of Holy Roman Church; Bishop Sergio Pagano, prefect of the Vatican Secret Archives, and experts such as the historian Franco Cardini and the archaeologist and author Valerio Massimo Manfredi." .../TEMPLARS/VATICAN SECRET ARCHIVESVIS 071004 (200)

13 posted on 10/05/2007 2:01:57 PM PDT by ELS (Vivat Benedictus XVI!)
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To: vetsvette

Not the first time nor the last.


14 posted on 10/05/2007 2:02:39 PM PDT by Joe Boucher (An enemy of Islam)
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To: ConservativeMind

The Pope at the time as I understand it viewed the Knight’s as a threat and desired the treasure they had accumulated over the years.. so he set out to destroy them, and their standing.


15 posted on 10/05/2007 2:02:40 PM PDT by HamiltonJay
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To: joebuck
Technically, the writ condemning the Templars was Friday the 13th (10/13/1307), DeMolay was tortured for several years and was finally slow roasted to death on 03/18/1314.
16 posted on 10/05/2007 2:02:55 PM PDT by mnehring ("Ron Paul and his flaming antiwar spam monkeys can Kiss my Ass!!"- Jim Robinson, Sept, 30, 2007)
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To: NYer

The vatican exterminated the Templars. The book will be whitewash.


17 posted on 10/05/2007 2:03:28 PM PDT by bert (K.E. N.P. +12 . Moveon is not us...... Moveon is the enemy)
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To: ConservativeMind
Wonder what else is in the Vatican Secret Archives?
18 posted on 10/05/2007 2:03:29 PM PDT by NCjim (The more I use Windows, the more I love UNIX)
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To: ELS

Only 799 copies? Shoot, guess it won’t be available on Amazon. :->


19 posted on 10/05/2007 2:04:48 PM PDT by mnehring ("Ron Paul and his flaming antiwar spam monkeys can Kiss my Ass!!"- Jim Robinson, Sept, 30, 2007)
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Vatican paper set to clear Knights Templar (from the Telegraph.co.uk)
20 posted on 10/05/2007 2:05:52 PM PDT by ELS (Vivat Benedictus XVI!)
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To: NYer
"Where the bishop is, there is the catholic church"

Even THESE bishops?

21 posted on 10/05/2007 2:06:16 PM PDT by Jim Noble (Trails of troubles, roads of battle, paths of victory we shall walk.)
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To: NYer

Keeping my eye on the woodwork to see what comes out of it ...


22 posted on 10/05/2007 2:06:21 PM PDT by ReignOfError
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To: mnehrling

You are correct. And the vatican went along with it because the great wealth of the Knights had made them a threat to the Church.


23 posted on 10/05/2007 2:06:59 PM PDT by joebuck
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To: NYer

Jacques de Molay, Thou art avenged.


24 posted on 10/05/2007 2:08:15 PM PDT by Some Fat Guy in L.A. (Nope. Not gonna do it.)
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To: Joe Boucher
Soooo, who does the movie?

Sounds like a Mel Gibson Production.

25 posted on 10/05/2007 2:11:39 PM PDT by Doomonyou (Let them eat lead.)
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To: Joe Boucher

The Phillip the Fair on the Discovery looked just like John Edwards .


26 posted on 10/05/2007 2:12:02 PM PDT by kbennkc (For those who have fought for it , freedom has a flavor the protected will never know. F Troop)
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To: NCjim
Wonder what else is in the Vatican Secret Archives?

They aren't so secret - Vatican Secret Archives

27 posted on 10/05/2007 2:15:29 PM PDT by ELS (Vivat Benedictus XVI!)
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To: Doomonyou
I would like to see a historically accurate movie instead of the DaVinci Code type conspiracy crap or a complete trashing like The Kingdom of Heaven.
28 posted on 10/05/2007 2:15:59 PM PDT by mnehring ("Ron Paul and his flaming antiwar spam monkeys can Kiss my Ass!!"- Jim Robinson, Sept, 30, 2007)
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To: NYer

It was all over money. The Templars were the defacto bankers of the European royalty. When the King of France couldn’t pay back his loans, he decided to have them trumped up on heresy charges...............


29 posted on 10/05/2007 2:16:00 PM PDT by Red Badger ( We don't have science, but we have consensus.......)
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To: ConservativeMind
Why did the Catholic church allow a falsehood to exist for 700 years?

Clerical error.......pun intended..........

30 posted on 10/05/2007 2:17:25 PM PDT by Red Badger ( We don't have science, but we have consensus.......)
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To: Red Badger
When the King of France couldn’t pay back his loans, he decided to have them trumped up on heresy charges...............

This is why separation of church and state is such a great idea.

31 posted on 10/05/2007 2:18:39 PM PDT by BearCub
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To: joebuck

The fraud worked so well for the king o f France, other monarchs across Europe decided they didn’t want to pay back their loans either.............


32 posted on 10/05/2007 2:18:59 PM PDT by Red Badger ( We don't have science, but we have consensus.......)
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To: kbennkc
The Phillip the Fair on the Discovery looked just like John Edwards .

I see two Europes.........

33 posted on 10/05/2007 2:20:28 PM PDT by Red Badger ( We don't have science, but we have consensus.......)
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To: mnehrling

Ditto.


