Posted on 04/25/2008 3:52:05 AM PDT by marktwain
The owner of an Internet-based firearms store that sold a gun to Virginia Tech shooter Seung-Hui Cho says he is now offering a discount for students who want to carry guns on campus to protect themselves. The company, TGSCOM Inc., also sold two 9mm Glock magazines to Steven Kazmierczak, who killed five people at Northern Illinois University earlier this year.
The owner of TGSCOM, Eric Thompson, announced today that for the next two weeks he will sell firearms at cost in the hopes of targeting students who may be on a tight budget. Customers will have over 5,400 different kinds of firearms from which to choose.
"This offer allows students and people who might not have otherwise been able to afford a weapon to purchase one at a hefty discount and at a significant expense to myself," Thompson told ABCNews.com.
A spokesperson for Virginia Tech said that Thompson's remarks and offer are "incredibly insensitive to the families of the victims who lost loved ones, and to the injured students still recovering from this horrendous tragedy," said Larry Hincker, the Associate Vice President for University Relations.
Related U.S. Guns Arming Mexican Drug Gangs; Second Amendment to Blame?PHOTOS: Mexican Drug Gangs' Weapons of ChoiceWATCH: U.S. Guns: Drug Gangs' Weapons of ChoiceGun control advocates also call Thompson's special offer "shameless".
"He's arming the criminals and then telling the rest of us to buy guns so we can protect ourselves from the criminals he's armed," said Peter Hamm, communications director for the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence.
While gun control advocates acknowledge that Thompson has a right to make this offer, they say this is yet another example of the gun industry trying to profit from gun violence.
"What this shows is that to the gun industry, gun violence is at best an abstract concept and at worst a business opportunity," said Josh Sugarmann, the Executive Director of the Violence Policy Center.
"No matter how these products are used against citizens, the answer is always more guns when in fact these problems stem from the fact that there are too many guns out there already," Sugarmann told ABCNews.com.
Thompson says that the fact that the college campus killers Cho and Kazmierczak bought products from his site has only made him more adamant that students should be allowed to legally carry guns on campus.
"The next news story I want to be involved in is how I sold a firearm to someone who helped stop a mass murderer. By forgoing a profit, I hope to help give law-abiding citizens the tools to prevent tragedy," he said. Hamm says Thompson's logic angers him. "He's so upset about his sales that he wants more sales," Hamm told ABCNews.com.
Thompson acknowledges that many private colleges ban guns on campus.
Related WATCH: U.S. Guns: 'Weapons of War' in MexicoReport Singles Out 'Easy' Gun Stores As Key to Gun CrimesIs That a Gun in Your Wastebasket, or Are You Just Happy to See Me?"The second amendment still stands," said Thompson. "I don't see why state laws and university policy should dictate and override people's right to defend themselves."
Thompson will be in Blacksburg, Virginia tomorrow speaking to Virginia Tech students who are in favor of allowing people to carry concealed weapons on campus. Current Virginia law prohibits carrying concealed weapons on college campuses.
Virginia Tech officials say that while Thompson certainly has a right to say what he wants, they are stunned that he would actually visit the school to tout guns on campus.
"Free speech is a hallmark of university life," said Hincker. "Still, I find it terribly offensive to learn that the gun-seller of the weapons used in the Virginia Tech campus murders would set foot on this campus."
Mail order firearms is not a cheap endeavor considering the hassles you have to go thru in finding a dealer to take delivery for you and his subsequent charges too........
Since when can you buy a gun over the internet? Didn't he merely buy magazines and a holster from this website? Seems like typical shoddy reportage to me.
“”Still, I find it terribly offensive”
A significant portion of this county have become sissified pussies, inept in the art of manhood.
Personally I was more upset about the killings than I was about the sales.
Besides, he's selling things "at cost". Does the media really not know that "at cost" means "no profit"? Teaching the media the truth about guns is like trying to teach particle physics to chimps. You can go on and on, but they just don't get it.
The rules explain that you need a local “transfer agent” in your state. It's all on the website.
Mr. Larry Hinker needs to resign or be fired. His completely closed-minded attitude has no place at a University.
I have already told Virginia Tech that they will get no more of MY money until they change their anti-gun policies. I urge all other Hokies to join me in this.
Thank you.
You may buy guns on the internet (or by mail order) but they must be shipped to a licensed dealer and you must pass the background check at the time you pick up the gun(s).
Most gun shops will take shipment of guns you have purchased on line or by mail. They typically charge around $25 plus the background check fee for this service.
This is the case in Virginia, at least.
Who wrote this crap?
