Posted on 03/08/2008 6:18:29 AM PST by jdm
Call it the Obamalypse, if you will. Andrew Sullivan makes an interesting argument that a Hillary Clinton victory over Barack Obama could create “mass flight from the process” as disillusioned voters embrace apathy and reject electoral politics altogether. He thinks that killing it would be 1968 all over again:
What I think this misses are the cultural and social consequences of beating Obama (or McCain) this way. I don’t mean beating Obama because the Clintons’ message is more persuasive, or because the Clintons’ healthcare plan is better, or because she has a better approach to Iraq. I mean: beating him by a barrage of petty attacks, by impugning his clear ability to be commander-in-chief, by toying with questions about his “Muslim past”, by subtle invocation of the race card, by intermittent reliance on gender identity politics, by taking faux offense to keep the news cycle busy (”shame on you, Barack Obama!”) and so on. If the Clintons beat Obama this way, I have a simple prediction. It will mean a mass flight from the process. It will alter the political consciousness of an entire generation of young voters - against any positive interaction with the political process for the foreseeable future. I’m not sure that Washington yet understands the risk the Clintons are taking with their own party and the future of American politics.
Pete Abel at The Moderate Voice disagrees. In an open response to Andrew, Pete says that the voters would only have themselves to blame for buying what the Clintons are selling:
Please. If the Clintons beat Obama this way, there’s no one to blame but us, we the people, we the voters. If an entire generation lets the Clintons turn them off from politics then I guess those ‘Yes we can’ chants were nothing but empty rhetoric after all. The facts of the matter are relatively simple: If we want a different kind of politics, if we truly believe ‘yes we can,’ then we better start acting like it. Mud-slinging won’t stop until mud-slinging is proven ineffective. And the only viable proof is this: For the buyers to refuse the sale.
Andrew has the better argument here, I believe, but the Clintons are not completely to blame. We have seen massive reform movements take to the streets when elections have been rigged or perverted, such as in Ukraine with the Orange Revolution. When voters start building expectations higher than anyone can deliver, their disillusionment can take very passionate form. I think Andrew estimates the potential destructive impact reasonably and realistically.
However, Abel points out where the real disillusionment will be placed. The Clintons have never really pretended to be anything other than ruthless, relentless pols who will do anything to win. In fact, that’s really been the Hillary message for the last couple of weeks. She’s tough enough to answer that red phone, and she’s tough enough to go toe-to-toe negative with Mr. Nice Guy. She’s going to win or collapse in the direction of the finish line, whichever comes last.
Obama himself will be the real source of the disillusionment. No one in politics could live up to the expectation he set for himself and his campaign, especially one who comes out of Chicago, as we are all learning. Unlike John McCain, who seems to take a bit of delight in delivering bad news to voters, Obama tended to tell people what they wanted to hear. The demagoguery over NAFTA came from a relentless pursuit of populism that hadn’t been a characteristic of his early campaign.
That doesn’t make Obama any worse than most politicians, and probably still a league above the Clintons. It does strip him of his New Politics conceit, though, and he has little else to offer. As David Brooks put it, even that New Politics identity has never translated into any specific policies or concrete improvements in American life, and his three short years in the Senate hasn’t shown any evidence that he’s tried to apply it anywhere except on the campaign stump.
The real Obamalypse might be better described as a little more maturation in the electorate. Instead of buying into soaring rhetoric without any track record of its application, voters might pay more attention to policy and experience in its pursuit. That isn’t as sexy or exciting as fainting over the next political messiah, but it will result in better candidates and better campaigns — and will eventually chase hucksters like the Clintons out of the arena.
One can only hope.
And I have said this before he is the lesser of the 3 evils
Mc Cain that is
I like it better than the alternatives.
This is exactly why Rush Limbaugh’s scheme to vote for Hillary is a dangerous one. We should defeat her while the chance is here, then go after Obama next. Should she steal the nomination, she will unleash the mother of all dirty campaigns against McCain, who is too weak politically to survive such an attack.
May well tear the rat party into two entities, moonbats and monsters. Am popping corn in garbage can sized portions in anticipation of Denver.
