Posted on 10/10/2007 11:43:35 PM PDT by Wiz
Turkey has denounced a vote by a US congressional committee recognising as genocide the 1915-17 mass killings of Armenians by Ottoman Turks.
President Abdullah Gul said the decision was unacceptable and had no validity for Turkey, which has always denied any genocide took place.
The White House said it was very disappointed by the non-binding vote.
It fears Turkey could now limit co-operation in the war on terror and provision of military bases near Iraq.
The genocide bill passed in the House Foreign Affairs Committee by 27 votes to 21 - the first step towards holding a vote in the House of Representatives.
Divisions within the committee crossed party lines with eight Democrats voting against the measure and eight Republicans voting for it.
(Excerpt) Read more at news.bbc.co.uk ...
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It has been 90 years since this event took place. Why is it imperative that we chose this time of all times, to insult an ally in this manner?
We are three or four generations beyond the 1915-1917 events. If it wasn’t imperative that we condemn Turkey’s actions before his, why now?
This issue is a sore subject with me. My town is about 60% Armenian now. And by God, they want this to be the old country. They do not accept that it is the United States. Every year the local contingent makes new demands that we observe their historical events. Balderdash!
Why is it that the U.S. flag must be at half mast, and city offices in my town have to close due to events that took place half-way around the world nearly 100 years ago?
If I were in Congress, I'd avoid addressing this issue.
It fears Turkey could now limit co-operation in the war on terror and provision of military bases near Iraq.
I wonder if that's what they intimated to our leaders hoping to stop the vote.
Face your history Turkey.
You mean the feckless piece of dog feces of an ally that pulled that bullcrap over the 4th ID transiting to northern Iraq and helped set up Falujah as a hard point?
When push came to shove, they went islamist. Screw em till they’re drowning in their own blood and their homes are ashen heaps.
Why the idiots in our legislator picked now... you’re probably right, but I have less charity in my heart for the domestic allies of our enemy than I do for the foreign, so its all equal in the end.
Just in case you were curious. None of the above is aimed at you for your opinion, just venting my views.
It is not a matter of time. Nazism does not change in its ideology by time, nor Islamofascism. This is a matter of tradition and ideology dead or alive. The difference between Germany and Turkey is regret of their sin, and the sin of their ancestory. There is no such improvement without admiting the mistakes done. Nazi regime has never revived in Germany. They admitted their mistakes, they admitted it as their own sins. This is what is important for mistakes not to be repeated. Turkey did not just deny its mistake, but kept on holding its imperialism even afterward as seen in Cyprus. They have repeated their own barbaric manners. Their tradition of Islmofascism is still alive today. Even worse, books promoting Nazism in Turkey has been popular these days.
Turkey is not an ally. It will never be forgotten that Turkey has betrayed US for denying access to Iraq during Iraq War. They have not just denied access, but attepted to invade northern portion in the first few weeks of the Iraq War. It is uncertain how many of our troops have died as the result of this obstacle. According to Turkey’s official site, more than 90 percent of Turks that responded to the poll opposed the war. It was an action against the spread of democracy, and sympathy for Islam.
Once again, this is not a matter of time, but tradition and ideology. Germany continues to regret the act of Nazism since it is not a matter rather they have done it or not, but a matter of the shame of their ethnicity and nationality, and their responisibility to continue to regret Nazism throughout generations.
Nazism is still Nazism after 50 years. Genocide is still genocide after 50 years. It will remain on history books, and it is the responsibility of both Germans and Turks to continously regret generations after generations that they no longer promote genocide.
The Armenian Genocide was a Muslim Jihad on Christians and Jews
People do like to pretend that the world was invented just yesterday, dont they?
Islam has an established record as a murderously expansionist ideology of absolute cultural obliteration in its conquests that goes back to its very founding days.
The only interruptions have been when a bigger badass came along (like the mongol) and whipped the deliverance’s out of them for a few generations.
Islam does not peacefully coexist because Islam can not peacefully coexist. Peaceful coexistence with non islam is expressly forbidden by the ideology.
Islam is no different of an abhorrent degeneration of mishmashed philosophy/religion and governance than was Nazism. No part can be separated from the others (religion, civil governance, philosophy) by design. The very few attempts to do so have been short lived, always under assault from within and never more than an eggshell thin veneer.
Those are my thoughts and observations on the issue.
