Posted on 12/20/2007 6:58:59 AM PST by wintertime
(snip)
American education will never be improved until we address one of the problems seen as too delicate to discuss. That problem is the overall quality of people teaching our children. Students who have chosen education as their major have the lowest SAT scores of any other major. Students who have graduated with an education degree earn lower scores than any other major on graduate school admissions tests such as the GRE, MCAT or LSAT. Schools of education, either graduate or undergraduate, represent the academic slums of most any university. As such, they are home to the least able students and professors with the lowest academic respect. Were we serious about efforts to improve public education, one of the first things we would do is eliminate schools of education.
The inability to think critically makes educationists fall easy prey to harebrained schemes, and what's worse, they don't have the intelligence to recognize that the harebrained scheme isn't working.
(snip)
(Excerpt) Read more at jewishworldreview.com ...
So?....If the FR government teachers posting on this board are intelligent, and on average teachers aren't too bright, there must be some very stupid teachers on the lower end of that bell curve. I hope your kid doesn't have one.
The fact that Walter Williams and Thomas Sowell aren’t lauded as national treasures from every rooftop morning, noon and night is a national disgrace. The fact that they are invisible to the MSM is a crime.
I have mentioned studies about teacher ACT and SAT scores to my fellow teechurz. They are not too happy when they hear this. Of course, I’m just the token conservative in the teechurz lounge. Sadly I see many teechurz in my own publik scewl that are only here because they attended scewl here and now want to COACH here.
Many of these blockheaded bozos can't find Cuber on a map, or name any state and they'll gaze at the map forever.
Yet, they continually are granted 'contract' raises every contract expiration time and wonder why their salaries buy so much less ignoring the fact that their undeserved increases cause inflated prices.
People are voting down school levies with increased regularity.
Perhaps you should transition to teaching and show them how it’s done. Or you could complain on a message board. I’m sure that will solve the problem with equal speed.
Yes, there is much, much room for improvement ...
I am in a demanding profession, and many of my colleagues constantly criticize teachers, with their summers off, easy jobs, benefits, etc.
But the one thing I never understand is: if the life of a public school teacher were as easy as people say it is, why don’t smarter people become teachers? Is it the money? Yet, I don’t hear more calls for increased pay.
Our son has been a high school teacher for many years and has enough material to write an interesting, but frightening book.
I'd suspect that the attitudes, core beliefs, and intelligence of teachers on this forum are in no way comparable to the average NEA-loving, leftist indoctrinationists that make up a huge proportion of the teaching profession.
Many of the kids are incapable of expressing a cogent thought or write a paragraph that is easily understood.
It’s because the parents aren’t involved and demanding of junior to actually excel at the coursework assigned. The teacher can motivate a child to a point at school, but after that, it’s the parent’s job. The common factor between a great home school education and a great public school education? Parental involvement.
Yep, even at the “good” universities...
Unfortunately, the statistics prove you wrong. American children are less well educated than almost everywhere in the "developed" world, and many places in the "developing" world. SURELY you have seen the results of standardized tests for math and science given to groups in different countries???
"My parents have dedicated their lives to educating kids."
All my female forebears for three generations back taught school. I thought about it, and had actually intended to major in chemistry and minor in education--imagine my surprise when I found out that it was impossible to do so--you had to major in education to be allowed to take education classes (at a major state public college). So, the ed biz lost out, and I became a chemist and instrument designer instead.
I recently witnessed a situation where a a veteran AF officer of 8 years, graduate of the Air Force Academy, Pilot, with a major in math and mechanical engineering was turned down to teach H.S. math because Ohio does not recognize the AF Academy credentials. That is “freakin” pathetique.
I will clarify that my observations are my own. My views are not a blanket statement. There are some very qualified teachers. But the system has purposely been diluted.
Williams supports his article with facts ... the SAT scores are solid indicators of a trend. The answer from a politician is throw more money at it. Boehner/Kennedunk proves their own IQ. And on that statement I will shut up and keep my powder dry.
