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Ex -US Envoy: Croatia Expelled Serbs
Balkan Insight ^ | 6/25/08 | Staff

Posted on 06/25/2008 7:19:23 PM PDT by Bokababe

24 June 2008 Zagreb _ A former US ambassador to Croatia has accused Zagreb of plotting and sanctioning the exodus of Serbs in 1995 to create an "ethnically clean" country.

Peter Galbraith told The Hague war crimes trial of three Croatian generals, that the leadership headed by late President Franjo Tudjman used ‘Operation Storm’ to ‘cleanse’ Croatia of Serbs.

“Croatian authorities either ordered or allowed a mass destruction of the Serb property in former (Serb-held region of) Krajina to prevent the return of the population. I consider that to have been a thought through policy,” he said, testifying at the trial of generals Ante Gotovina, Ivan Cermak and Mladen Markac.

The International Criminal Tribunal for Former Yugoslavia, ICTY, based in The Hague indicted the three for war crimes their troops allegedly committed during and after Operation Storm.

Up to 800 ethnic Serb civilians were killed and some 250,000 fled Croatia when in 1995 Croat forces crushed the rebel Serb breakaway state that occupied up to a quarter of the country’s territory since it declared independence from Yugoslavia in 1991.

“Croatia was an organised country, its army the most disciplined in former Yugoslavia, and therefore I cannot accept that the illegalities that occurred after Storm were spontaneous,” Galbraith told the court.

He added that had happened because “President Tudjman and people around him wanted it, wishing for an ethnically clean country.”

However, Galbraith said Croatia did not carry out an ethnic cleansing campaign following Operation Storm, because “you could not cleansed those who were not there, but I’m not saying it would have not happened had the population stayed.”

His testimony came as a surprise, since when he testified at the trial of late Serbian strongman Slobodan Milosevic in 2003 Galbraith said Croatia was not responsible for the ethnic cleansing of Serbs.

On Monday he said he was sorry for saying that because it was understood as his justification for the Croatian army’s actions, which had not been his intention.


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: antichristian; atrocities; b92isajoke; balkans; boring; croatia; ethniccleansing; fascist; galbraith; getoverit; getusedtoit; itsnotover; itsover; livinginthepast; longpasthistory; nationalsocialists; nazi; operationstorm; revengekrajina; serbianpropaganda; ustashe; warcrimes; yawn
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1 posted on 06/25/2008 7:21:05 PM PDT by Bokababe
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To: Bokababe

This is news?


2 posted on 06/25/2008 7:24:26 PM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: Bokababe

More from B92:

Galbraith, who testified on Monday in the presence of a U.S. government representative, said that he and other American officials had information months before Operation Storm that there would be a military attack on the Serb Krajina.

They “showed understanding for operations the Croatian Army launched in the Cazin Krajina and Croatian Krajina, especially in light of the massacre in Srebrenica in July 1995 and the Bosnian Serb army attack on Bihac”.

But the U.S. never green-lighted the operation, he contended. However, since the U.S. administration knew the assault might be launched, “it expressly warned the Croatian authorities and president Tudjman of their obligation to protect the Serb civilians and prisoners of war. The atrocities like those committed in the Medak Pocket in 1993 were not to be repeated”.

In the first days after the arrival of the Croatian Army in Knin, Galbraith recounted, the reports of the U.S. embassy personnel indicated there were widespread killings of Serb civilians and destruction of their houses, “thus confirming that the situation in the field was exactly what the U.S. administration wanted to prevent”.

In Galbraith’s opinion, this happened “on the orders or with the tacit approval of the Croatian leadership, in the presence and with the participation of the military”.

Although the prosecution indicted the three for deportation and forcible transfer of the Serbs, its witness, Galbraith, does not see Operation Storm as ethnic cleansing, mainly “because most of the population had already fled when the Croatian army and police arrived”

“You cannot ethnically cleanse somebody who is no longer there, although it doesn’t mean that the Croatian forces would not have done it if the Serbs had remained there,” he told the court.

In his view, the Serb Republic of Krajina (RSK) authorities are responsible for the Serbs’ departure “because they had urged the population to leave”.

However, then Croatian Defense Minister Gojko Susak “admitted to Galbraith that the Croatian authorities engaged in psychological warfare that partly contributed to the exodus”.

When the Serbs left Krajina, the Croatian authorities did everything to prevent them from returning, issuing a decree to confiscate the property of all those who failed to return within thirty days.

