Webb's rebel roots: An affinity for Confederacy

Politico ^ | 6/10/08 | David Mark

[Non-Sequitur]

Chill out. It was a joke.

Having a sense of humor over the War of Southern Rebellion is not the cowboy way.

[cowboyway]

Robert E. Lee surrendered precisely because he rejected that entire concept as beneath the dignity of Southern manhood.

Lee's letter of surrender:

Mr. President:

It is with pain that I announce to Your Excellency the surrender of the Army of Northern Virginia.

The operations which preceded this result will be reported in full. I will therefore only now state that upon arriving at Amelia Court House on the morning of the 4th with the advance of the army, on the retreat from the lines in front of Richmond and Petersburg, and not finding the supplies ordered to be placed there, nearly twenty-four hours were lost in endeavoring to collect in the country subsistence for men and horses. This delay was fatal, and could not be retrieved.

The troops, wearied by continual fighting and marching for several days and nights, obtained neither rest nor refreshment; and on moving on the 5th, on the Richmond and Danville railroad, I found at Jetersville the enemy's cavalry, and learned of the approach of his infantry and the general advance of his army toward Burkeville.

This deprived us of the use of the railroad, and rendered it impracticable to procure from Danville the supplies ordered to meet us at points of our march. Nothing could be obtained from the adjacent country. Our route to the Roanoke was therefore changed, and the march directed upon Farmville, where supplies were ordered from Lynchburg.

The change of route threw the troops on the roads pursued by the artillery and wagon trains west of the railroad, which impeded our advance and embarrassed our movements. On the morning of the 6th General Longstreet's corps reached Rice's station on the Lynchburg railroad. It was followed by the commands of Generals R.H. Anderson, Ewell, and Gordon, with orders to close upon it as fast as the progress of the trains would permit or as they could be directed (diverted) on roads father west.

General Anderson, commanding Pickett's and B.R. Johnson's divisions, became disconnected with Mahone's division, forming the rear of Longstreet. The enemy's cavalry penetrated the line of march through the interval thus left, and attacked the wagon train moving toward Farmville. This caused serious delay in the march of the center and rear of the column, and enabled the enemy to mass upon their flank. After successive attacks Anderson's and Ewell's corps were captured or driven from their position. The latter General, with both of his division commanders, Kershaw and Custis Lee, and his brigadiers, were taken prisoners.

Gordon, who all the morning, aided by General W.F. Lee's cavalry, had checked the advance of the enemy on the road from Amelia Springs and protected the trains, became exposed to his combined assaults, which he bravely resisted and twice repulsed; but the cavalry having been withdrawn to another part of the line of march, and the enemy, massing heavily on his (Gordon's) front and both flanks, renewed the attack about 6 P.M., and drove him from the field in much confusion.

The army continued its march during the night, and every effort was made to reorganize the divisions which had been shattered by the day's operations. But the men being depressed by fatigue and hunger, many threw away their arms, while others followed the wagon trains and embarrassed their progress. On the morning of the 7th rations were issued to the troops as they passed Farmville, but the safety of the trains requiring their removal upon the approach of the enemy all could not be supplied. The army, reduced to two corps under Longstreet and Gordon, moved steadily on the road to Appomattox Court House. Thence its march was ordered by Campbell Court House, through Pittsylvania, toward Danville. The roads were wretched and the progress of the trains slow.

By great efforts the head of the column reached Appomattox Court House on the evening of the 8th, and the troops were halted for rest. The march was ordered to be resumed at 1 A.M. on the 9th. Fitz Lee, with the cavalry, supported by Gordon, was ordered to drive the enemy from his front, wheel to the left, and cover the passage of the trains, while Longstreet, who from Rice's Station had formed the rear-guard, should close up and hold the position. Two battalions of artillery and the ammunition wagons were directed to accompany the army, the rest of the artillery and wagons to move toward Lynchburg.

In the early part of the night the enemy attacked Walker's artillery train near Appomattox Station on the Lynchburg railroad, and were repelled. Shortly afterward their cavalry dashed toward the Court House, till halted by our line. During the night there were indications of a large force massing on our left and front. Fitz Lee was directed to ascertain its strength, and to suspend his advance till daylight if necessary. About 5 A.M., on the 9th, with Gordon on his left, he moved forward and opened the way. A heavy force of the enemy was discovered opposite Gordon's right, which, moving in the direction of Appomattox Court House, drove back the left of the cavalry and threatened to cut off Gordon from Longstreet. His cavalry at the same time threatening to envelop his left flank, Gordon withdrew across the Appomattox River, and the cavalry advanced on the Lynchburg road and became separated from the army.

