Posted on 03/19/2008 9:57:35 AM PDT by Born Conservative
HARRISBURG - House members began debate last night on controversial legislation that would require handgun owners to report lost or stolen weapons, marking the first time in more than a decade that the General Assembly has considered a substantive handgun-control measure. Supporters, including mayors across the state, law enforcement officers and prosecutors, have fought for years for similar legislation in seven other states and the District of Columbia to curb "straw purchasers" who buy handguns for felons.
But the powerful constituencies that make up the National Rifle Association and sportsmen's groups have blocked the legislation from reaching a floor debate, contending that it would infringe on the rights of gun owners.
Rep. David Levdansky (D., Allegheny), the measure's sponsor and an avid hunter, argued that it would not target law-abiding citizens, only criminals seeking to avoid background checks.
"This amendment is about life and death," Levdansky said. "[This is] an effort to help stop the human carnage and to take a stand against the carnage perpetrated by those who traffic illegal handguns."
It was unclear whether proponents had the 102 votes needed to pass the amendment, but they said that even if it failed, lawmakers would be forced to make their positions on the issue known.
"Our objective today is to get the recorded vote," said Phil Goldsmith, president of Ceasefire PA, a handgun-control advocacy group.
The National Rifle Association's chief lobbyist in Pennsylvania, John Hohenwarter, said the NRA, which has 250,000 members in the state, opposed the amendment as an infringement of gun owners' rights.
(Excerpt) Read more at philly.com ...
Have any States managed to pass these turning theft victims into criminals bills yet?
Just curious
Yep, the Peoples Republic of Connecticut has.
I have had debates with people who actually think this is a great law. I ask them..."if someone stole your snow shovel in July, how long before you knew it was missing?"
They get the idea pretty quickly.
Am I to presume that it is presently illegal to transfer a handgun through a private sale in PA?
“I have had debates with people who actually think this is a great law. I ask them...”if someone stole your snow shovel in July, how long before you knew it was missing?””
You have to report it after you realize it was stolen. Why wouldn’t you report it anyway? I wouldn’t want my weapon being recovered at a crime scene and have the police looking at me as a suspect. I consider it a duty of a responsible gun owner.
When they come to confiscate them, you won’t be able to say it was lost or stolen. Surrender everything on their list, or go to jail.
Tyranny. Won’t go over well in PA, that’s for sure.
Ed “the mobster” Rendell is turning PA into a police state.
I believe that it HAS been illegal for quite some time.
If SCOTUS strikes down the DC handgun ban, it will be even HARDER for the Philth-adelphia legislative cabal to try to pass crap legislation like this....
I would think that responsbile gun owners keep track of their guns: have them on their persons, in a locked gun cabinet, etc.: not just sitting in a drawer where a kid could find it. How could you not notice it was stolen?
That's my point. You're obviously not a gun owner, because if you were you'd realize that you don't open your safe every day and as such you wouldn't know it was missing. With the CT law, if you don't report it within 72HRS of it being stolen...YOU'RE now the criminal.
Nice huh, punish the ONE WHO HAS BEEN STOLEN FROM.
You answered your own question with: in a locked gun cabinet
Do you assume everyone opens their safes/cabinets on a daily basis? They don't.
It will be a great day.
Of course, having weapons that are in no database can be quite useful.
Correct, although many residents are not even aware of it.
When you have more than a few dozen, one wouldn’t be missed for quite a while. What good is a weapon if it is locked up? I started shooting at the age of about five or six, and always had free access to dozens of guns; never misused that privelige nor will my children. I have misplaced a couple of rifles; you’d think that an SKS or Remington 7400 would be pretty hard to miss, but it took me weeks to find them. Put them in a different closet. Pretty easy really.
Ummmm, are you sure it isn't 72 hours after you discover it stolen???? If your house was broken into, you wouldn't check your safe to see if it was opened?
And how many thieves actually reseal the safe after breaking into it? Are they just going to steal your gun and thats it? No jewelry, no money? Just crack the safe, target the gun, reseal the safe and thats it? I think that is pretty unrealistic.
This amendment is about pandering, pimping political prostitutes and another attempt to punish legal gun owners instead of criminals and absentee fathers who beget and create them.
“With the CT law, if you don’t report it within 72HRS of it being stolen...YOU’RE now the criminal.”
WTF...what if your out of town or on vacation and have not checked the secured location every day.