Furthermore, their houses were destroyed and their return obstructed in various ways. According to Galbraith, this fit Tudjman’s idea of an ethnically homogeneous Croatia.

Whenever they met, the president would emphasize that every country should be ethnically homogeneous, adding that local Serbs posed a threat to the homogeneity of the Croatian state.

“He was not ashamed of his views and I wondered how he could imagine that an American would accept his reasoning,” Galbraith said, noting that the Croatian president “spoke favorably of the so-called humane transfer of population”.

“Tudjman’s attitude towards Muslims was racist and he advocated the division of Bosnia which would lead to the creation of a Greater Croatia,” Galbraith concluded.


3 posted on 06/25/2008 7:27:52 PM PDT by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: joan; Smartass; zagor-te-nej; Lion in Winter; Honorary Serb; jb6; Incorrigible; DTA; vooch; ...

4 posted on 06/25/2008 7:29:31 PM PDT by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: Ron Jeremy

Actually, what is “news” is that Galbraith or any Western official is calling it “ethnic cleansing” and not just trying to justify it as “a necessary military operation”.


5 posted on 06/25/2008 7:32:26 PM PDT by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: Bokababe
Up to 800 ethnic Serb civilians were killed and some 250,000 fled Croatia when in 1995 Croat forces crushed the rebel Serb breakaway state that occupied up to a quarter of the country’s territory since it declared independence from Yugoslavia in 1991.

Hmmmm...compare/contrast to kosovo...

6 posted on 06/25/2008 7:32:43 PM PDT by 2banana (My common ground with terrorists - they want to die for islam and we want to kill them)
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To: Bokababe

The real problem, in my opinion, is that the globalists didn’t want to split up Yugoslavia.. leaving the Serbs, Croats, etc. to split it up themselves.


7 posted on 06/25/2008 7:37:39 PM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: 2banana

Pretty much, the difference is pipelines and press coverage.


8 posted on 06/25/2008 7:45:15 PM PDT by padre35 (Conservative in Exile/ Obamao v Mad Jon, win the battle and lose the war..choice of evils be..)
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To: Ron Jeremy
The EC voted 11-1 against the breakup of Yugoslavia. Germany being the 1. By the time Germany got done twisting arms the EC was unanimous for the breakup of Yugoslavia. The rest is history!
9 posted on 06/25/2008 7:49:12 PM PDT by F-117A (Mr. Bush, Condi, have someone read UN Resolution 1244 to you!!!)
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To: F-117A

Personally, and I am sure I will get flamed for this, this is why Iraq has been so much more difficult than anyone thought, and why we still might have to be there a long time.

It’s just like yugoslavia.. three distinct cultures that don’t want to live together. The only successful was to make them live together is with the force of a brutal tyrant.

Split it up.


10 posted on 06/25/2008 7:52:04 PM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: Ron Jeremy

Actually, it was Germany who originally wanted Yugoslavia split up, then we unfortunately jumped on the bandwagon.

I do disagree with you on what “the globalists wanted”. The globalists definitely wanted Yugoslavia split up — both for international financiers to buy off property for pennies on the dollar (think Soros) and to cut it up into easy to manage bite-size chunks to be run by bureaucrats — or more appropriately, “Eurocrats”.

We, on the other hand, just wanted to kick Russia in the nuts and expand our influence into Russia’s backyard, so we backed local neo-Nazis and Muslims. That policy came screaming back to bite us on 9/11 when four of the hijackers had cut their jihadi teeth in Bosnia.


11 posted on 06/25/2008 7:56:16 PM PDT by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: Ron Jeremy
"Split it up."

If only it were that simple in Yugoslavia, but it wasn't. Neither Bosnia nor Kosovo had ever been "countries". Croatia had a history of genocide against the many Serbs living their (who had been there for centuries).

It wasn't as easy as drawing lines with a pen and saying "poof, you are independent". Virtually all of the animosity between people in the Balkans can easily be attributed to foreign meddling and internationals "redrawing borders" over the centuries.

Fact is that if we really wanted "peace" and not just a predetermined outcome, we should have never got involved there at all. Instead, we are still in Bosnia, propping up some phony country ten years later, and we are still in Kosovo and will be for the foreseeable future, do the same. What a waste of time resources, and manpower!

12 posted on 06/25/2008 8:06:41 PM PDT by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: Bokababe
Actually, it was Germany who originally wanted Yugoslavia split up, then we unfortunately jumped on the bandwagon.

