Posted on 02/29/2008 7:10:19 PM PST by Plane_Guy
The lawsuit is a fact...go ahead and deny it. No offense, this is typical of free trade. If you show a believer absolutely factual evidence, they ignore it. This is why I believe free trade is almost a religion-based on faith not facts.
By the way, I would love to hear people who believe in the free market explain the Bear Stearns bail out...free market for the manufacturing sector. Let the factories rot...but not apparently the financial sector which proves my point. There is no free market. Trading is done in order influence foreign policy or to make lots of lots of money for individuals aligned to the politicians of both parties(they give lots of lovely money ). No care or concern for the country... except of course the financial sector.You have drunk the free trade kool-aide when you refuse to believe factual evidence.
By the way tax breaks are not the same as a direct subsidy. However, apparently the government does not agree with you or they would not be suing in WTO court. I am confused. I thought you said the lawsuit was BS? It doesn’t change the point that we awarded a multi-billion contract to a company we are in the process of suing.
Take your blinders off, Boeing has gotten millions if not billions of dollars in handouts from the government.
I know this is not true because American companies are routinely sued by foreign companies over this issue and usally win in that hotbed of American haters known as the WTO.
I will add one more thing. Global trading policies have weakened the US while strengthening China. I believe China is our enemy and think any policy that enriches them allowing them to increase military spending is both shortsighted and stupid.
But you have no problem with Boeing farming work out to China?
ROFLMAO!
Of course I do... I do not believe any company especially one which does military work should allow manufacture in China. I believe companies that move jobs overseas should lose tax breaks and pay higher taxes. However, the US government has forced companies like Boeing to manufacture overseas in order to lower overall costs. The trade issue needs to be addressed. Really, the current recession is a direct result of the so called free market which isn’t really free. The government bails out wall street (Bears and Stern) while allowing manufacturing to be destroyed. Free trade for everyone but the Wall street people I guess.
Funny, because it seemed to me that you were getting all tied in knots over Boeing not getting the contract.
So if Boeing got the contract that means the chinese would have a hand in building them would it not?
But instead you B&M about an American company (Northrop-Grumman) building a licensed copy of an European design (Airbus) using American manufactured parts.
Here is a list of the companies that are onboard with Northrop-Grumman:
Alabama
Airbus
EADS North America
Engelhard Specialty Chemicals (BASF)
GKN - Westland Aerospace Inc.
Goodrich
KBR
PPG Industries
Thompson Engineering
Alaska
Northrop Grumman Technical Services
Arizona
American Aerospace Tech Castings
Goodrich
Honeywell
Intec EDM
L3 Communications
Parker Seal
Arkansas
Triumph Fabrications
California
ACRA Aerospace
Air Master Prod Corp
Alcoa
Ametek Aero
Argo Tech
Avibank Mfg, Inc.v Barry Controls
Carlton Forge Works
Cast Parts Inc.
Circle Seal Controls
City Wire Cloth
Dowkey
Easterline Mason
Eaton Aerospace Corp
Fischer Custom Communication
GKN Aerospace Chem-Tronics
Goodrich Aerostructures Group
Hartwell Corp
Hexcel Composites
Hi-temp Insulation
Honeywell
Independent Forge Co
ITT Aerospace Controls Division
Jet Manufacturing
KGS
Kirkhill Rubber Co.
Meggitt Safety Systems, Inc
Morton Manufacturing
Northrop Grumman Integrated Systems
Northrop Grumman Mission Systems
PAC Industry
Pacific Scientific
Parker
Pentacon Aerospace Group
Phoenix International
PSI Bearings
RBC Transport Dynamics
Schlosser Forge Co.
Stillman Seal
Synergy Microsystems
Teledyne
Thermal Structures Inc.
Transdigm Adelwiggins Group
Viasat
Colorado
GE Polymershapes
General Aluminum Forgings
Goodrich Corporation
Connecticut
AGC Inc.
Alinabal Corp.
B&F Machine
Columbia Manufacturing
Kamatics
Westport International
Delaware
GE Polymershapes
Florida
ABA Industries
BRPH Companies Inc.
EADS North America
Gables Engineering
GE
Kam Specialities
L3 Communications
Northrop Grumman Integrated Systems
Northrop Grumman Technical Services
Pall Aeropower Corp
Georgia
Millennium Solutions Inc.
Parker Hannifin
RCF Seals & Couplings
TIG Hitco
Vought
Idaho
Bamcorp
Illinois
Abrasive Form
Danville Metal Stamping
Hamilton Sundstrand
MPC
Northrop Grumman Electronic Systems
NTN Bearing Corp of America
Indiana
Alcoa
BAE Systems Controls
Honeywell
L&E Engineering
Morris Machine
Praxair Surface Technologies
Reeder & Kline Machine
Iowa
Alcoa
Rockwell Collins
Kansas
Arrow Electronics
Honeywell
Kentucky
Andrews Laser Works
Ellison Surface Technologies
GE Turbine Airfoils
Parker Seal
Parkway Products
Louisiana
Haynes International Inc.
Maine
Prescott Metal
Stewards Fire Extinguisher Svc.
Maryland
Middle River Aircraft Systems
Northrop Grumman Electronic Systems
PerkinElmer Fluid Sciences
Massachusetts
Ametek Aerospace
B&E Tool
Berkshire Manufactured Products
Bomco Inc.
Fenwal Safety System Inc.
