Skip to comments.Rick Warren: Vanity
Posted on 08/16/2008 10:31:29 AM PDT by Chong
I received an email from my pastor about Rick Warren's interview with "those two" on CNN and also received another email from an old timer freeper FRiend warning me about Rick Warren.
Please share with me what you know about this man and what he stands for (without in-fighting if you can? 'Cause you are not going to change anybody's mind by arguing?)
Gotta go run some errands but will check back in when I come back, so don't think I am being rude by not replying right away.
There are volumes of threads in the Religion Forum about Rick Warren. Suggest you take a peak over there. Always wise on FR to do a subject search first. I’m just sayin’...
Pinging a few folks who might be able to point you to the current discussion.
When I come back, I will do some search. Didn’t realize that there were discussion threads about him here. Been too busy to come here as often as I used to.
I posted the following a short time ago on another thread.
Lets see. Rick Warren has sold 35 million copies of his book “The Purpose Driven Life”. Good for him. He has an Email newsletter that is sent to 180,000 religious leaders, decimating his thoughts on a multitude of topics and subjects matter. Okay. Warren is also well known for advancing certain issues beyond traditional religious ministries. Hmmm.
Sounds like progressive preaching with a purpose driven agenda, front and center.
What I find troubling, is how can Rick Warren invite someone to his ministry, who professes to be a man of faith, yet condones and promotes abortion on demand. Its a total disconnect for me. Btw, this will be Obama’s second visit to see Warren.
Jim Wallis is America's foremost spokesman for the Religious Left. Bob Edgar, of course, is the former head of the National Council of Churches. Catherine Pinkerton sits on the Obama campaign's Catholic Advisory Council. Anybody see a pattern here? Just to drive the point home, consider the boards of directors and advisors of the FLP, which include such luminaries as: Story Continues Below Ad ↓
*Board of Directors president Meg Rlley, Director of Advocacy and Witness for the Unitarian-Universalist Fellowship.
*Elizabeth Letzler, member of the PCUSA's Mission Responsibility Through Investment committee and the Israel-Palestine Network (i.e., an Israel divestment proponent). She's also been "deeply involved" with FaithAmerica.org, an NCC outfit.
*Nazir Khaja, a Muslim leader who also sits on the board of the Religious Coalition for Reproductive Rights.
*Fred Rotondaro, a senior fellow at the Center for American Progress, run by Bill Clinton's ex-chief of staff John Podesta, which is basically a Democratic Party research organization.
*Susan Thistlethwaite, president of the UCC's Chicago Seminary, well-known to readers of this blog for her contributions to the Washington Post's "On Faith" column.
*Jim Winkler, General Secretary of the United Methodist Church's General Board of Church and Society, who also sits on the board (with Communist Party USA leader Judith LeBlanc) of the US Campaign to End the Israeli Occupation.
So don't really expect serious questions related to faith and Christianity. These people are more interested in gay rights and abortion rights than evangelism.
Ken Shepherd is Managing Editor of NewsBusters
Another explanation could be that the guy has changed, or that media reports on his activities are less than accurate. The latter is probably least likely.
Christ, which will likely make him unpopular with just about everyone depending on the issue.
That's a first.....
I read (sorry, no source) that he will be asking an abortion-related question of McCain/Obama today after all.
Who knows the nature of the question? I guess we’ll see.
It seems to me he wants to be the next “go-to” guy for “evangelical” opinion. That’s just my impression.
I don’t have a problem with a pastor meeting with Obama, or Achmedinijad, or Charles Manson for that matter. However I don’t like what Rick Warren is doing today, as it seems to be an endorsement, a sort of a “both guys are the same, both are acceptable” message.
Totally wiped them out?
Anyway I don't see a problem with him inviting both candidates to his church to discuss issues, religious or otherwise. What better way than to expose Obama’s real views than an hour of unscripted Q&A before people who really do take these issues seriously, instead of the usual perfunctory interviews and scripted answers from the drive by media and staged debates?
So you change people's minds by... what? ...exactly?
Agreeing with them?
What is most clear about Rick Warren, and paramount to what you need to know about him is: Rick Warren is ALL about Rick Warren.
Billy Graham is getting old, ya' know.
A am no big fan of Warren, but:
Warren did email religious leaders, the ones I know of are not lefties by any stretch of imagination, asking them to submit questions he would consider using tonight.
One other thing, Warren is a Christian and believes in the same triune God Christians on FR believe in, regardless of those with whom he may associate and minister. Christians need to stop beating up each other.
Oops. Spellchecker did its job. We all have a brain fart now and then.
I don’t see a problem having both candidates sit down and discuss any issues. That part of politics is good. However, inviting a pro-abortion candidate to his house of worship, isn’t an appealing aspect of Warren’s faith. Not something I’d do.
My point was, I see Warren as a new age religious leader, with a progressive ministry based on a liberal agenda. Many people have compared him to Billy Graham and Robert Schuller. I don’t think he measures up to either man.
“Rick Warren is ALL about Rick Warren.”
that’s true of modern leaders of religion and politics, and most all phases of public life.
Show me a list of humble leaders - the nation or the world!
GWB would most likely make the humble list, but who else??
Could be a Freudian slip. ;^)
Supposedly tonight will limited to "values" issues, so with Obama's astonishing "born-alive abortion" support, if Warren is the least bit consistent, he had better push Obama very hard on this.
Obama is far and away the most radical pro-abortion extremist that has ever run for the Presidency. He has no compassion for kids (at least not small ones).
Jesus said we are to be in the world, not of the world.”
I have people in my house who hold ideals and opinions I don't agree with, often. Every once in a while they will see the light.
