Oh I don't know. Looks like a fine upstanding Christian boy to me!
Posted on 05/11/2008 6:24:42 AM PDT by Gamecock
The son of evangelical Tammy Faye Bakker Messner will spend his first Mother's Day weekend since her death in Houston, waiting to hear from Lakewood Church Pastor Joel Osteen.
Jay Bakker, a high-profile supporter of Soulforce — a group that fights religious and political oppression of lesbians, gays, bisexuals and transgenders — wants Osteen to join the nontraditional families at a picnic Saturday and welcome them to church on Sunday.
As the tattooed and pierced Bakker spoke at a Soulforce news conference Wednesday, it was clear his mother was in his thoughts. Though she died of cancer last July, she remains a near-legend in the LGBT community.
"I want to celebrate my mother's life," said Bakker, pastor of Revolution New York City, "and help spread the message she lived and preached. We need to stop thinking of ourselves as 'us' and 'them.' We hope the families of Lakewood Church will open their hearts and minds to us and sit down and have a conversation and share a meal. ... Let's put our differences aside and share the love and hope of Christ."
Osteen has been largely silent on LGBT issues.
But for Bakker, "That's as destructive as speaking out against the LGBT community."
Bakker began trying to reach Osteen in December as part of a nationwide fellowship effort called The American Family Outing. Letters were sent to the pastors of six megachurches, including The Potter's House in Dallas and Willow Creek Community Church in Illinois.
Organizers asked the pastors to meet with members of the LGBT community over a meal and talk about shared family values.
While four megachurch pastors answered positively, Osteen and one other didn't respond, Soulforce spokeswoman Paige Schilt said.
After Wednesday's news conference, Bakker drove to Lakewood with a local lesbian mother who is an Osteen fan.
"Families come in all forms," said Kim Beggs, a real estate broker. "God loves us."
They were turned away after a brief wait with the assurance that the letters would reach their destination.
Donald Iloff, Lakewood's chief of communications, later told the Houston Chronicle that Osteen wasn't able to meet with Bakker or attend the picnic because he is busy writing his Sunday sermon. It's a four-day process, he said.
Iloff went on to say, "If we met to talk, would this group be satisfied if we agreed to disagree? ... Soulforce wants to use Lakewood to further their agenda."
The picnic will go on from 11 a.m. to 2 p.m. Saturday at Levy Park. The group welcomes people who attend Lakewood Church, Schilt said.
***Osteen has been largely silent on LGBT issues.***
That’s because Osteen is silent on most Biblical issues, like Jesus, sin, salvation, atonement.
Imagine how f***** up the child of Tammy Faye and Jim Bakker must be. Yikes!
YBPDLNPL Ping
Sins of the parents visited....
Absolutely correct. A little more time spent in the scripture would really benefit him.
Hoss
why would this be surprising, one Religion Charlatan wants the blessing of another Charlatan, Osteen is probably taking polls of his membership to see what they would do starting with the largest donors first.
I think Joel uplifts people.
"Brother love's traveling salvation show", pass the collection plate, have they finished the wax job on my new plane yet???http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djeEFiOyqrY&feature=related
We aren’t called to be uplifted, but to die to ourselves.
“I think Joel uplifts people.”
He is a fantastic speaker and certainly provides encouragement and inspiration to his audience. Its sad that its not biblically based.
Joel should welcome them to church and love them, but to legitimize their relationship is out of the question assuming Joel really believes the Bible.
I don’t think Joel is ready to come out of the closet yet with him mom in the front row every week.
Iloff went on to say, “If we met to talk, would this group be satisfied if we agreed to disagree? ... Soulforce wants to use Lakewood to further their agenda.”
He’s got that right.
God also loves those who have relations with farm animals. That doesn't mean he approves. God's love and forgiveness is not license to remain in sin.
I agree. I've watched several of his sermons....and have heard him use scripture throughout each of them. He focuses on a humble attitude of the heart....faith....and loving your neighbor.
