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Real Change ("Catholics donít stop being Catholic at the voting booth.")
National Review Online ^ | August 19, 2008 | Carl A. Anderson

Posted on 08/19/2008 10:35:30 AM PDT by kellynla

In eight of the last nine presidential elections, the crucial “Catholic vote” has picked the winner. And in what is shaping up to be another close election, America’s 69 million Catholics are again likely to hold the key not only to the White House, but to a great number of other races as well.

However, before we can settle the question “How did Catholics vote in November?” Catholics must decide “How should we vote in November?”

The bishops of the United States recently stated, “The Church’s obligation to participate in shaping the moral character of society is a requirement of our faith.”

“As Catholics,” they said, “we should be guided more by our moral convictions than by our attachment to a political party or interest group.” And at the top of the list of Catholic moral convictions, the bishops put “defending the inviolable sanctity of human life from the moment of conception until natural death.”

Once again the bishops of the United States have provided important guidance through their statement on Faithful Citizenship. This is especially important since Catholics often confront a dilemma in deciding how to vote: Can we support a candidate who may be attractive for many reasons but who supports abortion rights? Some partisan advocates have sought to excuse support for pro-abortion rights candidates through a complex balancing act. They claim other issues are important enough to offset a candidate’s support for abortion rights.

But the right to abortion mandated in the United States by the Supreme Court’s Roe v. Wade decision is not just another political issue; it is in reality a legal regime that has resulted in more than 40 million deaths.

(Excerpt) Read more at article.nationalreview.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Editorial; Government; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 2008; catholics; catholicvote; elections; prolife
Lets not confuse practicing Catholics with CINO's.
1 posted on 08/19/2008 10:35:31 AM PDT by kellynla
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To: Salvation; NYer; narses; A.A. Cunningham

ping


2 posted on 08/19/2008 10:36:05 AM PDT by kellynla (Freedom of speech makes it easier to spot the idiots! Semper Fi!)
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To: kellynla

Good to see the head of the K of C stepping up and taking this position.


3 posted on 08/19/2008 10:38:23 AM PDT by Zionist Conspirator ( . . . ki lo' `al-halechem levaddo yichyeh ha'adam, ki `al-kol-motza' fi-HaShem yichyeh ha'adam.)
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To: kellynla

If only white Catholics voted like white baptists, Rhode Island, Massachusetts, Connecticut, and New Jersey would be solidly Republican states.


4 posted on 08/19/2008 10:38:56 AM PDT by Clemenza (No Comment)
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To: kellynla

I know 2 Catholics who will be proudly voting republican like always. I could never vote for the party of death and still be able to sleep at night.


5 posted on 08/19/2008 10:44:16 AM PDT by chris_bdba
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To: Clemenza

Forget the skin color and religion... ALL CHRISTIANS and JEWS have no business voting for abortionists! PERIOD!
Or did I miss something and the Fifth Commandment got tossed while I was out of the office!


6 posted on 08/19/2008 10:46:56 AM PDT by kellynla (Freedom of speech makes it easier to spot the idiots! Semper Fi!)
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To: kellynla

“Lets not confuse practicing Catholics with CINO’s.”

Why not? People here castigate Jewish voters all the time without making the parallel distinction.


7 posted on 08/19/2008 10:51:52 AM PDT by MeanWestTexan ("Jesse Jackson was an important figure; paving the way for Osama bin Laden to appear" -- Dan Rather)
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To: Zionist Conspirator

I only wish this piece was on the op-ed pages of the Wall Street Journal, Washington Post, New York Times & Los Angeles Times...being in the National Review is like preaching to the choir.LOL


8 posted on 08/19/2008 10:53:58 AM PDT by kellynla (Freedom of speech makes it easier to spot the idiots! Semper Fi!)
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To: MeanWestTexan

“People here castigate Jewish voters all the time without making the parallel distinction.”

Not I!


