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Washington archbishop rips Pelosi on abortion
The Hill ^ | 08/25/08 | Bob Cusack

Posted on 08/26/2008 4:54:34 AM PDT by radar101

In a rare public rebuke of a top politician, the archbishop of Washington said Monday that House Speaker Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) was incorrect when she recently said the moment of conception has long been a matter of controversy within the Catholic Church.

In a release issued Monday night, Washington Archbishop Donald W. Wuerl said Pelosi's comments on "Meet the Press" on Sunday "were incorrect."

Wuerl noted that Pelosi responded to a question on when life begins by mentioning she was Catholic.

The release quoted Pelosi as saying the church has not been able to come with a definition of when life begins.

“After Mr. Tom Brokaw, the interviewer, pointed out that the Catholic Church feels strongly that life begins at conception, she replied, 'I understand. And this is, like, maybe 50 years or something like that. So again, over the history of the church, this is an issue of controversy,' " the release said.

Wuerl strongly disagrees.

He said, "We respect the right of elected officials such as Speaker Pelosi to address matters of public policy that are before them, but the interpretation of Catholic faith has rightfully been entrusted to the Catholic bishops. Given this responsibility to teach, it is important to make this correction for the record."

Wuerl pointed out that the Catechism of the Catholic Church is clear, and has been clear for 2,000 years. He cited Catechism language that reads, "Human life must be respected and protected absolutely from the moment of conception … Since the first century the Church has affirmed the moral evil of every procured abortion. This teaching has not changed and remains unchangeable. Direct abortion, that is to say, abortion willed either as an end or a means, is gravely contrary to the moral law.”

A Pelosi spokesman did not immediately comment for this article.

The Speaker recently said she, unlike other Catholic politicians who support abortion rights, has not clashed with her church about receiving communion.

In an interview on C-SPAN that aired earlier this month, Pelosi was asked about how some church officials have raised objections about whether former presidential contenders — such as Sen. John Kerry (D-Mass.) and former New York City Mayor Rudy Giuliani (R) — should receive communion.

Pelosi, a Roman Catholic whose district includes most of San Francisco, said she has not encountered such difficulties in her church.

“I think some of it is regional,” she said, “It depends on the bishop of a certain region, and, fortunately for me, communion has not been withheld and I’m a regular communicant, so that would be a severe blow to me if that were the case.”


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; Government; Philosophy; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 110th; abortion; catholicpoliticians; demlies; pelosi; wuerl

1 posted on 08/26/2008 4:54:34 AM PDT by radar101
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To: radar101
She is DARING the Church to do something.

I guess even Wuerl couldn't ignore this.

2 posted on 08/26/2008 4:55:56 AM PDT by AnAmericanMother (Ministrix of Ye Chase, TTGC Ladies Auxiliary (recess appointment))
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To: radar101

Not what I would call a rip.


3 posted on 08/26/2008 4:56:00 AM PDT by steve8714 (Curtis Strange ruined a man better than himself.)
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To: radar101
PELOSI: As an ardent practicing Catholic, uh, this is an issue that I have studied for a long time. And what I know is over the centuries, the doctors of the church have not been able to make that definition, and, uh, Senator -- uh, I'm -- Senator -- Uh, St. Augustin' (sic) said at three months. We don't know. The point is is that it shouldn't have an impact on a woman's right to choose. Roe v. Wade talks about very clear definitions of when the child -- uh, eh, er, first trimester, certain considerations second trimester, not so third trimester. The -- the -- there's very clear distinctions.
4 posted on 08/26/2008 4:56:35 AM PDT by radar101
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To: radar101

Pelosi has self-excommunicated.
She is NOT in communion with the Church.

It is not up to a priest to pick out those who might be receiving unworthily.


5 posted on 08/26/2008 4:59:01 AM PDT by G Larry (I'm investing in "Pitchfork Futures"!!)
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To: radar101

Sick old elitist witch.


6 posted on 08/26/2008 5:00:38 AM PDT by dforest (I had almost forgotten that McCain is the nominee. Too bad I was reminded.)
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To: radar101
He said, "We respect the right of elected officials such as Speaker Pelosi to address matters of public policy that are before them, but the interpretation of Catholic faith has rightfully been entrusted to the Catholic bishops.

IOW, you don't have a clue, and don't speak for the Catholic Church.

7 posted on 08/26/2008 5:01:30 AM PDT by bcsco (Obama's just biden his time until McCain wins in November.)
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To: radar101

Mrs. Pelosi cannot parse this away. Life begins at conception. After all, isn’t that why kids are encouraged to use rubbers? What does the Speaker think rubbers are for? Preventing the birth of 1948 Plymouth?

