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Security at what cost? National ID system is not worth the $23 billion price tag
Star Tribune ^ | 23 Feb 2008 | Bruce Schneier

Posted on 03/21/2008 5:14:17 PM PDT by BGHater

The argument was so obvious it hardly needed repeating: We would all be safer if we had a better ID card. A good, hard-to-forge national ID is a no-brainer (or so the argument goes), and it's ridiculous that a modern country such as the United States doesn't have one. One result of this line of thinking is the planned Real ID Act, which forces all states to conform to common and more stringent rules for issuing driver's licenses.

But security is always a tradeoff; it must be balanced with the cost. We all do this intuitively. Few of us walk around wearing bulletproof vests. It's not because they're ineffective, it's because for most of us, the tradeoff isn't worth it. It's not worth the cost, the inconvenience, or the loss of fashion sense.

According to the Department of Homeland Security's own estimates, Real ID will cost Americans around $23 billion. So is this a good tradeoff for us -- are the security benefits worth the price tag?

When most people think of ID cards, they think of a small plastic card with their name and photograph. This isn't wrong, but it's only a small piece of any ID program. What starts out as a seemingly simple security device -- a card that binds a photograph with a name -- rapidly becomes a complex security system.

It doesn't really matter how well a Real ID works when used by the hundreds of millions of honest people who would carry it. What matters is how the system might fail when used by someone intent on subverting it:

(Excerpt) Read more at startribune.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Editorial; Government; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: 110th; homelandsecurity; id; realid; realidact; security; wot
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To: Quix

Amen to that, Brother.


21 posted on 03/21/2008 7:17:58 PM PDT by FReepapalooza (Joshua 3:4 ..."for ye have not passed this way heretofore.")
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To: Quix
Yes, and a fan and customer of a certain obscure motel off of I-40 in Oklahoma where the owner alleges that Mohamed Atta, Marwan al-Shehhi (a 9/11 hijacker) and Zacarias Moussaoui all visited.
22 posted on 03/21/2008 7:28:31 PM PDT by freeandfreezing
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What a pant load this is! Next we’ll all have to have our SSN tattooed on our foreheads.
*************************************************
I think not ,, the SSA doesn’t allow the ssn to be used as any form of id (is it a felony or misdemeanor?) ... and we know they really mean it by requiring it’s use as an id on d/l’s and student id’s , bank accounts and hundreds of other things..

A smart card based system will be less secure than a dumb card.. there will no doubt be either a software workaround or a glitching fix to them by the forgers within months as hackers get a reader terminal to disassemble.. then the smart card that is 100% infallible and trusted by the gov’t becomes a liability as it allows undesireables access to whatever this is supposed to keep them out of.. I don’t like any of it but a dumb card that would be used in conjunction with a retina scan connected to a centralized secure computer system would be more secure by far..


23 posted on 03/21/2008 7:32:41 PM PDT by Neidermeyer
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To: FReepapalooza

Thanks for your kind affirmation!

Was beginning to wonder if anyone was awake who was well informed . . . or if anyone was not occupied with Resurrection Sunday Weekend relatives and such . .

Much appreciate your kind comment.

God’s best to you and yours this weekend.


24 posted on 03/21/2008 7:50:20 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: freeandfreezing

Thanks for your informed, informative comment . . .

Are you saying that you have some . . . first hand personal communications say . . . from said motel? Or at least not that much removed from first hand communications or . . . ???

Very curious, if you are willing to elaborate.

Thanks much.

A blessed Resurrection Sunday to you and yours.


25 posted on 03/21/2008 7:52:07 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Neidermeyer

INDEED.

Ain’t treasonous, stupid, idiotic, clueless, power-mongering elitist tyranny and enslavement wonderful.

/s


26 posted on 03/21/2008 7:53:37 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: Quix

Thank you.

May God shower his blessings on yours.


27 posted on 03/21/2008 7:55:13 PM PDT by FReepapalooza (Joshua 3:4 ..."for ye have not passed this way heretofore.")
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To: BGHater
Heck, the feds can't even protect the information on our passports.

