Posted on 10/05/2007 5:08:56 PM PDT by police
Hillary Clinton would like to forget this but as a retired NYC Police Officer I will never forget and want to remind others what she said and was even defended by the President her husband Bill Clinton and she did this all for the Afican American vote and could have cared less about these 4 Officers who were all acquitted
Those “Ask Me About Hillary” buttons are going to be a double edged sword.
I despise Hillary but I’m going to put aside what she said in this case.
If it had been my friend, my father, my cousin, ANYONE who was gunned down in that manner-—that’s a MURDER and those cops ARE murderers.
Can anyone demonstrate that Diallo had a criminal record, had a reason to be shot down with 40+ shots for pulling out his wallet and maybe not understanding English quickly? Are people not innocent?
If he were white would this have been an issue? No. He’d have been given the benefit of the doubt by police on the scene.
Did they mean to kill an innocent man? No. But were they guilty of reckless disregard for the life of an innocent human being? YES-—A thousand times YES.
Blacks always ‘look like a suspect,’ when you hear about these cases. That some suspects are black doesn’t give police carte blanche to kill them when they haven’t even been ARRESTED yet.
Yes.
Then it was a lie!
No, Skywalk, that’s a not MURDER and those cops ARE not murderers.
40+ shots might show a lack of discipline and training, but 40+ shots don’t make it murder.
If he were white, he might have been might have been given the benefit of the doubt by police on the scene, but, as you admit, the cops didn’t mean to kill an innocent man.
It ain’t murder.
Guess some writers at the Village Voice are not too supportive of the junior U.S. Senator from New York.
Wonder if they will still have jobs on Monday.
>>If he were white would this have been an issue? No. He’d have been given the benefit of the doubt by police on the scene.<<
You don’t have any way of knowing that. You are making the baseless charge that these men were racists, without knowing them.
Shame on you.
Hillary never Mis-Speaks. She only Mis-Polls.
must be a deep cover sleeper agent.
regards - red
Actually, reckless disregard for human life can be used in 2nd degree murder cases.
It’s funny how these ‘accidents’ always happen to black suspects.
It does sound surprising, but yes, they will have jobs. I believe the Voice dislikes Hillary immensely, or at least likes others better, so they'll still have jobs.
Kneecaps, on the other hand, . . .
They’ll all vote for the Stalinist (Hillary) when the time comes.
LOL That’s absurd. I have thousands of posts on this forum and I don’t need to prove myself to you. I just am waiting for a white suspect to get filled with lead by ‘mistake.’
And even though it was a ‘mistake’ it’s odd how the person’s life is devalued, even moreso than if he HAD been an outright murder victim.
Some of you are letting your hate for Hillary blind you to the fact that this man was killed and it was no ‘mere accident.’ If it were you son or father or brother or friend, you would not be so quick to dismiss it as a terrible mishap.
Police should be PEACE officers, not paramilitary as they’ve become. Nor should any person, simply because they are the same race as an assailant and in the area of a crime that was committed be targets of an overzealous stop that results in their death.
This is not the War on Terror, this ain’t Iraq. Police are not and SHOULD not be given the same leeway as soldiers who may make mistakes in war.
RON PAUL stickers EVERYWHERE!!
Stalinist? They’d vote FOR STALIN if they somehow resurrected the old tyrant.
So long as he didn’t have an “R” in front of his name.
Hillary? Hillary? Hillary? Isn’t that the wife of the guy who was accused of raping a woman? They never did address that accusation, did they???????
Certainly it was a grievous case.But the issue is that 4 people (yeah, they were police - but they were people nonetheless) were under trial for a capital offense. Those people were innocent until proven guilty, and Hillary as a lawyer had an affirmative duty to not publicly prejudge their case.
What she did was admittedly not as egregious as what Nifong did in Durham, but it was wrong in the same way that Nifong was wrong - in both cases a Democrat was pandering to his base when talking out of turn about a pending criminal case.
And that is still true no matter how sure you are that the four were guilty as charged.
Again, I HATE Hillary and I’m not saying that her comments were just or appropriate.
I do NOT think that calling it a ‘murder’ was out of bounds as it was a homicide investigation and typically that’s what those are called until there’s reason to reduce the charges or scope of the case.
This is not about Hillary but about the case itself. As I see it, the only reason they should have been acquitted is because the DA was too stupid to charge them with something below murder (manslaughter would have been appropriate. IF I’m wrong and he DID do that, then I retract this bit.)