Abetting abortion, which Mrs. Pelosi does, is a mortal sin in the Catholic faith. If she does not confess this, it will stain her soul until she dies.

God doesn’t like it when we kill his babies.


8 posted on 08/26/2008 5:02:31 AM PDT by RexBeach
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To: radar101

I don’t know where Pelosi goes to Mass in DC (if she does), but I’m praying that she will soon be denied reception of the Eucharist due to her consistent scandalous position on abortion. Pray that the bishops responsible will finally take action on this.


9 posted on 08/26/2008 5:04:09 AM PDT by SumProVita ("Cogito ergo sum pro vita." .....updated Descartes)
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To: radar101

watched her speech last night...horrible.

watched her interview afterwards...closeups...ugly...ugly


10 posted on 08/26/2008 5:04:20 AM PDT by palomonte
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To: radar101

Where’s a good Grand Inquisitor when you really need one?


11 posted on 08/26/2008 5:08:18 AM PDT by Thrownatbirth (.....Iraq Invasion fan since '91.)
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Archbishop Wuerl on the Church’s Constant Teaching on Abortion

August 25, 2008

The following statement is from Washington Archbishop Donald W. Wuerl:

On Meet the Press this past Sunday, August 23, 2008, Speaker of the House Nancy Pelosi made statements regarding the teaching of the Catholic Church, human life and abortion that were incorrect.

Speaker Pelosi responded to a question on when life begins by mentioning she was Catholic. She went on to say, “And what I know is, over the centuries, the doctors of the Church have not been able to make that definition...” After Mr. Tom Brokaw, the interviewer, pointed out that the Catholic Church feels strongly that life begins at conception, she replied, “I understand. And this is like maybe 50 years or something like that. So again, over the history of the church, this is an issue of controversy.”

We respect the right of elected officials such as Speaker Pelosi to address matters of public policy that are before them, but the interpretation of Catholic faith has rightfully been entrusted to the Catholic bishops. Given this responsibility to teach, it is important to make this correction for the record.

The Catechism of the Catholic Church is clear: the current teaching of the Catholic Church on human life and abortion is the same teaching as it was 2,000 years ago. The Catechism reads:

“Human life must be respected and protected absolutely from the moment of conception…Since the first century the Church has affirmed the moral evil of every procured abortion. This teaching has not changed and remains unchangeable. Direct abortion, that is to say, abortion willed either as an end or a means, is gravely contrary to the moral law.” (Catechism, 2270-2271)

The Catechism goes on to quote the Didache, a treatise that dates to the first century: “’You shall not kill the embryo by abortion and shall not cause the newborn to perish.’”

From the beginning, the Catholic Church has respected the dignity of all human life from the moment of conception to natural death.

Contact:
Susan Gibbs
Director of Communications
301-853-4517
gibbss@adw.org

12 posted on 08/26/2008 5:14:01 AM PDT by A.A. Cunningham
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To: radar101

The fact is that Demonrats are just hedonists; there is no right or wrong in their worlds, except for being in opposition to them and their power-hungry, controlling goals. They will say anything to fool people into voting for them and play the religion card even though it is so transparent Pelosi is on ‘Catholic’ in name only. They are abominable to religion and any sort of recognition of morals.


13 posted on 08/26/2008 5:14:05 AM PDT by bushfamfan (America's sunrise has turned into a sunset.)
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To: A.A. Cunningham

It is true that both Augustine and Aquinas wrote of a delayed ensoulment, but I don’t believe that either declared it legitimate to destroy the unensouled, but still animate, embryo.

Great theologians sometimes speculate, and not all speculation rises to the teaching of the church.


14 posted on 08/26/2008 5:19:29 AM PDT by heartwood
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To: steve8714

Yeah, when did the ripping take place? Not seeing it...


15 posted on 08/26/2008 5:23:42 AM PDT by subterfuge (BUILD MORE NUCLEAR POWER PLANTS NOW!!!)
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To: G Larry

I’m Lutheran, not Catholic, and my question is meant to obtain understanding and is in no way an evaluation or critique.

Is it possible that Pelosi has lulled herself into believing she’s safe in her pursuit of abortion rights because communion rights have not been withheld? So, she rationalizes her continued allowance of the Sacrament of Communion by assigning convoluted and illogical confusion within the Church on the topic. Sort of a self-justification mechanism.

Just trying to understand how someone who claims to be a practicing Catholic (or member of any Christian church) could be so disabused of Christian doctrine.


16 posted on 08/26/2008 5:23:49 AM PDT by bcsco (Obama's just biden his time until McCain wins in November.)
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To: radar101
Nancy thought the Church would look the other way on this one.

