Posted on 05/27/2008 8:29:00 AM PDT by shrinkermd
A good deal of what is posted on FR is based on misreading of the facts or outright xenophobia. Anyone who speaks on this subject should have some facts and understanding of the issues and solutions.
Karl Rove did this in December 2006. The You Tube presentation at CSPAN can be found: HERE.
Eight-and-a-half minutes?
zzzzzzzzzz....
Too bad a 20 second clip isn’t out there.
He certainly seems to have made GWB into a believer of his nonsense.
“Karl Rove: U.S. Cannot Secure Border”
I think he mean’t “WILL NOT.”
There’s always that crowd that views life aas having value only when you can buy cheap dates.
Bump for later.
I hope everyone can now see who our enemy is. Why the Republican Party has gone liberal. It’s Karl Herr Rove. You have been duped.
The US, can, in fact, accomplish just about anything the people decide is important enough to undertake.
With the logic being used, California should be an arid wasteland rather than the agricultural giant it is, etc.
One problem in this issue is that there are no single, overnight and comprehensive solutions that cost nothing.
No disrespect to Mr. Rove, and no, I did not spend 9 minutes listening. WOuld love a transcript though.
God Bless
Molon Labe
Nonsense. Of course it can be secured.
We just lack the willpower and sufficient public outrage to do so.
How convenient for their corporate globalist plans.
They believe in Market forces until wages go up- then they pervert the Market with a food a cheap labor.
It's a hypocritical philosophy.
Treat the southern USA border the same way as Mexico takes care of theirs and there will be far less illegals coming.
On the other hand, walls, fences and people with guns enforcing borders will go a long way to stopping illegal crossing.
Like any other crime, of course you will never stop it all.
You can reduce it greatly though.
The problem that Rove and his (former) boss and frankly the rest of the government has on this issue is that the American people do not trust them. We have good reason not to.
Glad to see the definition of 'enemy' has been so watered down as to be almost meaningless.
“Karl Rove: U.S. Cannot Secure Border”
The replies crowd the mind.
1. We went to the moon, we can’t secure our border?
2. If we cannot secure OUR border, how in Gods’ name will we EVER secure Iraq?
3. A nation that cannot secure it’s borders does not deserve them.
When someone is de facto aiding and abetting the invasion of my nation, that person or group of people are not my friend.
No system is 100%, but the current system is a “non-system” of security meaning that we are relying on little more than the honor of the individual to obey the laws.
A border fence, with monitors and enforcement will reduce the in bound flow from a flood to a stream.
Add to that, laws that make it difficult or painful for illegal aliens to be in the US and you significantly reduce the motivation to come here in the first place. The stream becomes a trickle. Further, those that are already here start to head back home as per the example set by Arizona.
People forget that it was Rove, not Bush himself, who “pushed” Bush into his Amnesty efforts in 2001 prior to 9/11 and thereafter. Rove had this insane notion that amnesty was what legal aliens and Mexican-American citizens favored, but he was wrong. What Rove and Bush didn’t realize was the depth of anger in law-and-order citizens against ANY amnesty. They (Bush thru Rove) tried to paint patriots like The MMP as “vigilantes” and “extremists”—when it was Bush & Rove who kissed the Mexican govt.’s behinds by allowing the Mexican leaders to “coax” their millions to break our Federal laws. The legacy of Bush will certainly be Iraq and two recessions, but his promotion of Amnesty and refusal to secure the Border caused an exponential increase in illegal entry. The blood of innocent Americans who have died from the murders and drunken driving killings by illegal aliens is on his hands.
Crux of the problem isn’t “matching willing workers with willing employers”
Example: In the late 70’s myself and lots of other college guys worked summer construction labor at abut $6/hr ($8/hr when I lucked out on a union contract). But there were plenty of family men and others in our crews.
By any measure you use (CPI, Average Wage Rate, inflation, etc), that $6 to $8 an hour would in 2006 dollars be $22 to $28 per hour.