Pope Benedict XVI
It is unfair to wrap Warren and Olsteen in the same wrapper. Joel stays neutral on most controversial issues, while Warren is a liberal activist on issues such as gay rights and abortion. You can criticize Joel for not taking stances on social issues, but he is far from what Warren does, which is to actually promote such behavior.
You can do some reading here:
And you can read an online book that I think is a must-read for any Christian here:
I would also recommend the books “Faith Undone” and “Deceived on Purpose,” and there are also other good books out there.
Essentially, Rick Warren was mentored by Robert Schuller, who is a new age spirituality proponent, and Warren has many connections to other new agers who call themselves “Christians.”
1) They preach a disproportionate Gospel. What I mean is, they preach almost exclusively about the love of Christ, how he forgives, how he can meet your needs, how he can heal your wounds, how great he can make you feel, etc. I ABSOLUTELY don NOT disagree with any of those things, BUT they never seem to get around to preaching about our sinfulness and Jesus reaction to that. Jesus talked about hell 3x as much as he did about heaven. He taught about becoming holy and the consequences of sin and living a sinful life. Warren and others NEVER seem to get around to those points.
2) This is my MAIN objection to Warren and those in the ‘Emerging Church’ movement. It appears to me that they approach their relationship with God, and thus teach others the same, from the point of what God can do for them. It is all about how you can benefit from a relationship with God. Almost like the reason for entering into a relationship with him is for all the ‘goodies’. This is SO wrong. We are placed here to SERVE God. To bring Him glory. Not the other way around. All of the examples in the bible are of men who served God to further His kingdom, not to make their life on earth a more pleasant experience. Warren seems to miss that quite often.
Rick Warren was a church growth guru who did well at that. He then decided to inject himself into politics and has taken what appears to be a Sojourners/Jim Wallis type position....that is, a pacifist, eco-conscious, internationalist.
On another thread, I’ve read that he’s had tonight’s questions prepared by a left-leaning organization. I wonder what it was about his 20 thousand parishoners that disqualified them from coming up with some decent questions?
In any case, I’d peg Warren politically as a left-leaning cleric. Be prepared from all of the tricks of the left, when you watch.
In fact, I consider this event to be designed to promote Barak Obama, and to make religious evangel-lite voters comfortable with him.
PDL might seem harmless, but Warren does misuse Scripture in it. He also sometimes uses a new-age-friendly version, The Message, when it suits some point he is trying to make. His “gospel” message in PDL is so “lite” it can hardly be called a gospel message.
We must be vigilant and “test the spirits,” as deception is washing over the church! Question everything, and compare everything to the Bible, and ask God for wisdom so that you will have discernment.
So what? The fact that that truth is so widely repeated by others does not diminish the relevance of it, in understanding Rick Warren.
How do we really know that Warren believes in the God of the Bible? He was discipled by new ager Robert Schuller. Wolves sometimes wear sheep’s clothing. We are told in Scripture to contend for the faith, and to expose false teachers. Us anti-Warren Freepers are just being obedient to God. :-)
Like at the diaper station.
Or you could get a sheisse-suction device from Ronco.
Billy Graham has a great deal of influence in America. And he is one of the most humble of men. His goal has only been to spread the word of Christ. I don’t believe that Warren can say the same.
All I can say about Rick Warren is that he is a very good marketer. His religion is all messed up, his philosophy has destroyed churches and driven millions out of their traditional settings, but he is a good marketer. He sells lots of books through his gimmicks.
I've never heard his message
But just as glance or two at his photos show me someone who isn't serious
Who is far too pleased with himself
Maybe he's delivering a feel good message to his mega-congregation
At least he isn't a Satanist or such so bully for you Rick!
Warren = Watered Down Christianity, Let’s all get along - don’t worry about the details.
Don’t fret Abortion - we’ll all sing Kumbaya and get over it.
no,no, this thread is not about Mohammed, as in "if the mountain won't come to Mohammed...."
Good web source here: www.crossroad.to/News/Church/emergent.html
His book was excellent.
I don’t care what the media or the accusers of the brethren have to say, they are cut from the same cloth.
Interested in how these question and answer sessions with McCain and Obama go.
Jesus Christ and His glory first....politics does not even come close.
My comments are this:
He has writen a great book, no doubt about it. It has been very helpful to a lot of people.
However, taking Christ out of the works of the gospel, saying that we need to solve the world-wide situation with the poor, and offering that Christ is not essential in this work, first and formost, is another gospel. Jesus said we’d always have the poor with us. And it is not wrong to do our work for the sake of the poor, as the NT also states that looking after the poor, the widows and the fatherless are doing the works of the gospel. However, doing the works to serve the poor, but without doing it in the name of Christ, and for His sake alone, is not biblical.
Another thing is this: It appears that Warren is saying that the sacrifices made by missionaries to bring the gospel and thereby transform the soul is not as useful as transforming the material lives of people. Facts show, though, that when the soul is transformed, the people prosper naturally...as an outcome.
Robert Heinlein had it right: “Shamans and priests are the world’s SECOND OLDEST PROFESSION.” I remain highly skeptical of entrepreneurial evangelists.
LOL! Give me a break. Better get your bible out and take a closer look at Bro Rick's teachings.
Tackling poverty is a Christian virtue. Ignoring abortion and homosexuality to further your cause isn’t. Either it’s all gospel, or none of it is. Judge your preachers on that.
I already now what the word of God says about accusing the people of God and about gossipers and scoffers and loving one another. Not interested in your religious judgmental hatred. Do you even know what spirit you are under the control of? It is not the Holy Spirit, for your words reveal your heart. How do you think the Pharisees fared, with their religious hard hearts? Do you think it will be any different for you?
And many will fall away being offended in their hearts, even betraying their brothers, their love having grown cold.