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Wolf debate hits close to home for ranchers ( Canadian wolves )
Associated Press...The Billings Gazette ^ | November 24, 2007 | MATTHEW BROWN

Posted on 11/24/2007 6:50:43 PM PST by george76

PRAY - For rancher Randy Petrich, the removal of gray wolves from the endangered-species list - a move that would open up the animals to hunting in the Northern Rockies for the first time in decades - couldn't come soon enough.

Petrich has seen fresh wolf tracks almost every morning this fall - close enough to threaten his cattle.

"I believe that any wolf on any given night, if there happens to be a calf there, they will kill it," ...

Just 12 years since the wolves were reintroduced into Yellowstone National Park ... federal officials say the sharp rise in the wolf population in the region justifies removing them from the endangered species list.

It took $24 million of federal funds and more than two decades to bring wolves back ...

After years of debate, an initial 66 wolves were transplanted into the park from Canada beginning in 1995. Now, an estimated 1,545 roam Idaho, Montana and Wyoming - more than enough, federal official say, to justify removing them from the endangered-species list.

"The more of something you have, the less valuable each individual piece becomes," said Ed Bangs, the Fish and Wildlife Service's wolf recovery project leader. "If you have more wolves than you have now, it's really going to start causing a lot of problems."

David Mech, a University of Minnesota researcher considered one of the world's leading experts on wolf behavior, predicted populations in the Northern Rockies could hold steady or keep expanding, even with hunting permitted...

Since reintroduction, wolf numbers have increased 20 percent to 30 percent a year as the animals thrived in a habitat flush with elk, moose and other prey. Even where entire packs were taken out to curb livestock kills, new packs have quickly filled the gap.

(Excerpt) Read more at billingsgazette.net ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Government; US: Idaho; US: Montana; US: Oregon; US: Washington; US: Wyoming
KEYWORDS: animalrights; ar; canadian; canadianwolves; cattle; congress; corruption; depredation; econuts; eminentdomain; endangered; endangeredspecies; esa; g79; graywolves; predation; predator; predatorproblems; predators; privateproperty; ranchers; ranching; sss; taigawolves; usfw; wildlife; wolf; wolfattack; wolfattacks; wolfpacks; wolves; wolvesattack; yellowstone
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Hunting won't put a dent in these Illegally transplanted Canadian Taiga wolves. It will take trapping and snaring and aerial hunting. ... .

You've gotta love Ed Bang's comment - "The more of something you have, the less valuable each individual piece becomes" - We have one Ed Bangs and that's one way too many. Will someone please fire this clown? We can't afford any more of this Bozo's lassons.

ht comments

1 posted on 11/24/2007 6:50:45 PM PST by george76
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To: Troublemaker; girlangler; Montana Headlines; CarryaBigStick; 4woodenboats; Osage Orange

2 posted on 11/24/2007 6:56:15 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: george76
wolf numbers have increased 20 percent to 30 percent a year as the animals thrived in a habitat flush with elk, moose and other prey.

Pretty easy to increase 20-30% a year if this is what they mean by "other prey."

3 posted on 11/24/2007 6:56:56 PM PST by USNBandit (sarcasm engaged at all times)
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To: Carry_Okie; Unrepentant VN Vet; GOP_Raider

Leviticus 26:22


4 posted on 11/24/2007 6:57:40 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: george76

They should look into dogs to help guard their herds.


5 posted on 11/24/2007 6:59:15 PM PST by Mike Darancette (Democrat Happens!)
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To: george76

These poor unappreciated wolves need to be humanely trapped, transported, and released some place where they are truly loved and appreciated, such as Washington DC, New York, San Francisco, or Hollywood.


6 posted on 11/24/2007 7:00:02 PM PST by joshhiggins
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To: SJackson; familyop; B4Ranch; OregonRancher; Leatherneck_MT

Choose number three ?


7 posted on 11/24/2007 7:00:51 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: george76

Simple solution. The envirowhackos can put THEIR money where their mouths are. Every time a wolf kills any livestock, the envirowhackos must pay the rancher 10 times the value of the animal.


8 posted on 11/24/2007 7:03:18 PM PST by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
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To: Mike Darancette; MediaMole; redpoll; Diana in Wisconsin

Dogs would be a snack for a pack of wolves ?


9 posted on 11/24/2007 7:07:51 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: george76

A few years ago, as a drunk was driving toward us from the direction of a cluster of casinos with his bright lights on, we collided with a deer. The drunk called the Sheriff’s dept., and a deputy arrived within minutes.

The deputy said that his report of the incident would force us to file an accident report with the State (”because all of the deer belong to the State). He was very gleeful about it. He also spoke gleefully about how he wanted to feed the animal carcass to the wonderful wolves at the wolf preserve. ...went on and on about those wolves. He was very much in favor of radically leftist policies.

