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Why conservatives should condemn Ann Coulter (vanity)
Vanity | October 12, 2007 | ChicagoHebrew

Posted on 10/12/2007 3:26:26 PM PDT by ChicagoHebrew

I've seen a significant amount of support on this board for Ann Coulter's recent comments on CNBC. Let me explain why that support is misplaced:

First, as an initial matter, I don't think Coulter's comments about Jews needing to be "perfected" are offensive at all. As an observant Jew, I obviously don't agree with Coulter. But Coulter's remarks here clearly represent standard Christian belief, and it's wrong and intolerant to condemn someone for her basic religious beliefs (provided, of course, that those beliefs don't cause one to do things like blow up Israeli school children or crash airplanes into buildings).

That being said, Coulter said more than standard Christian dogma. In explaining why the 2004 GOP convention was "like heaven," Coulter said "People were happy. They're Christian. They're tolerant. They defend America." That's flatly wrong and blatantly offensive -- attendees at the GOP convention included Christians, Jews, Muslims, atheists, agnostics and adherents of several other faiths. In defining the Republican Convention (and, tacitly) the Republican Party as Christian-only, Coulter has done a tremendous disservice to Republicans and conservatives in general. The fact of the matter is that you don't have to be Christian to believe in things like small government, strong national security, legal fidelity to the constitution, and basic moral values. No one here should defend attempts to define conservatism or the Republican Party as limited to believing Christians. . .

As an aside, please don't let this thread be dominated with replies trying to "convince" me that Christianity is right. Suffice it to say that I have heard and rejected every single one of those arguments. But, as is the nature of being a 1% minority, I -- like most Jews -- get missionized quite frequently, which we find very irritating. Kind of like door-to-door salesmen who keep showing up a few times a week and don't always take a polite "no" for an answer.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; News/Current Events; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: annbashers; anncoulter; antichrist; christianity; coulter; jews; macacamoment; mediamaters; sleepertroll; stalinisttactic
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1 posted on 10/12/2007 3:26:28 PM PDT by ChicagoHebrew
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To: ChicagoHebrew

Theologically, I agree with her. Politically, it was stupid.


2 posted on 10/12/2007 3:28:55 PM PDT by Mr Rogers (I'm agnostic on evolution, but sit ups are from Hell!)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

What is an “un-observant” Jew?????????


3 posted on 10/12/2007 3:30:43 PM PDT by Doc Savage (The tree of liberty needs to be refreshed from time to time with the blood of patriots and tyrants)
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To: ChicagoHebrew
In defining the Republican Convention (and, tacitly) the Republican Party as Christian-only,

That's an exaggeration of what she said.

4 posted on 10/12/2007 3:31:52 PM PDT by Jeff Chandler ("A person's a person no matter how small." -Dr. Seuss)
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To: ChicagoHebrew
Well this should be an interesting thread.

For the record, I stopped paying attention to Ann a long time ago. She makes too many outrageous statements that really are not helpful to the conservative cause.

5 posted on 10/12/2007 3:32:17 PM PDT by SaveTheChief (Chief Illiniwek (1926-2007))
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To: ChicagoHebrew
Coulter should not be condemned (too harsh a word).

Coulter appears to be a juvenile ditz who has difficulty coming up with substance and reverts to adolescent retorts (such as If Democrats Had Any Brains, They'd Be Republicans with Coulter making a 'modelesque' pose on the cover).

That stated, Coulter isn't all that crazy. This is just another case of pointing out somewhat superficial or partial flaws in subjects which are generally supported.

6 posted on 10/12/2007 3:33:08 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( What is your take on Acts 15:20 (abstaining from blood) about eating meat? Could you freepmail?)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

She was following her faith. It is not aligned with yours. Such is history and such is the future. Don’t take it personally, eh?


7 posted on 10/12/2007 3:33:28 PM PDT by Glenn (Free Venezuela!)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

Try this out on DU. Dont be ignorant. You remind me of a lib.

Like most of us do if offended, get over it. Disagreement is a human condition.

Christians get it socked to them daily, including here.

No one has a right to not be offended. I am not up for condemnation of too many people other than, perverts, liberal appeasers, and Islamo fascists. Words don’t kill.


