"Don't Blame Darwinism for Hitler! Blame Christianity!"

Jewcy - What Matters Now ^ | April 30, 2008? | David Klinghoffer

[sitetest]

Another perspective on what Ben Stein was communicating in his recent effort. One should go to the original article on-line as well, and follow a couple of his links where the author further explicates how Hitler actually did draw on Darwin's work, and how Darwin, how shall we say? - provided the rhetorical "hooks" to get there.

[sitetest]

If this is a double-post, my apologies. I searched for the title but didn’t find it.

[sitetest]

I’m pinging a few of the folks from this thread who might have an interest here:

“A Blood Libel on Our Civilization. Can I expell Expelled?”

My apologies in advance if you really didn’t want to be pinged to this thread.

[mnehring]

How about, don’t blame anyone for Hitler but Hitler.

[allmendream]

Can anyone supply a single quote where any Nazi leader (extra credit for Hitler) ever mentioned the word “evolution” in the context of Biological evolution, or ever used evolutionary rhetoric to whip up Jew hatred?

I have posted this challenge numerous times and have yet to see a single example.

The quotes of Nazi leaders, and Hitler, talking about “avenging the blood upon the cross”, “doing the Lord's work”, “internationalist bankers”, “and mongrel races” are quite easy to find.

If we are talking about what motivated Nazi's to hate and kill Jews, is not the language that the leadership used upon the masses to whip up Jew hatred of primary importance? How could Evolution through natural selection possibly be a motivation for the Holocaust if it was never sold to the German people under that banner?

Hasn't there been enough historic revisionism about Hitler to gag a maggot? Must “cdesign proponentists” wallow in their lack of credibility by engaging in Historic revisionism as well as shoddy theology masquerading as Science?

[william clark]

How can you call yourself a religious Jew and still believe in such Fundamentalist Protestant Christian nonsense like Intelligent Design?"

Yes, because as we all know, Genesis was a revisionist text drafted by the apostle Paul.

[Guenevere]

Good mercy, some of you folks twist yourselves into pretzels about this movie.

Just go see it.

It's a well made, profound movie....fast paced.

The message is not convoluted....it's clear as a bell.

[dan1123]

How can you call yourself a religious Jew and still believe in such Fundamentalist Protestant Christian nonsense like Intelligent Design?

Wow, ID is Fundamentalist Protestant Christian. I guess that's why it's part of Calvinist doctrine, "TULIPID" right?

Galileo got in trouble from the elites for pointing the microscope at the sky, and now researchers like Behe get in trouble from the elites by applying information theory to microbiology. Just remember, tools are domain specific. You can't go out and just use them on anything or it might rattle some elitist cage.

[Revolting cat!]

I’ll have a quote for you as soon as you provide a quote for us from the Beast herself which says that Saul Alinsky, or Karl Marx have influenced her current thinking. Yours is a Joe Palooka request, if I may use a historical reference.

[steve-b]

Expelled doesn't equate Darwinism and Hitler.

No reason to read past the first blatant lie.

[Soliton]

Hitler never mentioned Darwin, but he mentioned Christianity and Catholocism frequently as sources of his beliefs.

[dan1123]

“The law of selection justifies this incessant struggle, by allowing the survival of the fittest. Christianity is a rebellion against natural law, a protest against nature. Taken to its logical extreme, Christianity would mean the systematic cultivation of the human failure.”

- Adolf Hitler (Norman Cameron and R.H. Stevens, trans., (Oxford, 1953), Hitler’s Table-Talk, p. 51)

[steve-b]

Yet when Hitler successfully sold his ideology of hate to the German people in his bestselling tract Mein Kampf, he phrased his argument not in Christian terms

[ex-snook]

" Rabbi Gary Bretton-Granatoor, director of interfaith affairs wrote: "The anti-Judaism that begins in the New Testament was transformed through the admixture of political, economic and sociological prejudice into the anti-Semitism of modernity. This reached its ugly and inhuman nadir during World War II with Hitler's Final Solution for the Jewish people." "

I wonder if he read the NT account of Stephen.

[goldstategop]

The point is Nazism was post-Christian. It was the first post-modern ideology that drew upon the central scientific theory of the 19th century for its legitimation. Changing the subject does not in anyway refute the Darwinian inspiration behind Nazi thought. After all, Hitler made the argument that human nature should be driven not by morality or by religious scruples but by the iron law of Nature: the survival of the fittest. There was and is nothing Christian about Nazi dogma.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[steve-b]

Why would anyone waste money on bogus movies like Sicko, Farenheit 9/11, An Inconvenient Truth, or this latest companion piece to them?

[goldstategop]

Nazism is paganism. That they had to indulge in the cultural conceit of the Germans does not mean they were interested in preserving Christianity. Just the opposite.

"Show me just what Mohammed brought that was new, and there you will find things only evil and inhuman, such as his command to spread by the sword the faith he preached." - Manuel II Palelologus

[sitetest]

Dear allmendream,

Read the article, go the original article on-line, and read a couple of the articles at the links. Mr. Klinghoffer makes a reasonable case that Hitler was a eugenicist (in fact, that's a truism). Eugenicism certainly took its cues from Darwin.

Thus, that Hitler engaged in a “crude Darwinism” (Mr. Klinhoffer's term) should not be terribly controversial. He was far from the only person of the first half of the 20th century to do so.

The bigger questions are:

1. Was Hitler's use of Darwinism a legitimate explication of Darwin?

2. Did Mr. Stein suggest that Hitler's use of Darwinism was legitimate?

sitetest

[PzLdr]

Hitler believed Christ was the product of a rape of Mary by a Roman soldier. Want to tell me how that squares with Christianity? He was at best a pagan, and possibly a Deist. Personally, I think he was an atheist.

[vpintheak]

Well, I will blame the devil too.