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Vanity: My opus on combating vote fraud
Darth

Posted on 03/26/2008 10:35:37 AM PDT by darth

Vote Fraud and How to Combat It

Introduction

I have been involved in campaigns and volunteering at the polls since 1994. In every election where I have been involved there was evidence of vote fraud. Based on personal experience I estimate that in important national elections up to 10% of all votes cast are fraudulent. Did you notice how polls that favor Republicans to win on Election Day are almost always off by a significant amount when the votes are counted? Have you noticed how Philadelphia turns in more ballots than the number of adults in the city?

Who are the perpetrators? Every time that I have observed fraud it was carried out by Democrats. Why do they do it? Zeal and greed are reason enough. Democrats, especially activists, often tell me, “Everyone is crooked. Both parties commit fraud.” This is their justification. Besides, they are usually paid for results.

After evidence of massive fraud in a California congressional election the investigator from the California Attorney General’s office told me, “For $500,000 in cash you can be guaranteed to win the Primary, the General Election, and a seat in Congress. The candidate willing to commit the most felonies always wins.” At a Texas precinct a guy wearing a union jacket walked up to a Republican Poll Watcher and said, “OK, I voted. Where’s my $40? I have seen vans full of people going from one precinct to another voting repeatedly and being paid every time they got back on the van.

Vote fraud in some precincts approaches Third World levels of corruption. I am convinced that vote fraud is the single greatest threat to our Republic since it can thwart the will of the electorate.

In this short pamphlet I will outline vote fraud methods I have seen and suggest ways to combat each method.

Phantom Voters

In California the professional vote fraud scam perps drive down a typical, middle class, residential street copying down addresses where the mailbox is accessible from the street. For example, the Wilson family lives at 300 Elm Street. The perp then creates fictional voters, sometimes one, sometimes an entire family of phantoms named Jones. He then registers the phantoms named Jones to vote (no ID required) at 300 Elm Street. On the day that Sample Ballots are delivered a small army of homeless and illegals hired by the perp go down Elm Street collecting the Sample Ballots addressed to the phantoms on their list. Mind you, they don’t steal the Wilson’s ballots; they let the Wilsons vote. The perp then uses the Sample Ballots to vote the phantoms as absentees. For example, in the 1998 Congressional election, California had a statewide turnout of 63%. In an off year? Unheard of! In my survey during the 1996 elections across 7 precincts in Orange County (200 voters personally surveyed) I discovered that 50% of the registered voters did not exist. By the way, I gave interviews to reporters from the LA Times and Orange County Register offering my evidence of vote fraud. They were not interested; and not one word about the fraud got into print.

How to combat phantoms?

With dead people and felons you can get lists of registered voters to challenge, and you should. However, with phantoms you must establish that no such person exists at that address. My approach was direct. I simply rang the doorbell and spoke to the Wilsons. Since they don’t know the Joneses and have lived at the home (typically) for over 10 years it’s a good bet that the Joneses are phantoms. With the internet and our current resources you can zoom in on potential phantoms using resources such as Reverse Lookup directories that give you the phone numbers of whoever lives at 300 Elm Street. It’s a bit tedious to work your way through the official Voter Roll, but remember that changing a swing voter from Democrat to Republican can cost more than $50 in advertising, phone calls, etc. per vote while eliminating a phantom drives a stake through the heart of someone who always votes Democrat and cannot be swayed since he’s bought and paid for. There are other resources out there such as marketing lists, the U.S. Census, etc. I am not sure exactly how to use these resources, but a bit of experimenting will tell you what works best. Ask a friendly Private Investigator how he would uncover phantoms to get more ideas.

Once you have identified phantom voters, what do you do about it? Well, you can approach the Registrar of Voters, however, if the Registrar is a Democrat who is well aware of the scam, then expect to be stonewalled. You can call a press conference or create publicity (you know how much cockroaches hate the light). You could make sure that every phantom voter has a subscription to the LA Times, NY Times, and Rolling Stone. Maybe when the bills come back undeliverable these publications will get interested in the problem of phantom voters.