Interesting you should say that.
They have a 30 foot statue of Lenin in Fremont, a neighborhood in Seattle.
They claimed it was a mockery, but their claim was never taken seriously. Their love of communism kills their sense of humor.
<<
It’s funny how these ‘accidents’ always happen to black suspects.
>>
My dad was accidentally shot and killed by a jumpy cop looking for an armed suspect. The cop called out to him to identify himself and my dad didn’t hear him clearly. He walked toward the cop to see what he wanted, not realizing he was agitated and the cop drew on him and fired in one move. He never showed him the gun, which I believe is standard. The cop testified that my dad fit the description so closely that he just panicked.
My dad was white.
I used to live there. I think it would have been unconscionable to the very same people to have a statue of Hitler, Goebbels or EVEN Rommel. Heck, let’s cast out evil men from the discussion. I think they would not dared have had Robert E Lee, Nathan Bedford Forrest or even a bust of Longstreet or Stonewall in there.
That tells me all I need to know about it. Not everyone in Seattle is a far leftist, there are some true anti-communist, anti-jihadis there who are ‘democratic.’ But far too many seemed more determined to fight the crusade against anyone not resembling their ideology than the truly malevolent entities out there.
Again, this tells us what we need to know about such peoples’ motivations.
I am sorry for your loss.
The fact that it DOES happen to everyone (though I’d still say the fatalities are overrepresented in the other columns) just lends more force to my distrust of police and what they’ve become.
Being “jumpy” and someone ‘fitting a description’ does not equal a death sentence in my book. As a cop, you’re supposed to give your OWN life rather than take the life of an innocent. Some have forgotten that.
I want to reiterate how sorry I am that your father was taken from you.
No asperations cast in this case but I do want to bring up that there are a lot of dormant accounts dating from 1998, 2000, 2001, 2003, 2004...
Impeachment, 2000 election and recount recount recount and innauguration and the build up to Iraq and Abu Ghraib and the 2004 election etc. brought in the trolls.
Occassionally one of these sleeper cells will start posting on an account that has existed all that time without any posts. A quick check of forum posts can out some of those users (along with a habit of starting topics and then never following up to them).
Just mentioning this here since the issue was brought up and we are again facing a season of dirty political tricks.
I take you back to the thread already in progress (and with this post I was addressing the issue in general, not a specific case of trolling).
I propose that the RNC buy every or at least most commercial slots during the superbowl this year, which BTW is right before the primaries start, and use every little soundbyte they can muster to put together a montage that irrefutably slams the RATS and in particular Hitlary.
Go big and get the best bang for your buck is my motto.
Sam Donaldson did ax the question.
The answer from *BJ - "You'll have to talk to my lawyer."
Hello Jesse Jackson and/or Al Sharpton.
You don’t really want to open this Pandora’s box, do you?
First, I suggest you look up the illegal definition of murder.
Police are trained to fire only if they feel they are in mortal danger, or to protect someone else who is.
This case had a tragic ending. But Diallo was an illegal immigrant who appeared to be reaching for a gun when confronted by police.
When police are faced with a suspect who does not show his hands or come forward when confronted,reaches for something in his pocket, should they wait and see if he was reaching for a gun and one of their partners gets shot?
NYPD has an excellent record interms of using force when necessary, and no more than necessary.
This is Hillary at her worst : playing the race card to divide and gin up racial hatred. She is the partner of Al Sharpton & Jesse Jackson in this.
All this is about discrediting Rudy. It has nothing to do with police brutality, or anything like that.
And concerning “benefit of the doubt” I will always side with the NYPD who put their lives on the line every single day to defend us.
With intelligent responses like that, what can I do but tremble?
It’s funny. You can spend post after post (and not just on this forum) pointing out black racism against whites, especially as expressed in violent crime (I wonder if those two security guards in Philly would have been gunned down without a chance to even surrender, if they were black) and being balanced and demonstrating common sense and consistent moral judgment-—but say ONE thing that contradicts the conservative version of PC for a particularly controversial case and you’re now ranked with Sharpton and Jackson.
The reality is different. There IS prejudice towards blacks by the police and if you knew any law abiding blacks you’d know they DO target you. Just as there is prejudice against non-blacks by black violent criminals.
But I suppose this isn’t one-sided enough for you.