IMO, no one preacher expresses the message of salvation and Christian living in the exact same way. Does it mean they aren't of the body of Christ? 1 Corinthians 12
“If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death. Their bloodguiltiness is upon them.” Leviticus 20:13 (New American Standard)
Do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals, nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, shall inherit the kingdom of God. And such were some of you; but you were washed, but you were sanctified, but you were justified in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ, and in the Spirit of our God.”(19)
You are very mistaken in your comment about Joel or any of the Osteen.Don't try to put a guilt trip on this man he is not the problem..I can tell you this he and many more Christians will be in heaven with God when our Lord comes back and I really feel sorry for the ones that are left behind..We will leave the earth to you people and let you run it the way you want becasue we Christians won't be here..
“a group that fights religious and political oppression of lesbians, gays, bisexuals and transgenders...”
I don’t think they’re oppressed at all...they just resent that society doesn’t give them widespread approval.
Oh I don't know. Looks like a fine upstanding Christian boy to me!
Perhaps if Mr. Osteen had mentioned, you know, that Homosexuality is a problem with God, some may even call it a Sin, if Mr. Osteen had mentioned that perhaps Mr. Bakker would not be delivering letters for a Homosexual outings?
“Preach the Word in season or out of season..” or something like that, or is it “I’m okay, your okay, It’s alrighty with the Almighty”?
I don't have to imagine much - the article tells me about all I really want to know.
"Families come in all forms," said Kim Beggs, a real estate broker. WRONG
"God loves us."
You've never actually seen a real Bible, have you Ms. Beggs?
Interesting that conservative Christians tend to focus on the "effeminate homosexuals," while pretty much ignoring the verses equal condemnation of "adulterers, thieves, covetous, drunkards, revilers, and swindlers."
Premarital (heterosexual) sex has been accepted as an unremarkable fact of life in most American churches, at least in practice.
The high levels of divorce in churches indicates that adultery is widespread, and seldom brings significant repercussions to the church members who indulge in it.
Drunkenness is as always popular among Christians.
Slander and gossip is widespread.
Immoral business practices certainly constitute theft, covetousness and swindling.
The Bible doesn't single out homosexuality here as uniquely sinful, yet many Christians do.
Why is that?
Are there parades and political lobbies for adulterers, thieves and gossips?
Don’t need em. Too widely accepted without them.
The Bible condemns homosexuality, as it condemns all sin. Yet most conservative churches seem to classify this one particular sin as immensely more sinful than any other. This is not scriptural.
Do you agree that premarital heterosexual sex is widely accepted as no big deal in many if not most churches?
Are there any repercussions for open adulterers in most churches?
What do you think the average conservative church’s response would be if a married parishioner left his wife for a man rather than a woman?
The bulk of the American Evangelical churches have left behind the old testament. Until the “full council” of God is taught...especially his law...things will continue to deteriorate. Our society reflects the health of the so called “church”. Without repentance...returning to the Lordship of Christ by following his “laws”, the Church will continue to be marginalized and mis-guided. Keep in mind, this is not God’s fault. This is man unrestrained.
Thanks. I agree.
Yea. I guess. But watching him makes me ill. He is sooooooooo FAKE. He turns this and that way like a wax robot with a smile of death pasted on his clown face. I mean it. He is scary if you watch him enough. He looks and acts like something out of a end times horror film.
“Do you agree that premarital heterosexual sex is widely accepted as no big deal in many if not most churches?
“Are there any repercussions for open adulterers in most churches?”
What is acceptable or not acceptable, excusable or not excusable, condoned or not condoned in churches today (in general) is in NO way an indication of whether something is right, wrong, good or evil.
Many say that sodomy is no worse than other sins. I believe it is a “last straw” sin. Romans chapter one indicates that sodomy is a result of man worshipping created things and man himself. It is at the end of the line, or at the depths of degradation.
Sodomy is the only sin for which the decescendents of one of Noah’s grandsons were cursed, for which two cities were fire-bombed by God, and for which 50,000 members of the tribe of Benjamin were slaughtered under Divine sanction.
I don't know about widely accepted but not roundly condemned, that's true.
Are there any repercussions for open adulterers in most churches?
I don't know. Are there any repercussions for open homosexuality in most churches?
What do you think the average conservative church’s response would be if a married parishioner left his wife for a man rather than a woman?