Having studied and worked with such people in the past, I know that most of them are radical socialists (and against our Second Amendment). Bureaucracy is self-perpetuating, and not all is as it seems to most people.

Big government leftists and corporates apparently have a wish to starve. They should allow our ranchers to do their work without impediments from political sociopaths who’ve watched too many cartoons full of fantasy animals.


10 posted on 11/24/2007 7:12:32 PM PST by familyop (cbt. engr. (cbt.)--has-been)
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To: LucyT

cattle ranchers like Petrich in the Paradise Valley north of Yellowstone...

Although his wolf kills have earned praise from fellow ranchers, Petrich shrugs off the attention, saying he shot the wolves out of necessity, to protect his ranch and his family.

“This is something we’re going to have to keep doing,” he said.

“I didn’t ask for this. ... We’re just going to have to cope with it however we can.”


11 posted on 11/24/2007 7:13:48 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: Mike Darancette
They should look into dogs to help guard their herds.

LOL

The old three S's have never failed.

12 posted on 11/24/2007 7:16:18 PM PST by org.whodat (What's the difference between a Democrat and a republican????)
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To: familyop; GladesGuru; Grampa Dave

We taxpayers wasted at least $ 24 million on this introduction of Canadian wolves...now we will pay much more to the beaurocrazies in management fees.

Ted Turner and friends will be happy.

/s


13 posted on 11/24/2007 7:18:13 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: george76
Meet the pack that's not a snack:

The Irish Wolfhound

14 posted on 11/24/2007 7:24:14 PM PST by Alas Babylon!
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To: george76
I've been stocking up on varmint class ammo in 30-06 and .270 Win. Idaho is getting close to having a plan in place when the wolves are delisted. Most of the locals have been complaining that they headed out for deer and elk and came up empty. We need a little predator management around here.
15 posted on 11/24/2007 7:26:06 PM PST by Myrddin
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To: george76

Ranchers won’t be able to just let their “meals on hoof” just wander around without keeping an eye on them. I’m all broken up about that.

To me, this sounds the same as someone complaining that their car got broken into in Chicago when they left a couple of fifties sitting on the front seat.


16 posted on 11/24/2007 7:31:42 PM PST by glorgau
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To: Mike Darancette

Darby Montana,Wolf “ate” ranchers dog.


17 posted on 11/24/2007 7:32:47 PM PST by Plains Drifter (If guns kill people, wouldn't there be a lot of dead people at gun shows?)
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To: Mike Darancette

Do you have a particular breed in mind? I don’t know of any that are as vicious as a wolf is. Nor do I know any that can fight as efficiently as a pack of wolves can.


18 posted on 11/24/2007 7:32:57 PM PST by B4Ranch (( "Freedom is not free, but don't worry the U.S. Marine Corps will pay most of your share." ))
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To: george76

I think a four or five year old Holstein would be a good choice ...... for dinner, said the wolves.


19 posted on 11/24/2007 7:35:40 PM PST by B4Ranch (( "Freedom is not free, but don't worry the U.S. Marine Corps will pay most of your share." ))
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To: B4Ranch

See post 14!

They were bred to chase down (IW is descended from greyhounds) and kill wolves. A male IW is over 6 feet tall on its hind legs and typically weighs about 180 pounds.


20 posted on 11/24/2007 7:39:49 PM PST by Alas Babylon!
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To: glorgau; SunkenCiv; jazusamo; JB in Whitefish; Issaquahking; Calpernia; maine-iac7; proud_yank

This is nothing like leaving a couple of fifties sitting on the front seat in a car in Chicago.


21 posted on 11/24/2007 7:43:52 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: Myrddin

The US Fish & Wildlife Service released these Canadian wolves in Yellowstone NP, tied all their money to Yellowstone...knowing that the wolves would harass several other states.

Sounds like the beaurocrazies do their management from their desks.


22 posted on 11/24/2007 7:47:14 PM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: Alas Babylon!

#14 must be a picture of female pups with one young male. I doubt any of them weigh close to 100.


23 posted on 11/24/2007 7:52:18 PM PST by B4Ranch (( "Freedom is not free, but don't worry the U.S. Marine Corps will pay most of your share." ))
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To: george76

Right on, George, but to the clueless it seems it is.


24 posted on 11/24/2007 8:12:01 PM PST by jazusamo (DefendOurMarines.com)
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To: glorgau
Ranchers won’t be able to just let their “meals on hoof” just wander around without keeping an eye on them. I’m all broken up about that.

Boo Hoo, they might have to spend some of that 90 Billion dollars in subsidizes they get on a few Irish wolf hounds to guard their cows that are grazing on federal land the taxpayer are paying for.