Did you read anything about where I separated Hillary out from the case? I’m talking about the CASE.
BTW, as I pointed out, premeditation is only required for 1st degree. I believe reckless disregard is available in NY and I did state that even a manslaughter charge could have been contemplated as I don’t believe there was malevolence in this case. But it was a lot easier to gun down the black ‘suspect’ than it would have been a white one.
Again, you would have a totally different view if it was your loved one. It’s easy to dismiss when it’s ‘someone else,’ especially a black, foreign someone else.
Diallo’s legal status is irrelevant and you know it. It’s simply added for emotional reasons and not for legal or moral grounds.
I find it funny that some people really think that there aren’t plenty of police out there who have, at least, a prejudicial view of people when they strap on that gun. Not malevolent, mind you, but a perspective that more easily allows them to act just a touch differently than they might otherwise due to the person’s background.
That Brett Darrow near St. Louis would probably have been beaten or shot if he were black. Brett is lucky in that regard.
Again, some of you don’t know that many law-abiding black folk. My aunt was forced to walk at night on the highway with a BABY when he car was impounded and the policy (the chief apologized) was that any person stopped in such a manner was entitled to a call and/or being dropped off at the nearest inhabited area. The officer was reprimanded and I’m sure the apology was to avoid a lawsuit.
I can cite more. You want to take a guess at what the race of officer and citizen was in these cases?
Police officers must realize they are accountable to society. Not everyone has perfect hearing. Not everyone speaks english. Not everyone has perfect vision. Trigger happy police officers pumped up on testosterone and adrenalin should know this.
My two cents.
Black “hip-hop” culture glorifies killing cops. Can you forgive the police for being a little more cautious when dealing with somebody who, statistically speaking, is much more likely to shoot his way out of the encounter?
That said, there is no justification for using lethal force in the absence of a clear threat, regardless of the suspect’s race or immigration status. At its core this is about abuse of power, not whatever prejudices may or may not have helped motivate it.
FReep Mail to you!
Since the population density of blacks is unproportional to the crimes they commit, it is no wonder that whites don't get shot full of holes as often as blacks. However, if you actually believe this has never happened to white people, then you are indeed a fool or a troll, long time member or not. I do not agree with shooting someone full of holes because they reach for a wallet, but at the same time when cops say "hands in the air" you had better put them in the air or face a similar fate.
All you have to do to find cops shooting, beating, killing or otherwise being unfair to whites is just google, if you can't do that on your own, or simply don't want to in order not to face the truth, too bad. Your statement about "waiting for whites to be shot by mistake" as if it has never happened is really a telling statement and points out your agenda and your prejudice.
I’m actually aware of cases of corrupt or brutal conduct towards white suspects.
Here’s an example. A white person was detained and then dropped off in a dangerous black neighborhood. Within the day, his body was found charred from being set alight, most likely by person(s) from the neighborhood. I believe this was in Houston, Texas.
I’m just saying that a white suspect (in the city) is more likely not to get roughed up and/or shot. In the outlying areas, as whites are the majority of the population and the odds of corruption or abuse are as high or higher than the city, then yeah, I’d expect the incidents to involve white suspects.
But to pretend that we don’t see these cases more frequently (lethal ones) involving minorities is, I think, a naive perspective. This isn’t just about MSM bias. I am VERY familiar with the cases in Tennessee, Wichita, Long Beach etc involving white victims of black hate crimes in spite of MSM ‘blackout.’ I am NOT seeing a lot of white suspects being ‘accidentally’ shot by cops.
You are correct that blacks are disproportionately represented in the police blotter and in the prisons. However, there are a number of areas where whites are a VAST majority and you should see a similar share of these cases occurring. Though, I will say the WoD has predisposed authorities to shooting up anyone during their raids, regardless of race.
It is precisely because of that overrepresentation that you mentioned that might lead officers to behave in a different manner towards black citizens and suspects than they might otherwise.
Thanks for your two reasonable and rational responses. I had almost forgotten the old FR where one could debate and discuss in such a manner.
:)
Do you recall how often an incident happens where a black police officer is not charged even though he was just as involved as the white police officers?
It’s happened in several incidents. It’s hard to claim a shooting was racially motivated when you a cop who is the same race as the victim is up on charges.
Have you checked your FReep Mail?
You posted: Hillary as a lawyer had an affirmative duty to not publicly prejudge their case.