I say, bring on another 1968 and plenty of popcorn.
I keep looking for a graphic of a deflating balloon propelling itself in spirals and zig-zags through the sky. If I could find one, I’d post it here with the caption “Obama” under it.
If Clinton becomes the nominee, I’m going to get “No You Can’t!” put on a t-shirt. Is that mean?
Hillary is the most disliked woman in America. Only massive voter fraud can put her in the whitehouse. And I don’t think the blacks on the city plantations will allow it to happen this time, unless MS 13 tries to take control. Then we have a war.
Let’s see Hillary use McCain’s speech - Just shut up and vote for me. I think you’ll see riots.
Andrew, Andrew, Andrew. Thou dost make an assumption that is grand indeed. First of all, NOT ALL young people are enamored with Mr. Obama or Mrs. Clinton. In fact - I know three twenty somethings in our family who would be thrilled for them both to be dispatched off the stage immediately. They have friends too - and their feelings mirror theirs. Pish posh. Full speed ahead ... and yes, she is a monster and he is a pretender. If their feelings get hurt with the truth - so be it.
“And I have said this before he (McCain) is the lesser of the 3 evils”
I agree.
This is all about the democrats and the Clintons.
This sounds to me like wishful thinking. Obama’s people are the rabid Leftist base of the Democrat party.
They are use to being screwed over by the Democrat Leadership and the Clintons. They hate and fear us far more then they disagree with each other. Hillary and Obama are basically the same coin just different faces of it. I suspect Democrats, desperate to control the Fed Govt for the 1st time since 1994, will show up in droves to vote for whom ever the Democrats put up.
They will be like we were in 2000. Ground Glass Democrats.
No, but it is very very very funny!
You are correct. Crush Hillary, crush here again. When she is completely crushed, crush her again. She needs to be crushed sho bad that she will never run for office again.
Then we move on to Obama and do the same.
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I am lighting a candle in hope.
I think that’s a great idea! Funny as heck!
Works for me.
Andrew Sullivan is a DRAMA QUEEN. Just another argument for a hands-off approach to Barack ******* Ophama. If the young voters get their collective panties in a knot over the things mentioned here they always crawl back under the rock Ophama found them hiding under.
If The Chicago Sheik Obama is on the ballot in November the un-schooled masses may well wash over McCain like a plague of locusts.
McCain's vaunted temper and his debate smirk would work against him in face-to-face debates with the Chicago Sheik's post-modern Cool.
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THE WHOLE WORLD'S WATCHING.....THE WHOLE WORLD'S WATCHING....
All this proves is that if Hillary is the nominee she will choose Obama as her VP. She would have nothing to lose and everything to gain by doing so. And at his age and career-stage, he would have nothing to gain and everything to lose by turning down the offer.
There. Problem solved.
Now all they have to get by the American people the fact that they would be the most far-left team since Lenin/Trotsky.
I leave that problem to them.
Republicans cannot take down Omaba, that would be racist. Hillary has to do it.
I actually began to pity the Democrats — they have to choose between the Gorgon and the Manchurian Candidate. But this feeling pretty well evaporated with the realization that they allowed their party to shift from values to mantras, from treatises to talking points, and from substance to smoke screen. It’s going to be fun to watch the implosion.
You mean like what has already been done to young (and now former) Republicans over the last few years?
THis would be an obamanation if that happened....
“Bring it on!”
At this juncture Hillary’s only shot at the nomination is to manipulate the super delegates. Neither she nor Obama will have the delegates to win on the first ballots, but Obama will have a delegate lead. A Hillary win under such circumstances would certainly alienate Obama supporters. I too predict a replay of 1968.
click for nutter web site
The crazies are already getting ramped up to Recreate 68" at the Donkey Convention in Denver. Should be amusing, and most helpful to Sen. McCains election bid. After all, Nixon won in 1968.
No one ever said leftists were very smart, but they know what they feel.
I totally agree with you. Hillary is a bigger threat to us than Obama. If Hillary's "kitchen sink" had this much impact on Obama, then I'm sure the GOP would be able to beat him in the fall. Hillary, on the other hand, would have the media on her side in the fall and would perform an autopsy on McCain in the debates.