Is there a national holiday for the Jewish Holocaust? No. Why then should our flag be replaced with the Armenian flag for one day and all city offices close? Yep, this is the demand. It’s just one more group that thinks this nation must change to suit them, not them change to fit in here.
I don’t defend Turkey for doing anything wrong in 1915-17. If the facts bear out that they were the sole aggressors and there weren’t mutual hostilities, then Turkey should apologize. I don’t dispute that. However, we’re ninety years down the road since these events took place, and although we shouldn’t forget it, it’s idiotic to affront a nation that has held off against provocateurs going across the border onto it’s soil.
What would we do to Mexico if it were sending in armed insurgents to kill people by design? It’s bad enough that foreign nationals just show up here and abuse our system, but if there were an insurgency, I don’t think we’d sit by like Turkey has for the most part.
I’m just not buying into the official condemnation at this time. If it could wait for 90 years, it’s extremely il-advised to do it while our troops are on the ground in theater.
I don’t disagree with you at all on the activism crap. I’m just bent in the way that makes me hate the islamos more than the Armenians (and their brutal gangs) annoy me.
But, like I said at the end of that bit of ugly vent above, none of it’s aimed at you. So, I do hope I didn’t write sloppily enough to make it sound personal.
Obviously, this is a big subject for you, so will try to state opinion respectfully.
Opinion: what exactly went on during World War 1 between the Armenians and Turks is not very clear. Were the Turks trying to wipe out the Armenians? Were the Armenians trying to take advantage of the Ottomans' fighting in the world war to secede and attain independence? Were 1.5 million Armenians killed to put out the uprising/secessionist movement or to ethnically cleanse the region of Armenians? Until there are straightforward answers to these questions, whether there was or was not genocide by the Turks toward the Armenians is not settled.
Because of some massacre, which did nor did not happen 90 years ago, you want the US government to take a position that has no benefit other than possibly assuaging the feelings of some long dead people in order to anger one of the few allies we have in the Middle East?
Although Turkey is not always taking the position we want them to, they are generally the most reliably Muslim country in their support of the US. They are currently fighting their own battle against Muslim extremists.
Let me make it simple. If we piss off the Turks with this meaningless gesture, more Americans will eventually die in the current battle against Islamofacism. How many Americans should die in 2007 through 2010 so Armenians will feel better about something that happened, or didn't happen, 90 years ago?
Idoicy
The islamos are a thorn in my side right now as well. Believe me, there’s no love lost for folks who abuse every good motive we’ve extended to them over the years. Those in our own nation that walk around as if they own the place, anger me.
We try to be fair to everyone. We should be fair to the Armenians as well. I have to tell you though, I have absolutely no patience for any group that wants to turn this nation into something else, be it Islamofascists or Armenians.
We are the United States. Leave your (immigrant groups) baggage at the door.
Your comments weren’t specifically addressed to me, but I didn’t particularly care for the implication that I don’t care what took place in 1915-1917.
What took place was between two nations on the other side of the world. I am not convinced the bad deeds were a one way affair. I will admit to not having studied the events of that specific region as well as I would have liked. I’m just trying to remain somewhat objective about it.
I HAVE seen what the personalities are like in my home town. I have a hard time thinking a people this proud and forceful could have been abused at will, but I am open to learning more about the facts and accepting the reality of it.
Thanks for the additional comments. I appreciated them.
In general terms, you’ve expressed what my concerns are. I wish more folks could understand this.
I am not convinced what took place in 1915-1917 Turkey were the same as what took place in NAZI Germany. If I were, I’d be angry that it took us 90 years to address it.
I just have a very hard time thinking we ignored a mirror of NAZI Germany for 90 years. Something doesn’t pass the sniff test here IMO.
I’m still not ruling out that I could be wrong. I just need to study this issue and come to a better understanding of what actually did take place. My hunch is that there’s some fast an loose play with the dynamics of the 1915-1917 events.
Genocide against Tutsis at the end of the twentieth century has been thoroughly documented.
Genocide against Armenians at the beginning of the twentieth century has not been thoroughly documented.
The Jews of the World War 2 Holocaust and the Tutsis of the Rwandan genocide were not attempting to overthrow or secede from their respective states. They were clearly attacked and persecuted for who they inherently (genetically or ancestrally) were, not because they were a de facto threat to the state (although they were portrayed as such). That they were murdered wholesale when they were not actively opposing the state is testimony to their being murdered in an act of genocide.