Learning the condition of affairs on the lines, where I had gone under the expectation of meeting General Grant to learn definitely the terms he proposed in a communication received from him on the 8th, in the event of the surrender of the army, I requested a suspension of hostilities until these terms could be arranged. In the interview which occurred with General Grant in compliance with my request, terms having been agreed on, I surrendered that portion of the Army of Northern Virginia which was on the field, with its arms, artillery, and wagon-trains, the officers and men to be paroled, retaining their side-arms and private effects. I deemed this course the best under all the circumstances by which we were surrounded.

On the morning of the 9th, according to the reports of the ordnance officers, there were 7892 organized infantry with arms, with an average of 75 rounds ammunition per man; the artillery, though reduced to 63 pieces with 93 rounds of ammunition, was sufficient. These comprised all the supplies of ordnance that could be relied on in the State of Virginia. I have no accurate report of the cavalry, but believe it did not exceed 2100 effective men. The enemy was more than five times our numbers. If we could have forced our way one day longer it would have been at a great sacrifice of life, and at its end I did not see how a surrender could have been avoided. We had no subsistence for man or horse, and it could not be gathered in the country. The supplies ordered to Pamplin's Station from Lynchburg could not reach us, and the men, deprived of food and sleep for many days, were worn out and exhausted.

With Great Respect
Your Obedient Servant
R.E. Lee
Genl.

(The above doesn't seem to support your theory................)

[DarthVader]

Jim Webb and Larry Flynt were separated at birth.

[Dems_R_Losers]

James Webb wrote in 1979:

"There is a place for women in our military, but not in combat. And their presence at institutions dedicated to the preparation of men for combat command is poisoning that preparation. By attempting to sexually sterilize the Naval Academy environment in the name of equality, this country has sterilized the whole process of combat leadership training, and our military forces are doomed to suffer the consequences.

-----

And I have never met a woman, including the dozens of female midshipmen I encountered during my recent semester as a professor at the Naval Academy, whom I would trust to provide those men with combat leadership.

-----

Captain Jack Darby, the recently departed commandant of midshipmen, frequently mentioned that there had been only three cases of sexual fraternization in the three years women had been midshipmen. While there have been only three major conduct offenses of this sort, it is no secret that sex is commonplace in Bancroft Hall. The Hall, which houses 4,000 males and 300 females, is a horny woman's dream. Virtually every female midshipman who dates is seeing either a male midshipman or a recent graduate. Of the 25 women who have left the class of 1980 since induction day, 20 are married to former midshipmen. While this is a natural human phenomenon, it gets in the way of military indoctrination, and creates a very real resentment among males due to the evolution of a double standard of discipline. Furthermore, it is scarring many women in ways they may not comprehend for years.

-----

Can you IMAGINE what would be coming if a Republican candidate for ANY office had written these words???

[Lucky Dog]

Another nattering naysayer of negativism............

Methinks you confuse negativism with realism

[Non-Sequitur]

At the time he was a Republican. And I think that the performance of the overwhelming majority of women in the military since then has proven him wrong.

[Dems_R_Losers]

It infuriated me that this was brushed off during his Senate campaign. George Allen ran what I thought was a devastating ad featuring several female officers talking about how offended they were by Webb’s writings and that he was unfit to be in the Senate making decisions on U.S. military policy. But somehow “macaca” was more important to the idiot voters of Virginia!

[wideawake]

(The above doesn't seem to support your theory................)

Indeed it does. Lee is explaining to Davis why the continuation of conventional warfare against the Union was impracticable, and that the impracticability of continuing conventional warfare was his reason for surrender.

He does not even suggest guerrilla warfare or sabotage as possible alternatives.

For Lee, it was conventional fighting or surrender.

If Lee had believed that sabotage and terrorism were acceptable tactics, there is no doubt that most of his command would have followed him into the hills rather than surrender - after all, they were willing to try and fight on conventionally, which would have been suicidal.

Other Confederate commanders, like William H. Thomas and William Quantrill, continued on after Appomattox in guerrilla fashion - unlike Lee.