25 posted on 11/24/2007 8:14:14 PM PST by qam1 (There's been a huge party. All plates and the bottles are empty, all that's left is the bill to pay)
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To: B4Ranch
I have an English Mastiff that weighs in at a little over 175 lbs. I wouldn’t give a pack of wolves two seconds of survival if they ever attack his favorite couch.
26 posted on 11/24/2007 8:33:16 PM PST by IrishCatholic (No local communist or socialist party chapter? Join the Democrats, it's the same thing.)
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To: IrishCatholic

Eight, ten or twelve to one. Must be quite the killer dog you have.


27 posted on 11/24/2007 8:36:50 PM PST by B4Ranch (( "Freedom is not free, but don't worry the U.S. Marine Corps will pay most of your share." ))
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To: george76

There are various breeds of large dogs:Kuvas, Maremma, Pyrennes sheep dogs,that are raised with the sheep, consider them their pack, and run off predators [the dogs are generally white, or cream colored. Spanish mastiffs do the same thing, although they look nothing like sheep.

As for the wolves, there’s a large population in Michigan and Minnesota, largely in and among farms in the latter. And while there is stock predation, it is surprisingly low, considering the number of wolves estimated to be in the area. Must be something about that western air that causes them to kill all those cattle....


28 posted on 11/24/2007 9:33:30 PM PST by PzLdr ("The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am" - Darth Vader)
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To: george76

“If you have more wolves than you have now, it’s really going to start causing a lot of problems.”

They are already killing off the herds of elk in Yellowstone and National Teton area.


29 posted on 11/24/2007 9:34:38 PM PST by garylmoore (Faith is the assurance of things unseen.)
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To: Scotsman will be Free

Defenders of Wildlife has been paying ranchers for lost livestock, when proven to be a wolf kill for years. And as I recall, wolves that kill livestock are subject to execution.


30 posted on 11/24/2007 9:35:36 PM PST by PzLdr ("The Emperor is not as forgiving as I am" - Darth Vader)
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To: B4Ranch

HERE is a picture... the Irish Wolfhound on all fours has a head that is almost even with the lady handler’s shoulder!

http://www.windhundwelt.de/images/!!irish-wolfhound-095.jpg


31 posted on 11/24/2007 9:43:04 PM PST by muffaletaman
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To: B4Ranch

Borzoi, or Russian Wolfhounds, hunted in packs. They would run a wolf down, grab it by it’s neck and shake it. They usually worked in teams of two when taking out a wolf.


32 posted on 11/24/2007 9:44:56 PM PST by SatinDoll
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To: muffaletaman

Wow! What a gorgeous Irish Wolfhound.


33 posted on 11/24/2007 9:48:11 PM PST by SatinDoll
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To: george76

For the life of me, I don’t understand why ranchers ranch cattle instead of Buffalo. I only buy and eat buffalo meat. It tastes better than beef, is lower in cholesterol and saturated fats, and buffalo can protect their own against wolves, as well as being better able to withstand climatic conditions in the west.


34 posted on 11/24/2007 10:00:13 PM PST by ZULU (Non nobis, non nobis Domine, sed nomini tuo da gloriam. God, guts and guns made America great.)
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To: SatinDoll

Wolves that I have seen from the air in Northern Canada were in packs of 8, 10 and 12.


35 posted on 11/24/2007 10:03:19 PM PST by B4Ranch (( "Freedom is not free, but don't worry the U.S. Marine Corps will pay most of your share." ))
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To: B4Ranch

The Russians used wolf hounds in organized hunts while on horseback. I’m not sure whether the ferocity of Borzoi is even still intact. But a book written in the past five years by a German dog expert said quite bluntly that a Borzoi in kill mode was terrifying to watch, and that this breed wasn’t recommended for people with small children, cats, or dogs smaller than itself.

And Borzoi, bred from Greyhounds, can out run wolves.


36 posted on 11/24/2007 10:27:30 PM PST by SatinDoll
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To: PzLdr

Good. I have no romantic ideals when it comes to competing predators. Folks that want wolves can import them into their city parks, and deal with them.


37 posted on 11/24/2007 11:03:29 PM PST by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
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To: glorgau

Do you always make stupid comments or is it just on Saturdays?


38 posted on 11/24/2007 11:04:23 PM PST by Scotsman will be Free (11C - Indirect fire, infantry - High angle hell - We will bring you, FIRE)
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To: ZULU

For the life of me, I don’t understand why ranchers ranch cattle instead of Buffalo.

Your comments are spot on. Buffalo, though, is pricey. We bought buffalo roast instead of turkey this year. The cost was about $7.50 per pound. For that reason it can never compete with beef, even though the taste is better than beef.

If you know of a supplier that sells it for less than that, let me know.


39 posted on 11/25/2007 5:51:00 AM PST by sergeantdave (The majority of Michigan voters are that stupid and the condition is incipient and growing.)
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To: qam1

Six Wolves kill 650 pound yearling steer

By PERRY BACKUS
Montana Standard

ENNIS – Jim Nelson nearly had wolves at his doorstep Tuesday morning.