Stupid...plain stupid!
That will do ABSOLUTELY NOTHING to stop crime
Ummm, yes. Very sure thank you very much
If your house was broken into, you wouldn't check your safe to see if it was opened?
Oh, jeez. Of course. Once again, Mr Non Gun Owner bringing up the perfect, everyday burglary scenario.
No, non-gun owner...riddle me THIS: What if you're away on vacation, hmmm? The law DOESN'T CARE......you, the victim are now the criminal.
“No, non-gun owner...riddle me THIS: What if you’re away on vacation, hmmm? The law DOESN’T CARE......you, the victim are now the criminal.”
The law states “ Sec. 53-202g. Report of theft of assault weapon. Any person who lawfully possesses an assault weapon under sections 29-37j and 53-202a to 53-202k, inclusive, and subsection (h) of section 53a-46a that is stolen from him shall report the theft to law enforcement authorities within seventy-two hours of when such person discovered or should have discovered the theft.”
Okay — so I think if you are on vacation, it is covered under “when discovered or should have been discovered”.
Here's the BIG problem....define: should have been discovered
“No, non-gun owner...riddle me THIS: What if you’re away on vacation, hmmm? The law DOESN’T CARE......you, the victim are now the criminal.”
Oh, and stop the non-gun owner crap. I have one in the house, too. I know if my house was broken into, first thing I would do is call the police, and while waiting for them to come, I’d check to see if my gun was stolen.
“should have been discovered”
Yeah, I’ll give you that. Someone will have to challenge the law to get that changed.
I understand why they feel they have to do this — because of a few scumbags who do purchase weapons and then sell them illegally to criminals, everyone has to suffer.
Here’s a scenario for you to think about. If you wish, I’d appreciate an honest reply.
You call the TV cable guy to come out and look at your system because you are getting static on the TV when it rains. He comes out and is walking back and forth from room to room with his meters and testing various televison outlets in your home. He goes outside and disconnects the incoming cable then comes back inside and resumes his room to room testing of the outlets looking for moisture resistance in one of the outlets.
Are you going to continiously follow him through your home and wait in the room while he test every outlet the second time or are you going to resume whatever it was you were doing before he arrived?
Assuming that you did give him free roam of your house, he is the very type of person who could easily steal your handgun and not steal anything else. Unless you checked to verify that your handgun was in place just prior to him arriving at your home, you would have a difficult time proving it was taken by the cable guy, the phone man, the electrician, the painter, the carpet man or any of a number of other people that you allow into your home.
No break in occurred. You allowed these people into your home to do repairs or give you cost estimates. Perhaps you should also be charged with aiding the theft because you didn’t maintain your handgun in a secure location.
Uh, B4, I’m not sure why you pinged me, as I thought my position was clear from my post above and years of posting on this topic. I believe in the RIGHT to keep and bear arms, not the privelige that our feudal overlords grant us with restrictions that keep growing over time. I agree completely with your scenario and its implications. It is just another backdoor way to make gun ownership more risky and cumbersome, and to criminalize gun owners. They don’t have to ban it; just make it inconvenient enough so fewer and fewer people are gun people. After two generations, the new majority will ban them voluntarily, just like in England.
I agreed with your post where you said, “When you have more than a few dozen, one wouldn’t be missed for quite a while. What good is a weapon if it is locked up?” and I wanted to give Londo Molari a scenario where we wouldn’t, right away, ‘miss’ a weapon that had been stolen.
“I wanted to give Londo Molari a scenario where we wouldn’t, right away, ‘miss’ a weapon that had been stolen.”
But when you discover it is missing or stolen (maybe months later), why not report it within the 72 hours?
Thanks for the clarification, B4.
Supporters, including mayors across the state, law enforcement officers and prosecutors, have fought for years for similar legislation in seven other states and the District of Columbia to curb "straw purchasers" who buy handguns for felons.
It sounds like there's a lot more in this bill than just reporting a stolen gun.
Unless you are young and brimming with self confidence I think you might be more apt to believe that your memory burped and that you stashed the weapon someplace else.
Thanks for the info. Scary. So you’re expected to go through an FFL holder every time you transfer a handgun? Scenario: You sell a gun to a friend, he uses it in self-defense, cops trace gun to original purchaser and charge him(you) with unlawful transfer of a handgun. Lovely.
Not just handguns, all firearms, to include shotguns.
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