Why is it unfortunate? Why force together people who didn't want to live together? I know the Serbs liked it since they were a majority.. but too bad for them. The croats wanted their own country. We should have helped them achieve it peacefully.

13 posted on 06/25/2008 8:08:02 PM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: Bokababe
It wasn't as easy as drawing lines with a pen and saying "poof, you are independent". Virtually all of the animosity between people in the Balkans can easily be attributed to foreign meddling and internationals "redrawing borders" over the centuries.

Sure it wouldn't have been easy.. but it couldn't have been as bad as what happened.

Fact is that if we really wanted "peace" and not just a predetermined outcome, we should have never got involved there at all. Instead, we are still in Bosnia, propping up some phony country ten years later, and we are still in Kosovo and will be for the foreseeable future, do the same. What a waste of time resources, and manpower!

I'm fine with that.

14 posted on 06/25/2008 8:13:40 PM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: Ron Jeremy
The croats wanted their own country. We should have helped them achieve it peacefully.

There were plans for a peaceful resolution to the Bosnian question. Unfortunately, we encouraged Izetbegović to reject them. In other words, we helped them achieve the mess that BiH is today through war

15 posted on 06/25/2008 8:19:55 PM PDT by F-117A (Mr. Bush, Condi, have someone read UN Resolution 1244 to you!!!)
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To: Bokababe
The Trail of Tears
16 posted on 06/25/2008 8:46:59 PM PDT by MadelineZapeezda ( MUST SEE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkgHkxIfgBc)
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To: Ron Jeremy

I take it then that you are fine with the idea of the Confederacy rising again and the Mexicans reconquering Aztlan?


17 posted on 06/25/2008 9:02:21 PM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: Ron Jeremy
I know the Serbs liked it since they were a majority.. but too bad for them. The croats wanted their own country.

Oh, I see now, you supported the ethnic cleansing of non-Croatians from Croatia by whatever means necessary. Yes, the fascist state of Croatia's dreams are finally realized over 60 years after the Allies defeated them.

18 posted on 06/25/2008 9:04:33 PM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: Bokababe

btt


19 posted on 06/25/2008 9:17:52 PM PDT by Cacique (quos Deus vult perdere, prius dementat ( Islamia Delenda Est ))
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To: Ron Jeremy
"Why is it unfortunate? Why force together people who didn't want to live together? I know the Serbs liked it since they were a majority.. but too bad for them. The croats wanted their own country. We should have helped them achieve it peacefully."

I had no problem with the idea of an independent Croatia. I had a problem with an independent Croatia under Tudjman, who thanked God that his wife was neither a Serb, nor a Jew.

We backed a bunch of neo-Nazis who took great joy in ethnically cleansing their country of Serbs. And what's worse, is that "the father of their independence", "the George Washington of Croatia" was allowed to be a ranting, raving neo-Nazi racist. That is something that they will never get past, never get over -- which is why a neo-Nazi rocker like "Thompson" who sings of the joy of killing Serbs & Jews in WWII deathcamps like Jasenovac, can still draw an audience of 60,000 in Zagreb.

20 posted on 06/25/2008 11:22:43 PM PDT by Bokababe ( http://www.savekosovo.org)
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To: Ron Jeremy
This is news?

Well, it is news to the extent that there are certain individuals around here that would blame Milan Martic for the allegations that are justifiably charged against General Gotovina et. al.

21 posted on 06/26/2008 1:26:44 AM PDT by LjubivojeRadosavljevic
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To: Ron Jeremy

well, more than 3 — the Kurds (Aryanic/Indo-European people), the Arab Sunnis, the Arab Shias and then also the Christian Chaldeans/Assyrians, then the tiny communities of Manecheans and Sabeans who are Semitic while Yazidis are Irani peoples (like the Kurds)


22 posted on 06/26/2008 2:35:59 AM PDT by Cronos ("Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant" - Omar Ahmed, CAIR)
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To: FormerLib

That’ absurd. I support people having their own countries when they want them. Why don’t you just say “I’m a Serb and it makes me mad that we don’t get to rule the entire former Yugoslavia”?


23 posted on 06/26/2008 6:15:58 AM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: Ron Jeremy
That’ absurd. I support people having their own countries when they want them.

So, you supported the breakaway Serbian areas within Croatia then?

24 posted on 06/26/2008 6:29:18 AM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: Bokababe

Not just Tudjman...we have today croatian president who says “we don`t have to apologize to anybody, or to kneel in Jasenovac, because `we won twice in WWII` on 10. of april 1941. when Axis forces recognized NDH and we won after WWII when we were among winners`”.