9 posted on 08/19/2008 10:55:22 AM PDT by kellynla (Freedom of speech makes it easier to spot the idiots! Semper Fi!)
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To: kellynla

Being a good Catholic also means not voting for McCain if a pro-abort is on the ticket.


10 posted on 08/19/2008 11:16:50 AM PDT by Texas Federalist (McCain/Cantor '08)
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To: kellynla

“But the right to abortion mandated in the United States by the Supreme Court’s Roe v. Wade decision is not just another political issue; it is in reality a legal regime that has resulted in more than 40 million deaths.”

I wish somebody would tell the black church that abortion kills.

In 30 years, I don’t think the congressional black caucus has ever had a member who didn’t love abortion.


11 posted on 08/19/2008 11:17:21 AM PDT by CondorFlight (I)
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To: Clemenza
After mass the other day-deep in Republican Morris Countyi I saw a car with an Obama sticker. Shook my head and kept going. Tempted to leave a note asking if they agreed with Obama on the BAIPA. Unbelievable.

I have a sneaking feeling that Obama won't carry Jersey. The union workers I knew and grew up with are the most rascist people I know. I can't see them voting Obama.

The only Obama lawn signs I see are a handful in Lawrenceville/Princeton

12 posted on 08/19/2008 11:17:46 AM PDT by MattinNJ (I would really, really love to depose Obama.)
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To: kellynla

Let’s see. On the one hand you have a candidate supporting a right to an abortion. On the other hand you have a candidate divorced and remarried, living in adultery. Not a great choice either way.


13 posted on 08/19/2008 11:23:41 AM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: MattinNJ
The only Obama lawn signs I see are a handful in Lawrenceville/Princeton

I see you've been in my neighborhood.

NJ will be close this time. The south Jersey, disproportionately blue collar counties that face Philly will all go Republican for the first time since 1988. We have been hurting in South Jersey for some two decades now due to the Dems carrying the lunchpail vote in those areas.

Still, that will not be enough to give the state to McCain. He needs to make inroads among the large Korean population in Bergen County, the large Indian American population in Middlesex and Mercer counties, and blue collar Dems throughout the state. Its been said that he who wins Bergen County wins the state, but, these days, they have to win Bergen by at least 5%.

I predict that Obama wins Essex, Hudson, Passaic, Camden (barely, unless the suburban towns come out heavily for McCain), Union, and Mercer counties. The real wild cards in this race are Middlesex (if McCain gets the Indian vote and enough of the blue collar whites, he wins here), Atlantic, and Bergen Counties.

14 posted on 08/19/2008 11:26:57 AM PDT by Clemenza (No Comment)
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To: Non-Sequitur

Whoever is president picks the judges. The judges we have at present are starting to mandate doctors (whatever their own religious convictions) perform en-vitro fertilizations for same-sex couples; that pastors not criticize homosexuality (a ‘hate crime’); that schools teach that homosexuality is normal; that the media give equal time to ‘all’ points of view (end of free speech); etc.

The entire culture of America can be changed in one generation; but don’t let that stop anyone who is religious from voting for whoever is going to hand out more federal goodies. . .(sarc/off)


15 posted on 08/19/2008 11:29:20 AM PDT by CondorFlight (I)
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To: Non-Sequitur

“On the other hand you have a candidate divorced and remarried, living in adultery?”

“living in adultery?”

and who might that be? and how would YOU know? LOL


16 posted on 08/19/2008 11:34:20 AM PDT by kellynla (Freedom of speech makes it easier to spot the idiots! Semper Fi!)
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To: Non-Sequitur

True but one edorses the killing of 40 million babies and the other does not... In this case, I’ll take the divorced candidate every time.


17 posted on 08/19/2008 11:36:18 AM PDT by Robbin
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To: Texas Federalist

“Being a good Catholic also means not voting for McCain if a pro-abort is on the ticket”

Well, we’ll just have to hope & pray that McCain chooses a Pro-Life running mate.


