Marine general: Special Forces unit should have stayed in Afghanistan after shooting

AP via the North County Times ^ | November 29, 2007 | LOLITA C. BALDOR

[stylin19a]

Marines & Navy have the C.A.R. ( Combat Action Ribbon )

[freema]

They are too gorgeous to keep all to myself, don’t ya know ; )
jaz, love the drill team video!

[Mr Rogers]

Hate to throw a wet towel on y’all, but I believe this is the incident where the Marine unit returned to Jalalabad thru what they described as a 7 mile long ambush...along the biggest road in Afghanistan, immediately next to a large FOB with helicopter gunships waiting.

Didn’t happen. An ambush 7 miles long?

I’ve been on that road. The bad guys in the area don’t have the resources to put together an ambush like that.

Sorry, but these guys panicked and shot the place up without any justification by the ROE. They deserve punishment.

I would also note the local Army CC has a reputation for outstanding integrity. I’ve worked briefly with him, and talked to a number of his soldiers - they admire him to an extent I haven’t seen elsewhere in 24 years in the military.

There is no way investigating this incident was going to help his career, unless he swept it under the carpet. He wouldn’t do so. He made General based on an outstanding record, NOT being a suck up.

[brityank]

The Army Major Gen wears the C.I.B., Combat Infantryman’s Badge...The Marines don’t have that , yet it is one of the most honored badges amomg Army personnel..Maybe time Congress recognized the high honor it conveys and allow the Marines to design and have their own C.I.B. ...

Every Marine would get one; maybe you missed this up-thread:

"Only in the Marine Corps can you take an artillery man, or tanker, or a cook and tell him that he is an infantryman and he'll know what to do." - General CE Mundy

All of the Marines I served alongside in the Navy were infantry trained first, any specialization they did was in addition to those basics. You'd be hard-pressed to take a Snipe out of the Engineering Gang and throw him into a Deck or Gun Division and get him competent in a fire-fight situation. Marines do. They have to.

[brityank]

Remember when your soda came in glass bottles? How cool would it be to return to those days, but use glass imported from the middle east, and we wouldn’t have to worry about all those yammering rag-heads. I guess I’m just a simple fool, cause a few (hundred thousand) dead ragheads (by any method) doesn’t stir the calm of my pond.

Could save electricity too -- glow-in-the-dark bottles!

I'll drink to that.       ;^)

[RedRover]

If he’s not a suck-up, care to explain Kearney’s actions in the Green Beret case?

As far as your observations go, I have no respect for anyone who says servicemen are guilty based on his recollections of Associated Press accounts.

You didn’t throw a wet towel. Just irresponsible hot air.

[Mr Rogers]

The local Army CC I’m talking about isn’t Kearney...Col Nicholson was the local Army CC, and he’s been promoted to BG.

Nor are my comments based on AP accounts - I was at Jalalabad when this happened. I’ve talked with people who were part of the original investigation, and I’ve been on the road in question.

Not hot air.

[Mr Rogers]

I would also point out Col Nicholson took a fair bit of heat for apologizing for this incident...but it was the right thing to do, both as SOP & as a specific action in this instance.

[Recon Dad]

I guess I have to put my 2 cents in at this point. My son started out in 3/6 moved to Recon, then to Force and is now an Operator in Marsoc. He’s attended and been through everything every and more than other SpecOps person has been through.
Marsoc was created and is funded to put the Marines into the SoCom community.

[Recon Dad]

Force Recon was disbanded on both the East and West Coast and most of the operators were moved into Marsoc, the rest back to Recon.

[RedRover]

Gen Kearney is the commander who ordered MARSOC out of the theater. That’s who we’re talking about.

Your other comments remind me of Haditha. When news of the incident first broke, there were plenty of people in the military who said the Marines were guilty of murder.

On what basis? They had talked to people who talked to people who talked to people....Yeah, they deserved to hang. Everyone said so. And some of the loudest accusers had been in Haditha—though it turned out they didn’t actually see what happened.

But when it came to proving it, the evidence just wasn’t there.

Prejudging the MARSOC case, as you are, is absolutely hot air. NCIS agents (if that’s what you mean by “investigators”) are not trustworthy sources. And asserting that you have special knowledge just because you were on the same road is pretty funny.

If this goes to trial, we’ll see the actual evidence, if any exists. In the meantime, most people here believe our servicemen deserve the benefit of the doubt.

[Recon Dad]

but there are no Marines who have that kind of designation. There are only Marines who have trained for those kinds of missions.

You need to update your information in light of what Marsoc is doing. Marsoc operators are being trained to the same standards as SEALS and SF.

My son was started out in 3/6 moved to Recon then to Force Recon and is now part of Marsoc (Marine Special Ops Command).

[USMCPOP]

The Combat Action Ribbon is fairly high up in the order of precedence when worn. There is no medal, just a ribbon.

[mad_as_he$$]

My Delta operator friends will be hurt you left them out.

[Mr Rogers]

One fact you are ignoring - they claim to have been in an ambush 7 miles long. That claim is fantastic to anyone who knows the area. There is also physical evidence. There is simply no rational explanation for what they did that day.

As for Haditha, I always thought and still believe there was no basis for charges. My every instinct says to assume the soldiers/Marines/airmen acted properly. This is the one case where I cannot figure out an innocent explanation.

[Girlene]

Was it the right thing for Col. Nicholson to apologize for an event that wasn't fully investigated yet? See link here Conway Condemns Afghanistan Apology

"....On May 9, Col. John Nicholson, commander of the 3rd Brigade of the 10th Mountain Division in Afghanistan said he had conveyed "apologies" to the Afghan victims' families, giving them about $2,000 each in payments for their loss.

"I stand before you today deeply ashamed and terribly sorry that Americans have killed and wounded innocent Afghan people," Nicholson told the Afghans in a statement. "This was a terrible, terrible mistake. ... We humbly and respectfully ask your forgiveness."

...."Marine Commandant Gen. James Conway told reporters May 17 the recent statement made by a top Army commander in Afghanistan that the civilian deaths were a "stain on our honor" and a "terrible, terrible mistake" wasn't appropriate and did not factor in the presumption of innocence every service member enjoys."....

[PeteB570]

Sssssshhhhhhhuuussssss

They don’t exist.

[mad_as_he$$]

lol...”We do not acknowledge they exist.”

[4woodenboats]

That’s a keeper!

[miliantnutcase]

Yeah special operators were being overly taxed with the new 21st century style of fighting in Afghanistan/Iraq/Iran and they needed more qualified candidates and resources to call upon. The Marines for years have trained guys good enough to be a SEAL or a G.B. It only made sense they setup their own and train with SOCOM.