For the Armenian argument, this is not clear. As with Turkish Kurds today (seeing as you pinged an apparent Iraqi Kurd), Armenian Ottomans were seeking their own, independent Armenia. They may have even resorted to force to achieve that sovereignty. And this is why the clarity which would show an Armenian genocide by the Ottomans during World War 1 is muddied.
To be crystal clear, this is NOT to state that there was not a genocide against Armenians. There definitely could have been. However, as of today, the world in general does not have enough information to firmly decide that there was a clear-cut genocide of the Armenians at the hands of the Ottoman Turks during the first World War.
Europe pinglist ping.
Okay, since you don't seem to get it, let me ask you if you would like to see us have to expand our efforts in Iraq to include Turkey? Tell me, wouldn't that be grand?
Alright, listen up. I'll tell you what I get and where I got it. I'm one of those that have been watching the slow slid toward war with islam since the scumbags blew up my brother Marines in Beirut. This is not new. This is not something that just came up recently. This did not start with the Palestinian. This did not start with the founding of Israel. Islam has been at war with the non islam world since islam was invented by a sociopathic con artist as a comprehensive ideology of imperial conquest.
Islam is at war with the rest of the world. It has been since its foundation. It will be until its obliteration. The war against the rest of the world is mandated by the source document.
Now, about the Turk. The Turk turned betrayer because, at least in part, the islamofascists have gained significant power. That power is not going away by any means other than bloodshed. It never does, never has, never will. That is set in stone and easily observable at any and every point in islamic history. No islamic/muslim society has "westernized" or seriously secularized for any real length of time. It doesnt happen because it is forbidden. For as long as there is islam, there will be those who read it as it was intended and they will war upon their neighbor until their society is as islam demands it be. Then they will war upon their next neighbor, so on, so on and until there is no non muslim and all muslim are proper muslim (according to the muslim holding the knife) or until islam is beaten into temporary submission...or obliterated.
That cycle has been repeated ad nauseum in the history of islam.... except for the obliterated part. No one's gotten around to that just yet.
...And why after us not being in the region militarily for decades except for a short stint around 1992, our troops exposed to life and death issues in-theater, do you think now is a great time to push this issue in Congress?
The first part of your question I addressed above. The other part...Congress? I give less than half a squat for them regardless of what they do or why. It will be the wrong thing at the wrong time for the wrong reason. That is an expanded and more detailed version of what I posted to you on that issue in a preceding post.
As to the Turk in specific, we will have to fight them anyway, eventually. If they choose to go pugnacious over this bit of meaningless idiocy, then fine. Burn em to the ground. And yes, Turks have been flowing into the Iraq AO and providing cash and weapons and porting bombs around europe (and getting caught) etc etc etc. Maybe not officially, but who of our enemies do that "officially"?
The Turk deserves exactly zero consideration on any issue due to their already established proclivity to play the arab and be treacherous in this fight. There's always just enough assistance given to cause some among us to want to grasp onto hope of peaceful coexistence and cooperation, but the chances of that are slim at best.
The idea that the Turk would go overtly beligerant is silliness in the extreme at this time. They're advanced enough in military to understand that we can kick them to death and never have to put a boot on their dirt if we needed to.
Is Turkey today doing what it did in 1915-1917? It would seem that might be at least one prerequisite to pushing this issue at this time. Why after 90 years is this the best moment we could choose to address this issue?
As I said earlier, the Turk has only had a veneer of western secularization and that veneer has been eaten at since day one by various slow burn islamic insurgencies. The islamics have gained much power in the politics of the Turk in the last decade or two. The islamic insurgency will win because enough of the population is actually islamic in orientation that the change will be demanded. There is as much dominance in the Turk secular areas as there are the same sort in Pakistan. It's what we choose to see and ignore the rest. The rest will fight and win unless obliterated. That is how it works.
Until the secularists are willing to give up islam completely, islam will continue to be reborn as it was intended to be and it will, eventually gain supremacy in that population. 1000+ years of pattern and practice trump the supposed mutation of the last 70ish.
Nobody is making the claim that Islam is wonderful. Holy Cow, you really are dropping off the deep end here.
Oh, really? I am, am I? Your response to the issue was that the Turk must be mollified and coddled or it will become our enemy. I fully disagree. This bit of congressional idiocy means nothing, in any real terms. If it gives the islamics among the Turk an excuse to show their hand then fine. They are no threat. If they choose to become a threat, they can be depopulated/destroyed to whatever degree proves beneficiary. We really do have that much strength, and I'm not talking nukes.