34 posted on 10/05/2007 2:22:04 PM PDT by Doomonyou (Let them eat lead.)
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To: NYer

Next week marks the 700th anniversary of the Infamous Friday the 13th purge. I wonder what occultic Masonic rituals will be in store for us all?????


35 posted on 10/05/2007 2:22:34 PM PDT by Cvengr (The violence of evil is met with the violence of righteousness, justice, love and grace.)
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To: Cvengr
occultic Masonic

Oxymoron.

36 posted on 10/05/2007 2:23:47 PM PDT by mnehring ("Ron Paul and his flaming antiwar spam monkeys can Kiss my Ass!!"- Jim Robinson, Sept, 30, 2007)
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To: ConservativeMind
If you read the article, it says the proof of their exoneration was misfiled and only just found.

That’s their story, anyway.

37 posted on 10/05/2007 2:24:20 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: Some Fat Guy in L.A.
How do you figure? He won’t be avenged until a pope suffers the same fate he did. That means boiling of genetalia in oil and pulling them off of his conscience living person. Then execution. In otherwords, he won't ever be avenged.
38 posted on 10/05/2007 2:29:05 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: vetsvette

It was the King of France that wanted the Templars gone.


39 posted on 10/05/2007 2:31:45 PM PDT by tdewey10 (Can we please take out iran's nuclear capability before they start using it?)
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To: mamelukesabre
But it was known the whole life of that Pope.

The Pope here, appears to have a sin of omission.

40 posted on 10/05/2007 2:33:17 PM PDT by ConservativeMind
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To: mamelukesabre

I wouldn’t trust anything the Vatican says about the Knights Templar.


41 posted on 10/05/2007 2:35:31 PM PDT by cerberus
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To: bert

The Vatican DID NOT EXTERMINATE the Templars. They were arrested and tortured by the French at the orders of the French king. Those Templars who lived outside of France were largely untouched.

This why Templars survived as an order even somewhat after the dissolution at Vienne. Read: http://www.brill.nl/default.aspx?partid=10&mcid=3&pid=29039


42 posted on 10/05/2007 2:36:33 PM PDT by vladimir998 (Ignorance of Scripture is ignorance of Christ. St. Jerome)
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To: ConservativeMind

Why does that matter? A pope, any pope, must suffer the same fate if revenge is the goal.


43 posted on 10/05/2007 2:37:09 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: mnehrling
Only 799 copies? Shoot, guess it won’t be available on Amazon. :->

No, but there's always E-Bay!

44 posted on 10/05/2007 2:39:18 PM PDT by yankeedame ("Oh, I can take it but I'd much rather dish it out.")
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To: ConservativeMind

You wrote:

“But it was known the whole life of that Pope.”

Who said that? No one. What is being claimed is that it is obvious to MODERN observers that the Templars were innocent based on this one document. That doesn’t mean that the pope believed they were innocent.

“The Pope here, appears to have a sin of omission.”

Then, according to your logic, you might be committing a sin of ommission because you are omitting obvious points here. This is what the article actually said:

“The official who found the paper says it exonerates the knights entirely.”

Okay, so the MODERN OFFICIAL believes it exonerates the Templars. What did the pope believe?

“In the hearings before Clement V, the knights reportedly admitted spitting on the cross, denying Jesus and kissing the lower back of the man proposing them during initiation ceremonies.”

What makes you think the pope was hiding something then?


45 posted on 10/05/2007 2:43:30 PM PDT by vladimir998 (Ignorance of Scripture is ignorance of Christ. St. Jerome)
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To: mnehrling

You wrote:

“occultic Masonic”

“Oxymoron.”

More like, “Redundant”.


46 posted on 10/05/2007 2:45:25 PM PDT by vladimir998 (Ignorance of Scripture is ignorance of Christ. St. Jerome)
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To: ConservativeMind
Why did the Catholic church allow a falsehood to exist for 700 years?

700 years is pretty swift for the Vatican.

That's practically yesterday.
47 posted on 10/05/2007 2:46:00 PM PDT by rock_lobsta (It's October... Buy Popcorn from a Scout!)
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To: joebuck

You wrote:

“You are correct. And the vatican went along with it because the great wealth of the Knights had made them a threat to the Church.”

No. The Church, overall, was more wealthy than the Templars could ever dream of being. Also, wealth simply wasn’t a threat to the Church in any case. The Church supported the French King for essentially four reasons: 1) the Church was trying to heal the wound left by the battle between King Philip and Pope Boniface VIII, 2) popes of the Avignon period were not only physically close to France (too close!) but were dependent upon the good graces of the French (they could not go back to Rome), 3) the popes of the period were French as was Philip, 4) the Templars looked guilty as sin.


48 posted on 10/05/2007 2:49:45 PM PDT by vladimir998 (Ignorance of Scripture is ignorance of Christ. St. Jerome)
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To: joebuck
the King of France decided he didn’t want to pay back all the money he had borrowed off them. So, with the tacit consent of the Vatican, he butchered a bunch of them

Exactly. These were powerful men, and the crowned heads of state did not relish being in their debt.

49 posted on 10/05/2007 2:49:47 PM PDT by IronJack (=)
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To: Doomonyou
Sounds like a Mel Gibson Production.

I was just thinking how great it would be if Gibson created an epic
about the Templar Knights. 4-hours would be perfect..

50 posted on 10/05/2007 2:50:20 PM PDT by MaxMax (God Bless America)
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