Hansen Engineering & Machinery
Northrop Grumman Information Technology
Palmer Manufacturing
Titeflex
Turbine Component Services Goodrich
Wyman-Gordon Forgings
Michigan
Barnes Aerospace
Eaton Aeroquip
Eaton Aerospace
Flexfab LLC
GE
Howmet Corp
Moeller Manufacturing
Parker
Rolled Alloys
Minnesota
Goodrich
Honeywell
Mississippi
Eaton Aeroquip
Missouri
Essex Industries
Montana
General Distributor Co.
Nebraska
Royal Plastic Mfg, Inc.
Nevada
PCC-Structurals
New Hampshire
GE Airfoils
Luminescent (LSI)
New Hampshire Ball Bearing
Smiths Tubular System
New Jersey
Avionic Instruments
Breeze Eastern
Groupe H.T. M. ( Fortech)
Kulite Semiconductor Products, Inc.
Meca Electronics
RS Microwave Co Inc.
New Mexico
GE Fan Cases
Honeywell
Sun Country Industries
New York
Ametek Thermal Systems Inc
Avox Systems
Chromalloy New York
Cox & Co.
Gray Syracuse
Moog Inc.
Northrop Grumman Integrated Systems
Orkal Industries
Telephonics
W S Wilson Corp
North Carolina
AAR Cargo
Allvac Titanium
Allvac Engine Assemblies
Cincinnati Thermal Spray
GE Assemblies
GE Disks
Goodrich
North Dakota
Kildeer Mountain Mfg.
Ohio
Barnes Aerospace
Byron Products
Cincinnati Thermal Spray
Ferco Tech
GE Engines
GE Frames & Shafts
GE Tubes
Goodrich
Goodrich-Ice Protection System Division
Graphel Corp.
Honeywell
Metal Improvement Co.
Northrop Grumman Information Technology
Ohio Gasket & Shim
Parker
PCC-Airfoils Co.
QC Labs
RTI International Inc.
Tool Sales & Service
TW Metals
US Aeroteam
US Chrome Corp.
Oklahoma
Northrop Grumman Technical Service
Oregon
Planar Systems
Precision Castparts Corp.
Pennsylvania
Carpenter Technology
SPS Technologies
Timet
Rhode Island
Tri-Mack Plastics
South Carolina
Phoenix Specialty Mfg
South Dakota
MJ Specialities
Tennessee
Aircraft Safety
Vought Aircraft Industries
Texas
Chelton
Honeywell
Knight Aerospace
Texas Almet
Wyman-Gordon Forgings
Utah
Barnes Aerospace
Hexcel
Klune Precision Casting
Parker
Vermont
GE Airfoils
Goodrich
Virginia
EADS North America
Euro-Composites Corp.
Mecaero Products
Washingtion
Accra Mfg
ELDEC Corp
Exotic Metals Forming Co.
Honeywell
Kaiser Aluminum
West Virginia
Alcan
EADS-CASA
Sargent Fletcher
Star Technologies
Wisconsin
Ladish
Metaltek International
Wyoming
Aviat Aircraft, Inc.
Boeing on the other hand listed 8 American companies as part of their KC767 program of which most if not all are also on the N-G/EADS KC-45 program.
As was stated before, the Boeing jet is an older, less capable design than what Northrop-Grumman/EADS offered.
BTW, we’re not in a recession since a recession is negative growth of the GDP for two or more consecutive quarters.
Airbus also subs out to the Chinese. I think that is awful in terms of national security. However, at least there would be more jobs for Americans if Boeing got the contract. Boeing-like many American companies is forced to use China because of the awful unfair trade policies in this country.
By the way, on a different subject did you hear about the Toyota prius (don’t know if I spelled it right) hybrid. The car was completely subsidized against WTO laws. The Japanese government basically paid for the entire car. Of course, if anything is done it will probably take ten or 15 years. The WTO is anti-American and Repubs have done nothing to make other countries follow the law in terms of trade. They will hang the Airbus fiasco around McCain’s neck-just watch. Trade is a big issue and will cost the Repubs the election this year in my opinion. I have no incentive to vote Repub-none at all. I have voted Repub for years. This year, I don’t know. The Dems have promised to fix trade...they will have to do something if elected. I can not believe in the middle of a recession when jobs are being lost, the Air Force would do this...it is a slap in the face to all Americans.
“there would be more jobs for Americans if Boeing got the contract.”
Prove it.
“Boeing-like many American companies is forced to use China because of the awful unfair trade policies in this country.”
BS! Trade policies have nothing to do with it. It’s pure corporate greed so the CEO can have his eight figure bonus for the year.
That’s why Boeing wanted the contract because it would have been 95% profit for them since the 767 line has been paid off for a decade or more now. The ONLY overhead they would have had was payroll and benefits.
Oh and as far as jobs go Boeing claimed that it would add 9,000 jobs but according to a survey conducted by the Pacific Northwest Aerospace Association, found that fewer than 400 jobs would have been added as a result of Boeing getting the contract. On the otherhand, Boeing and companies will lose 250 jobs at most.
EADS subsidiaries other than Airbus already have contracts with DOD, and EADS is a supplier to the Boeing 787.
Boeing was publicly quoted being in favor of the U.S. Air Force procurement process until the award was announced.
Can Boeing document the estimated 44,000 jobs that would be created within United States if they had been chosen? On Northrop Grumman’s website, there is list of the suppliers and the 48,000 jobs supported. What evidence does Boeing have that U.S. jobs would disappear overseas?
Boeing has sold 8 of their KC767’s and not a single one was delivered on time. One order was 2 years overdue.
If they can’t deliver 8 aircraft, how are they expected to deliver 178 aircraft?
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