How lucky they are. Great opportunist. I just wonder what real croatian antifascist have to say about that (my grandmother was one of them). Discusting.

It`s in croatian. I translated the essence of it.

S. Mesic (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jLaIDT8FZHw&feature=related)


25 posted on 06/26/2008 6:45:35 AM PDT by BabaYaga (BRE!)
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To: FormerLib
Not sure... I know nothing about it.. certainly if they are along the border with Serbia, and the vast majority want it, then yes.

Now, I have explained my positions, you have not explained yours. What are they? That you want one government, dominated by Serbia, that rules over the whole of the former Yugoslavia? If so, why? Also, why does it bother you so much that the Croatians want their own country, rather than to be ruled by Serbia?

26 posted on 06/26/2008 8:26:42 AM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: Ron Jeremy

It’s all “Serbia First” with these Milosevikniks.


27 posted on 06/26/2008 8:33:22 AM PDT by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Ron Jeremy
Not sure... I know nothing about it.. certainly if they are along the border with Serbia, and the vast majority want it, then yes.

Why would their bordering Serbia be a factor? I thought you supported the notion of people being able to create their own nations but now you are adding conditions?

By the way, the Croatians attacked and ethnically cleansed the Serbian areas in Croatia along with scores of horrific atrocities being committed against unarmed civilians, as documented by Canadian troops in the Medac pocket.

28 posted on 06/26/2008 8:35:24 AM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
"Milosevikniks"

LOL! Joe, you still don't get it one bit, do you. So very sad to witness such an impaired individual floundering!

29 posted on 06/26/2008 8:36:45 AM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: FormerLib

I do get it. You are a Miloseviknik. You are upset that his war against Croatia was a failure. You wish he had won, but he lost and his people suffered for his stupidity.


30 posted on 06/26/2008 8:45:42 AM PDT by Tailgunner Joe
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To: Bokababe; montyspython; getoffmylawn; Hoplite; kosta50
Shame on you for not pinging me to this thread. As usual, you conveniently forget the corrections and as usual, you engage in outright lies as many Serbs do.

I had a problem with an independent Croatia under Tudjman, who thanked God that his wife was neither a Serb, nor a Jew.

I've already corrected you on this matter. The quote is taken out of context. He made that statement because he said that he was neither a fascist nor a communist. It had nothing to do with race. Ante Pavelic's wife was from a Jewish family and Tito's wife was a Serb. Tudjman's son-in-law is a Serb as well. Hopefully you'll remember it this time.

We backed a bunch of neo-Nazis who took great joy in ethnically cleansing their country of Serbs.

That's funny, considering that Tudjman fought the Nazis in WW2 as did Manolic.

And what's worse, is that "the father of their independence", "the George Washington of Croatia" was allowed to be a ranting, raving neo-Nazi racist.

How could he be a neo-nazi when he fought the Nazis? You're not this stupid, bokababe.

31 posted on 06/26/2008 9:28:52 AM PDT by Diocletian
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To: LjubivojeRadosavljevic
Galbraith needs to make up his mind because during two previous trials at The Hague, he said the exact opposite thing: that ethnic cleansing did not take place because the Serbs cleansed themselves.

Why has he changed his mind now? Simple: because there is no threat from The Hague to Americans thx to American supplying of weapons and MPRI...so Galbraith helped the prosecution then and is helping the prosecution now. In the end, the NWO types win.

32 posted on 06/26/2008 9:31:33 AM PDT by Diocletian
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To: Ron Jeremy; Tailgunner Joe

Gentlemen, feel free to ask the Serbs about what happened to the Croatians who were from Serb-occupied Croatia. Ask them why the Serbs kicked them out, killed thousands of them, destroyed their churches, and wouldn’t let those who fled return. I’m sure you’ll get an answer :)


33 posted on 06/26/2008 9:33:06 AM PDT by Diocletian
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To: FormerLib
Why would their bordering Serbia be a factor? I thought you supported the notion of people being able to create their own nations but now you are adding conditions?

You've asked me a number of questions that I have answered. I asked you questions that you have not answered. I do not have one way conversations. Please answer the questions I have asked you, and I will gladly answer the questions you just put to me above.

34 posted on 06/26/2008 10:05:02 AM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: Bokababe
which is why a neo-Nazi rocker like "Thompson" who sings of the joy of killing Serbs & Jews in WWII deathcamps like Jasenovac, can still draw an audience of 60,000 in Zagreb.

