Skip to comments.Gunman made sexual advances (Tinley Park near Chicago)
Posted on 02/05/2008 10:55:42 AM PST by Mad-Margaret
The killer of five women at a Lane Bryant store in Tinley Park made sexual advances on at least one of the victims before the slayings and may have targeted a women's shop to avoid confrontation with men, a source said Monday.
The gunman entered the store after 10 a.m. Saturday and chatted briefly with some of the victims before announcing a holdup, and may have initially feigned that he was making a delivery, sources said.
He then took the women to a back room and bound them with duct tape he had brought with him, a law-enforcement source said. He said that before the shooting began, the man made advances toward one or more of the women.
(Excerpt) Read more at chicagotribune.com ...
And, he chose Chicago so as to avoid a confrontation with a legally armed citizen, IMHO.
Tinley Park is not Chicago, though Illinois doesn’t have CCW.
Here’s a prediction: when caught and identified, he’ll be a repeat violent offender on probation.
Understood, but the same thought applies.
Tinley Park isn’t Chicago. It’s a village with its own Mayor.
I have no problem with the death penalty.
Well, OK, Just one. It will take too long to snuff the scumbag.
Reminds me of the Richard Speck killings. I lived not far from where it happened.
Are malls now shooting galleries? Why not have metal detectors at mall entrances? Or (much as I hate it) someone to look in women’s purses and men’s pockets. I’m angry at the current practice, at certain stores, of only looking in women’s purses. Men’s pockets need to be looked in, too. A surprising number of men carry knives. How much could a metal detector, and a guard at each entrance, cost?
Yeah, I caught the irony, with my tagline.
Oh, my gosh! I was just thinking the same thing this morning. We are really dating ourselves.
My mother’s office was in Roseland, not far from Mr. Matuzek’s bar (I hope I spelled that correctly-he was the father of one of the slain nurses). There was no doubt in my mind that Mr. Matuzek would have killed Speck with his bare hands if he’d ever been released in Mr. Matuzek’s lifetime.
How ironic that the survivor here was also a nurse in training.
How about this... piss off, you ain’t looking in my pocket, and if I’m carrying a weapon, tough. Tough on the jackass that pulls his out to shoot innocent people.
I’m SICK of people thinking that metal detectors, or searching INNOCENT CITIZENS is the way to go.
(Oh and I know you were kidding!!!!!!!)
One of the many lovely folks (along with Manson, Unruh, and others) who benefitted by having SCOTUS throw out the death penalty in the early 70s.
When I first heard about this, I figured it would turn out to be an ex-husband or ex-boyfriend of one of the women, not a stranger.
His physique should make him stand out in a crowd.
” Mens pockets need to be looked in, too. A surprising number of men carry knives.”
You want to make men not able to carry a knife?
This is trully heartbreaking...I (like you from the other thread) thought that this was somehow related to one of the woman who worked there. My gut instinct was that this was a jilted boyfriend/husband/babydaddy who went nuts. Sadly, alot of the young girls I have worked with have had alot of ‘drama’ in their lives. This scenario is all the scarier...the randomness of it...and the premeditiation (a woman’s clothing shop early in the day). This makes sense that the police did not confirm that there was a survior (protecting her). Any leads or other info in the Chicago news?
What were you doing in that neighborhood? I thought those apartments had been demolished.
The first home my mother owned was in Jeffrey Manor. It was a duplex. We moved to our first house (in Rosemoor) when I was 3. And we kept moving southwest.
The people who once lived in Jeffrey Manor are the parents and grandparents of those folks who now live in Tinley Park.
The cost would be enough to eat up the profits of any store in a strip mall, and it would be ineffective.
The cost to the stores of allowing concealed carry is a big fat zero, and that would be more effective than anything else.
And before you say there wouldn't be anyone with a gun there, I live in an Oregon county. Shall issue is the law of the state, and in our county I am proud to tell you that just under 17% of the total population has permits. Now, subtract out all of those under legal age and I bet 25-30% of the adult population has carry permits.
This kind of stuff just plain doesn't happen around here. Who wants to face those kind of odds?
I'm really torn on this. While I hate people searching my purse (what are they looking for?), I hate the fact that men's pockets aren't searched. Why should a woman be searched, but not a man? Men are primarily the violent ones, not women. I also would have no problem with a metal detector. So, as distasteful as this all is, you got a better idea?
The amazing thing about Jeffrey Manor is that so much of the nabe was built AFTER WWII, basically as an alternative to suburbia for plant managers/city workers. I know that it had a large Jewish population until the late 1960s.
Speaking of the last demographic point: I understand that the old South Shore Country Club did not allow Jewish members, even after the neighborhood became heavily Jewish. Its now a public course (with a nice view of the lake).
I am a law abiding citizen, I DO NOT and will not conform to any rules that deny me the right to defend myself or others.
You may find the metal detectors a valid argument from your perspective, however, those of us who have been in confrontations and know what kind of animals are out there, will never submit to being disarmed.
Just to add another thought for you. I would defend your life in a heartbeat, even though you would not.
I didn’t mean a guard and metal detector at the entrance of every store in the mall, but just at the entrance TO the mall. That certainly can’t cost that much. And, whatever the cost, every store in the mall, including the mall itself, could share the cost. There are usually dozens of shops in a mall, so if it was spread between them, the cost would be minimal.
I’m still not convinced that one of the victims didn’t know the killer. I just can’t get my mind around a robbery at a Lane Bryant in Tinley Park.
And there’s still no composite sketch of the killer!
Here’s an article from the neighborhood paper about the search for the killer.
Why would you need a gun at the mall? If everybody went through a metal detector, and no guns were allowed in, what would be the problem? I admit it’s not a perfect solution, but do you have a better idea? I’m just exploring ideas on what we can do to prevent our malls from becoming shooting galleries.