A bold approach would be to identify a street with lots of phantoms registered to vote and follow the mail truck on the day when Sample Ballots are delivered. Once you see the winos stealing ballots, you simple follow them back to the perp’s headquarters. With luck this may be the local Democratic campaign HQ, a union hall, or wealthy Democrat’s residence. Be sure to videotape the ballot theft and delivery. By the way, when you follow perps it’s a good idea to have video cameras with telephoto lenses, lots of tape, spare batteries, cell phone with emergency numbers, and a tool that punches large holes at 100 meters. Remember that vote fraud perps are sophisticated criminals who may not take kindly to surveillance and exposure. Go in teams so that you can follow perps switching out the following vehicle to prevent them from knowing that they are followed. Get in the spirit and have some fun being a good citizen.

Once you have identified specific perps you can contact appropriate law enforcement agencies. For example, creating phantom voters involves mail fraud, identity fraud, violating state voting laws, defrauding all voters in a precinct or district, etc. That last one is my favorite. When I think of a class action suit against a union with deep pockets on behalf of 150,000 voters in a Congressional district, I get goose bumps. Wow, we could bankrupt the vote fraud scam artists and provide a payout to every voter at the same time! We might even become popular.

Polling Place Workers Casting Ballots

One of the most effective scams that I have seen is where the Election Judge and Election Clerks are all Democrats and they are paid based on how many ballots they deliver. They simply wait until the end of the day, close the doors, and cast a ballot for every registered voter who did not show up. This is far cheaper than buying box lunches, renting vans, and pushing people to vote. In a precinct in Port Arthur, Texas in the 1998 election I watched a precinct that had a 110% turnout in the 1996 election. How many voters showed up? Zero! However, when the votes were counted that precinct once again had over 100% turnout.

How to combat crooked polling place workers?

BE THERE! For example, in Texas every candidate can send Poll Watchers to precincts in the district where that candidate is running. Be prepared for a confrontation with the crooked Election Judge if you show up as a Poll Watcher since you are threatening his paycheck! However, in Texas the Secretary of State has become much more supportive of Poll Watchers and has cracked down on crooked election officials. In fact, the Election Judge can be arrested on the spot by an investigator from the Secretary of State’s office if the irregularities are extensive.

An even better way to be there is to volunteer as a Republican Alternate Election Judge. In that case, you receive training in election law and arrive as an official. It’s very difficult for the crooks to throw you out. However, once again, be prepared for a confrontation. This is an ideal assignment for some of you macho guys to take on. My experience has shown that you can seriously disrupt vote fraud if you are an Alternate Election Judge. Just know the law and follow it to the letter. Be nice but firm about following the rulebook. You need to know the appropriate state and federal officials to call and have their numbers with you on Election Day.

Better yet, go undercover and register as a Democrat. This is a difficult assignment which takes years to really pay off, but has rich rewards. Just steep yourself in Democrat-think and get in there and volunteer. Eventually you will find yourself in a position to blow the whistle on vote fraud or other illegal activities. Be sure to keep records and gather evidence until the time comes to bust the perps. Be especially mindful to get the goods on the Big Fish. Oh yeah, don’t tell anyone you are doing this. Perfect cover and security is assured when ONLY YOU KNOW.

Ballot Tampering

In the 2000 election an attorney that I know flew to Florida to watch the recount. After a while he noticed something like snow on the carpet under the chair of one of the ladies counting paper ballots. Upon closer examination he discovered that she had sharpened a fingernail to make a punch and had punched out HUNDREDS of chads for Gore. This is the source of the “confusing, overvoted, butterfly ballots” canard that showed up in the press. Luckily, the attorney grabbed James Baker and promptly stopped the recount. Other famous cases involve crooked workers putting the same ballot through the counting machine repeatedly ( I have that on video), punching holes in ballots before handing them out to voters (Yup, saw pre-punched ballots handed out in Houston in the 2000 election), Democrat judges taking Ballot Boxes home to punch holes, etc. If the ballots are paper you must find a way to observe them until they are properly counted.