Please provide the lyrics to this song where Thompson sings about the joy of killing serbs and jews, thanks.

35 posted on 06/26/2008 10:10:01 AM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: Tailgunner Joe
You are a Miloseviknik

Wrong as always, Joe, wrong as always.

Slobodan was a communists and communists are not supported by Serbian Christians, which means that virtually all Serbs in America opposed him.

36 posted on 06/26/2008 10:15:32 AM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: Ron Jeremy

The song in question isn’t by Thompson but rather by the late singer Josko Tomicic. Thompson did perform the song once, but that was years ago. He apologized for singing it. The song is distasteful, much like the flipside Serbian versions about cutting the throats of Croatians and dumping them into ditches.


37 posted on 06/26/2008 10:15:59 AM PDT by Diocletian
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To: Diocletian

The answer is simple, you are lying.


38 posted on 06/26/2008 10:16:23 AM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: Ron Jeremy

No, Croatia did not have the right to secede with her borders enclosing hundreds of thousands of Serbs who did not wish to leave Yugoslavia.

Your turn.


39 posted on 06/26/2008 10:18:06 AM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: FormerLib

Lying about what? Be specific so that I can bury you.


40 posted on 06/26/2008 10:19:38 AM PDT by Diocletian
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To: FormerLib
No, Croatia did not have the right to secede with her borders enclosing hundreds of thousands of Serbs who did not wish to leave Yugoslavia.

You should bring that up with all 6 republican leaders, including Milosevic, who agreed that Croatia did have the right at the EU meeting in 1991. Take it up with Belgrade.

41 posted on 06/26/2008 10:21:09 AM PDT by Diocletian
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To: Diocletian
...so that I can bury you.

The standard Croatian solution to the Serbian problem. Ethnically cleanse one-third, convert one-third, kill one-third.

42 posted on 06/26/2008 10:24:56 AM PDT by FormerLib (Sacrificing our land and our blood cannot buy protection from jihad.-Bishop Artemije of Kosovo)
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To: FormerLib

Feel free to point out the lies you claim that I posted. Since you’re a coward I know it’s gonna be a long wait.


43 posted on 06/26/2008 10:26:55 AM PDT by Diocletian
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To: FormerLib

I asked you far more questions than that. Don’t bother though, it is clear you are hopelessly biased on the subject and it is not worth the time to argue with you.


44 posted on 06/26/2008 10:28:07 AM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: Ron Jeremy

There’s a few Serbs here that you can discuss the topic with rationally. FormerLib is not one of them. Not a problem anyway since FormerLib is not well versed on the subject either.


45 posted on 06/26/2008 10:33:26 AM PDT by Diocletian
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To: Diocletian

It just seems very transparent to me that they simply want to rule the Croatians. The Serbs want to rule Zagreb. The Croatians do not want to rule Belgrade. The Croatians are happy with the status quo. The Serbs are not as they are not ruling the Croatians.


46 posted on 06/26/2008 10:41:30 AM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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To: Diocletian

Exactly, its all about self preservation.


47 posted on 06/26/2008 10:42:31 AM PDT by montyspython (Love that chicken from Popeye's)
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To: Ron Jeremy

What are you babbling about? We really don’t care about Zagreb and nor are we wanting to rule it. Croatians had no problem killing a few Serbs to achieve their goals so turn about isn’t fair play?


48 posted on 06/26/2008 10:46:55 AM PDT by montyspython (Love that chicken from Popeye's)
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To: Ron Jeremy

The Serbs got to rule Zagreb twice, but they scaled back their demands on Croatia to simply 2/3rds of Croatia in 1991, then to 1/3rd by 1992 since they were beaten back on several fronts. But when one speaks of Serbs one cannot count them as homogeneous in their views. The Belgrade Serbs already wrote off the Croatian Serbs by 1992, with Milosevic’s righthand man Borisav Jovic telling the Croatians that “those Serbs are your citizens, not ours. Crush them on wheels for all I care”. The Croatian Serbs were by and large isolated by 1994 and even more so in early 1995 when the Bosnian Serbs refused to help them out. It’s little wonder why they put up such a weak fight after the first day of Operation Storm and decided to make a run for it.


49 posted on 06/26/2008 10:50:21 AM PDT by Diocletian
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To: montyspython
We really don’t care about Zagreb and nor are we wanting to rule it.

Well, you have consistently wanted to rule it, and since you don't you are extremely bitter.

50 posted on 06/26/2008 10:54:24 AM PDT by Ron Jeremy (sonic)
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