A conservative church? Not very positive in either case.
Because these sins are prevelent in out society does not mean Conservative Christian theology says they are all o:K. Why do people have blinders on. There is a big difference in knowing what sin is and in trying to call things sinful non sinful. That is the agenda of the homosexuals. They want the Christians to CONDONE what they do. I have yet to see fornication, adultry and all the other sins you listed as being preached as non-sinful. I have yet to see a conservative preacher stand up and say “Hey fornication must be accepted as not a sin”. Give me a break and open up you eyes.
No matter what you say it is not normal..and I will not be here when you find out what will happen..
Where did I say it was normal? Of course it’s not, from biological and evolutionary perspectives as well as Biblical ones.
I am merely pointing out that God’s Word provides a list of sins, and many Christians pick out the only one they’re not personally tempted to indulge in for most of their condemnation. This strikes me as remarkably hypocritical.
“The Bible condemns homosexuality, as it condemns all sin. Yet most conservative churches seem to classify this one particular sin as immensely more sinful than any other. This is not scriptural.”
Name ONE denomination that preaches homosexuality is worse than all others. Maybe you have a link or just the name of a particular church to google? This should be very easy since it includes “most conservative churches.”
That is my opinion too. There is something very phony and wrong about Mr. Osteen. It will probably come out years from now, but it will be a doozie.
“and have heard him use scripture throughout each of them.”
If you listen carefully, he speaks from the “I”, not from the Bible. The passages he quotes are often more than glitter on his opinions.
The man is not rooted in the Word and is the type of preacher warned against in both the Old and the New Testament.
“and have heard him use scripture throughout each of them.”
If you listen carefully, he speaks from the “I”, not from the Bible. The passages he quotes are often nothing more than glitter on his opinions.
The man is not rooted in the Word and is the type of preacher warned against in both the Old and the New Testament.
Um, can I get the 2 minutes and 36 seconds back of my life that I wasted watching that video?
That is probably more natural than harping on the sins one is more tempted to indulge in. But that does happen. It's all neurosis.
I’m speaking of attention, not doctrine.
How many “family values” organizations spend as much time (or any) campaigning against premarital sex or adultery as they do against homosexuality?
God views all as sins, yet I think some sins are viewed by many as more equal than others. That it is an unpopular sin, statistically speaking, I’m sure has something to do with this.
Osteen seems to have the same credibility as Dr. Phil.
all a “put your hand on the TV and buy mah book”
This group and this man, Jay Bakker, both seem to be more than just a little vague about the nature of sin, and the forgiveness freely offered to us, sinners all, through the death and resurrection of Jesus Christ. Mr. Bakker cannot define away the sinfulness of his own particular weaknesses; he is to repent. That is to say, he is to make a very sincere and earnest effort not to repeat the behavior, as well as to work with God through prayer to control the thoughts that lead to the behavior. His campaign will lead to the judgment and second death of his own self, body and soul, as well as the deaths of all who believe as he does. God’s truth is eternal ... unchanging. Jay Bakker is loved by God, but the gift of eternal life with God is not provided to those who reject it, and he clearly is rejecting it, choosing instead to lead countless hurting, confused people to the same self-deception that leads to destruction.
And midgets!
Actually he has a ministry to youth /street people. Non traditional approach to reach people that would never sat foot inside a church.
Man looks at the outward appearance, but the LORD looks at the heart." 1 Samuel 16:7
He does have a ministry trying to reach those that would never set foot into a church.
“Actually he has a ministry to youth /street people. Non traditional approach to reach people that would never sat foot inside a church.”
...and then teaches them false biblical doctrine. Just helping Satan along.
God also loves mass murderers and child molesters. That doesn't mean society should deem such behavior acceptable.
From God's perspective, the distance between the sinfulness of an evil and that of a righteous man is not great. The sacrifice of Christ is equally efficacious for both.
Joels ministry is wealth based christanity. That it is God's intent that all his children should be worldly and materially wealthy. After all, the more you have the more you must give to the church or something like that. As in the more God blesses you with the more you must bless me, your good-shepherd. And that is most likely the reason why his church is the worlds largest mega-church.
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