If push came to shove and we didn't worry so much about who got hurt, we could have landed our forces on the west coast of Turkey and have destroyed our way to Indonesia by now. We do not have to play nice. So far we choose to. By putting forward the image that we give ourselves no option but to play so nice goes a long way to ensuring that this will, eventually, turn into a much much bloodier fight.
There is a real and true value to providing an enemy an undeniable reason to fear for his survival and the survival of his kith and kin. We have forgotten that in our social re engineered war fighting dogma.
I do view you as a good and decent person and I do realize my opinions on this issue are still considered to be in the extreme. That's fine with me, for now. But folk need to understand, bloody days are ahead of us for a long time. And it's not going to be over with Iraq and Afghanistan, nor when Syria and Iran have been thrown into the bucket.
About the Congress and what it did, why it did it, or whatever. My respect for Congress and the cowards and enemy sympathizers that infest that palace of corruption is not much affected by this latest idiocy. Only a declaration of unconditional surrender given to some random guy walking down a road in some randomly selected islamic neighborhood would cause me to view the Congress with less respect than I do now.
“Your comments weren’t specifically addressed to me, but I didn’t particularly care for the implication that I don’t care what took place in 1915-1917.”
If I implied that, it was accidental and your ire is justified. My contention is “I” dont care.
Because it is the truth.
Why are you afraid of the truth?
Enough of this kissing the ass of mooselimbs or chi-coms or venezuelans or cubans or any group.
Enough of concealing truths.
As Hitler himself said: "Who remembers the Armenians?"
The blindness of the west towards the jihadist democide of the Armenians was a direct factor in Hitler's genocide of the Poles and Jews. 1.5 Million people being killed at the edge of Europe with no, repeat no comeback - Hitler is on record as having taken note of this, and I bet Stalin and Mao did too.
The West does seem to have had a blind spot about this act of mass murder: kudos to your Govt for calling a spade a spade. Anything else would have been seeking rapprochment with Islamic murderers.
Your whole premise is off.
The Turkish parastate has never been an ally of the west. The only time Turkey was nominally an ally was during the cold war era when it was to their benefit to be bought off in exchange for putting bases there to watch the Soviets.
Your insulting of Armenian Americans is beyond the pale. Too bizarre.
The Turks would only agree to help and then knife us. It’s their way.
Good riddance.
“Are you convinced that Turkey was the sole aggressor here?”
Absolutely. 100%
You are correct.
The Rats are behind this, as usual.
This vote at this time undermines the safety of our troops.
What is the point of this action aside from disenfranchizing an ally?
Folks, you have to ask yourselves why, after 90+ years, the Dems would vote on a useless measure like this.
Then the answer come naturally: They want us to lose in Iraq. That vote was directly used to hurt our Iraq efforts by offending the Turks to drop their support. And it seems to have worked, the Turks are condemning the measure and might pull out.
“Because of some massacre, which did nor did not happen 90 years ago...”
The massacre did happen. 1.5 million dead. Whether or not it was genocide is another matter.
Absolutely right.
Everything the Rats do is intended to undermine the war.
Just look at the number of FR posters who are backing the Dems' action. Some people will never learn.
Sheesh.
One hundred years have passed...so to bring this up now...so what? If Turkey says its sorry...so what.
But lets settle the picture correctly here. The land of Turkey, was run by the Ottoman empire up until the early 1920s...by the Sultan. When you examine these periods of cleansing...which would run two to three years and then simmer....from the mid 1890s until around 1923...it was not the Sultan’s folks who started alot of this unrest. I would call them “young bulls” with an agenda...which was very fascist in nature...and very much anti-Sultan.
The cleansing? Oh...the young bulls would go through a region and start unrest...blaming the Armenians for creating the situation. Property would be taken. Assets in the bank would be taken...and the ones who stood up to challenge this...shot dead. So they slowly pushed the Armenians out of very neutral areas where they were part of the general neighborhood. They created concentration camps later...during WWI and work gangs. Starting to sound familiar? Maybe related to some Hitler dude in Germany? Yep...it is a carbon-copy.
But read on....the German military was there in 1915...and witnessed various acts...sending letters back to Berlin and demanding that the Kaiser bring this up and HALT the genocide going on. This is documented. The German government did nothing because they were involved in a war. The British and Americans....saw and documented vast acts....and attempted after 1919 to bring these up in a world court type setup. Nothing occurred. The guilty parties escaped any punishment.