How to combat ballot tampering

Once again, BE THERE. Crying about vote fraud the day after the election is useless. Get out there and volunteer as a Poll Watcher, Election Judge, or in some capacity where you can make a difference. With today’s technology you could use hidden video cameras to capture proof, of ballot tampering, however, recording devices are ILLEGAL in Texas precincts. Check your state laws and penalties before going this route. In some cases, the video camera could be in a remote location recording and observing through a window into the place where ballot tampering is taking place. For example, you might be able to record precinct workers opening the Ballot Box and tampering with ballots.

There may be a way to use invisible ink to prove ballot tampering. For example, you could vote your ballot, mark it with invisible ink, and shoot a photo while still in the booth of the ballot showing how you voted. Later using the invisible ink for identification you could retrieve your ballot and see if it had been tampered with. It would be a good idea for state or federal officials to run a sting with marked ballots and RFID chips to see where ballots were when someone tampered with them. RFID chips or GPS can also be used to record where ballot boxes are taken.

Vote machine rigging.

In the 1998 election one of our Poll Watchers at an Early Voting location noticed that the Democrat clerks were steering all elderly and confused voters to one machine at the end of the line. Upon checking the voting machine he discovered that a perforated plastic strip had been inserted into the machine. If you voted Democrat the hole could be punched. However, if you tried to vote Republican the stylus could not punch all the way through the plastic strip and you ended up with PREGNANT CHADS.

How to prevent vote machine rigging

BE THERE, be observant, be cynical, be suspicious. If there’s a way to scam the vote, they will try it.

Democrat election officials advocating how to vote

In the 2000 election I stood behind the Democrat Election Judge as he told a newly-minted citizen which hole to punch for a straight Democratic ticket and stayed to watch the voter meekly comply. Since I speak Spanish, I told the Judge that what he just did was illegal. He looked like he might faint.

How to combat Democrat officials advocating how to vote

In addition to BEING THERE, you must speak the language. Determine what languages are spoken at your chosen precinct and recruit Poll Watchers or other helpers who speak those languages.

Summary

The time to combat vote fraud is NOW. Get the Official Voter Roll and start looking for felons, dead people, phantoms, 20 people living at one address, etc. Using sampling techniques start auditing door-to-door. Interview people registered to vote. For example, after Bob Dornan lost his seat to Loretta Sanchez, his volunteers got over 500 people to sign affidavits stating that they voted illegally (they were non-citizens who had been pressured to vote by Hermandad Nacional Mexicano, a FEDERAL CONTRACTOR operating on taxpayer funds!!!). I learned a lot from personally interviewing people registered to vote. Just ask questions; you will be amazed when they unburden themselves and tell the truth.

Get involved as a Poll Watcher, Election Judge, Precinct Clerk, or infiltrate the other party. I know from personal experience that you CAN make a difference that will win elections.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Politics/Elections; Your Opinion/Questions
KEYWORDS: ballot; byanymeansnecessary; dncbrownshirts; election; everyonebookmark; fraud; howtostealanelection; justsayno2johnmccain; notanopus; opus; spartansixdelta; vote; votefraud; voterfraud
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1 posted on 03/26/2008 10:35:39 AM PDT by darth
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To: darth

I have been providing info on vote fraud for my Fellow Freepers since 1996. Please add your own experiences and wisdom to my post. Thanks.


2 posted on 03/26/2008 10:37:30 AM PDT by darth
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To: darth

two main mwethods to combat voter fraud:

Photo ID
Ink Finger Dip.


3 posted on 03/26/2008 10:38:17 AM PDT by camle (keep an open mind and someone will fill it full of something for you)
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To: darth

Just be prepared for when the number of “actual” votes cast decreases immensely due to voter verification initiatives, one of the parties will present that as evidence of “disenfranchisement”.


4 posted on 03/26/2008 10:39:47 AM PDT by AbeKrieger (There is a special place in Hell for Lyndon Johnson.)
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To: darth
Vanity: My opus on combating vote fraud

Man. For a minute there I thought you were quitting Free Republic over vote fraud.

Now that I'm past the strange headline, I'll read your vanity.

5 posted on 03/26/2008 10:43:19 AM PDT by Responsibility2nd (Typical White Person)
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To: darth

Basically, you’re saying, “Be There”.