When feeding cattle in a nearby pasture in the Bear Creek area of the Madison Valley, Nelson was surprised to see six gray wolves feeding on a 650-pound yearling steer.

“He was so close that he could have thrown a baseball at them,” said his stepdaughter, Bennie Clark.

Clark said three houses are located within about 200 yards of the kill site.

“The kill was right in the center of all three,” she said.

That marked the fourth confirmed wolf kill in the Madison Valley in less than a week .

“We’re not moneyed people who can just absorb this kind of loss,” said Clark. She and her husband, Gary, owned the yearling that was killed. “This has a huge impact on us ... we’ve told Ed (Bangs) that we have to live here and want to make this work. Now we’re begging for help.”


40 posted on 11/25/2007 8:05:43 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: ZULU
The next step may be the bankruptcy of even more family ranchers who have been stewards of these lands for generations.

Even more of our beef supply will then come from feed lots. No more ‘free range’ beef.

Our feed lot food may be full of growth hormones, penicillin, and who know what else.

Buffalo tastes great to me, but it is more expensive to produce compared to beef.

41 posted on 11/25/2007 8:11:49 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: joshhiggins

... I second the motion to introduce wolves into Chappaqua, Hollywood and Capital Hill.


42 posted on 11/25/2007 8:14:04 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: glorgau
Ranchers won’t be able to just let their “meals on hoof” just wander around without keeping an eye on them. I’m all broken up about that. To me, this sounds the same as someone complaining that their car got broken into in Chicago when they left a couple of fifties sitting on the front seat.

To me, you don't know what you are talking about.

43 posted on 11/25/2007 8:15:37 AM PST by roamer_1 (Vote for HuFrudMcRomsonbee -Turn red states purple in 08!)
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To: PzLdr

“Frank Robbins runs about 3,000 head of Angus cattle. He said one 3-5 year old cow weighing 1,200 pounds is valued at about $1,000. “

“We’re missing 10-15 head,” Robbins said. His neighbor, who runs 300 head, is missing five.

He says the federal government “turned my ranch into a recovery zone for the wolf,” adding they “are willing to sacrifice us to get (wolves) delisted.”

In 10 years Robbins says he has never received any payment for loss of cattle to predators. In one case he said a predator control officer observed a wolf eating a dead cow, but the officer could not say what killed it.

http://www.codyenterprise.com/articles/2004/03/08/news/news2.txt


44 posted on 11/25/2007 8:16:17 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: Scotsman will be Free

I say share the blessing of wolf reintroduction—reintroduce a wolf pack into Connecticut and let the Limousine Liberals enjoy having their little dogs killed and eaten the natural way.


45 posted on 11/25/2007 8:18:19 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: qam1
Boo Hoo, they might have to spend some of that 90 Billion dollars in subsidizes they get on a few Irish wolf hounds to guard their cows that are grazing on federal land the taxpayer are paying for.

Thanks for that. I'm sure we'll be looking to New Jersey for more sound advice about Western matters. You haven't a clue.

46 posted on 11/25/2007 8:20:49 AM PST by roamer_1 (Vote for HuFrudMcRomsonbee -Turn red states purple in 08!)
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To: garylmoore; Myrddin

Myrddin noted the same thing in Idaho :

They are already killing off the herds of elk in Yellowstone and National Teton area.


47 posted on 11/25/2007 8:23:04 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: george76

“... I second the motion to introduce wolves into Chappaqua, Hollywood and Capital Hill!”

Lets add Gay Frisco, Marin County, Oakland/BeZerkley, Portland, Seattle, Denver, Chicago, NY City, Boston,
DC, Baltimore and Atlanta. Then make it a capital offense if any blue city liberals kill these beautiful animals.


48 posted on 11/25/2007 8:27:17 AM PST by Grampa Dave (("Ron Paul and his flaming antiwar spam monkeys can Kiss my Ass!!"- Jim Robinson, Sept, 30, 2007))
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To: Grampa Dave

‘...overall goal is to re-establish wolves in Montana’.

What genius thought this one up?

Shall we introduce locusts into our Iowa corn fields too?


49 posted on 11/25/2007 8:31:52 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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To: o_zarkman44

Borrowed this from you :

” For all the wolf and mountain lion lovers out there, a bullet in the head is totally reasonable when a predator invades and threatens man, livestock, pets or whatever.

I have no sympathy for the predator and all sympathy for the pet, and the people protecting their dog or their livestock.

The bullet and the shovel are the best defense against the envirowackos who think wildlife habitat trumps established human habitat.”


50 posted on 11/25/2007 9:06:24 AM PST by george76 (Ward Churchill : Fake Indian, Fake Scholarship, and Fake Art)
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