[StoneWall Brigade]

“Born Fighting” is on my must read list.

[Non-Sequitur]

It infuriated me that this was brushed off during his Senate campaign.

Because Webb had had the good sense to become a Democrat, so as far as the media was concerned he was on the side of the angels. And because Allen had his "Macaca Moment".

[BnBlFlag]

“Born Fighting” is a great book. I’m re-reading it right now.

[NFHale]

Good synopsis of the 17th.

On May 31, 1913 the 17th amendment to the US Constitution providing for the direct popular election of senators was declared a ratified Amendment.

1913 is the year that this country started it’s slide to Marxist hell. Got the Fed Reserve that year too...income tax...

Ahh, good old Progressive Democrat Woodrow Wilson...

Good article here:

http://prairiepundit.blogspot.com/2007/12/liberal-control-freaks-from-woodrow.html

[BnBlFlag]

“Women Can’t Fight”
Damn! I ‘m likin’ this guy more and more. If he wasn’t a Porno Writer, I’d support him.

[freespirited]

What I want to know is how they will bury this: James Webb: Women Can't Fight

That can't be buried, but I don't have a problem with it. But the following, if true, will get his name scratched off the list real fast.

Jim Webb, VA Political Muddle

I assume the young woman was bound by the Code of Military Justice when he was alleged to have engaged in extra-curricular activities with her. Not good if true.

[Rebelbase]

“An amazing feat considering Webb supposedly supports a political system that merely “supported slavery””

You talking about the first 80 years of the United States of America?

[BnBlFlag]

“You talking about the first 80 years of the United States of America”?
Great comment!!! Way to go!!!

[Lucky Dog]

At the time he was a Republican. And I think that the performance of the overwhelming majority of women in the military since then has proven him wrong. Any generalization is automatically a lie because there are always exceptions to prove the generalization wrong. However, I find your generalization more seriously flawed than most (especially Mr. Webb’s) from a couple of aspects.

First, your comparison is fallacious. Mr. Webb’s comments concerned negative impacts of female presence upon the function of training future combat leaders in leadership. Further, his comments were aimed at the resulting, subsequent, potential degradation in combat effectiveness of combat organizations as a result of “double standards.”

In contrast, your unsupported statement merely cited the performance of women in the military which includes a great deal more than combat organizations. Additionally, Mr. Webb’s comments were more focused upon the deleterious impact of women upon the potential of men’s combat performance and leadership than on that of the women, themselves. Your comparison fails completely to address the issue he raised.

Second, Mr. Webb’s comments come from direct observation. His position and background uniquely qualified him as an expert to render such judgments at the time. Whether or not you agree with his statements, you have failed to refute their validity with either fact or countervail authority.

Victory (the ultimate aim of combat) is, to use an old saw, about killing people and breaking things more effectively and efficiently than your enemy. Anything that detracts from that combat effectiveness and efficiency is, by definition, a degradation to a combat organization. Only when a combat force is so overwhelmingly superior in numbers and impact to an enemy can it afford any intentional degradation of its combat effectiveness and efficiency, and even then, the amount of degradation it can afford is strictly limited.

[Non-Sequitur]

So I should put you down in the “boot ‘em all out” category?

[Lucky Dog]

So I should put you down in the “boot ‘em all out” category?

No.

However, you may put down in the category that supports complete and strict compliance with public law which precludes assignment of any female military member to a direct ground combat organization or to a combat, or combat support, organization wherein there is a reasonable expectation that she could be regularly and routinely exposed to normally expected enemy action.

Additionally, you may put down in the category that supports separate training for females and males for all services similar to what the Marine Corps does currently.

Furthermore, you may put me down in the category that maintains military service in not a right.

Moreover, you may also put down in the category that backs the principle just because an individual serves (women) there has to be no guarantee of opportunity to get promoted. Promotion should be based upon the needs of service and the experience/training/demonstrated competency of the individual to be promoted. If combat service is considered a prerequisite for promotion and women are barred from such by public law, then so be it.

Finally, you may put down in the category that maintains the purpose of the military is to fulfill the US Constitution’s requirement to provide for the common defense. In recognition of responsibility to the taxpayers who foot the bill for such defense, it should be provided as effectively and efficiently as can possibly be the case. It is not the purpose of the military to engage in some social engineering experiment.

[chesley]

Forget, Hell!