I'm so mad at Rush Limbaugh that I can't see straight. I am convinced he hatched his little plot because he was angry that the media were calling him "irrelevant" after he wasn't able to get a conservative nominated to the GOP ticket. His ego got the better of him and he recommended voting for Hillary in order to show the media that he is relevant. What a juvenile (and dangerous) idea.
We need to ensure that ALL Republicans in Mississippi (3/11), North Carolina (5/6) and Indiana (5/6) show up for the Dem primaries and pimp themselves for Obama.
Apocalypse Now!
- John (with apologies to Mr. Copolla)
DEMOCRATIC CONVENTION...Chicago, IL...1968...
"The major battles were fought in Lincoln Park, three miles north of the Loop (the city center), when the police tried to enforce evening curfews. A legal rally in Grant Park ended when the police clubbed a teenager who was lowering an American flag, and others who tried to protect him."
"Mayor Richard J. Daley called out 7,500 members of the Illinois National Guard to reinforce the 12,000 police officers. Wednesday night they tried to remove everyone -- mostly party volunteers, candidate supporters and tourists -- from Michigan Avenue in front of the Hilton hotel, which was the convention headquarters. While the nominating speeches were being given at the amphitheater several miles away, these unlucky people were pushed through plate glass windows when caught between Guard and police as they dispersed the crowd."
"TV cameras in front of the Hilton captured the confrontation. When these images were played on monitors at the convention itself -- about an hour later -- they disrupted the proceedings far more than the demonstrators could have had they succeeded in their efforts to march. "The whole world is watching" became more than just a slogan. What an official report later described as a "police riot" did more damage to Chicago's reputation and the fortunes of the Democratic Party than anything the protestors could have done."
>>Call it the Obamalypse, if you will. Andrew Sullivan makes an interesting argument that a Hillary Clinton victory over Barack Obama could create “mass flight from the process” as disillusioned voters embrace apathy and reject electoral politics altogether. He thinks that killing it would be 1968 all over again:<<
And Claire Wolfe says, “America is at that awkward stage. It’s too late to work within the system and too early to shoot the b@st@rds.”
I think the comment above is suggesting that Americans will no longer think we are in the “awkward” stage.
If the voting booth doesn’t cut it to enough people, then you start having things like Boston tea parties and, eventually, worse.
Or better, depending on your persuasion.
You are right. Obama has brought many blacks and young people into the electorate. They will simply evaporate if he is not on the ticket. [I do not think he wants to be VP].
Also, Obama really appeals to the Dim base. Many will be disillusioned at the DNC “selecting” the nominee.
>>And I have said this before he is the lesser of the 3 evils<<
Yeah, Hitler, Stalin or Mohammad.
Which to choose? Especially if you are Jewish.
You completely understimate the power of the Dixie Mafia and the Clinton scum machine.
No, but it is funny. I’d buy one.
If Hillary was able to tear down Obama's mystic in just 4 days (by running one 3:00 AM advertisement against him) I'm sure we could do so easily given a few months. A resusitated Hillary, on the other hand, with the left wing media on her side is going to be much tougher to beat.
Additionally, do you think that Hillary is any less a radical leftist? Have you ever heard of Saul Alinsky? The only difference between her and him is that she is a little slicker tha he is.
I cannot speak for Mississippi or Indiana, but in North Carolina only INDEPENDENTS can choose between party ballots. If you are a registered Republican, you can ONLY vote on the Republican ballot. I switched to Independent this week, in order to vote against Hillary.
Also, in North Carolina the re-registrations must be completed and in the hands of the Election Department 25 days prior to the election.
Perceptions won’t change the delegate counts. And Obama will add two more victories today in WY and MS on Tuesday padding his delegate count further essentially giving him the same lead he had before the Texas, Ohio, RI, and VT primaries. Obama will also win big in NC, which has 115 delgegates compared to PA’s 158.
The real question is why is Hillary still in the race knowing full well she will be trailing in the pledged delegates and popular vote going into the convention. It is hubris and selfishness.
In the darkness of the DemonRAT night, two trains are speeding towards each other; not knowing they are on the same track. . .
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