Actually, most of these "inter-country" tests pick the "best and brightest" kids for each country to take part, so I suspect "parental involvement" isn't a factor. Thse are our "elite" students. The sad fact of the matter is that the US educational system is grossly deficient, and has been "dumbed down" so badly that our children are being short-changed in a major way.
Me brudder is an engineer who got tired of being squeezed by low-quality, cheap Asian competition. He’s in a crash program at what was once a State Teacher’s College, and is now a State College. He tells me that most of the “How to Teach” classes are basically about trying to understand little Jimmy/Juan/JaMille’s background and deprivations and about trying to manipulate evaluations into soft-scored group efforts that will protect those who wouldn’t otherwise pass, so that the “No Child” tax money will keep coming in.
Absofreakinglutely!
The intellectual requirements for the job are not challenging, the curriculum required for teacher training is not intellectually challenging (e.g., blackboard use 101), other college majors. e.g., biology, physics, are too demanding and the education major has traditionally (at least since I was in college in the 1960's) has attracted those who cannot handle anything else.
public school ping
Exactly the missing component, according to conversations with my son.
The education system is deficient because we the voter allow it to be so. It is like a child, it will live up to our expectations or grow more corrupt from our neglect. I agree with what was posted earlier that it is much easier to get on these chat boards and complain then to actually do something about it.
People complain about the NEA being so powerful. Well, if parents and the concerned public would actually get together and fight the NEA the power would shift.
Our education system is so broken it will take a major shift in public opinion and a very strong coalition of a truly concerned public to right this sinking ship.
I went to college to become a teacher, putting myself through all the way - working 8 hours a day on top of it.
What I saw horrified me then - teaching future teachers how to cut out paper figures to paste on boards instead of filling their minds with the knowledge to impart to their students. After watching higher level student teachers get shocked in their internships, I changed my major to business and never looked back.
I thought it interesting that as an Air Force brat, everytime I went out of country and attended Catholic schools, I came home 1-2 grade levels ahead of my new public school. And when I went back overseas, my grades always went down as I caught back up. They made me learn, and taught me right.
In the late 80’s, I worked part time as a file clerk in the education department at my college. I looked at a lot of high school and college transcripts of education majors. A majority of these transcripts were filled with C’s and D’s. Dr Williams column is spot on.
If I could live on it I would love to go into teaching but I would be taking a 50% pay cut. Not to say that teachers are not aquatically paid but until the concept of paying by merit really catches up I don’t the starting salary for a teacher will be high enough for me any time soon.
I think they should also pay by pupil (see then if they complain about class size). If you can teach a class of 30 kids (and do it well) you should get more than someone who can only teach a class of 20 at the same grade level.
Well, the point remains, though. Either it is an attractive job, or it isn’t. If it is, then why aren’t smarter people doing it? If it isn’t, then I’m sure glad that somebody is willing to do it.
It’s funny that you say that. My wife, mom, and sister are all teachers. They are all very strong, competent women. But I see exactly what you are talking about, Rudder.
I do think pay has a lot to do with it. My wife is a 4th grade teacher, in her 12th year with a Master’s in Educational Technology, and make over $80k per year. She’s in one of the top paying districts in Southern California, and it attracts the better teacher because of the pay. They are able to pick and choose who they hire, and there are rarely openings other than retirement.
That being said, the district is in a low-rent area. A good chunk of the kids are from families whose parents don’t speak English. Many of the kids come to school having not showered in a week, or they haven’t eaten properly in a great while. Many come to school sleepy because they stay up until 11 or 12 o’clock playing video games, but don’t do their homework. And the test scores aren’t where the state would like. Is it the school’s fault? I don’t think so. But someone has to take the blame. And the politicians are afraid to place blame where it really belongs.
That’s exactly what my wife’s district does. She receives a stipend for every trimester per student over 27. Last year she had 32 kids all year, and got a $3000+ bonus. This year, she has 26 kids, and is in a much better mood. Haha.
I share your grief, comrade. I, too, am a publik screwl teacher and notice the same phenomenon you are describing on a yearly basis.