The Sultan was eventually kicked out, and the new “fascist” government of Turkey, with Mr. Atatürk then took over...with a republic type “look”. Turks will talk boldly of their new government and how things got modern after the Sultan was kicked out. But make no mistake...this was a fascist-state and got results by extreme action.
So did Hitler learn from the Turks? Yes, without any doubt. We need historians to go through the Munich press and find the connection of Hitler and the methods he used in the 1930s/1940s with the Jews...because he learned every trick...from the Turks. He knew they would work....especially with his brown-shirts and a fascist-type environment that he created.
Modern Turkey....built itself on this entire concept. The modern enemy? The Kurds. Thinking about stopping the Turks...oh...don’t even joke about it. The US has this funny relationship that it can’t envision in any other fashion. The Turks are the friends of the US...even if they are modern-day fascists, and even if they would kill 50,000 Kurds tomorrow if given the chance.
So does anything matter 100 years later? Nope...really not. But its funny how you can lay the template of the young bulls of Turkey over Hitler and see the vast connection to the genocide of the Jews. Should that change our minds and make us care in 2007...over a 100-year event? It all depends on how you view your future in the world, and that of the Kurds. Have you learned anything about history yet? Or....the real question...what is the obvious thing that you should have picked up from years and years of observing history?
“Because of some massacre, which did nor did not happen 90 years ago...”
The massacre did happen. 1.5 million dead. Whether or not it was genocide is another matter.”
Perhaps it did. But please help me understand how any focus on this matter in any way will help us save 1.5 American lives, or perhaps, 15 hundred, or perhaps 15 American lives in the current flight against Islamofacism?
“But please help me understand how any focus on this matter in any way will help us save 1.5 American lives, or perhaps, 15 hundred, or perhaps 15 American lives in the current flight against Islamofacism?”
I haven’t seen anybody claim it will help save lives.
Sins of the father belong to the father (Ottoman Empire) not to the son (Turkey).
They insult us and the rest of the Western world by not acknowledging it. Turkish genocide denial is disgusting. Stating the truth that millions were killed in a genocidal bloodbath is an insult only to those who deny the truth. And honestly, I could care less about genocide deniers. If it costs us more money to move our troops and material by sea, then so be it. I have no interest in coddling genocide deniers.
This is just more proof that Turkey really isn't interested in being a Western country. Sarkozy is right in saying that they don't deserve to be in the European Union.
Idoicy
It did occur. And the word you are looking for is backbone. If it insults an ally so be it. I don't want to be an ally to a country that denies butchering millions of people.
>>have their ambassador in US leave with the embassy closed
Looks like they recalled their ambassador.
“Turkey recalls ambassador to U.S. over Armenians”
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20071011/ts_nm/turkey_iraq_dc_18
This isn’t about Turkey or Armenians.
Its about Democrats using a new method of trying to stop the progress being made in Iraq.
If they insult the Turks enough, they’ll cut off our using Turkey’s airbases, and landroutes, into Iraq.
Many of us know what happened NINETY TWO (92) YEARS AGO in this incident of what can only be described as ‘genocide’.
But thats not why the committee held this vote. They did it in an attempt to get Turkey to stop cooperating with the Bush Administration.
ping for later
I don’t necessarily disagree with your take on Islam. I would agree with your comments about ‘the true Islam’ also, in that different factions always seem destined to purifty those who foster a little different view of what is the correct observance of Islam. As for Islam moderating it’s stance, I haven’t seen any evidence of that either. In fact, I’m not a big fan of us allowing more immigration from Islamic states. IMO, the continuance of that exposes our population to all the destabalizing forces we’ve observed in the midst of Islamic states and regions. A person would have to be an absolute fool to miss the warning signs associated with this situtation.
Now as for Turkey as it relates to our present War on Terrorism, I don’t necessarily disagree with your take on whether it will decide to use military force against our will in the region. What I do think is quite likely is that they could decide that it’s pointless to play along with desires of the U.S. remaining as neutral has they have, and choose instead to aid the terrorists much the same as Syria and Iran are. This is something Turkey could to in a much greater capacity than they have. And our troops would be the ones to have to face the negative impact of this. Not you or I or others that think this is the perfect time to confront Turkey, would face what our troops on the ground would. Based on that, I can’t support a confrontation at this time.