Definitely grounds for excommunication:

Excommunication, in the sense of a formal proceeding, is not a penalty at all but simply a formal proclamation of a pre-existing condition in a more or less prominent member of the Roman Catholic Church. When such a person commits acts that in themselves separate him from the communion of the Faithful, particularly when by word, deed, or example he "spreads division and confusion among the Faithful", it is necessary for the Church to clarify the situation by means of a formal announcement, which informs the laity that this is not a person to follow, and notifies the clergy that this person, by his own willful acts, has separated himself from the Church and is no longer to receive the sacraments, with the exception of Reconciliation., The decree may also indicate the mode of Reconciliation required for re-entry into the Church, specifying whether the local bishop may administer the process or it is reserved to the Pope. Excommunication is never a merely "vindictive penalty" (designed solely to punish). It is always used as a "medicinal penalty" intended to pressure the person into changing their behaviour or statements, repent and return to full communion.
17 posted on 08/26/2008 5:23:59 AM PDT by Mr. Binnacle (Baby, Everybody's Had to Fight to be Free - Tom Petty)
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To: radar101
“We respect the right of elected officials such as Speaker Pelosi to address matters of public policy that are before them, but the interpretation of Catholic faith has rightfully been entrusted to the Catholic bishops. Given this responsibility to teach, it is important to make this correction for the record.”

Weasel words. It is easy to read into this statement an acceptance of the discredited Cuomo stance of “personally opposed but not wishing to impose one's morality on others through the law.”

Archbishop Wuerl continues to be a part-time Catholic and a full-time Democrat.

We should pray for his conversion.

18 posted on 08/26/2008 5:29:23 AM PDT by sitetest (If Roe is not overturned, no unborn child will ever be protected in law.)
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To: G Larry
"It is not up to a priest to pick out those who might be receiving unworthily."

I agree with you (and I'm not even Catholic) as you are exactly right in that statement. The Bible is very clear on this: "Therefore, whoever eats the bread or drinks the cup of the Lord in an unworthy manner will be guilty of sinning against the body and blood of the Lord. A man ought to examine himself before he eats of the bread and drinks of the cup. For anyone who eats and drinks without recognizing the body of the Lord eats and drinks judgment on himself." - 1 Cor. 11:27-29.

19 posted on 08/26/2008 5:33:29 AM PDT by Pablo64 (What is popular is not always right. What is right is not always popular.)
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To: bcsco
I’m Lutheran, not Catholic, and my question is meant to obtain understanding and is in no way an evaluation or critique. Is it possible that Pelosi has lulled herself into believing she’s safe in her pursuit of abortion rights because communion rights have not been withheld? So, she rationalizes her continued allowance of the Sacrament of Communion by assigning convoluted and illogical confusion within the Church on the topic. Sort of a self-justification mechanism. Just trying to understand how someone who claims to be a practicing Catholic (or member of any Christian church) could be so disabused of Christian doctrine.
+++
Good question ... Last week on Wednesday, my brother-in-law, Fr. William O'Toole, said Mass for my recently deceased mother. My husband and children were in attendance and Fr. told my sons (who hadn't been to the previous Sunday's Mass) that they could not receive Communion. They, of course, haven't been to many Sunday Masses, but the rule is no weekday Mass without attending the previous Sunday Mass. Our kids were taken aback. They thought they could be Catholic when they wanted to. I wish Fr. Bill was Pelosi's priest. There would be NO COMMUNION for her. To all priests -- Step up and "instruct" those who are not abiding by the rules.
20 posted on 08/26/2008 5:39:37 AM PDT by mlizzy (abortion, barack obama,)
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To: Mr. Binnacle

Just curious....what is your source for the grounds for excommunication?


21 posted on 08/26/2008 5:48:44 AM PDT by Country Eagle
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To: mlizzy

I’m sorry to hear that your mother passed away. Prayers for you and your family, in the knowledge she now is in Heaven with Christ our savior.

Pelosi’s (and now the Church’s) problem, is that she made her separation from Church doctrine public is a big way. Archbishop Wuerl’s statement was made to correct the record (apparently) but that just clarifies the schism between Church doctrine and her work and her beliefs. It would seem to me she’s painted herself and the Church into a very public corner.


22 posted on 08/26/2008 5:52:47 AM PDT by bcsco (Obama's just biden his time until McCain wins in November.)
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To: bcsco
I think Rome should issue a declaration concerning this. Something like this. After hearing Nancy Pelosi, the Speaker of the House, being so confused about Church doctrine, we feel it is time to expressly state our beliefs and how we will ensure that they are followed among our clergy.