6 posted on 03/26/2008 10:43:39 AM PDT by Just another Joe (Warning: FReeping can be addictive and helpful to your mental health)
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To: Chance

7 posted on 03/26/2008 10:45:16 AM PDT by evets
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To: camle

Add to the list:

- verifiable paper trail
- multiple independent audits of all elections

It comes with a price tag, but that price is far smaller than the cost of not doing it.


8 posted on 03/26/2008 10:45:30 AM PDT by Content Provider
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To: AbeKrieger

We combat democrat propaganda by having solid evidence of vote fraud. For example, I would love to see video of ballot stealing, ballot box tampering, etc. posted on FR. The lamestream newsies can only ignore solid evidence so long.


9 posted on 03/26/2008 10:46:42 AM PDT by darth
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To: Content Provider
It comes with a price tag, but that price is far smaller than the cost of not doing it.

I agree. I would go so far as to say the government should be willing to cover the cost of secure digital/electronic IDs for the purposes of voting. The card should be scanned along with the voter's thumbprint. And voter fraud should be a felony punishable by YEARS in prison. It is akin to sedition, in my view.

10 posted on 03/26/2008 10:52:02 AM PDT by AbeKrieger (There is a special place in Hell for Lyndon Johnson.)
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To: darth

Thanks for this post. At the Repub Caucus here in CO, my husband signed up to be an election judge this fall. Hopefully they will call him. I’ll show him these tips.


11 posted on 03/26/2008 10:52:21 AM PDT by beaversmom
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To: camle

While I obviously support better election security, we CANNOT wait for our elected officials to legislate reforms. My whole post is about concrete steps we can take now to prevent elections from being stolen.


12 posted on 03/26/2008 10:53:36 AM PDT by darth
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To: darth
For getting real voters out to the polls, a company called "First Tuesday in November" has a Blackberry-based tool (PDF), text version here.
13 posted on 03/26/2008 10:54:30 AM PDT by AZLiberty (Wipe the national hard drive and reinstall the Constitution.)
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To: darth

Great post!


14 posted on 03/26/2008 10:59:49 AM PDT by MtnClimber (Not liking my choices in this election!)
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To: darth
Excellent post and one that needs to be bumped by 2 dozen people every day until election day.

Well done, Darth!
15 posted on 03/26/2008 11:00:44 AM PDT by Antoninus (Tell us how you came to Barack?)
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To: darth

One of the most important things we can do is ensure that Democrats are Not Elected to Secretary of State positions. I believe that in every state (there may be a few exceptions) the Secretary of State is responsible for administering and overseeing elections. If Democrats hold these positions, you can be sure voter fraud will occur. ALL Secretaries of State Must Be Republican.


16 posted on 03/26/2008 11:01:10 AM PDT by FFranco
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To: darth

bump


17 posted on 03/26/2008 11:02:40 AM PDT by lowbridge ("I can't wait to see what he stands for." - Susan Sarandon on her support of Barack Obama)
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To: darth
...and a tool that punches large holes at 100 meters

Love it!

18 posted on 03/26/2008 11:03:03 AM PDT by wbill
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To: Responsibility2nd; darth

We’ve had so many opuses that one begins to forget what the word “opus” really means.


19 posted on 03/26/2008 11:06:11 AM PDT by Larry Lucido (Still looking for UART at FX1050)
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To: darth

You have some good suggestions. How would you address the absentee ballot fraud? I think that one is going to be more difficult to curtail.


20 posted on 03/26/2008 11:08:59 AM PDT by Hoffer Rand (Forget "Who is John Galt?" I want to know "Where is Galt's Gulch?")
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To: darth

We’ve known about the fraud and phony votes for decades thanks to people such as yourself. How many elections have actually been recorded for one party and then changed to the other party once fraud was proven?

None that I know of.


21 posted on 03/26/2008 11:11:28 AM PDT by B4Ranch ( (Give a person a fish .......Teach a person to use the Internet and they won't bother you for weeks)
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To: darth

Bookmarked...


22 posted on 03/26/2008 11:11:52 AM PDT by Antoninus (Tell us how you came to Barack?)
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To: FFranco

Here in Texas the most important post is County Tax Assessor Collector. In my county we elected a Republican and he removed over 150,000 dead people and felons from the rolls.