Okay, you’ve determined that Turkey is going to go balistic on the world. Personally I think China is. Perhaps we could come up with some other nations we could agree might/or will become problematic later on. Do you want to help develop that list then attack all of them now? I don’t. I wouldn’t mind altering some of our policies, but I don’t think it the proper time to take on everyone we happen to disagree with. And that includes Islamic nations. Turkey may be a nation we’ll have to confront some day. It is not one we have to confront today. And if it is going to moderate it’s desires in relation to the Kurdish region of Iraq, then once again, I’m not going to sign on to a plan to engage or incite Turkey now.
Look, I am not confident Islam is going to change. I’m fairly certain it isn’t going to. And I actually think this may be part of the ‘end days’ scenario. All I can say is, that we need to think of what we are going to do before it winds up dragging other parties in the region unnecessarily right now.
Well, I hold very little respect for Congress. Still, when a leading body of our government decides to declare a condemnation of a state that borders a war zone our men are involved in, I want it done in a professional manner. Deciding to do it right now was sophmoric and down right idiotic.
Despite whatever Turkey has done in the past, it is NOT involving itself in the war in Iraq in nearly the negative manner Syria and Iran have. In the reports that I have read, Iran, Syria and Saudi Arabia have been the real problem nations. Right now we have set our sights on Syria and Iran. If that doesn’t moderate their actions, then I do support military resolutions to those problems. And if other problems don’t rectify themselves, then other decisions will have to be made.
Right now Turkey has moderated its desires. We all know it wanted to take action against the Kurds and hasn’t. Right now, that’s good enough.
When Iraq has calmed down and we’re out of the region, I don’t have a problem at all with discussing the events of 1915-1917 with Turkey. I do think it’s rather preposterous to demand things from fourth gerenations removed, but it should own up to its past. And if things are as bad as some have intimated here, it truly should.
I don’t actually consider it to be millifying or coddling Turkey to make the observation that it hasn’t been acting in a particularly bad manner during this war. Further, I think Turkey has shown restraint as it applies to Kurdish incursions onto it’s soil. And I don’t think it’s a bad thing to treat it with some respect for that restraint. I don’t seek to make the case that Turkey will not become a problem, or that it simply couldn’t. It may go that route in time. For the last fifty years or so, it hasn’t seemed to be the same state it was in the 1915 time frame. If has shown some willingness to work with us at times. At other times it hasn’t been quite as willing. Is this the time to lash out at it for something that happened 90 years ago? No.
Look, I appreciate the difference of opinion on this. In time we may have to declare the whole region in need of a attitudinal change, and mop up across the board. At such a time I’ll support the move. At the present time I don’t. We have engaged in a limited effort to stabalize the region, and I think we’re making some great progress in Iraq. As we do, Iraq will become it’s own protector and our job will be done.
Iran and Syria are in need of some correction now. In time, I think we’ll have to make a move. At that time, I’ll support it.
I apprecite your response.
Thanks for your comments here also. I appreciate your clarification.
As for being afraid, I don't think that's a word that applies, just because I'm not inclinded to assess judgement against one state until I understand more about what took place.
Well I don't think of it as kissing the ass of a state to declare that I need to know more before I can make a bonified assessment. Further, I don't think it's kissing ass to question why the Democratically controlled Congress found it worthy of fixing this, in effect addressing this issue at the current time. In the proper time and place, I think it's an issue that could be and should be addressed.
Concealing truths? You mean the truth of going out of our way to offend a nation state that borders a nation in which we are involved in war.
Joe, look, this is an issue that hasn't been settled in 90 years. Despite that, the Democrats who have hated our war effort since it's inception and have tried to sabotage it at every step of the way, have suddenly decided the issue of the Turks vs the Armenians is an issue that must be settled right now.
What bothers me as much as anything about this, is that good conservatives are more than willing to jump on this Democrat launched ship, and row with all their hearts. Wow! I guess the Democrats have really changed their stripes, and I better get with the program. Not hardly...
Yes, kudos to my Democratic controlled Congress who out of the blue suddenly became a supporter of our war effort and thinks it’s time to correct Turkey’s actions of 90 years ago right now.
The Democrats are desparate to find a way to turn this current war situation around. And now they’ve got some great allies.
Folks, this is the wrong problem being driven by the wrong people at the wrong time.
Is it a national holiday? Are all businesses nationwide closed? Is the U.S. flag stored away on St. Patrick’s Day while the Irish flag flies from all flag poles?
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