8 posted on 10/12/2007 3:33:38 PM PDT by dforest (Duncan Hunter is the best hope we have on both fronts.)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

Ann uses extreme comments to draw attention. It sells books and keeps her on TV and in the talk show circuit. I’m no fan at all. I prefer to change the channel when I see her on TV.


9 posted on 10/12/2007 3:34:17 PM PDT by Clara Lou (Thompson '08)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

I wouldn’t think of missionizing you. I’d just appreciate it if you didn’t missionize us.

When you’re in a group that is 70-80% Jewish, do you find it highly offensive when a speaker addresses the crowd as if all the peopole were Jewish?

I’ve been in situations like that, and it wasn’t particularly alarming to me. I chose to enter a venue knowing I was the minority, and I realized what I might hear going in. Big deal.

Ann is a good person and I like her. I don’t find this problematic.

BTW, if you are of a mind to let this sour you on consevatives, you better think long and hard about who your friends are. And I can guarantee you Ann Coulter would line up behind you in seconds if a threat against the Jews were to rear it’s ugly head. I certainly can’t say that for other goups out there.

Think long and hard about who you saw parading around with Yasser Arafat, Fidel Castro and Hugo Chavez. They weren’t conservatives my friend, and it certainly wasn’t Ann Coulter.


10 posted on 10/12/2007 3:34:40 PM PDT by DoughtyOne (Hillary has pay fever. There she goes now... "Ha Hsu, ha hsu, haaaa hsu, ha hsu...")
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To: Jeff Chandler

>>>That’s an exaggeration of what she said.

BTTT

Off to buy another copy of her book, or two. I have them all; but I will need more now to support her.


11 posted on 10/12/2007 3:34:59 PM PDT by Calpernia (Hunters Rangers - Raising the Bar of Integrity http://www.barofintegrity.us)
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To: ChicagoHebrew
Please!

Ann said what she did to get a rise out of the person she was speaking to. I had a friend who used to say, "Guns for the Arabs; Sneakers for the Jews," to me. It was a joke. Judge these people by their actions and how they treat us.

Shabbat shalom.

ML/NJ

12 posted on 10/12/2007 3:35:40 PM PDT by ml/nj
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To: ChicagoHebrew

Sardonic is the operative word here.


13 posted on 10/12/2007 3:35:40 PM PDT by sappy
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I’ll stick with Anne, but thanks just the same.....


14 posted on 10/12/2007 3:35:50 PM PDT by clintonh8r (Waiting for the other Hsu to drop....)
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To: ChicagoHebrew
I -- like most Jews -- get missionized quite frequently, which we find very irritating.

Is it OK if we pray for you, our beloved elder brethren?

:^)

15 posted on 10/12/2007 3:36:04 PM PDT by JimRed ("Hey, hey, Teddy K., how many girls did you drown today?" TERM LIMITS, NOW!)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

you post a thread like this here, and then tell us what we can post? Unbelievable.


16 posted on 10/12/2007 3:36:18 PM PDT by RDTF (Proud member of the lunatic fringe)
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To: ChicagoHebrew
Christians could form their own political group.

Republicans are a more secular bunch, as you've practically stated, with adherents of a variety of faiths.

Also, while Christians would overwhelmingly tend to be 'socially' conservative, they may also be fiscally and otherwise politically liberal.

17 posted on 10/12/2007 3:36:18 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( What is your take on Acts 15:20 (abstaining from blood) about eating meat? Could you freepmail?)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

You are vastly over-reacting.


18 posted on 10/12/2007 3:37:05 PM PDT by ECM (Government is a make-work program for lawyers.)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

You have done a very good job of explaining why this particular remark by Ann Coulter was unwise and unhelpful.

I take exception to the call to condemn people for such things. You did precisely what was necessary...you explained why you took exception to the remarks and explained in sensible language why.

There is just way too much of the condemning and denouncing going on. It doesn’t bring people around to one’s way of thinking or seeing things.


19 posted on 10/12/2007 3:38:46 PM PDT by Bahbah
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To: ChicagoHebrew

You mean, you’re asking for this without even posting pictures? Wow, you’re way off.


20 posted on 10/12/2007 3:39:09 PM PDT by Kevmo (We should withdraw from Iraq— via Tehran. And Duncan Hunter is just the man to get that job done.))
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Comment #21 Removed by Moderator

To: ChicagoHebrew

If Ann Coulter was a muslim, she’d just say Jews need to be killed.