The Catholic Church believes that life begins at conception, and we will not participate at any level. We will instruct our clergy to teach that to all Catholics. The Catholic Church believes that marriage is made up of one woman and one man, and we will not participate. We will not participate in same sex adoptions.

Any clergy member participating in the advancement of these sins will be defrocked. Catholics who publicly disagree or work toward the implementation of these sinful activities will be denied Communion and/or excommunicated.

We are taking this stand because, as Nancy Pelosi has shown, too many of our faithful have not been properly instructed in Church Doctrine.

23 posted on 08/26/2008 6:27:08 AM PDT by Betty Jane
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To: Betty Jane
I think Rome should issue a declaration concerning this.

I think Pelosi, having made the issue very public, has challenged the Church on this. What remains to be seen is what the Church will do. I'm certainly in no position to make suggestions. I'm simply curious how this will evolve.

24 posted on 08/26/2008 6:32:20 AM PDT by bcsco (Obama's just biden his time until McCain wins in November.)
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To: Country Eagle

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/05678a.htm
Summarized at: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excommunication


25 posted on 08/26/2008 6:36:21 AM PDT by Mr. Binnacle (Baby, Everybody's Had to Fight to be Free - Tom Petty)
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To: sitetest
Archbishop Wuerl continues to be a part-time Catholic and a full-time Democrat.

Sounds like his problem with her is that she was on his turf - rather than her promoting evil.

26 posted on 08/26/2008 6:38:45 AM PDT by Last Dakotan
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To: radar101

Wait, I sure see some inconsistency here. How about Teddy Kennedy’s pro-abortion stand, his perverse ways, his lying, why hasn’t any Bishop taken him to task over these things for DECADES?? If someone has, I would appreciate a reference.

So many of us are so disgusted at politician’s in-your-face behavior but worse than that are the ones who continue to vote for them and keep them in POWER.


27 posted on 08/26/2008 6:40:39 AM PDT by brushcop (We remember SSG Harrison Brown, PVT Andrew Simmons B CO 2/69 3ID KIA Iraq OIF IV)
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To: heartwood

St. Luke seems to have thought the soul entered the embryo at or very soon after conception—he has St. Elizabeth speak to Mary concerning “the fruit of your womb” and call her “the mother of my Lord” (1.42-43), at a time that may have been only a few days after the Annunciation.


28 posted on 08/26/2008 6:49:35 AM PDT by Verginius Rufus
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To: Last Dakotan
Dear Last Dakotan,

“Sounds like his problem with her is that she was on his turf - rather than her promoting evil.”

No. Ms. Pelosi has done more outrageous things than this under the archbishop's nose.

Rather, the public nature of her heretical statements forced him to make some response, no matter how weak.

And this response was very weak.


sitetest

29 posted on 08/26/2008 6:52:42 AM PDT by sitetest (If Roe is not overturned, no unborn child will ever be protected in law.)
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To: sitetest
And this response was very weak.

Agreed.

30 posted on 08/26/2008 7:27:27 AM PDT by Last Dakotan
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To: bcsco

Pls see post # 19 on this thread and then vist the thread below:

>http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2068438/posts<


31 posted on 08/26/2008 10:52:28 AM PDT by G Larry (I'm investing in "Pitchfork Futures"!!)
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To: G Larry; Pyro7480

I understand God’s Word, and how she is apart from God in her actions and beliefs. My point, however, is that the Archbishop of Denver has called into question Joe Biden’s qualification for the Sacrament of Communion, yet no one has brought this aspect up regarding Pelosi. And make no mistake; her continued taking Communion was part of her dialog.

If the Church can excommunicate someone for failing to live up to Church doctrine, can they not also recommend abstaining from Communion unless/until the offending party shows themself worthy? And if the Church can do this, then will they in this case, or will political expediency prevail?

Pelosi has called this down upon herself. Will the Church act? That’s what I wonder.


32 posted on 08/26/2008 11:16:52 AM PDT by bcsco (Obama's just biden his time until McCain wins in November.)
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To: bcsco

The Denver Archbishop is putting Pelosi and Biden on notice...if you plan on going to Mass in Denver...you have been told...do not take Communion...unless you repent...It also give any priest in the Denver diocese cover to refuse Communion to either Pelosi or Biden


33 posted on 08/26/2008 1:22:18 PM PDT by Fred (The Democrat Party is the Nadir of Nihilism)
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To: Fred

Yes, I understand that. I guess my questions have been directed to what occurs in their own parish. We may never know the fallout in that regard unless their individual Archbishops go public with pronouncements.


34 posted on 08/26/2008 1:29:14 PM PDT by bcsco (Obama's just biden his time until McCain wins in November.)
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