23 posted on 03/26/2008 11:11:54 AM PDT by darth
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To: Hoffer Rand

What type of “absentee ballot fraud” are you referring to? In my post, my emphasis was on identifying phantom voters and getting them off the rolls.


24 posted on 03/26/2008 11:19:32 AM PDT by darth
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To: Content Provider

‘verifiable paper ttrail’? no such thing in a computerized world.

paper ballots, hand counted by all sides.


25 posted on 03/26/2008 11:21:57 AM PDT by camle (keep an open mind and someone will fill it full of something for you)
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To: B4Ranch

When the election tally is announced its usually too late. Hence, my emphasis on actions we can take to PREVENT vote fraud. For example, in the 2000 election I prevented over 100 fraudulent votes out of 850 cast at the precinct where I worked. That’s a significant percentage.


26 posted on 03/26/2008 11:23:05 AM PDT by darth
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To: darth
I'm in Michigan and a few years ago I noticed something I thought odd when I voted.

One of the poll workers was making different marks on the voter lists as she marked those that were given a ballot.

Michigan has no party registrations anymore but they used to.

Some voters were marked with a Hi-lighter all the way across the name and some only half.

I questioned why my name was marked different that several above it and she turned rather pale and said she likes to mark some different.

I then noticed that some that were longtime voters still had the “D” or “R” next to the names and only the “R” had the half mark. The “D” or no letter had the full mark.

I don't know what the reason for sorting out was but it might have been a way to know which ballots to change later?

27 posted on 03/26/2008 11:23:09 AM PDT by Beagle8U (FreeRepublic -- One stop shopping ....... Its the Conservative Super WalMart for news .)
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To: camle

I could design a device that had the advantages of both without much trouble. Allow the voter to use a touch-screen to register the vote, then print it out and have the voter confirm its veracity then drop it in a secured ballot box. When the voter is finished voting, record the vote locally AND to a remote site which would independently tally the result. Produces both an electronic and a paper record, which would greatly increase the barrier to forgery and fraud.

If the numbers don’t add up from all the different places where it is recorded, immediately secure all physical and electronic evidence and conduct a thorough probe of the actions of all individuals involved.

Increase sentencing to a felony with a minimum of 10 years with no parole for anyone convicted of willful alteration of the results of the vote.


28 posted on 03/26/2008 11:29:00 AM PDT by Content Provider
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To: darth

There are several types of absentee fraud. People registered in more than one state, who vote absentee in one, in person in the other. People who register people in nursing homes, then request absentee ballots for them. Even your phantom voters are voting absentee. Since you had such good suggestions for dealing with phantom voters, I was wondering if you had any thoughts about how to curb illegal absentee voting.


29 posted on 03/26/2008 11:29:14 AM PDT by Hoffer Rand (Forget "Who is John Galt?" I want to know "Where is Galt's Gulch?")
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To: Beagle8U

Any time they start sweating its usually because some kind of scam is going down. For example, here in Texas it is illegal for the precinct workers to let anyone know who has voted and who has not. However, democrat workers often call party workers to let them know who has not voted so that they can send a van to pick the voter up and get them to the polls. Being involved in the process will allow you to understand how fraud can be perpetrated, so once again, get involved.


30 posted on 03/26/2008 11:35:44 AM PDT by darth
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To: Hoffer Rand

A good private eye would have no trouble determining if a voter owns homes in more than one state. It may require Freepers in more than one state to look at the Voter Rolls to determine if the perp is double-registered. Here in Texas we often catch people registered multiple times at relatives’ homes, rental properties, businesses, etc. Just remember that you can have a major impact by exposing such fraud, shining a spotlight on it, and getting the perps off the Voter Rolls.


31 posted on 03/26/2008 11:42:15 AM PDT by darth
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To: darth
However, democrat workers often call party workers to let them know who has not voted so that they can send a van to pick the voter up and get them to the polls.

They did that in New Orleans when Blanco was trailing at the polls. They seemed competent at getting buses out and about (loaded with free food, drinks and dixie land jazz) when their power was at stake.

Getting the buses out during Katrina wasn't so important. The dead still vote Democrat.