22 posted on 10/12/2007 3:39:19 PM PDT by struggle ((The struggle continues))
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To: ChicagoHebrew

As an agnostic, I can tell you that I am not offended by Ann Coulter’s remark, nor am I offended to be associated with Christians (or Jews), as this is a Judeo-Christian country. I like her quick wit, and while the left looks for another conservative to scapegoat, ridicule and lecture, I won’t be a part of it. Plus, Ann Coulter is smokin’ hot!


23 posted on 10/12/2007 3:39:19 PM PDT by SunStar (Democrats piss me off!)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

What I’d like to know is why so many Jews are liberal/progressive/Democrat when in fact leftist dogma is anti-Jew and anti-Israel.


24 posted on 10/12/2007 3:39:36 PM PDT by clintonh8r (Waiting for the other Hsu to drop....)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

I wonder how her secular Jewish boyfriend (New York politico Andy Stein) feels about this?


25 posted on 10/12/2007 3:39:47 PM PDT by Clemenza (Rudy Giuliani, like Pesto and Seattle, belongs in the scrap heap of '90s Culture)
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To: SaveTheChief

I’m with you. I don’t pay much attention to her these days since it has become pretty obvious that she is more about getting publicity for herself than she is about effectively advancing conservative positions. Just as an aside, her attempts to explain Christian doctrine and the Gospel on D. Deutsch’s show were pretty incoherent and garbled.


26 posted on 10/12/2007 3:40:17 PM PDT by Cecily
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To: RDTF

He didn’t tell you what you may or may not post. He clearly made a polite request—which is his right, and which you have the right of agreeing to or disagreeing with (and thus try to ‘missionize him’).


27 posted on 10/12/2007 3:41:06 PM PDT by Jedi Master Pikachu ( What is your take on Acts 15:20 (abstaining from blood) about eating meat? Could you freepmail?)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

I’m not trying to sell you anything. Are you?


28 posted on 10/12/2007 3:41:39 PM PDT by new cruelty
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To: ChicagoHebrew
"don't let this thread be dominated with replies trying to 'convince' me that Christianity is right"

Only enough room for you to convince others Coulter is wrong.


29 posted on 10/12/2007 3:41:44 PM PDT by I see my hands (_8(|)
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To: ChicagoHebrew
Why conservatives should condemn Ann Coulter

.. and if you don't you'll be a bigot?

To wit, No one here should defend attempts to define conservatism or the Republican Party as limited to believing Christians. Who intimated that?

I know the name of that tune. Name-calling was was top-40 throughout the last four decades of the 1900s. I hope we've moved beyond that. I for one will not condemn Ms Coulter.

Call me a bigot.. please!

The issue is what she meant.. not her. I am tired of seeing the individual being named the "issue."

30 posted on 10/12/2007 3:41:44 PM PDT by WilliamofCarmichael (If modern America's Man on Horseback is out there, Get on the damn horse already!)
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To: SunStar

Mega Agnostic Dittos!

I just wish a few of the Republican Presidential candidates would have half of the guts that this wickedly smart and funny lady does.


31 posted on 10/12/2007 3:42:08 PM PDT by exile ("Get off my phone, ya big dope"- The Great One)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

This is the USA. We have freedom of speech here. I think that Anne has a right to talk. It is just her opinion. This is a free country.


32 posted on 10/12/2007 3:42:09 PM PDT by GinaLolaB
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To: Jedi Master Pikachu

whatever


33 posted on 10/12/2007 3:42:14 PM PDT by RDTF (Proud member of the lunatic fringe)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

I give your vanity a 4 ... the righteous indignation is there, but it isn’t much to dance to and you didn’t threaten to leave if we didn’t all agree with you. Try a bit harder next time.