18 posted on 08/19/2008 11:38:21 AM PDT by kellynla (Freedom of speech makes it easier to spot the idiots! Semper Fi!)
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To: kellynla

There is a good reason why we have McCain rather than Guiliani. Guiliani wouldn’t even pretend to be pro-life.


19 posted on 08/19/2008 11:39:28 AM PDT by tiki (True Christians will not deliberately slander or misrepresent others or their beliefs)
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To: Non-Sequitur

Is McCain Catholic? If not, I don’t see how the divorce/adultery issue is relevant!


20 posted on 08/19/2008 11:40:20 AM PDT by GatorGirl (Election 2008--It's all about the judges!!)
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To: Texas Federalist
"Being a good Catholic also means not voting for McCain if a pro-abort is on the ticket."

True to an extent. The vote is for President and McCain is pro-life and NObama is pro-abortion. I don't really care who John's VP selection will be. I certainly hope he selects Sarah Palin (pro-Life), but the VP choice won't change my mind to vote for McCain. This is too important an election and I won't waste my vote to enable a NObama Presidency.

21 posted on 08/19/2008 11:42:29 AM PDT by NoRedTape
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To: kellynla
and who might that be? and how would YOU know? LOL

Because I read the Bible? Mark 10: 5-12

And Jesus answered and said unto them, For the hardness of your heart he wrote you this precept.
But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female.
For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife;
And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh.
What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
And in the house his disciples asked him again of the same matter.
And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her.
And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.

22 posted on 08/19/2008 11:43:45 AM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: GatorGirl
Is McCain Catholic? If not, I don’t see how the divorce/adultery issue is relevant!

The Bible applies to all Christians.

23 posted on 08/19/2008 11:44:40 AM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: CondorFlight

” I wish somebody would tell the black church that abortion kills.”

Some Blacks, like many other races including Whites, have this silly notion that the fetus is not a human being...now what they “think” it is, is a mystery to me and obviously to them too!


24 posted on 08/19/2008 11:46:25 AM PDT by kellynla (Freedom of speech makes it easier to spot the idiots! Semper Fi!)
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To: kellynla

Bingo!!


25 posted on 08/19/2008 11:48:59 AM PDT by 353FMG (What marxism and fascism could not destroy, liberalism did.)
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To: Non-Sequitur

Aren’t we the only ones who consider marriage a sacrament?


26 posted on 08/19/2008 11:52:30 AM PDT by GatorGirl (Election 2008--It's all about the judges!!)
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To: Non-Sequitur

Well you did a nice “cut & paste” job on the Bible but you STILL didn’t tell me “who & how you would know?”


27 posted on 08/19/2008 11:59:56 AM PDT by kellynla (Freedom of speech makes it easier to spot the idiots! Semper Fi!)
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To: kellynla
Well you did a nice “cut & paste” job on the Bible but you STILL didn’t tell me “who & how you would know?”

Because John McCain married in 1965. John McCain divorced his wife in 1980. John McCain married again three months after the divorce became final. So what part of Jesus' comand that "Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her" are you not understanding?

28 posted on 08/19/2008 12:05:39 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: GatorGirl
Aren’t we the only ones who consider marriage a sacrament?

No, Jesus did too. Hence the what God hath joined, let not man put asunder.

29 posted on 08/19/2008 12:07:48 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: Non-Sequitur
Does that mean that you won't be voting for John McCain and have never voted for someone who has divorced and remarried?
30 posted on 08/19/2008 12:13:17 PM PDT by kellynla (Freedom of speech makes it easier to spot the idiots! Semper Fi!)
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To: Non-Sequitur

Do you only vote for devout Catholics who oppose the war?


31 posted on 08/19/2008 12:20:00 PM PDT by RPTMS
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To: kellynla
Does that mean that you won't be voting for John McCain and have never voted for someone who has divorced and remarried?

It means that if you are choosing candidates based on sin then you're out of luck in this case. I have a great many reasons not to vote for Obama, and a great many reasons to vote for McCain. Theology doesn't enter into it.