32 posted on 03/26/2008 11:47:48 AM PDT by Grizzled Bear ("Does not play well with others.")
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To: darth

BUMP!


33 posted on 03/26/2008 11:48:49 AM PDT by Fester Chugabrew
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To: darth

Congratulations


34 posted on 03/26/2008 11:49:58 AM PDT by B4Ranch ( (Give a person a fish .......Teach a person to use the Internet and they won't bother you for weeks)
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To: Content Provider

the progbrammer who makes your device do what you want it to do can control the output. period. anything that can be programmed can be programmed to yield the desired outcome.

I can program this (and I haven’t written a real application in 15 years or so) in a short time, and there is absouutely no way you can catch me.


35 posted on 03/26/2008 11:57:32 AM PDT by camle (keep an open mind and someone will fill it full of something for you)
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To: Larry Lucido

FYI, the plural of opus is OPERA.


36 posted on 03/26/2008 12:01:16 PM PDT by FFranco
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To: camle

I am a programmer too. There’s no way you can program past the requirement I put in that the voter inspect his own physical ballot and drop it in a box, and the later check of the physical record results against the electronic results. You would need the full cooperation of most if not all of the election personnel on site, in every district where fraud was to occur.

Even then, you’d have to be one hell of a programmer to do it in a way that wasn’t able to be detected by post facto by pattern analysis.


37 posted on 03/26/2008 12:02:18 PM PDT by Content Provider
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To: FFranco

Thanks. Looks like I’ve been rope-a-dopused!


38 posted on 03/26/2008 12:11:42 PM PDT by Larry Lucido (Still looking for UART at FX1050)
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To: FFranco

Maryland is such a socialist state the we do not even HAVE a Secretary of State. We have a totally vetoproof dem legislature, a dem/socialist/crook governor who will not appoint anyone to the SecyState position. Someone is “acting” which means he has no autonomy at all!

Our head of the State Board of Elections is a partisan Democrat whose replacement was refused by our courts, when we briefly had a Republican governor. She has essentially a job for life.

We have a law that makes it very difficult to remove a name from the rolls, even if a family member declares that they are dead, never mind that the name is a phantom.

I have worked as a Chief Judge in every election since 2000 and highly recommend it as a civic duty.


39 posted on 03/26/2008 1:11:34 PM PDT by maica (Peace is the Aftermath of Victory)
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To: darth

To prevent vote fraud AND get rid of the current campaign circus that drives most rational and competent people away from even running for office, we need to eliminate the direct popular vote concept. People should vote for a VERY local representative, for a district of a few square blocks max (population 2-300 adults max). That way they’d be voting for someone they can actually get first hand information about, and the candidate can have intelligent, direct discussions with small groups of voters and individual voters. Then have those elected representatives vote for a town/county officials and state legislators/senators. Have state legislators and senators vote for Governor, and for national House of Representatives and Senators. Have Representatives, and with population-based votes, Governors and Senators, elect the President and Vice President.

Nobody would be campaigning to huge masses via soundbites and stupid TV ads (much less spending huge amounts of time and energy raising money to run that sort of campaign). Nobody would be voting for anyone they hadn’t met and talked to in person. At the grass-roots level, nobody would be voting for someone without being able to ascertain what that person is really all about, because they could not only talk to the candidate directly, but also to other people in the immediate area who have worked with candidate, lived next door to the candidate, have kids who go to school with the candidate’s kids, etc. At the higher levels, everyone with a vote could at least have direct conversations with the candidate, and among each other.


40 posted on 03/26/2008 1:35:00 PM PDT by GovernmentShrinker
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To: GovernmentShrinker

This is similar to my thoughts on the matter. One thing this would do is to destroy the idea that the US is a democracy. In fact, until 1913, with passage of the Seventeenth Amendment to the Constitution, Senators were elected by the state legislatures. And of course, the President is not elected by popular vote,

Many years ago, a conservative thinker (and millionaire, whose name I have forgotten) recommended citizens get an extra vote for every million dollars of their net worth. That would give more electoral weight to property holders. In addition, taking an idea from RA Heinlein, I would give one extra vote for each two years of active duty military service. For each of these, I would give a maximum of ten extra votes.