***
It pains me to say it, but no attorney (except the ones prosecuting and defending the case) has any duty not publicly state his/her feelings about a case, even Hillary. The presumption of innocence is a legal presumption for purposes of the case only. I don’t think they were guilty of murder, but I could state my opinion before trial, as could those who thought they WERE guilty.
As you admit, the cops didn’t mean to kill an innocent man.
It ain’t murder.
Her husband also pardoned terrorists who had killed policemen in order to boost her vote in the ethnic group the terrorists belonged to.
The fact is that these police officers were tried before a jury of their peers, and acquitted.
I am in NYC and am very familiar with NYPD cases.
Knowing the NYPD as I do, and the rigorous, professional training they undergo,I doubt that race was even an issue in this case.
I am sorry that anyone in your family was treated differently for racial reasons. Unfortunately, it does still happen in many parts of the country.
There is large, stable, and ever growing number of memebrs of the Black middle class in NYC. They are teachers, lawyers, doctors, dentists, shopowners and homeowners. They go to work every day, and see that their children get a good education. These are the people you never hear about.
The NYPD has an excellent record in dealing with racially sensitive matters.
This is not about Hillary but about the case itself. As I see it, the only reason they should have been acquitted is because the DA was too stupid to charge them with something below murder (manslaughter would have been appropriate. IF I’m wrong and he DID do that, then I retract this bit.)
I think you pretty much are correct. But the point, surely, is that the DA was not too "stupid" to charge the cops with manslaughter - he was too Nifong. An innocent black man was riddled with bullets, and it wouldn't have been politically correct to admit of any charge but "murder most foul." And there was apparently no evidence that the death of that unfortunate man was the result of malice aforethought.What apparently happened was that one cop misinterpreted the actions of the suspect, and fired. And the others took the first shot as additional confirmation, and also fired. And so on, and so on. In two shakes of a lamb's tail the cops had riddled the poor guy. The true question is, "What caused the cops to be so placed that they were so easily convinced that they or their comrades were in danger?"
Hillary no more cared about the humanity of the guy who was the poor black victim than she did of the men who were the out of control cops - they were cardboard characters in her play. She only cared about votes. Nifong.
Wonder if they will still have jobs be alive on Monday.
There, fixed it for you.
I think there was a similar case of cops mistakenly killing an innocent black person in Chicago about the same time as the “41 bullets” death in NYC...but that case received no publicity because the cops involved were black (or at least the one who had fired the fatal bullet).
The Leftists I met are so extreme in their will to power and in their socialist agenda, that they share many of the same ideological beliefs as Hitler and his NAZI part.
Here’s how I address Leftists who repeat the often misapplied quip that conservatives are like NAZIs:
“I’m going to give you a list of characteristics that define an ideology and the founder of that ideology. There’s a quiz at the end of it so listen carefully:
1. A Socialist who believes all business should be run by the State and all profits made by business should be the property of the State.
2. Despises personal profit as greedy and against the good of the state.
3. Believes in a strong, state-run education system to instill the ideologies of “the party” counter to the teachings of parents and families.
4. Has full run of the media and used it exclusively to propagandize the views of the party.
5. When their economic system weakens, they seek to tighten regulations on business and to absorb the economies of others to compensate.
6. Anti gun and even implements and then enforces a national confiscation of firearms.
7. Pro abortion.
8. Pro euthanasia.
9. Pro eugenics.
10. Animal-rights activist.
11. Vegetarian.
12. Believes personal sexual fetishes are fine and a private matter, especially for politicians.
13. Hates Christianity and anti-religion in general, though tries to use the church for political support when needed.
14. Vehement anti-smoker who wants to ban all smoking nationally.
15. Believes in national healthcare as part of their Socialist platform.
16. Tries to enforce national exercise programs for both the physical and fiscal health of the State.
I’ve just highlighted some of the traits of Hitler and his Nazi party, which roughly translates as the ‘National Socialist Party.’ Here’s the quiz: Does this sound more like today’s American Christian conservative, or the left wing of the Democrat party?” I only met a few conservatives while living there. And most of them I met at pro-America/LEO rallies. I don't think most of them lived in Seattle but came from elsewhere.
My apologies sir!.
Regards - red
This is not the War on Terror,....I beg to differ.
BTTT
I accept your apology.
No hard feelings.
And yeah, there are deep cover agents here. As lame as they are..lol :)
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