An anti-gun reporter who's trying to get every little subliminal dig in that s/he can. Note also the "bought the guns over the internet" - without mentioning that Cho had to take delivery of the guns from one or more Virginia dealers who did have to run the background check. I've never seen a mention of who he picked them up from; as far as the media is concerned, the actual recipient of the sales price is the only one involved.
Or be jailed, should he be found participating in violations of federal law respecting either First or Second Amendment rights. It's not just *a hallmark of university life,* it's the law.
United States Code Title 18, U.S. Criminal Code
PartI, Chapter 13, §ection 241
Conspiracy against rights:
If two or more persons conspire to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any person in any State, Territory, Commonwealth, Possession, or District in the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or because of his having so exercised the same; or
If two or more persons go in disguise on the highway, or on the premises of another, with intent to prevent or hinder his free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege so secured—
They shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and if death results from the acts committed in violation of this section or if such acts include kidnapping or an attempt to kidnap, aggravated sexual abuse or an attempt to commit aggravated sexual abuse, or an attempt to kill, they shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for any term of years or for life, or both, or may be sentenced to death.
Bookmarking your post. Very interesting!!!
So is Sugarmann saying that Cho was able to kill 32 people because there were too many guns "out there"?
Cho only needed the guns HE had purchased. It's not like he found some extra guns lying around and picked them up to use them. Cho could have done what he did if there were only two guns in the entire country -- the ones he used.
It’s interesting when gun-grabber organizations accuse others of profiting off gun violence. Gun grabbers cheer gun violence because it gives them a reason for being. What blatant hypocrisy, yet these so-called journalists would never call them on it.
I feel strongly about this because I have two nieces at Tech, one of whom was an engineering student in an adjacent building during the shootings and as her class let out, she literally had to run for safety per SWAT orders as they were storming Norris. She had classes in Norris, just not that morning. She lost 3 close friends and nine folks she was acquainted with and will forever be affected. She and her sister have been avid hunters since they were old enough to climb into a tree stand with their dad - actually started shooting as soon as they were old enough to take a gun safety class. Their grandpa, who has hunted since he was a boy, went with them and re-took the class himself to impress upon them how important it was. They know, respect, and safely handle guns, are comfortable with guns, and one of them is currently planning to carry concealed (requiring yet another training class) while off campus and would certainly do so on campus if allowed.
Side note: Why is "Glock" not in the spell checker here?
gunbroker is in my favorites list. Finally pulled the trigger and bought my coveted chicago palm pistol thru them.
Thanks.
I just sent Mr. Hincker a “cease and desist recommendation” via e-mail based on the code you quoted...
Dear Mr. Hincker:
I am writing this to strongly recommend that you and other members of the Administration at Virginia Tech cease and desist in your conspiracy to infringe upon the rights guaranteed the students and faculty at Virginia Tech under the Constitution of the United States of America. Please carefully read the following section of the U.S. Criminal Code, and respond to me in detail explaining how the anti-gun policies implemented by Virginia Tech University and enforced by you and other members of the Administration are NOT in violation of this Code:
United States Code Title 18, U.S. Criminal Code
Part I, Chapter 13, §ection 241
Conspiracy against rights:
If two or more persons conspire to injure, oppress, threaten, or intimidate any person in any State, Territory, Commonwealth, Possession, or District in the free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege secured to him by the Constitution or laws of the United States, or because of his having so exercised the same; or
If two or more persons go in disguise on the highway, or on the premises of another, with intent to prevent or hinder his free exercise or enjoyment of any right or privilege so secured—
They shall be fined under this title or imprisoned not more than ten years, or both; and if death results from the acts committed in violation of this section or if such acts include kidnapping or an attempt to kidnap, aggravated sexual abuse or an attempt to commit aggravated sexual abuse, or an attempt to kill, they shall be fined under this title or imprisoned for any term of years or for life, or both, or may be sentenced to death.
It certainly appears that you have involved yourself in a conspiracy to prevent students and faculty at Virginia Tech from enjoying and exercising their most basic rights. I eagerly await your response. I am sure it will be as logical, well thought out and free of emotion as your previous discourse has been on this subject. Thank you.
J. Wayne Stephens, PE
VT Class of 1986
PS – I have previously donated whatever small amounts of money I could spare each year to Virginia Tech and the College of Engineering annual funds. I know it makes little difference to the bottom line of the University, but you will be receiving NOTHING from me until the unconstitutional and illegal policies regarding firearms at Virginia Tech are repealed.
Thank you.
Please give your nieces my condolences on the loss of thier friends.
Also, take a look at my post above; I sent an e-mail to Mr. Hincker a few minutes ago.
Again, I urge EVERYONE to withhold their money from Virginia Tech until they stop the madness.