To summarize:
Every citizen gets 1 vote.
A citizen with 20 years active duty military service gets 11 votes.
A citizen with $10 million of net worth gets 11 votes.
A citizen with 20 years active duty military service and $10 million of net worth gets 21 votes.

As you suggest, these would not be direct votes for candidates, but votes for electors who would then elect the office holders.


41 posted on 03/26/2008 2:22:26 PM PDT by FFranco
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To: camle

I have to present SSN information to the driver’s license bureau because of the problem of “deadbeat dads” not paying child support.

Certainly we can require proof of citizenship for those registering to vote.


42 posted on 03/26/2008 2:25:32 PM PDT by weegee (Famous moments in history: March 18th, 2008 “I have a bridge (to sell you)...” - Barack H. Obama)
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To: FFranco

I have a problem with “every citizen gets one vote”. Nobody should get a vote if they’re receiving government handouts of any kind. We urgently need to put an end to people voting themselves goodies from the public treasury, i.e. from other people’s pockets. Trouble is, about 99% of the US population either currently is receiving, or expects to be receive in the future, some kind of government handout.


43 posted on 03/26/2008 2:28:33 PM PDT by GovernmentShrinker
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To: GovernmentShrinker

I think you are underestimating the extent of our dependence on the government. Everyone receives benefit from the government, either directly or indirectly.

I live in a western state where a lot of people have the idea they are rugged individualists not dependent on the government. But they grow crops irrigated by government irrigation systems drawing water provided by government dams. Their electricity is provided by government cooperatives. Ranchers have their cattle roaming on government land, while loggers cut trees in government forests. And that’s not even counting the government roads and highways we drive on, the government hospitals we go to when we’re sick or injured, and the government fire, police and ambulance services we depend on.

Let’s face it, our ideas are just utopian dreams that will probably never be implemented.


44 posted on 03/26/2008 2:57:24 PM PDT by FFranco
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To: darth

bookmark


45 posted on 03/26/2008 3:43:54 PM PDT by GiovannaNicoletta
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To: darth; All
1. moral inculcation from childhood.

Problem solved.

46 posted on 03/26/2008 4:01:14 PM PDT by the invisib1e hand
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To: FFranco

Well, everyone SHOULD be receiving benefits from the government INdirectly. If it weren’t so, we should completely shut down the government forthwith. But those who are using government to transfer money and/or property from others to themselves shouldn’t have a vote. And yes, that includes a lot of people who don’t think of themselves as living on government/taxpayer handouts, including everyone who has children in public schools without paying the full tab in taxes every year (about $15,000 per child on average, and a lot higher in some areas).


47 posted on 03/27/2008 12:04:26 AM PDT by GovernmentShrinker
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To: evets

Great movie, and a bump for this thread.


48 posted on 03/27/2008 11:24:44 AM PDT by FreedomPoster (<===Typical White American)
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To: darth

“While I obviously support better election security, we CANNOT wait for our elected officials to legislate reforms. My whole post is about concrete steps we can take now to prevent elections from being stolen.”

So, lets get started, we’ve got enough bodies here. Are the election rolls accessible online? Lets pick a district to start with, maybe someone can load the list into a spreadsheet and do a “sort by address”? We can at least get a head start on tracking phantoms together. Then we can send the list of suspects to someone who can check locally.

Anyone else want to help Freep The Vote?


49 posted on 07/10/2008 10:05:42 AM PDT by Ellendra (Most eco-freaks wouldn't know nature if it bit them on the butt . . . and it often does!)
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To: darth; eaglesnest1; neverdem; Mr. Silverback; votelife; King Nothing; blam; Conspiracy Guy; ...

Great suggestions to act on now and pass on, please! May justice and righteousness prevail.

Also see:
July 10, 2008
The Threat of Non-Citizen Voting
by Hans A. von Spakovsky
http://www.heritage.org/Research/LegalIssues/lm28.cfm


50 posted on 07/11/2008 8:36:48 AM PDT by The Spirit Of Allegiance (Public Employees: Honor Your Oaths! Defend the Constitution from Enemies--Foreign and Domestic!)
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