34 posted on 10/12/2007 3:43:19 PM PDT by JustaDumbBlonde
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To: ChicagoHebrew

I think David Horowitz has it right:

“I have received a surprising number of emails from friends basically asking “What are you going to do about Coulter?” This is a reference to her recent comment that she is hoping for the perfection of the Jews. My response is this: what else would a Christian hope for? That’s the message of the New Testament: Jesus came to fulfil, complete, perfect the Law. If you’re a Christian, that’s what you believe. If you don’t accompany this belief by burning Jews who refuse to become perfected at the stake why would any Jew have a problem? Why do some Jews think that Christians should not really believe what they believe while it’s okay for Jews to really believe they are God’s Chosen People? I don’t get it. Whatever happened to the pluralism of ideas? In any case, what I’m going to do about Coulter is finish her latest exhilarating book, If Democrats Had Any Brains They’d Be Republicans, which happens to be a hall of fame of her so-called “over the top” moments that drive leftists crazy. Right on Ann.”

http://frontpagemag.com/blog/Read.aspx?guid=4580397f-e030-431f-b7b5-d0c6d76604c6


35 posted on 10/12/2007 3:43:56 PM PDT by Main Street (Stuck in traffic)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

You live in an overwhelmingly-Christian nation and subscribe to a political philosophy shared by the overwhelming majority of those same Christians.

Deal with it and get over yourself. I’m sick of whiners of all stripes.


36 posted on 10/12/2007 3:43:56 PM PDT by RightOnline
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To: Jedi Master Pikachu
RE: 6

...such as If Democrats Had Any Brains, They'd Be Republicans with Coulter making a 'modelesque' pose on the cover...

Saaay...I happen to have that book on my book pile (queued up to be read at some distant date in the future)... Is it any good?

I enjoyed her other books -- dripping with pointed sarcasm (which was half the fun) -- and she also displayed excellent clarity in presenting her opinions.

37 posted on 10/12/2007 3:44:32 PM PDT by El Cid (Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved, and thy house...)
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To: ChicagoHebrew
As a Christian I think it is the only way. Coulter thinks Christianity is the right way. You are a Jew and must believe your way is the right way. Cut the lady some slack. There is no one, including Coulter, who believes that 100% of the Rebpublicans are Christian. It’s probably closer to 99%. Ha ha. Don’t be so sensitive. We Republicans are happy to have Jews and Muslims voting for the conservatives principles that the Republic was founded on.
38 posted on 10/12/2007 3:44:53 PM PDT by discipler (Shi Tao gets 10 yrs. Revealed China's plan to control the media on Tienanmen 15th Anniversary)
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To: ChicagoHebrew
Note to everyone upset with Ann Coulter's comments:

Get over it!


39 posted on 10/12/2007 3:45:15 PM PDT by TommyDale (Never forget the Republicans who voted for illegal immigrant amnesty in 2007!)
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To: ChicagoHebrew
That's flatly wrong and blatantly offensive...

Only to someone who is looking for reasons to be offended. The things some Democrats have said about our troops is what should offend you.

40 posted on 10/12/2007 3:45:20 PM PDT by JaguarXKE
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To: ChicagoHebrew
No one here should defend attempts to define conservatism or the Republican Party as limited to believing Christians. . .

I agree and haven't seen any posters making that claim.

I also have the liberty to talk of my faith and not be apologetic for my convictions in my beliefs.

I can acknowledge that others follow Scientology, Rev. Moon, wicca, paganism, devout atheism, etc. but I don't have to look for the "silver lining" in their belief systems.

There are a lot of misguided people in this world (see Scientology). Doesn't even have to be religious or political or dietary.

There are subjective differences of opinion (say in music). I can be tolerant of your difference of taste but I don't have to apologize for my lack of support for your choices, whatever they are.

Ann made a comment that can be heard in the clips' I've heard rebroadcast where she says that it would be good if was an observant Jew. The host says he is. That was an issue that could have been discussed to find some common ground. Not even settle the argument of which is the "true" belief system (or if Christians are "misguided" followers of a false prophet), just to speak about how that faith in something greater than themselves (Ann or the host) does affect their worldview and on that they can agree.

41 posted on 10/12/2007 3:45:34 PM PDT by weegee (NO THIRD TERM. America does not need another unconstitutional Clinton co-presidency.)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

I can’t argue or debate you on the merits of her latest comments because I haven’t heard or read them in their entirety and context.

What I can say is that Ann does not have any history I’m aware of that is remotely anti-semetic. I’ll give her the benefit of the doubt for the time being.