“But the one thing I never understand is: if the life of a public school teacher were as easy as people say it is, why don’t smarter people become teachers? Is it the money? Yet, I don’t hear more calls for increased pay.”
I think the per money student being spent is more than adequate. What needs to happen is the school systems themselves have to do better with the dollars they are given.
For instance. Why not go to classes of 30 (in middle and high school)? Why not hand teachers more power in discipline. In a school of 3000 kids going from 20 to 30 would save you *50* teachers. Take that money and split it up among the 100 or so teachers who you keep around. Take the rest and give it back to property tax holder or use it for boos / supplies.
But instead we have this
“The Morgan-Hart Class Size Reduction Act provides funds to school districts for participating schools that reduce class size in Grade 9 English and one other Grade 9 course required for graduation, either Mathematics, Science, or Social Studies. The majority of pupils in participating classes must be identified as Grade 9 students. (Districts which implemented the program prior to June 30, 1998 may also be serving Grades 10, 11, or 12.)
Average class size for the school year at each participating school can be no more than 20:1 per certificated teacher and no more than 22 pupils enrolled in any participating class.” — http://www.cde.ca.gov/ls/cs/mh/
BTW,
My plan was/is to ‘retire’ to teaching when I’m 50 but Ill be you dollars to dough nuts that an Engineering Degree, an MBA, and 30 years of experience in engineering wont be enough for me to be a Math teacher...
When I was a kid, a lot of the brightest women were teaching school. Now the brightest girls are told that they are “too smart to be a teacher.”
Another feather in the hat of the feminazis.
Economic analysis (thank you Dr. Sowell):
You can increase pay, ie, pay more for a product, when that product is superior. Superior products (teachers) will be attracted to the higher pay/price.
The way to improve any product is to introduce competition so that those products that are superior are in more demand and thus can have their prices set higher and attract more of the same superior product.
Unfortunately, the teachers’ unions fight competition with all their power, so we end up with what we have.
In Buffalo every few years, the city teachers are required to take a proficiency test that high school students are supposed to(or required to, I don’t remember) pass to receive a diploma. Many of the teachers fail this test. They can’t even pass a test to graduate from high school.
Of course, the poor performance of the teachers is immediately met with cries of racism.
Re-read my post about "the best and brightest". Kids don't get into that category of competition with un-involved parents. In fact, most of them probably have "type-A" driver parents.
But then, you're so focussed on blaming absentee parents and making excuses for lousy teachers and school administrators, you can't "see the forest for the trees". The "ed biz" in the USA is grossly deficient by world standards. The tests prove it. It is NOT "media hype".
There is a tremendous disparity among the children who come into our public schools. The average child comes into kindergarten with a working vocabulary of approximately 2500 words. The average inner-city child arrives at school with a working vocabulary of 400 to 500 words.
And the teachers are supposed to remedy that problem? Impossible.
Having gone through public schools myself, I don’t believe our schools are deficient hellholes. I saw kids (that applied themselves) get great educations, and I saw other kids (who jerked around and never took a book home) fail. Parents were the difference.
That sounds appropriate for a curriculum that has been watered down.
I know an 8th grader whose “advanced” math teacher’s idea of teaching math is to let the kids watch reruns of “Numbers”.
Thinking critically is a necessity for a teacher. Hmmmm.
Actually, if the teachers are, in fact, at the lower end of the spectrum in general, that means that all those parents who homeschool their kids, who are not teaching majors, are actually better qualified to teach their own children than your average public school teacher.
Come and stick up for yourself. :)
“In the late 80’s, I worked part time as a file clerk in the education department at my college. I looked at a lot of high school and college transcripts of education majors. A majority of these transcripts were filled with C’s and D’s. “
Where I live you don’t get into college with a transcript like that, not even as an education major.
Anyone who feels their skills are better than the vast majority of teachers can easily transition into the profession. Perhaps more should consider doing so. I am considering it, though not for any reasons of ego. I won’t do it until I feel I can do as good of a job as my parents do every day.
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