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VIKING REVISIONISM
http://www.interweave.com/spin/spinoff_magazine/default.asp | winter 07 issue | Judith MacKenzie McCuin

Posted on 12/21/2007 7:39:54 AM PST by finnsheep

Gutefar - The Bronze Age Sheep of Gotland

This article claims sheep of the British Isles descended from sheep from Gotland, an Island in the Baltic "...arriving in Britain between 2,000 and 3,000 years ago, doubtless traveling along with the same Viking raiders that brought sheep originally to Gotland." She also claims Vikings are the ANCESTORS of the Visigoths.

Only problems is that the Visigoths preceded the Vikings by about 400 years. The Visigoths sacked Rome in 451 AD and the first recorded Viking raid on the British Isles happened around 800 AD with the raid on the monastery at Lindisfarne.

The people who might have brought sheep to the British Isles 2,000 or 3,000 years ago would have been Celtic peoples or even their predecessors. The only folks raiding the British Isles 2,000 years ago would have been Romans.

She also claims the Icelandic sheep are descended from sheep from the island of Gotland which is also not true since Icelandic sheep arrived with the first humans in 874 and they came from NORWAY!

Further on in this article she claims the prehistoric mouflon is the ancestor of the Big Horn sheep (Ovis canadensis) of North America. Only problem with that is that it isn't true either. The Big Horn sheep's closest relative isclosest relative is the Siberian wild sheep (ovis nivicola) and the Big Horn diverged from them 600,000 years ago. Genetically the Big Horn belongs to the Pachyceriform group, not the Moufloniform and evolved separately from them having diverged 1.4 million years ago.


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: ancientnavigation; animalhusbandry; britain; godsgravesglyphs; gotland; history; medieval; thevikings; viking; vikings; visigoths
This is an eight page article that begins with false statements and builds on them in the subsequent pages.
1 posted on 12/21/2007 7:39:55 AM PST by finnsheep
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To: finnsheep

Well, I THINK this calls for DNA testing to see if the sheep are indeed related to the Visigoths, or even the Scots....


2 posted on 12/21/2007 7:41:52 AM PST by Rick.Donaldson (http://www.transasianaxis.com - Visit for lastest on DPRK/Russia/China/Etc --Fred Thompson for Prez.)
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To: finnsheep

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fvLs5KXWYI

ALL HAIL...


3 posted on 12/21/2007 7:42:38 AM PST by picard (Liberal: ability to supplant reality with multiple truths which are all in opposition to each other)
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To: finnsheep

Vikings or their predecessors traveled far more extensively and earlier than many people think. There are hieroglyphics in Runestone State Park in Heavener, Oklahoma http://www.oklahomaparks.com/detail.asp?id=1%2B5U%2B5325 long before the Spanish or French explored the area.


4 posted on 12/21/2007 7:49:17 AM PST by DBCJR (What would you expect?)
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To: finnsheep

This doesn’t have anything to do with Viking Kitties, does it?


5 posted on 12/21/2007 7:49:55 AM PST by Oberon (What does it take to make government shrink?)
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To: Oberon


No stinking Visigoths in my ancestry!!


6 posted on 12/21/2007 7:52:07 AM PST by ConorMacNessa (HM/2 USN, 3rd Bn. 5th Marines, RVN 1969. St. Michael the Archangel defend us in battle!)
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To: picard

Can anyone spell “narcissism”?


7 posted on 12/21/2007 7:55:11 AM PST by DBCJR (What would you expect?)
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To: DBCJR

This thread is useless without SPAM.


8 posted on 12/21/2007 7:58:08 AM PST by massgopguy (I owe everything to George Bailey)
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To: DBCJR
Can anyone spell “narcissism”?

B-I-L-L C-L-I-N-T-O-N.

9 posted on 12/21/2007 7:58:46 AM PST by KarlInOhio (Government is the hired help - not the boss. When politicians forget that they must be fired.)
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To: finnsheep

I have never hearda anything else than our sheep being from Norway (or Scandinavia in general).

If she finds DNA that says they are from Gotland there could be a simple reason for it. Since sheep were taken from Scandinavia to Iceland about 1200 years have come and gone, during wich time a lot of influx of new sheep DNA to Scandinavia has probably happened. But in islands like here in Iceland, in Shetland islands (Hjaltland like we call them), Faoerer island and Gotland the old stock was preserved and isolated.

Probably because the sicknesses that must have come with the migration of sheep to the rest of Scandinavia, and we people of the islands have not wanted to endanger our sheep when they have heard about the sicknesses.