I already know who I am, my state department of motor vehicles knows who I am, the social security administration has my number, my birth certificate says who I am, date and where I was born, my baptismal certificate says who I am, my First Communion Certificate says who I am, my Confirmation certificate says who I am, my Marriage License says who I am and who I married, my high school diploma says who I am, my college diploma says who I am, my employer knows who I am, my doctor knows who I am, and my insurance companies know who I am, and if the government doesn't know by now who I am, my Mom and Dad are alive, they can vouch for me.

Did I forget anything? Oh yes, the deed for my home, childhood friends, family, new friends, etc., etc..

$23 Billion another certificate to tell me who I am.

28 posted on 03/21/2008 7:55:19 PM PDT by harpo11 (Rush, had better have a back-up strategy just in case the third term grabbing Clintons win the WH.)
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To: FReepapalooza

MUCH APPRECIATED.

BTTT


29 posted on 03/21/2008 8:01:02 PM PDT by Quix (GOD ALONE IS GOD; WORTHY; PAID THE PRICE; IS COMING AGAIN; KNOWS ALL; IS LOVING; IS ALTOGETHER GOOD)
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To: BGHater

So must we now learn how to speak gestapo German?


30 posted on 03/21/2008 8:03:12 PM PDT by sergeantdave (Governments hate armed citizens more than armed criminals)
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To: harpo11

“$23 Billion another certificate to tell me who I am.”

No, to tell THEM who you are.


31 posted on 03/21/2008 8:07:37 PM PDT by FReepapalooza (Joshua 3:4 ..."for ye have not passed this way heretofore.")
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To: djf
I could drive them to a place in Eastern NY, and if I got permission to go on private property, show them the falling down gravestone of a man born in 1761. A man who happens to be my gr gr gr gr gr grandfather.

Now see, that's your problem. You are a real live *native* born American. We have to keep track of you rabble rouser's.

32 posted on 03/21/2008 8:10:13 PM PDT by AFreeBird
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To: Cobra64
ROFLMFAO!!!!!

Oh that's priceless!

33 posted on 03/21/2008 8:11:28 PM PDT by AFreeBird
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To: BGHater

Why not just use the Passport...we can’t even go to Canada or Mexico without it now.


34 posted on 03/21/2008 8:22:36 PM PDT by Former Dodger ( "Insanity: Doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results." --Einstein)
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To: BGHater

If a Real ID data base would be insecure would it be any more insecure then the data bases our information is in now.
If privacy is the concern does anyone think they have greater privacy now?
How much does credit fraud and stolen ID cost now and would that change under RealID?
Whatever the valid objections to Real ID are this newspaper didn’t hit them by a long way.


35 posted on 03/21/2008 9:01:26 PM PDT by count-your-change (you don't have to be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: M203M4

That was absolutely hilarious thanks!


36 posted on 03/21/2008 9:47:49 PM PDT by Content Provider
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To: harpo11

The feds can’t even protect their own information. I have the home phone numbers of two Presidents and no less than 2 dozen current and former Cabinet members, plus numerous political VIPs. Never called any of them, because I know they could care less about what a peon like myself thinks.


37 posted on 03/21/2008 10:06:30 PM PDT by Content Provider
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To: FReepapalooza

Rats, if they don’t know by now, what an idiotic excuse to verify what they already know. What about the Census records, and IRS records?


38 posted on 03/22/2008 6:43:57 PM PDT by harpo11 (Rush, had better have a back-up strategy just in case the third term grabbing Clintons win the WH.)
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To: Content Provider

Just another boondoogle scheme to create another reason for more confounding red tape and bureaucratic nincompoopery at the expense of the “We the People”.


39 posted on 03/22/2008 6:52:43 PM PDT by harpo11 (Rush, had better have a back-up strategy just in case the third term grabbing Clintons win the WH.)
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To: harpo11

What they have in mind is a more compiled “chip file” that would include your religious beliefs and medical records amongst other things.

It’s for your own own good, doncha know? sarc/


40 posted on 03/22/2008 7:05:54 PM PDT by FReepapalooza (Joshua 3:4 ..."for ye have not passed this way heretofore.")
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