Posted on 04/09/2008 6:45:27 PM PDT by Delacon

"The climate is not highly sensitive to CO2 warming because water vapour is a damper against the warming effect of CO2.
That is why history is full of Ice Ages - where other effects, such as increased reflection from the ice cover, do provide positive feedback - while we do not hear about Heat Ages. The Medieval Warm Period, for example, is known for being benignly warm - not dangerously hot."
ping


Click on POGW graphic for full GW rundown
New!!: Dr. John Ray's
GREENIE WATCH
The Great Global Warming Swindle Video - back on the net!! (click here)
Ping me if you find one I've missed.
Somebody please tell these guys:
The attorneys general of 17 U.S. states recently filed a lawsuit against the Environmental Protection Agency over their alleged inaction on supposed “global warming.”
http://www.onenewsnow.com/Legal/Default.aspx?id=75023
But this is no longer science, it is a religion.
‘all over in 6 mos’ and ‘profoundly embarrassing for pols?’
Optimistic he is!
“Optimistic he is!”
LOL. Hey, he’s an Aussie. Gotta love em.
Absolutely tremendous article.
I will have to memorize this whole thing, and look into the details of the changed evaluation of the Stefan-Boltzmann equation. I know the change has to do with the IPCC using the wrong boundary conditions, but now that this has been out in the public for some time and withstood some scrutiny, I am gaining confidence it is worthwhile to study.

"Because I'm super important, I can say anything I want and the ignorant masses will listen to me."
YEP - every fifteen hundred years you can just count on heating and cooling cycles like it has been for the millenium.
you don’t think mere facts are going to deter these lunatics from destroying economies and wrecking havoc on mankind do you? There is just too much money to be made and people like Gore, the MSN, hollywood, and all the politicians, (repub & dem) feel the need to lead the way.
“This has struck the alarmists like a thunderbolt, especially as the lead author of the IPCC chapter on feedback has written to Spencer agreeing that he is right!”
:)
bttt
"...childish nonsense...."
eh, eh, eh
I say, let's put some more shrimp on the barbie.
Religious politics without God. Socialism, pure and simple.
I’ve asked this question before and I will ask it again:
Would not higher levels of CO2 enhance plant growth which in turn would consume more CO2? Sort of like another negative feedback. Probably a silly question but would like to get some positive feedback.

Climate ping!
The troposphere goes up approximately 7 - 10 miles or so, depending on the latitude and time of year.
That is roughly 35,000 to 50,000 feet.
And these Nimrods forgot the possibility of RAIN?? /sarc>
Cheers!
Cooling is much more serious for the obvious reasons like failure of seeds to germinate but what if cooling lasts long enough to cause the polar ice cap to build up until this old planet becomes top heavy and starts wobbling in its orbit, even flipping over? Talk about something we can’t control.
At least when these fools kept saying sea levels would rise there would have been a transition period. And so what? Venice has been flooded for centuries.
Cheers!
Another what?
Perhaps. But the level of CO2 is rising. This indicates that the response of plants to higher levels of CO2 is not adequate to keep the CO2 concentration within a "narrow" range, depending, of course, on how one defines "narrow".
One observation that can be made is that CO2 levels have been much higher in the past than they are now. Similar statements can be made concerning global temperature.
I have yet to read an explanation for how ANY ice age has occurred, meaning that there is much left unexplained regarding earth's climate.
Those who predicted an imminent ice age in the 1970s were shown to be fools. I predict the same for those who follow the Gore-ical. My worry has always been that it would take too long to reveal their foolishness and that great damage would be done to human progress as a result. I am becoming more optimistic that finally, ... the end is near.
Correct. It turns out that we put out 7 Gigatonnes of CO2 (I think) and more than half is 'absorbed' by the biosphere and oceans. The natural carbon cycle is as big as 100 Gigatonnes a year. Still, it is not *all* absorbed and so incrementally we are adding about 1.5 ppm of CO2 per year to the atmosphere.
PING for important article on water vapor as a not-so-positive feedback on AGW.
I think that I read that our oceans contain 50 times the CO2 that is contained in the atmosphere.
We know that if we warm a carbonated beverage, some of the CO2 dissolved in it will be released. The same is no doubt true of the oceans. If the globe warms, CO2 will be released from the warming oceans. Similarly, if the oceans cool, one would expect that the oceans would be able to dissolve more CO2 from the atmosphere.
I believe that some have suggested this as an explanation for why CO2 concentrations in the atmosphere LAG global temperature changes. A quick net search reveals the following paper: http://www.rocketscientistsjournal.com/2006/10/co2_acquittal.html
I believe that the paper makes the case that temperature changes in the oceans are sufficient to explain CO2 levels. It is not necessary to suggest that man's contribution is significant nor is it necessary to suggest that CO2 concentrations are capable of creating run-away global warming.
Yes, from what I’ve read the warming and cooling cycles of the oceans are what are responsible for rising and falling levels of CO2 in the atmosphere and why CO2 levels lag temperatures, not lead. Which gets us back to cyclical earth orbit changes and the sun actually driving all of this.
They have recently added another factor in all of it that makes a huge amount of sense.
Alot of the biology of the mid-oceanic regions (or , reather, the somewhat lack of biology) is because way out there in the middle there is not much iron.
Volcanism can eject hundreds of millions of tons of minerals into the sky, and if it falls in the mid oceans, it makes the plankton just go bananas. And when they go crazy, they suck HUGE amounts of CO2 out of the atmosphere.
Of course, volcanism also adds CO2 to the air, so maybe it’s a wash.
I know you were being sarcastic and that the models do have rain in them. But the main problem as far as I can tell is that the coarse resolution of the models precludes accurate weather modeling. It's not necessary to predict weather since the initial conditions don't matter, but they need to model effects like small scale convection accurately. Basically, concentrated convection causes cooling because it leaves large areas clear to radiate heat to space.
Just imagine what would happen if they got the recipe for the Krabby Patty.
Point #5 in my profile summarizes the current scientific understanding of glacial/interglacial transitions. Reading the references will provide a fairly full picture of what is known and where the uncertainties still are.
There have been controlled experiments to investigate the process, too. What they discovered is that most of the CO2 removed from the atmosphere temporarily by this process gets right back into the atmosphere. What happens: phytoplankton thrive with added iron, then they die. When they die, oceanic bacteria eat up the carbon in the phytoplankton, a process called "respiration" (same thing happens in our bodies). Net result: CO2. In the ocean, surface water pCO2 concentrations rise, and in warm waters, this CO2 gets released right back to the atmosphere.
The experiments determined that only about 5-10% of the CO2 removed by the phytoplankton is actually removed to the deep ocean. The main way that happens is that zooplankton eat the phytoplankton, and excrete rapidly sinking fecal pellets that do exit the surface zone.
Well, ... at the very least one of the groups must look foolish. We can't suffer catastrophic global warming and catastrophic global cooling at the same time; unless we let AlGore redefine some of the terms.
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