About weather sheep from scandinavia have been part of the genetic makeup of the british sheep, it is probable, as England used to be called Danish Law, as it was under Danish control for quite some time.

Sometimes people seem to be able to spin crazy stories from little or no evidence, probably they already had spun them, but then tried to find any proofs for them. It is not scientific.


10 posted on 12/21/2007 8:02:22 AM PST by Leifur
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To: Rick.Donaldson
Well, I THINK this calls for DNA testing to see if the sheep are indeed related to the Visigoths, or even the Scots....

Come now, everybody knows sheep come from the muslims.

11 posted on 12/21/2007 8:02:43 AM PST by JEC ((Pray for ALL our troops))
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To: DBCJR

No, it is not that.

In my youth, I was there. It is power. It is invulnerability. It is sheer ‘Aliveness’.

There was a time when I was so strong, that I could move the world to my whim. Notice how the crowd moves when he moves. He implicitly controlled them. Not in a malevolent way but just with his spirit. All things are possible.

That guy is 10 times more ‘alive’ than most people, including me.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svR3iXKTJvc


12 posted on 12/21/2007 8:03:11 AM PST by picard (Liberal: ability to supplant reality with multiple truths which are all in opposition to each other)
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To: finnsheep; SunkenCiv

Ping


13 posted on 12/21/2007 8:05:20 AM PST by Fiddlstix (Warning! This Is A Subliminal Tagline! Read it at your own risk!(Presented by TagLines R US))
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To: JEC

Oh, sorry. I thought those were pigs though.


14 posted on 12/21/2007 8:17:07 AM PST by Rick.Donaldson (http://www.transasianaxis.com - Visit for lastest on DPRK/Russia/China/Etc --Fred Thompson for Prez.)
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To: finnsheep

How do they explain their 6 loses this year?


15 posted on 12/21/2007 8:18:21 AM PST by Tatze (I'm in a state of taglinelessness!)
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To: Tatze
How do they explain their 6 loses this year?

2 to the cheese packers
1 to dem Cowboys
1 to an early season, pass happy Lions. Got revenge later in the seson.

Iggles an KC losses unexplainable.

16 posted on 12/21/2007 8:26:02 AM PST by toast
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To: ConorMacNessa

Thank you for making my day. - I love the Viking Kitties.


17 posted on 12/21/2007 8:29:21 AM PST by Martins kid
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To: toast

Viking Revision History? I was so disappointed to read this article was about sheep. I wanted it to detail how in the 1975 NFC Championship Game, Drew Pearson had pushed Nate Wright down and incurred an offensive interference penalty. The Cowboys subsequently lost the game 14-10 and the Vikings went on to the Superbowl. That’s the kind of Viking revisionist history I’m looking for...


18 posted on 12/21/2007 9:00:16 AM PST by philled ("CNBC?...You might as well be doing ham radio at that point."-- Dennis Miller)
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To: finnsheep

Bloody Vikings...


19 posted on 12/21/2007 9:02:03 AM PST by null and void (I've always liked Ron Paul, he is not a like a serial rapist. - rovenstinez)
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Breaking News from Scotland....

New Use for sheep has been found.

Wool.

Film at 11.....


20 posted on 12/21/2007 9:10:15 AM PST by Vermont Lt (I am not from Vermont. I lived there for four years and that was enough.)
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To: Fiddlstix; blam; StayAt HomeMother; Ernest_at_the_Beach; 1ofmanyfree; 24Karet; 3AngelaD; 49th; ...

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21 posted on 12/21/2007 8:02:24 PM PST by SunkenCiv (Profile updated Tuesday, December 18, 2007___________________https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: KarlInOhio

wonder what a jane fonda-bill clinton kid would be like?


22 posted on 12/21/2007 8:07:53 PM PST by ken21 ( people die + you never hear from them again.)
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To: Leifur
"...as England used to be called Danish Law, as it was under Danish control for quite some time."

Yup. That was my people...they were R1b (DYS390-23) from Denmark. If You're Irish, you're probably R1b (DYS390-24). I learned that this past year when I had my family DNA analysed. BTY, my last name is LAMB (hence, blam).

23 posted on 12/21/2007 8:12:50 PM PST by blam (Secure the border and enforce the law)
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To: finnsheep

Damn ... can’t imagine going thru the rest of my life not knowing this ... now my life (knowledge wise) is complete.


24 posted on 12/21/2007 8:17:19 PM PST by BluH2o
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To: massgopguy

This thread is useless without SPAM.


But I don’t like SPAM!


25 posted on 12/21/2007 8:21:06 PM PST by Grizzled Bear ("Does not play well with others.")
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To: Grizzled Bear

I don’t care what anyone says. Vikings had horns on their helmets just like in the movies.