But we know anecdotally that illegals are paid $10 to $16 per hour cash, no taxes.
Employers are getting a 40 to 60 percent discount on general unskilled labor compared to the 70’s.
And that’s where the “insatiable demand” for illegals comes from.
Okay let's insert “destroyer of Republican Conservatism” in lieu. It doesn't change the fact that this man, and his minions, have ruined the party.
Yep. You CAN reduce it greatly. Right now the costs of control are way below the cost of leaving the border unsecured. Way below - and Americans know it. We’re not xenophobic, we want our joint property protected. Presidente Arbusto wouldn’t let squatters onto his land, why the hell should we? Hell, I’ve been to Mexico and speak Spanish, so I know why a Mexican would want to come here. I don’t blame them for wanting a better life. That said, it’s not in our best long-term interests to let them come. Particularly when they don’t assimilate.
>>>>The replies crowd the mind.
Alaska Pipeline: 2 years permitting, 3 years actual construction of 700 miles from Barrow to Valdez. 7x24x365 in temps of -50F to 95F, in mosquito infested tundra, across the Brooks Range, at a cost of $28 billion (2006 dollars) with 7,000 workers.
You’re right Carl, it can’t be done. /sarc
The day we start to prosecute those who employ illegals, this problem will start to get fixed. We have the tools to do it now. Just not the will.
The question is what is one willing to do to secure a given border. We won't do here what we do there.
His a** belongs to the corporations pure and simple. He probably owes his entire political life to them. Yes, I know that is what a "Repbulican" president is all about, but there are a bunch of us 'social-conservatives,' who care about many other things than just the mighty buck, who thought this guy cared about the country (not just through corporations) but other things like the invasion of illegals and the long term effects on this country. etc
Karl Rove was a 'genius' only because he was able to dupe the social-conservatives into voting for the Reps in large numbers. Of course, now we know, He and the rest, do not care for those issues at heart, that was just a 'technique,' to increase the vote.
GUESS WHAT... the jig is up! Social conservatives will not support the GOP like that in a long while to come.
No work = self deportation.
Rove makes sense. Good video.
This problem existed long before Rove and Bush, at that, this problem goes back to when Rove was in diapers. If anything, they are guilty of allowing the status quo to continue. To decry them the enemy also damns everyone in control from after Eisenhower’s presidency. The fact is, they don’t see this as an invasion. Just running around screaming and making them the enemy(sic) does absolutely nothing to fix the problem. At that, all it does is keep lawmakers from listening to the arguments as it sounds like knee jerk reacting. If you want to do something, start talking to your lawmakers about the costs of identity theft and fraud. Support and vote in lawmakers who believe in security. Most importantly, stop doing business with those who hire illegals and make it clear why you have stopped doing business with them.
We won't, and we don't.
>>>>I know why a Mexican would want to come here. I don’t blame them for wanting a better life
I want to live on a Tahitian island with permanent residency. I want to buy a nice hut on the beach and eat mangos and bananas and fresh seafood every day.
But the Tahitian government says I have to jump through a lot of hoops and wait for my turn in line. Not to mention the application fees and hassles. I don’t like that.
How about I just land my fishing boat at night, build my shack, and live there without visa, passport, ID, permission, or anything else. Etc etc etc.
You think the Tahitians will like that? After all, I “just want a better life”.
Let’s all keep in mind what the creator of this thread is - a DU’er.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2014926/posts?page=52#52
“Yes, you are right it is not clear. Therefore, we should label it junk science, castigate McCain and get a “real conservative” to represent us. How about Limbaugh. While McCain was in the Hanoi Hilton, Rush was suffering from a pilonidal cyst that prevented him from being drafted—at least that is what Wikipedia once said.
We need more conservatives with pilonidal cysts, football injuries and other accouterments of manliness.”
>>>>>>Social conservatives will not support the GOP like that in a long while to come.