32 posted on 08/19/2008 12:28:21 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: All
Alright. The last divorcee we elected President wasn't bad at all. Granted, you could make a case that Nancy was Reagan's first legitimate wife since Jane Wyman had been married before she married Ronald Reagan. Still, I'll take a divorcee over a socialist any day of the week.

As for a pro-abort running mate, does anyone know when George H. W. Bush changed his mind on abortion?

33 posted on 08/19/2008 12:28:34 PM PDT by RPTMS
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To: RPTMS
Do you only vote for devout Catholics who oppose the war?

It means I don't vote for candidate based on what the archbishop says.

34 posted on 08/19/2008 12:29:11 PM PDT by Non-Sequitur
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To: Non-Sequitur

what is it with you...

are you or are you not going to vote for McCain...


35 posted on 08/19/2008 12:33:59 PM PDT by kellynla (Freedom of speech makes it easier to spot the idiots! Semper Fi!)
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To: kellynla

I have a radical idea - how about ALL CHRISTIANS wake up and remember their faith and the Bible when they step into the voting booth!

I never cease to be amazed at how many professing Christians who are otherwise quite solidly conservative in their beliefs, yet step into a voting booth and pull a lever/push a button for candidates who essentially represent a position 180 degrees away from their claimed faith.


36 posted on 08/19/2008 1:01:56 PM PDT by TheBattman (Vote your conscience, or don't complain about RINOs!)
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To: kellynla
and who might that be? and how would YOU know? LOL

Well - the New Testament definition of adultery might be handy:

Luke 16:18

Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery.

Also covered in Mark 10:11-12

And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery.

And finally in Matthew 5:31-32, a bit more detail is provided, including one acceptable reason for divorce and marriage to another:

It hath been said, Whosoever shall put away his wife, let him give her a writing of divorcement: But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery.

37 posted on 08/19/2008 1:17:46 PM PDT by TheBattman (Vote your conscience, or don't complain about RINOs!)
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To: TheBattman

Oh, so you want to stick your nose in this too...
well for all you little Ms. Scriptures...
I guess you forgot Matthew 7:1
“judge not lest you be judged....”

Wipe your nose, robin...it’s bloody. LOL


38 posted on 08/19/2008 1:48:29 PM PDT by kellynla (Freedom of speech makes it easier to spot the idiots! Semper Fi!)
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To: kellynla

I believe your attack is misdirected. I made no judgment, I simply answered the question posted.

And where did you get “little Ms. Scriptures”?

Finally - nope, no bloody nose. When taking scripture out of context, it is a good idea to find some other way to defend your position. Using your interpretation of your out-of-context quote would mean that we need to abolish our court systems, and none of us are thus qualified to make determination about who to vote for.

You see - “judge not, lest ye be judged” is actually, when taken in context, is showing that we have no business judging others for the same sins that we hold in our own lives. I would venture that this bit of scripture is one of the most taken out of context in the entire New Testament - likely in the top 10 of misused and misapplied verses in the Bible.

I assume you know where that quote is found in the Bible? If so, then look up the context (you really need to start in the preceding chapter and read through).


39 posted on 08/19/2008 3:21:19 PM PDT by TheBattman (Vote your conscience, or don't complain about RINOs!)
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40 million dead, mangled, trashed, dismembered innocent little children trumps one divorce any time.

My vote for president goes with McCain. I don’t care who he picks for VP; it would be nice to have a pro-life VP, but since the president spot is either McCain or Obama, I will choose McCain.

NOTHING outweighs 40 million dead Americans, innocent, shredded, thrown-aweay, dead Americans. Nothing. Not war, not the environment, not Gitmo, not the death penalty, not the divorce, NOTHING.


40 posted on 08/19/2008 3:32:08 PM PDT by Judith Anne
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To: kellynla; antonius

41 posted on 08/19/2008 10:41:11 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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To: Texas Federalist

That’s not going to happen. He trial balloon on that burst.


42 posted on 08/19/2008 10:42:28 PM PDT by Salvation (†With God all things are possible.†)
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