I didn’t know Vikings ate SPAM. Did they fry it and make sandwiches? Or did they chop it up in soups and stews?


26 posted on 12/21/2007 8:29:14 PM PST by Grimmy (equivocation is but the first step along the road to capitulation)
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To: picard

bloody spam-eating vikings....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wZ7YedEopp4


27 posted on 12/21/2007 8:45:35 PM PST by Pelham (No Deportation, the new goal of the Amnesty Republicans)
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To: DBCJR
“Vikings or their predecessors traveled far more extensively and earlier than many people think. There are hieroglyphics in Runestone State Park in Heavener, Oklahoma http://www.oklahomaparks.com/detail.asp?id=1%2B5U%2B5325 long before the Spanish or French explored the area.’

Might not want to bet on that, though. According to Dr. William Savage, the professor who taught Oklahoma history at OU a few years ago, there are no viking artifacts associated with the Heavener Runestone. Just the carvings themselves. My personal opinion of Savage is that he’s a jerk, but a competent and knowledgeable jerk. He’s certainly an entertaining lecturer...

28 posted on 12/22/2007 4:52:39 AM PST by Old Student (We have a name for the people who think indiscriminate killing is fine. They're called "The Bad Guys)
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To: finnsheep

Didn’t read the article. But the Goths did come from Southern Sweden. Some of them might have been ancestors of the Vikings, not the other way around. At any rate, they might have been closely related.

How does Gothic compare with Old Norse liguistically? There is part of the answer.


29 posted on 12/22/2007 7:39:37 AM PST by ZULU (Non nobis, non nobis Domine, sed nomini tuo da gloriam. God, guts and guns made America great.)
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To: Old Student

There is folklore around Mulberry, AR of another Viking hieroglyphic site. Only locals are aware of it and it hasn’t been looked at professionally to my knowledge. What I wonder about that, making the assumption these are in fact of Viking origin, is how did they get this far inland? The Arkansas River was not navigable until we dredged it for barge traffic, unless Viking boats were wide based with little to no keel. We are talking about 600 miles inland from the Gulf. My understannding is that the hieroglyphics are inconsistent with Native American writings.


30 posted on 12/22/2007 9:27:09 AM PST by DBCJR (What would you expect?)
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To: Grimmy
"I didn’t know Vikings ate SPAM."

Everyone knows they ate lutifisk. {;0)

31 posted on 12/22/2007 9:45:58 AM PST by cibco (defconw - "Where do I get me a pheasant?")
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To: DBCJR
“What I wonder about that, making the assumption these are in fact of Viking origin, is how did they get this far inland? The Arkansas River was not navigable until we dredged it for barge traffic, unless Viking boats were wide based with little to no keel. We are talking about 600 miles inland from the Gulf. My understannding is that the hieroglyphics are inconsistent with Native American writings.”

Viking longships are, in fact, wide, with not much in the way of a keel. From what I know of them, it is “possible.”
The runes are, as far as I know, as you say, incompatible with native writing. Dr. Savage’s conclusion was, he says, drawn from the fact that in excavations around the Heavener area, there are absolutely no viking artifacts. Not so much as a bead. Not sure how you would tell an Indian bead from a viking bead, but every other site I know of where the vikings stayed for even a little while, they left a lot of artifacts behind.

Best guess is 18th or 19th century hoax.

32 posted on 12/22/2007 1:39:10 PM PST by Old Student (We have a name for the people who think indiscriminate killing is fine. They're called "The Bad Guys)
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To: finnsheep
Vince was the best coach EVER - I do not care what you say!!!!

Oh not those Vikings, never mind.

33 posted on 12/22/2007 1:44:31 PM PST by mad_as_he$$ ("Has there been a code nine? Have you heard from the Doctor?")
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To: cibco

lutifisk? That’s a food?
I have always thought that was the term for what Vikings did to villages.


34 posted on 12/22/2007 5:37:35 PM PST by Grimmy (equivocation is but the first step along the road to capitulation)
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To: Oberon
I don't know, but I was a Viking one summer night long ago after drinking a sixpack of Ripple...
35 posted on 12/22/2007 5:43:00 PM PST by hinckley buzzard
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To: finnsheep

Yes, Scandinavia, where the men are men and the sheep are nervous!


36 posted on 12/22/2007 7:27:45 PM PST by Huber (And the light shineth in darkness; and the darkness comprehended it not. - John 1:5)
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37 posted on 03/26/2011 5:34:56 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (Thanks Cincinna for this link -- http://www.friendsofitamar.org)
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