“SOCONS” - who by the way are NOT conservatives in the Barry Goldwater or Ronald Reagan sense - will fall for any Elmer Gantry coming around the corner.
Even today they are still supporting the Huckster, who is Elmer Gantry reincarnate.
And they’re split the vote to leave us with McQueeg as the nominee.
Social Conservatives are the death of the GOP and perhaps of the conservative movement in America.
It’s that hypen that gives them away.
“A good deal of what is posted on FR is based on misreading of the facts or outright xenophobia.”
Baloney.
You are attempting to impute the racist canard upon Americans who merely expect the government to do its job and enforce the laws. I won’t even dignify that smear with a response.
I didn’t even listen to the recording. If Carl Rove, and George Bush and their pinhead buddies infesting Congress can’t enforce the laws of America, they should resign.
No nation which can’t guarentee the security of its borders will long survive as an independent nation. That idiot Rove and the others should pick up a history book and read it.
“This problem existed long before Rove and Bush, at that, this problem goes back to when Rove was in diapers. If anything, they are guilty of allowing the status quo to continue.”
The border should have been shut down hard on 9/12/01, and remained so.
LOL! Karl Rove? A guy who has made a lifelong career as a political barker and nothing else is going to dictate what we can or can’t do to secure our borders? LOL! He needs to get off his fat ass, quit attending all of those Chamber of Commerce all you can eat buffet luncheons, mow his own yard for once in his pasty white boy life and break a fat man’s sweat for starters. The exercise would do him good, provided he doesn’t drop dead from a coronary.
Bill1952: Outright lie.
Anyone who postulates any such absolute as “cannot” about anything that is, in fact, physically possible, does not deserve our time to read further.
And so, he shall not have it.
“We are now one of the largest Spanish-speaking nations in the world. We’re a major source of Latin music, journalism and culture.
Just go to Miami, or San Antonio, Los Angeles, Chicago or West New York, New Jersey ... and close your eyes and listen. You could just as easily be in Santo Domingo or Santiago, or San Miguel de Allende.
For years our nation has debated this change — some have
praised it and others have resented it. By nominating me, my party has made a choice to welcome the new America.”
George Bush, campaign speech in Miami, August 25, 2000.
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=16425
Maybe if one of Karl Rove’s kids was run over and killed by a drunk illegal Mexican he might change is tune...
Ronald Reagan and Newt brought us out of the darkness, it was the Bush “Kinder Gentler Nation” and Bush “Compassionate Conservative” that threw us right back into the abyss. If you want to be lickspittle for those clowns, okay, be my guest; but quit lying. “Oh it's always been bad and...” BS
No I am not a DU’r and I do not call people names. My DEROS from Viet Nam was 17 May 1969. What was yours?
I see Limbaugh as an entertainer. He is smart. He tells you what you want to hear and you agree he is a conservative. He may be, but he doesn’t live like one.
I bet you listened to neither of the Rove tapes, nor will you discuss anything except in pejorative terms. Ignorance is bliss, isn’t it.
>>>>>If anything, they are guilty of allowing the status quo to continue. To decry them the enemy also damns everyone in control from after Eisenhower’s presidency.
Wrong. The illegals problem pre-2000 was NOTHING like what we are seeing today. Not even close and you are disingenuous with your “status quo” and milquetoast non-judgemental assessment.
For example the current sub-prime meltdown is primarily the result of loans to illegals and/or those who house them.
Pfft..Your facts just get in the way of the open borders crowd. In their capitalist minds they have every right to pay lower wages under the table to illegals. The only consequences they are concerned about is getting caught doing it and the country club republican leadership of the past 8 years hasn’t shown much concern in doing that, save for a few high profile “raid” type operations on some larger scale operations recently.
Have you listened to either of the tapes?
Have you listened to either of the tapes?
“People forget”
That Bush is a dupe? Not I
Have you listened to either of the two tapes.
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