I'm assuming you're not being sarcastic here. I've got an idea for you. HOW ABOUT LETTING THE LITTLE PEOPLE GO ARMED? The murderers are armed, and the victims are not. THIS IS HOW THE GOVERNMENT WANTS IT. Or did anyone think that the criminal came in and took a gun away from one of his victims and then killed them with it.
The government wants several things. First that the populace be reduced to helplessness. If you're totally helpless, then you can't oppose the government, and that is one hell of a lot more important than the safety of any number of citizens. Second it doesn't want citizens to be able to defend themselves from criminal attack, because if they did, then the citizens might get the idea that they might not need so many donut sucking police and so many taxes to support them.
Frankly I find your attitude more worthy of Sara Brady than of free republic, but that just might be me.
From re-reading your post, he brought duct tape...and taped them...and held the gun on them while getting them all to the back room? And only one made it out? I think I am misunderstanding something...and I agree w/you...he may have had some kind of failed relationship w/one of the women. You would think that displays/mannequins could be over turned...a fire alarm pulled...something to distract the perp. This is just so odd and scary.
In other news a school bus careened off a bridge. killing 19.
I’m sick of school buses.
You are naive to think the criminal mind will adhere to following the rules.
You are naive to think that putting a machine in place for the appearence of safety is nothing more than a false sense of security.
I carry, because I can. I carry, because the police are not liable for my safety, I am. I carry, because there are people in this world who have no remorse for taking life from others. I carry, because I am a valuable contributor to society and not a victim to be slaughtered like sheep. I carry because I am trained and willing to defend others. Whether that happens is not dependent on me, but the resolution should it happen may rest with me.
Had ANY of those women been trained, armed, and able, they possibly would not be dead.
The message Concealed Carry delivers to the criminal element is simple.
You do not know who is carrying, and most likely will get shot trying to commit any atrocity.
This incident didn't answer that question for you?
PUT THE KOOL AID DOWN AND STEP AWAY FROM THE PITCHER! Are you daffy, trying to play Devil's advocate or are you just a trolling flaming liberal? I deal with criminals on a daily basis and I know what's out there. That's why I carry at the mall and anywhere else I happen to go. And when I get home, I don't put my pistol up. Although I live in an upscale neighborhood, that's no guarantee that a home invasion can't happen. Anymore you need to be prepared all the time.
I had no idea there was a large Jewish population in Jeffrey Manor. I thought they were farther north in South Shore and Hyde Park. Those used to be such beautiful neighborhoods. I went out with a Jewish guy when I was in my teens. His grandmother lived across from the country club. Her apartment was HUGE. They just don’t build apartments like that with so much character any more.
I was born in Hyde Park — at Lying-In Hospital. I feel so old.
Very well put!
Looks like you did all the typing for me.
I thought the same thing. Why rob a retail store right after opening? Most places only open with $200 cash in each register, plus this time of year people are still using gift cards and making returns.
Tinley Park is a nice place. I hope they catch this person soon.
I believe I stopped at this mall once. Really tragic.
This one is brand new, off 191st and Harlem. It’s near the Tweeter Center. The area has been really, really built up in the last few years.
D’oh! Never mind...you were talking about something else.
Slinking back to lurkdom....
Agree, never cooperate with a guy with a gun and duct tape that wants to take you to a back room. There were five women there and they should have made a run for it or tried to push him down and then run. Sure, you risk being shot, but the alternative is risking execution of all.
I only know Harlem further north, where all the good Italian delis are. ;-)
Because there are wolves who on occasion come hunting for sheep at the mall. Trolley Square in SLC, Westroads Mall in Omaha, and now this one in Tinley Park.
If everybody went through a metal detector, and no guns were allowed in, what would be the problem?
What happens when the guard(s) at the metal detectors get popped in the head by the wolf, and the wolf goes right on through the metal detector into the mall full of unarmed sheep? I'll tell you what happens - we get another mall full of dead, innocent sheep.
Im just exploring ideas on what we can do to prevent our malls from becoming shooting galleries.
Our malls have already become shooting galleries, and what you propose disarms only the law-abiding sheepdogs who desire to protect themselves, their families, and possibly even you. If you want to be a sheep, fine with me, continue to be one. But don't suggest policies that tell the sheepdog he can't protect himself or his loved ones.
If you want to be a sheepdog, I say to you welcome to the fraternity, and strongly suggest you read Jeffrey Snyder's "Nation of Cowards", and also the essay by Lt. Col. Dave Grossman "On Sheep, Wolves, and Sheepdogs", from his book On Combat.
So.. I was wrong in assuming you were JOKING???
See post 3 & 5
Women have been known to kill other people. They can and do carry weapons. A man can use a woman to carry a weapon in her purse. I sincerely hope you don’t get too offended if your purse is searched. If that offends you, I suggest you consider how a man might feel.
Stupidity cost a lot more than a Metal Detector and a cop.
Women can be just as violent. Most children killed by a parent, are killed by the Mother.
***So, as distasteful as this all is, you got a better idea?***
Should the mall in my area institute such draconian regulations for shoppers, it would see the LAST of me. As is, there WERE a few places around town that I refused to visit because they adorned their store with a sign that read in part “Pursuant to Section 30.06....” that forbid CCW in their place of business. They were removed at all the places I cared about because business declined and/ or store owners were contacted and informed that it was believed they could be sued by citizens attacked in their premises when they forbid us to carry.
So, while I respect any businesses right to conduct business as they see fit, I hope they respect my right to take my money elsewhere.
***I hate the fact that men’s pockets aren’t searched.***
Reminds me of a famous movie: “Is that a gun in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?”