I just sent Mr. Hincker a “cease and desist recommendation” via e-mail based on the code you quoted...
Excellent! It will of course require affirmation via the Supreme Court's decision on the Heller case, likely to be announced in June or July, but if that decision does make it clear that the Second Amendment guarantees an individual right, your position becomes much stronger, with federal prosecutions for such viuolations of civil rights taking place as much as 40 years after their commission in some cases.
You might have done well to have highlighted the most applicable portions of the statute in your e-mail, but that might also make a particularly nice feature to consider for a follow-up in June or July.
Additionally, you may find the information *here* to be of interest, as well as this link for reporting such violations to the appropriate federal authorities.
It tes 2 or more, so who would be the co-conspirator(s)?
Agreed.
“God,Guns and Guts”,
where have you gone to?
Unlike most conspiracy statutes, Section 241 does not require that one of the conspirators commit an overt act prior to the conspiracy becoming a crime.
If it's not the policy of the university, than their Associate Vice President for University Relations has overstepped his authority as an individual, and university President John T. Casteen has failed to prevent his subordinate's action against another's civil rights. Additionally, state charges for Official Misconduct by a governmental employee may also apply. However if it IS a stated UVA policy, then Casteen and the University Rector and Board of Visitors- who serve as the corporate board for UVA- would appear to be in violation of 18 USCS 241, and, potentially, 18 USC 242 instead or as well.
Note too: that when such a deprivation of civil rights by regulation, or custom that leads to the deprivation of any rights, secured or protected by the Constitution or laws of the United States and death results from the acts committed in violation of that regulation, as happened to Cho's victims, those responsible for that deprivation of civil rights "shall be fined under this title,or imprisoned for any term of years or for life, or both, or may be sentenced to death.
Indeed, at that point they are suspected criminal felons even if they are university officeholders, and can be apprehended by citizens- The common law in Virginia permits a citizen to effect an arrest for felony or breach of the peace. Interestingly, Virginia has had problems with such *campus* bastions with their own ways of doing things before. And in the Twentieth Century....
Your beef is with the General Assembly in Richmond, not Blacksburg. We have the same policies here at UVA, and I believe it's the same way at other Virginia colleges. Policy for carrying guns on campus is dictated by the folks in Richmond.
Are we talking about UVA or Virginia Tech? They are distinct and separate universities about two hours drive apart.
You wrote: “Policy for carrying guns on campus is dictated by the folks in Richmond.”
That is not correc t. LAWS are made in Richmond; the anti-gun policies are set by the schools.
The only thing the General Assembly has thus far failed to do is FORCE the Commonwealth’s public Colleges and Universities to change their policies by taking away their exemption under the current carry laws in Virginia (an exemption which, even though it IS unconstitutional, was intended to “protect” PUBLIC elementary, middle and high school children and NOT restrict the rights of law abiding adults). PUBLIC Universities have USED the law to justify, set and enforse anti-gun policies.
The schools themselves are free to change their policies ANY TIME they want to. There is NOTHING in the state law which prevents them from doing so.
So far, Virginia Tech has refused to change their policy. Thus, they get NONE of my money.
Any FFL holder in your area will agree to receive the weapon from the shipper for a small fee .
L
Sorry for my confusing the issue; I've been in communication with both a present UVA student and Class of 1986 VT grad and FReeper WayneS in post #20 above. Accordingly I had to dig into both Virginia law and university administration organization for both simultaneously, sort of like juggling a cat, a bowling ball a chicken and a chainsaw simultaneously and having the cell phone ring.
Stay tuned for further related news from UVA, and don't overlook the Supreme Court's ruling Wednesday in the MOORE case, also from Virginia.
I always look there for bulk ammo as well. So far it’s three span cans of 7.62x39, one 1000 round box of 9mm Luger and 4 cans of 7.62x54R for my Moisin Nagant.
It’s so competitive that the prices are usually great.
Link is to the MP3 of the interview that was on the air at 5:30pm EST today. Johnson defends his reasoning for speaking at VT yesterday and sheds some light on his side of the gun control debate.
“Mr. Larry Hinker needs to resign or be fired.”
“Or be jailed, should he be found participating in violations of federal law respecting either First or Second Amendment rights. It’s not just *a hallmark of university life,* it’s the law.”
United States Code Title 18, U.S. Criminal Code
EXCELLENT info on this thread for protecting ALL rights PING!
The way to reduce or eliminate these school massacres is to Arm the Students. High school students too should be allowed to carry firearms to school. And all teachers and staff who wish to and who meet the legal requirements should be allowed to arm themselves.
Whether middle school and primary school students should be allowed to carry firearms would depend on their age and physical and emotional maturity. Of course, teachers and staff need to be armed.
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