Maybe off-topic, but a lot of Jews believe people who support them do so primarily out of Christian views (G-d’s chosen people, etc....). I’d venture to say that Jews and Israel recieve a lot of support because of their admirable attributes (excluding the lunacy of voting for dems) as a people.


42 posted on 10/12/2007 3:46:31 PM PDT by umgud (Axis of Propaganda; lib academia, lib media, lib entertainment)
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To: ChicagoHebrew
Wrong.

First, if you are going to condemn someone for something they said, give us the quote. I'm willing to bet that you have misattributed something to Ann.

Second, Ann embodies a quality that every conservative should exalt. She speaks her mind, and is unabashed about her beliefs. We have many so-called conservatives who are afraid to say what they really think because it is unpopular or because some minority group objects to it, and that is exactly why the Left gets to control the debate so much of the time. We live in a virtual tyranny of the minority because people are afraid to say anything that might offend even the smallest minority group, and often that means that the speaker compromises his beliefs in favor of the group who claims offense.

Third, Ann is not running for public office. She can say whatever the hell she wants.

Fourth, the USA did, indeed, begin as a Christian nation. The Christian tradition was upheld fully until the last couple of decades. That doesn't mean that the US has to remain primarily a Christian nation, although I hope it does, but nobody gets to rewrite our history. If you don't like the history of the US, you are always free to move to a country whose history you do like.
43 posted on 10/12/2007 3:46:39 PM PDT by fr_freak
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To: Doc Savage
What is an “un-observant” Jew?????????
~~~~~~~~

Umm...one that believes in santa claus and likes hotdogs?
44 posted on 10/12/2007 3:46:52 PM PDT by mamelukesabre
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To: ChicagoHebrew

We Christian conservatives are very grateful for your participation in the political arena. I don’t think Coulter in any way feels you don’t belong. You are taking everything wrong, being particularly sensitive to this issue. She is talking about eternal matters when she says everyone shuld be Christian. The blood of Christ is the only acceptable sacrifice to atone for your sins. What she isn’t talking about is the Republican Party, other than in a general sense that many of them are Christians. The values represented (or at least used to be represented) by the Republican Party are Judeo-Christian, not uniquely Christian. So don’t worry about it. They are wonderful values, but you still sin and therefore still need a Savior — two different issues.


45 posted on 10/12/2007 3:48:20 PM PDT by The Ghost of FReepers Past (Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light..... Isaiah 5:20)
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To: ChicagoHebrew
I -- like most Jews -- get missionized quite frequently, which we find very irritating

Just be glad they weren't muslim.

46 posted on 10/12/2007 3:48:41 PM PDT by CzarNicky (The problem with bad ideas is that they seemed like good ideas at the time.)
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To: mamelukesabre

One who strays from a Kosher menu?


47 posted on 10/12/2007 3:48:47 PM PDT by TommyDale (Never forget the Republicans who voted for illegal immigrant amnesty in 2007!)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

Christopher Hitchens recently made the media circuit pimping his atheist screed against ALL religions (but specifically forcusing on how the world would be better off without Christianity). THAT is intolerant.

Islam’s worldview is that non-muslims are second class citizens under Islamic law. That is discriminatory and Islamic supremacist in ideology. They are tough on muslims who convert away from the faith of Islam because unlike non-muslims, they WERE saved and turned their backs on Mohammed/Allah.


48 posted on 10/12/2007 3:49:08 PM PDT by weegee (NO THIRD TERM. America does not need another unconstitutional Clinton co-presidency.)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

I think you have just identified one of the mysteries of life: Christians are conservatives and Jews are Democrats, and it’s a phenomena for which Ann Coulter cannot be held accountable.


49 posted on 10/12/2007 3:49:38 PM PDT by DJ Taylor (Once again our country is at war, and once again the Democrats have sided with our enemy.)
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To: ChicagoHebrew

Dude, you are missionizing (is that a word?) us for multi-culturalism - don’t say anything that might offend Eskimos, because there just might be one of them here amongst us, the 1,000 rednecks that gathered at this hall. Eff that, dude! That’s another demand for everyone to eat tasteless white bread, so that a slice of pumpernickel won’t offend a challah eater. Thanks, but no mucho gracias.


50 posted on 10/12/2007 3:50:54 PM PDT by Revolting cat! (We all need someone we can bleed on...)
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